Awful, boring, ugly


I was really curious to finally see it! The time you waste watching this will never come back. Go running. Go to the dentist. Call your mother in law. Anything is better than to have to sit through this.

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Nope

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I think Rourke's connection to it is just that he was at Cannes, saw it and described it as Ferrara's best film and praised G.D.'s performance as being amongst the most courageous he's ever seen. I'm taking his word for it over the o.p.'s and can't wait to see it.

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[deleted]

I would have to disagree with you and the OP regarding the film. I saw it yesterday at the Fantasia Film Festival in Montreal and there was even a Q & A with Ferrara after the movie which was highly stimulating. Welcome to New York for me is brillant portrait of a man whose life is unraveling because of his own doing, his own addiction and self-loathing ultimately. It was different from some of his other movies, but at the same time a lot of his movies do concern tortured characters who are basically unredeemable and go on a spiral of self-destruction. What I like about the film is that he presents you a character that is monstruous on several levels and yet I did want to follow him throughout the film. Of course, Depardieu's performance alone is magnificent in my opinion and I think it is one of his most challenging performance ever. For me, it is not so much a re-enactment of the facts but more of an exposé of a very dark and twisted character that is nevertheless fascinating to explore. The Wolf of Wall Street, altough a great film as well, was totally different in terms of style as well as in terms of the characters and the environment in which they evolve. I did not even view the movie as a political film and neither does Ferrara from what he said at the showing yesterday. Personally, I would actually suggest this film to people who are open to a crude and dark character study like this. It feels different than Ferrara's other films yet you can still tell it is a Ferrara's movie in my opinion.

Bill Foster: I'm the bad guy?...How did that happen?

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I thought Depardieu was very good here, although Empire praised this film more highly than I would, it's a good movie that's frequently audacious, compelling, inadvertently humorous and involving. It loses pace and purpose on occasion, especially in the final act, which drags a touch and employs some obscure flashbacks and moments where Depardieu seems to be looking directly at the audience. This is too cute and self-aware, but the arc from confident, sex-fuelled debauchery and lust to fish-out-of-water buffoonery and going from wholly in control to entirely lost worked for me. Even the flashbacks revealed other aspects of a complex and involving character, whilst the supporting roles are well played, too; particularly Jacqueline Bisset, who gives her best performance in years on the big screen. I think it could have been a little shorter and a bit tighter during the final act, but the first half is utterly compelling, highly amusing and handled with real aplomb by director and cast.

NOW TARZAN MAKE WAR!

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I can't go along with the original post's thesis. Nowhere in that comment does the writer say anything that suggests an understanding of the film - what type of film it is, what intention drives Ferrara's depiction of this man and the life around him - except to say in a number of ways that it's boring. I can understand how someone who is not interesting in the sort of interior, human paradoxes that Ferrara delves into, and the film's lack of plot and narrative clarification, would see nothing more than: awful, boring, and ugly. That limited view reflects the poster's narrow vision and understanding, and not the raw material for thought the film provides.

Yes, even in the cut version - which is all I have available to me at the moment - it's clear that Depardieu, now in his 60s, continues to be the astonishing actor he has always been. I think at this point, in his life and his career, he's taken the craft and art of acting way beyond anything Brando did; Depardieu's acting has always remained amazingly simple, but detailed in a way that we perceive who he plays and never the mechanism used to achieve the result. He is obviously a man at home in his own skin, for in it, he has achieved a confidence that does not allow the obstacle of fear, in any form, to intrude. Age has not soften his edges, or threatened his work with anything remotely resembling vanity. He embraces this character with a combination of rage and love; he does not act-out; he merely IS this conflicted, horrifically self possessed, self deluded man. Without judgement, Depardieu shows us a man with wealth, position, and governmental potential brought down by addiction, compulsion, and his constant self awareness that a downfall is, and will continue to be, the consequence of these actions. The film follows Ferrara's other films, as it observes a man of power's disintegration within a Catholic context balancing free will with an addict's compulsion. At one point the character says, "God denies me His Grace to be good," and we wonder, is this true or is this, as his wife insists, rationalization? All of Ferrara's films have theological themes running through them. A search for God is at the core of his work. What differentiates it from other theologically motivated work is Ferrara's willingness to descend into the pit and show the sins committed; to vividly demonstrate actions that challenge any acknowledgement of God's presence.

The other performance, equally frank and soul-bearing, is the one given by Bisset. And let me add, for once, she's actually got a part where a great deal is demanded of her! She grabs hold, with a force equal to her acting partner, stands her group, and plays out the part of this sort of scandal we are always curious about: the wife's reaction to a famous husband's risky, indiscreet behavior. The scenes between Depardieu and Bisset are the most important moments, the film's driving force, dramatically. The sex orgies are shown so we remember them when husband and wife debate his actions, her motive, their share circumstance. The grunting excess we watch, contrasts the emotionally fueled intellectual debriefing process between the two that, in truth, makes up the majority of the film's running time. Bisset is equally astonishing.

