Final Episode


An exhilarating ride! That's what I can say about the seventh and last episode of the series just now, but I think I'll have to re-watch for a more definite impression.

It's been a long time since I read that part of the book (I'm now at Strange's arrival in Portugal in my re-read), but I seem to remember quite a few things were different there. In particular Lascelles' fate is something that I think was lots more fitting in the book, although having him shatter to shards was very cinematic! :D

Lady Pole was really set on her feminist course, and that's fine, however I confess I would have liked to see a glimmer of hope that she and Sir Walter would be able to build a marriage in the true sense of the word, rather than the indefinite separation that seemed to be her intention.

But maybe they are supposed to be a contrast to the Stranges, who are separated indefinitely against their will, though permanently striving to be together again.

A lot was packed in this episode, and I'm looking forward to watching again and also reading everyone's thoughts! :)

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Agreed, it certainly was.

I have to say, I think the ending seemed a bit bleaker than the book. I would have liked a final scene with Strange and Norrel together in the darkness.

Though I guess the idea of Strange being slightly content with his separation, wouldn't have worked so well with this version being much closer toward his wife.

Really it was a wonderful ride, and a brilliant series.

And I've recently heard the writer is working on a sequel.

Lady Pole was really set on her feminist course, and that's fine, however I confess I would have liked to see a glimmer of hope that she and Sir Walter would be able to build a marriage in the true sense of the word, rather than the indefinite separation that seemed to be her intention.


I have admit I agree, I get he didn't treat the best at the start, but honestly I didn't doubt he truly loved her. Its a shame its dead, even if it does make a nice contrast.

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I was a little disappointed that Lascelles didn't suffer the same fate as he did in the book. It was indeed more fitting, and that shattered glass effect is a little overdone now. Having seen Vinculus hanging when Childermass strode up, I found that image rather striking and disturbing and could've definitely been put to use again with Lascelles.

And John Uskglass not speaking with Childermass. I loved that exchange.

This is probably the only episode I have gripes about changes with, funnily enough.

Well, just goes to show you can't trust anyone.

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I was never going to be fussed about how Lascelles got his comeuppance, I just wanted Childermass to be the one to deliver it. I loved the sequence during which Lascelles was smarming all over Norrell, whilst Childermass, sensing that something was amiss, quietly sat down with his cards and then just blew him out of the water. The little squit was so out of his depth. "Bloody useless".

Lovely performances all round, with special mention to Ariyon Bakare as Stephen, the noble creation that turned on his creator.



I'm the clever one; you're the potato one.

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And John Uskglass not speaking with Childermass. I loved that exchange.


That was really the only thing wrong with this episode. I was looking forward to the exchange. Perhaps it does not work the same way visually. In the book the Raven King was shown as a youth. Chldermass not recognizing him yet defending him in ignorance. Here they looked like a reflection of one and the other.

Vinculus was spot on.

The creepy stuff with the Fairy cursing Segundus and Honeyfoot in Staircross Hall was a bit over the top. I suspect the target audience likes that sort of stuff. Did hark back to some of the old Outer Limits/Twilight Zone tropes.

Kept telling myself, that It was good this was a Mini Series, Had it been a film as planned, there would have been so much lost. This way we keep the heart of the story.

Online Rumors are that the sequel would focus on Childermass and Vinculus so the ending fit. Loved the more pro-active Arabella, That she might go after Strange herself.

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I felt a bit deflated with the final and they were some of the things that irked me. Lascelles' meeting with the Champion of Castle of the Plucked Eye and Heart was the main thing I was looking forward to towards the end the show. It's the most memorable scene in the story for me and the creepiest; it also showed that Childermass was far cleverer than Lascelles in not getting caught in the same trap. Have to admit I'm disappointed the story didn't go that way.

I'm also disappointed that Childermass didn't get speak to his hero John Uskglass and that he didn't bother to heal Childermass' wounded face. Also not happy that Strange got to see the Raven King (instead of just that raven's eye which in itself would have looked cool on screen) - that was Childermass' privilege. I think Childermass has been downgraded in this show. Not completely happy in the scene where Childermass gives back Lady Pole's finger either - I felt Stephen and Sir Walter were superfluous there and I would have liked Childermass to have seen the two Emmas, as in the book.
I'll watch the episode again to see if I like it better the second time round.

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Yes, I felt very similarly. I would have loved seing Childermass getting to talk to Raven King and to be the one who heals Lady Pole.

