Did Lucasfilm really have no direction for the Sequel saga?


In the recent Daisy Ridley interview, she confirmed that Lucasfilm didn’t know Palpatine was Rey’s grandfather until filming the final Star Wars movie.

https://www.quora.com/In-the-recent-Daisy-Ridley-interview-she-confirmed-that-Lucasfilm-didn-t-know-Palpatine-was-Rey-s-grandfather-until-filming-the-final-Star-Wars-movie-Did-Lucasfilm-really-have-no-direction-for-the-Sequel-saga

reply

That was pretty much the problem with the entire sequel trilogy. There was no real plan, and the fact that JJ left a lot of "mystery boxes" for people to open, and then letting Ruin Johnson get his slimy hands on it make things worse. The last one looked like a really bad story repair job by JJ, though he's not entirely to blame. KK and Iger demanded they bring back Palpatine, because they didn't like the villain JJ had originally chosen, so that played a huge part in it, as did the lack of communication and chaos going on at Lucasfilm during the past 5 years.

reply

Dead-on, AmeriGirl; there was no plan and the mystery boxes set everything up for failure. Plot-wise, I also think they rubbished everything between Jedi and Awakens and that hobbled them from the backstory onward.

Honestly, though, a big chunk of blame goes to Disney for pandering to fans. I know that sounds dumb when fans are still furious about these movies, but think about this: The Force Awakens was mostly well-received on initial release. The biggest complaint/strike against it was that it was a retread of Episode IV. That dissatisfaction with a lack of originality grew as time went on. Disney took note.

The Last Jedi comes out and it's...well, it's not derivative. Everybody's probably sick of hearing the phrase, "subverts expectations" because TLJ tried so hard to remix Star Wars and bring in new worlds, elements, ideas, moral dimensions, and characters. It failed HARD and people were furious that Johnson threw out the idea that Rey "was somebody" or that Luke was a hero. Disney took note.

With the third film, they decided to retcon everything people didn't like about TLJ. They reduced Rose Tico to a cameo, they hand-waived the Holdo Maneuver, they re-noble-ized Luke, and so forth.

The problem is that, because they had a crummy backstory and no solid plot, they were drifting in the wind. Then they made the terrible mistake of listening to - essentially - a big committee made up of disgruntled fans. Focus groups suck. They clamour for happy endings in tragedies and they basically only harm art.

Mistake #1 was poor set-up and planning, but mistake #2 was trying to chase after the dissatisfaction of angry fans.

reply

Yep you got it right.

The first film basically copies ANH and it was executed a little better than the next two sequel trilogy films it was the second film that crumpled the entire sequel premise and shoved everything out the window just like how Luke shoved the iconic light-saber behind because Ruin thought it was funny !.

Disney kept the denial while many fans and critics thought TLJ just killed all the chances of a solid good ending for the sequels.

reply

The Sequel Trilogy should be STRUCK OFF, or shoved into the category of FanFiction, which it most definitely is.

The question is, should Lucas be brought back to make HIS Sequel Trilogy? He said in interviews it would be centered around the Midichlorians, an aspect of Star Wars almost everyone hates.

reply

Well, speaking as a person who ignores Lucas' prequel trilogy, and who still has a bitter taste in my mouth about midi-bleeping-chlorians, no I don't think Lucas should remake the sequels.

I only have time for the OT. I'll rewatch those movies and be content in the succinct, near-perfect story told in three parts rather than the rambling, drunken, uninvited guests of the next six (or eight or nine or whatever we're up to now) films.

reply

"I only have time for the OT"

How? Special Editions? That's the only way you can get the OT, legally, especially on modern formats.

And if anyone is still keeping a VHS or Laserdisc player just for the OT, then that's very sad.

reply

Why would it be sad to keep a VHS or laserdisc player to watch favourite films? I'm not doing that, but I don't think that's sad at all.

What's sad is that Lucasfilm hasn't released the original films on Blue Ray.

I have the OT, legally, on DVD. They're the bonus discs on a mid-2000s release. I've watched them several times and they're great.

The special editions would be better than no OT at all, and they would certainly be better than the prequels or sequels.

reply

Fair enough.

