How thoroughly disgusted by the United States I have always been, but this documentary was the icing on the cake. As if you guys weren't bad off enough following MKULTRA, Operations Paperclip, Northwoods, PBSUCCESS, Mockingbird.... I think you get the point. I'd be delighted if someone could enlighten me as to why Americans are so patriotic.... Your government is a joke and those who are proud of it are the punchline.
A confused Canadian. (Yes, I realize that we aren't that much better and that I "shouldn't bite the hand that feeds me"). But I never asked to be born on this corrupt *beep* continent and believe me when I say that I won't be here long.
As distasteful as it was, I'm not sure the United States had any choice with Operation Paperclip. If we hadn't gotten those Nazi scientists then the Soviets would have gotten them.
"I like simple pleasures like butter in my ass and lollipops in my mouth." - Floyd Gondolli
This is not the United States. These are elements of the government and in the name of defense or survival some people sometimes to stupid or unproductive things.
It is easy to look back and say these things were terrible, and some of them were, no argument there. It is not so easy for any government to monitor what it is doing, who is doing what, and who gets to make judgements about that?
Life, survival, power is all about politics, and everything done is not done to make things a fair fight. The US, in my opinion, is about full-spectrum-military-dominance, and that is an ugly thing from some points of view, but it is also a necessary thing to avoid having to fight for survival. Do we want a fair fight ... hell, no, we want to win, and we want to prevail to survive into the future - that is priority #1.
These operations, I think, I don't that much about them, but I think they are all in line with this goal. It is someone's idea of an area of something we can exploit to make victory, or some necessary action ( to them ) possible.
If I had to say, how can things be better, there are two choices.
We could give up all this stuff and try to live by our Constitution, to give up empire, to break up powerful groups of rich and powerful people, to run our country as a democracy and not a rather sad unrepresentative democracy, and in my opinion it would be destabilizing to the world, and more war would probably break out. I have no research to back that up, but that would be the argument there. The problem with this is that as soon as the US loses it's grip so to speak, how will there ever be another state like the US. There is no ground on with the seed of the what the US stands for ... even if it does not implement it or does so hypocritically in some ways - it's just gone. So, we put up with a lot. We also put up with a lot in our criminal system where lots of criminals get away with crimes. Every system has imperfections, and you must be sure to at least try to weight those imperfections objectively and pragmatically.
Then on the other side things could effective remain the same, but the US could bind itself to certain outcomes and remake a social contract with its citizens, and the citizens of other countries, as to what the US is fighting for. i am not sure how this would work, but it would be something like here is what you get if you work for the democratic republican socialist model. If you maintain good citizenship you get to vote, you get access to information, you get a universal basic income, you get a job if you want it, you get free health care, free education, basic communication, transportation rights, but you need to support morally and if you volunteer militarily to police the world and fight against the system that do not meet these standards in the world. Realize, this is one paragraph in an IMDB comment, so it is not as nuanced and complete as I would like, but somehow a world order of individualism needs to come about or we will have the same war, inequality and tyranny that we see all over.
The US even with all the programs you mention supports the freest country economically and socially for the most people. Of course there are going to be mistakes and problems, and some people who are brave enough to be whistle-blowers are going to have a bad end. I mourn for these people ... but most places in the world you would never have heard of these people, they would never have gotten their say, and they would end up dead.
The US even with all the programs you mention supports the freest country economically and socially for the most people.
You either drink the government koolaid or you're one of the government lap dogs who dish it out.
but most places in the world you would never have heard of these people, they would never have gotten their say, and they would end up dead.
If these people had of went through legal channels first and hadn't gone to the press then we'd never have heard of them either. Because they would have disappeared never to be heard from. Don't think for one little second that if the government and intelligence agencies and military had of gotten to these people before their stories went public they wouldn't have been killed. These people had their lives destroyed for exposing the truth and many were wrongly imprisoned to send the message to EVERYONE to keep their mouths shut.
Free country.... LMFAO that's pretty funny that is right there.
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