I understand the choice, the writers had to make, though.
It is often said that story needs a clear hero (and a clear villain, which I believe is the reason for alterations of the GentlemanĀ“s character). In the book it is possible to have several but in the movie/TV it would hardly work. And the book is called Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell, not Childermass (sadly :-), so I guess they needed to downgrade him a bit.

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I'm also disappointed that Childermass didn't get speak to his hero John Uskglass and that he didn't bother to heal Childermass' wounded face.

He did heal him.
Otherwise I understand you completely, but I still loved the episode.




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I've watched that part of the episode again and Childermass' face is still bloody after the Raven King has left him and Vinculus - when Uskglass waves a hand in front of Childermass' face I believe it was to make Childermass forget that he saw him. He also looks to have a scar on his cheek at the end of the episode.

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I felt the final episode was the weakest in the series. Lascelles' fate was one of the most memorable scenes in the book, especially since it is such an important trope in Faerie lore. Also, John Uskglass is portrayed in the show as a kind of diabolical character, which he definitely isn't in the book.

On the whole, I liked the show, despite the miscasting of both the Gentleman with the Thistledown Hair and Mr. Norrell (Eddie Marsan does a good job, but I felt the character should have been played by someone much older). However, I felt they rushed that last episode and it kinda messed up the good impression that the rest of the series had made upon me. If they had stretched out that final episode or made it two separate episodes, and kept it closer to the book, I think the series would have been better for it.

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I agree there was something-not-quite-right about Eddie Marsan as Mr Norrell, even though he's such a well-loved actor. He didn't seem to have enough gravitas or believability as the character; he laboured with his Yorkshire accent, his wig let him down. But I thought Marc Warren was great, with sufficiently beguiling malice and darkly comic arrogance. Why did you not like him? I'm glad they didn't cast a namby-pamby poncy fairy as The Gentleman. I thought Marc Warren was scary - and dangerous. He's been cast as Dracula before and his Gentleman had a touch of vampire in it.

But since we're on the subject, I didn't much like the casting of Lady Pole - I didn't think Alice Englert brought much likeability or vulnerability to the character, so the viewer wasn't caused to lament enough for her tragic abandonment and suffering. In contrast, Ariyon Bakare gave such a touching performance as Stephen Black, bringing so much quietly suffering dignity and humanity to the role.

I agree about the adaptation missing out important pieces from the novel - but it could never have been perfect, could it. When I saw Lascelles turn into china and smash to smithereens, I tried to recall if that happened in the book. What a shame that they invented it as an end for him. And yes, when The Raven King appeared, I thought he looked like an angry goth who can't find his mum's eyeliner. He was slightly absurd - maybe we shouldn't have seen his face in order to preserve his status as the charismatic legend the whole story hinges on.

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It was Marc Warren's voice that I found jarring. He used a gravelly tone which I just didn't buy as a Faerie voice. He sounded as if he'd been smoking a pack a day for 20 years, and I'd always imagined the Gentleman with a smooth tenor tone. Also, he somehow didn't capture the menace and sheer brutal psychopathy of the Gentleman with the Thistledown Hair. There was a line in the book telling how the Gentleman was wont to fly a battle banner made from the flayed skins of his enemies - I just couldn't see that in Mr. Warren's portrayal.

I don't agree regarding Lady Pole - I thought the actress did a nice job. I do agree about Stephen, and I totally agree regarding The Raven King. Susanna Clarke kept him very much in her pocket for the whole novel, and just allowed us a glimpse of a very human John Uskglass, and I really wish the dramatization would have done the same. As it is, they seem to have misused him as a silly grand guignol flourish, which is a great shame.

Again, this was all due to what seemed like poor writing and directorial choices - not sure who wrote and directed the last episode, but if they were the same folks who did the earlier episodes, all I can think is that they were rushed or just couldn't fit the necessary exterior scenes in the budget. It almost seemed like they were forced to shoot that last episode in a couple of days on a stage.

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I liked the scene where the Gentleman (in the presence of Strange) turns the pages of the book after Stephen refuses. I thought in that one scene, Warren captured the spirit of the character from the book well - but after watching the show again, I'm reminded how much I zoned out of all of the other scenes which involved the Gentleman. He should've been more charming than threatening in getting people to do his bidding and his look was too cartoonish. I ignored him and all of the scenes he was in and concentrated on the characters I liked or liked to dislike.
Personally I would've been interested to see what this man, Julian Rhind-Tutt, would have been like in the role. He has a more elegant and otherworldy/fae look about him and and has been good at playing a charming psychopath in the past.