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Excellent thoughts and analysis, nfaust! You certainly have a great grasp on Ferrara's essence and I'm glad to hear such a thoughtful and articulate defense of the film for it to stand up perfectly alongside the rest of his body of work despite the fact that numerous people have complained it isn't as aesthetically appealing in the way King of New York, Bad Lieutenant and The Funeral may have been on a more technical level. Unfortunately even the cut version doesn't seem to have opened in LA as I was expecting it should have in at least a couple of theaters on Friday, where/how did you see it?

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HolyShackles, it's streaming on AmazonPrime, Sony Streaming, and I believe Vudu. I had to look it up. It was not in any featured area. Hope you get to see it.

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IcySpoon, I didn't write "this person didn't love the movie as much as I did, therefore he/she is an idiot." If I had, it would have been "the rationale of a child." But I'm not a child and I do presume to ANALYZE both the film and the excessively negative statements made in the post I comment on. I presume because I know what I'm talking about, as, indeed, I demonstrate in the long paragraph after the paragraph you refer to as …."Anything you wrote after that was worthless …"

Let's look at what I wrote and see where all that arrogance you're talking about is hiding.

1. "I can understand how someone who is not interesting in the sort of interior, human paradoxes that Ferrara delves into …."

In that part of the sentence I describe how I categorize Ferrara's dramatic focus, making a reference to what separates his work from the mainstream. Note, I did not call the poster names. I said, I understand why the poster might come up with his/her opinion.

2. "...and the film's lack of plot and narrative clarification, would see nothing more than: awful, boring, and ugly."

In other words, WELCOME TO NEW YORK is not a plot driven story; it is therefore, without narrative clarification, ambiguous. For a viewer to enter the world of the film, they must recognize what the film does and how it's been conceived and put together; the viewer, to appreciate this difficult work, must be wiling to deal with the film on its own level and not apply narrative rule that have nothing to do with what's on the screen.

If the viewer doesn't, it therefore makes sense to categorize it as empty, ugly, and dull.


3. "That limited view reflects the poster's narrow vision and understanding, and not the raw material for thought the film provides."

I didn't categorize the poster in any way. I use a possessive noun - "poster's" - referring to the opinion not the person. And the poster's view? I didn't call it childish, arrogant, idiotic, pompous, judgmental, worthless, stupid, shallow; none of those things. I said the poster's view of the film was "limited" and "narrow," which, if one looks back at the original post, strikes me as being both accurate and polite.

Furthermore, I talk about the film.

You, IcySpoon, are the one who's not talking about the movie. You're talking about me, and you're the one who's calling me all sort of names.

Those who have read what I wrote know that I emphatically disagree with the the other's opinion, but do not spend the whole piece taking about that person. I spend the whole piece talking about the movie, itself; going point by point through the movie to communicate to the readers an alternative, and in my mind valid, approach to the film, and one's possible appreciation of it.

Now, since I've addressed your concerns above, responding to your specific comments, I'm going to address you:

How dare you anonymously enter into a discussion with me on such a childish and angry level. I could say everything you wrote is worthless. But that would be redundant because, in that entire post, you say nothing at all; you can't get any more worthless than that. Calling what you posted the "rationale of a child" would be insulting to children, even though the rationale behind your diatribe can certainly not be called "adult." My pedestal, as you put it, is something entirely of your making. I was not on one before you attacked. Your foolish, impolite, angry, insecure, intimidated name calling, that pretends to be an IMDB comment, makes what I wrote seem even more intelligent then it was to begin with; your stupidity puts me on a pedestal. Your arrogant self regard, which you obviously consider superior, gives you some loony sense of authority entitling you to call people names when you don't agree with what they say or like and understand how they say it.

Your number above has to be one of the most pompous and stupid comments I've seen in a long, long time. Get the hell out of my discussion and away from this thread. Go somewhere that will tolerate your name calling. Find a group on Facebook to get kicked out of. I don't care where you go, but go, get out of here, you ignorant ass.

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You must have a lot of free time.


"Eventually, all things merge into one, and a river runs through it." Norman Maclean

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No, as a matter of fact, I don't. I'm just very smart and can type fast.

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And IcySpoon, a quick spot check of your other comments left all over this message board validated what I suspected: You love landing within a discussion to tell someone how "superior" they are behaving. I think out of the ten post I quickly looked at, the word "superior" was used in eight of them. if not that, you make fun of people's spelling or syntax.

Your sort of trolling, personal attack is why most people stay clear of this board. I used to follow it a lot. Now very rarely. Too many loons with an aggressive sense of inferiority looking around to make themselves feel good by insulting others.

What an ass. At first I couldn't believe you'd have the nerve to post a response. Then I realized your post was so short because there was really nothing to say, but you wanted to say it anyway. Get a last word in.

Who has too much time on their hands?