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I'm in total agreement with you about the last episode. It turned all nu-who; something I really didn't want the story to descend into. The Lascelles' scene is one of the darkest in the book (I would've loved to have seen all those corpses of various states of decay hanging from the trees) and would have fitted in well with the rest of the adult story. They instead went with an ending aimed at five year olds - with all that flapping ears nonsense and Norrell and Strange going all Scooby Doo. It felt rushed and at odds with the rest of the series aimed at adults.

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but I felt the character should have been played by someone much older


I think that Marsan and Norrell ae more or less of an age.





I'm the clever one; you're the potato one.

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@beeryusa

I though Marc Warren was perfect as the sneaky, sinister Gentleman---even thought he acted like a typical gentleman, there was always something lurking underneath the surface of the character you never quite trusted, especially as he gradually started to show who he really was,and what he was about. I didn't like the fact that the fate of both Lady Pole's and Stephen Black's characters were left hanging at the end---I would have liked to have seen both of them given decent endings----especially since they were both being used and manipulated by the Gentlemen for his own ends. Since both of them played such large parts in the plot throughout the series, I thought their story arcs deserved better than to be just left up in the air.

I also thought Stephen Black's character (Ariyan Bakare) was intriguing simply because I've seen hardly any British shows or films (other than the film BELLE) that even deal remotely with the fact that Britain had slavery at one time (even though they did end it at least 28 years before the U.S. did----it was still legal at the time JS&MN is set in.) It was nice to see the series dealing with the life of a black man in 19th century Britain for a change---that made show even more interesting (and fun) for me to watch. That part where the Gentleman shows Stephen his origins on a slave ship was remarkable and eye-opening in itself. Not something you would usually see in a fantasy-based series about magicians, of all things. I also didn't see anything wrong with Marsan being cast as Norrell---he was actually fine in the part, and made what would have normally been a typical stuck-up, arrogant,unlikeable,insufferable 19th century English character more likable and human. (I'm American, so that's what I saw him as,lol. I also felt like he could have at least thanked Childermass for saving his life (considering hat he almost got killed because of it) but he didn't even tell him that.)

Also, what was the deal with the character of Lascelles? Why was he hating on Childermass so hard, and to what end was he trying to control Norrell? He obviously had some kind of vested interest in pitting Strange and Norrell against each other, but for what purpose? That's what I couldn't quite figure out. Also how come we don't see all that much of the Raven King, whose resurgence is supposed to be the end game for all English magic? He gets this big buildup as a mysterious, unknown character throughout the latter half of the series, yet only does a cameo appearance? I mean, come on. I also like Vinuculus, the crazy, eccentric stranger/prophet dude who told Strange,Norrell, and Black about their destinies---He was a trip unto himself,and just plain fun to watch because he was so insane, but sane enough to know what was happening around him.

That all being said, I enjoyed the heck out of this series---it was a truly magical experience in itself. I have to admit, I wanted to see the Stranges reunited, and find out what happened to both him and Norrell---that's the only parts of the show I didn't like,which made the ending pretty bleak for me.

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I don't think Britain ever allowed slavery within the British Isles - not since the Vikings ruled Northumbria anyway. Britain allowed it in the colonies, but I don't think it was ever allowed in England. There may have been no official law against it, but the church did not look kindly on it and historian John Gillingham opined that from about 1200 slavery in the British Isles was non-existent. However, there was no specific law against it until Somersett's case in 1772 held that no slave could be forcibly removed from Britain. This case was generally taken at the time to have decided that the condition of slavery did not exist under English law.

The Raven King appeared even less in the book, as I recall. I think I mentioned earlier that I didn't like his portrayal in the series at all. In the books, he's a very subdued character - not at all the flamboyant character he seems in the show.

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What a good episode, Berty was a such great Strange and his scenes with Arabella were so good, equally amazing the scenes with Norrell.





Died Tragically Rescuing His Family From The Wreckage Of A Destroyed Sinking Battleship

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I am not entirely sure I like the last episode, need to rewatch to make up my mind :-)
I donĀ“t mind the changes, some book elements would not have worked so well on screen but the episode felt a bit scattered. The same motifs repeated several times, as if the writers could not quite decide how to use them.

What was the point of shooting Mr Black? Yes, it gave Fairy the reason to kill Lascelles but surely that could have been set up some other way. Otherwise Stephen being shot and then revived had no function in the story at all.
Same with cursing Segundus and others - nice effects but quite redundant, since the enchantment was never mentioned again or used in any way for the story progession. It just sort of...ended.
Or Lascelles and Norrell "lost" in labyrinth only to find their way out a bit later without a problem...
And Raven King appearing to Strange and Norrell...only to fly a bit further next minute.