Don't you have a kid or something that you should go and irritate or dominate or in some way use to make yourself feel superior and important? Get off of IMDB.

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You at least have the good sense to do what I demand. Blocking me = got out of my IMDB post - foot stomping and all - something that you'd know about since it's not the first time you've purposely motivated that reaction from others.

Thanks for doing what I asked.

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What are you still doing here? Delete these replies to my comments NOW. You said you were going to block me. You obviously haven't. Get the hell away from what I've written. Do what you said you'd do. And do it now.

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But even Scorsese's latest narcotic thrill-ride handily beats Ferrara's failure; it at least has a coherent aesthetic and narrative view on the controversy it depicts, whereas WtNY is merely some kind of strange fly-on-the-wall document with little artistic or sociopolitical worth.


I guess we should do away with all of John Cassavetes' films then as the last thing he was concerned with was "a coherent aesthetic and narrative view" when trying to bring out some form of truth.

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Well, I would partly disagree that Cassavetes didn't have a "coherent" aesthetic, as I think he was much more in control than given credit for (especially with his masterpiece, The Killing of a Chinese Bookie).

Now, about Welcome to New York -- I deleted my post, as it was basically just a poorly thrown-together, angry rant brought about by my disappointment in the film, and containing some hasty generalizations and silly claims, to boot. Only such a film -- by Abel Ferrara, who I think is possibly our greatest living filmmaker -- could inspire such a lengthy, passionate, borderline-vitriolic response from me; it is often those artists we love the most whose disappointments, well, disappoint the most. But I'm hardly averse to giving the film a second chance. In fact, I only outright loved one or two Ferrara films on first viewing, with most of the ones now-cherished by me initially seeming very good but also quite flawed. The Blackout went from, in IMDb terms, a 5/10 to a 9/10 from my first to second viewing, and something like New Rose Hotel requires more than one look to even begin to appreciate and understand. These are films which really transform the more one sees them. Indeed, I just watched The Funeral for the third time the other night and I finally realized what a masterpiece it is.

All this is why I am somewhat hesitant to say that e.g. Mary and Go-Go Tales aren't very good films, having only seen them once; I suppose I'm similarly hesitant to make a firm judgment on Welcome to New York, but even from just one viewing I feel that it perhaps lacks something special that the other Ferrara films have, or is a bit bland. Whatever the case, I'm always happy to re-evaluate the work of this great director; and besides, one thing you can't say about his films is that they cause indifference...

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Of course Cassavetes was in control of his films, what I was saying is that he wasn't ultimately concerned with aesthetically framing in a picturesque, matching shots perspective (at least on a conscious level) as he believed that should the actors receive the utmost concern and deliver the truest, most impassioned performances possible that the rest would follow on its own and automatically look better on a purely visual level. This is something I think that has increasingly hurt Scorsese on a creative level (even if his last several films were his greatest financial successes) as he has given up taking that sort of creative risk and feels the need to deliver, as you put it, something that is primarily "aesthetically and narratively coherent" (actual situations are rarely that straightforward which is what Ferrara was no doubt trying to capture with Welcome...) to please mass audiences and ensure the exponentially absurd expectations for studios profit-wise.

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I watched it 5x already and am about to watch it again.

Join me?

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I confess that I wanted to hit "eject" after about 20 minutes. Then I became fascinated with the scenes of a rich man in jail, and of the $60,000-a-month apartment, and of Jacqueline Bisset (who somehow has become an amazing actress, and who seems to be a poster child on how to age gracefully), and I became fascinated by the presentation of a man with seemingly no conscience. Ultimately, I guess I was glad I watched it to the end, but I'd hesitate to recommend it to anyone without huge reservations.

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Awful, boring, ugly


Absolutely! Among other flaws, this piece of garbage had some of the worst dialogues I've seen in recent years. Depardieu's acting was terrible, he jumbled his lines, most of them were incoherent, and the whole thing seemed partly improvised anyway. He was so enormous and agonizing in his enormity, it became the focus of the movie. Even Jacqueline Bisset was pathetic. That line with the butterfly and how then she starts making sounds, has she lost all dignity? I know I lost all respect for her after seeing Welcome to New York and knowing she defends this despicable movie and Abel Ferrara.

And a long time ago, I used to like Ferrara! I went to see Body Snatchers and The Funeral when they came out.

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www.1up-games.com Last watched: imdb.to/K4tvL9

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I watch it at Fast-Forward most of the time... it could have been a 30 minutes short instead it's over 2 hours full of ... NOTHING ! I read all the comments and reviews before and I was like, it cannot be the truth ! As I watch the first 20 minutes or so, i had to fast forward because i was bored to death, on my cellphone, thinking about the stop a lot... it is really a mess !

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Well I liked it what I don't understand is why anne sinclair the wife was so angry about it? I thought they made her dignified and classy? I read she is suing? Also I can't believe Gerard Depardieu appears completely naked, and he is not in the best shape?

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