This was not the case in previous episodes, where the pieces from the book were selected perfectly and every single word or line had its place.

Having said that there were many moments I enjoyed immensly and I am already planning a marathon watching with my friends, as soon as the weather gets a bit more gloomy and wet :-)

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Yes, I would have liked a bit more Raven King, and found it a bit odd that he (and his swarm of birds) kept flitting from place to place like that.

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Fantastic series...Ive totally enjoyed all of it! Glad to see everybody got their comeuppance.
I am abit of a sap though so was disappointed that JS and Mr N got such a crappy ending, esp as there is no sequel.

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Why do you think there will be no sequel?
Hoping and praying for one, but I don't think it's decided on yet.

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Well, it is a book adaptation (the book was published some years ago) and the author never wrote any sequel, so it is quite unlikely she will do so now :-(

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THe second book is being written as we speak, so she is writing a second book - this is what she has been working on for years now.

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Mostly because the second book is not written yet.

However BBC can adapt Clarke's short stories. They are incredible. One of them was actually mentioned in the finale, the story about the charcoal burner from Cumbria - it is a very entertaining fairy tale about the Raven King.




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Well, I kind of thought that too: either they use short stories or continue on with original plot. However, we all know - the ratings..:(

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Actually I am kind of glad this will be just one off - I feel it would loose part of its charm, if all the bits of the story were too neatly tied up and described to the very end. I love its ambiguity about the ending and I love thinking what might be but don't want it necessary shown on TV.

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Disappointed that Lascelles didn't get his comeuppance as he does in the book (but, to be fair, it would have taken a lot longer that way) but otherwise very happy with it :)

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I just watched the last episode and I enjoyed it a lot. I agree though that it felt a bit scattered. The actions of the gentleman felt a bit strange. Or maybe I'm misremembering from the book? Can he just go around killing people? Then you kind of lose the whole point of him having to make deals and trick people.

I think my favorite parts were all with Norrell and Stephen. I wish we could have gotten the scene of Stephen being in the new Lost Hope addressing his subjects.

I'm not surprised they changed Lascelles faith. Him being trapped by the enchantment was satisfying but it's not important for the rest of the plot and would take time away from it. Also his actions there in the book seemed out of character for him IMO. Why should he care if some fairy threatened Childermas?

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How I understood it he didnĀ“t care the slightest for Childermass. He believed that Childermass behaved as a coward and wanted to show off, to prove he is better then him.

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Well yes I understand that he was not all "poor Childermass". I just felt that he would be more concerned of getting away from the magic than to fight some random person who hadn't done anything against him.

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[deleted]

I loved the series, it set me off on a fifth reading of the book! I understood going in that even a 7 part series could not do justice to the depth of detail in the book. I think there was about 30% of the magic from the book in the series, not just magic being performed, but the magic of the language and characters.

Spoiler below:


My biggest dissapointments, were the loss of the sense that there is magic everywhere, and that trees, stones, rivers, hills, mountains are constantly speaking and showing us things that we are not tuned into enough to see or realize. The biggest loss of this aspect were the exclusion of Drawlight's nightmare experience in Venice, and his dissolution into the forest, (They could have included this in his demise with an explaination and it would have added a nice creepy mystery.) And even worse, the loss of Stephen and the fairy gentleman's final confrontation outdoors. This was my saddest loss from the book. What they presented was too much like Old Man Willow from Tolkien. And the fairy retained his human form while dying. It also left you with the feeling that Stephan died along with the fairy when Lost Hope collapsed.

But all in all I thought all the actors were great, though I still long to have seen Ian Holm as Norrell, as in the original casting of the theatrical film, this amazed me when I first learned about it, because I pictured Holm as Norrell even from my first reading.

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Lady Pole was really set on her feminist course, and that's fine, however I confess I would have liked to see a glimmer of hope that she and Sir Walter would be able to build a marriage in the true sense of the word, rather than the indefinite separation that seemed to be her intention.


I would like that too and they might still reconcile. But I guess once trust is lost, it can never be recovered. After all, Sir Walter was the first one to distrust his wife and to get her incarcerated against her will. It's hard to forgive and forget that. He did love her and helped her get out of trouble when she attempted to retaliate against Norrell, but in this case, love isn't enough. He didn't understand her or attempt to understand her. It was unfortunate he was getting faulty advice from Norrell and others. It is worse that Lady Pole found understanding from strangers such as Segundus and Honeyfoot rather than her own husband.

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