I have the OT SEs on Google Play streaming video, along with Revenge of the Sith, as it's the only Prequel I like (I've tried and tried and I couldn't care less about Little Ani and rough sand, to be honest). I also have Rogue One cos I love the Death Star stuff.

reply

If you like it, you like it. I don't care for any of the films outside of the originals. Well...maybe I've got a little "holy cow, that's bad" b-movie love for Caravan of Courage and Battle for Endor. But that's not the same thing.

reply

Oh get real. You only saw Caravan of Courage because Ghostbusters was sold out.

reply

Saw them as a double-feature. I get a little fuzzy on those two sometimes as a result. Which one is the one with Bill Murray?

reply

I think he played the village shaman.

reply

That's right! He was standing on his knees, though, to be an Ewok. I remember now.

reply

Well, while I agree that TLJ was the breaking point, I still say that it was behind the eight ball given the thirty year gap between Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens. People complained that the return of the Emperor made the heroes' fight irrelevant, but I say that just keeping the status quo - Empire v. Rebels - was a bit of an idiotic slap in the face to everything Luke and the others fought for. It wasn't as hard a slap, but that gap was always a problem. Han lost the Falcon? Luke abandoned everybody? The Empire is better funded and more powerful than the ruling Republic, and has been unchecked for decades? How? Why?

reply

"Han lost the Falcon? Luke abandoned everybody? The Empire is better funded and more powerful than the ruling Republic, and has been unchecked for decades? How? Why?"

What strikes me about these current writers and directors is that they have NOT got a single creative bone in their bodies, they just prefer to go with what worked before, regardless of how illogical it is. And of course, they're correct, because they knew the SW fanbase would lap up such repetition, and the box office proved they did. Then again, when another director tries something different, the fans turn on him. The studios can't win with such a divided fanbase.

reply

Yes, the fanbase's expectations and rage are a big problem, too. I don't think it's possible to win on that front. Any attempt to create anything Star Wars will be, to some extent, divisive. Some people will dislike anything made about Star Wars.

But maybe the question is: if you told a complete story and nobody will be happy with any more of that story: why not go be creative and tell entirely new stories? (I know the answer is money).

The Mandalorian hasn't received the same backlash the other films have, and Rogue One is (although disliked by me) largely enjoyed throughout the fanbase. I wonder if the answer is to find new stories in the Star Wars universe that do not concern the main characters or the original story?

reply

"I wonder if the answer is to find new stories in the Star Wars universe that do not concern the main characters or the original story?"

Doubtful in the extreme: The main story of Star Wars has already been told with the main players of the whole conflict. What are they going to do, focus on minor characters in some outer rim backwater? Why? Who cares about them?

reply

No, they'd pick new eras or something like that. I'd love to see the dawn of the Jedi or the first Force users. How about a gangster epic where the New Republic goes after the Hutts? Stuff like that.

reply

My dad and brother pushed really hard to try and make me see this monstrosity of a film. I outright refused and defiantly put my foot down, telling them that TLJ had cured me of ever wanting to watch any more of these F-ed up, shitty, million-dollar fanfics; and they ended up going to see it without me. After hearing what happened in this wreck of a movie, I'm glad, even proud that I missed it.

reply

I went to see The Rise of Skywalker, but it was just because I knew a LOT of people who were going and I wanted to be able to discuss it from a place of knowledge rather than ignorance.

reply

Mystery boxes are so freakin stupid also, the best plot twists are the ones you don’t see coming, instead Jar Jar Abrams was basically telling the audience : “A big twist is coming!!!!” And therefore it built up expectations to a level they couldn’t possibly deliver on

reply

The truth is, JJ can't write or direct a story to save his life unless it's been done already. It makes me wonder where he came up with the fun story they had in the 2009 "Star Trek" film, because it worked when all the others either were a re-hash of the Khan movie, or a very weak, thin story that barely had any explanation.

reply

He’s a complete hack all he did was just recycle a story we’ve already seen a much better version of, I literally realized TFA was just going to be ANH all over again 3 minutes in. He didn’t even try to hide it. I never want to watch another one of his movies ever again

reply

I wish we had stopped after TFA too, but I guess we were all blinded by the novelty of it. I already had issues with seeing all our favorite Star Wars characters as old and faded, almost irrelevant; and Rey being able to use Force skills with no training at all. I should have known what was coming after that.

reply

Yeah Rey is the ultimate Mary Sue, it's ridiculous. If a character doesn't have to face any challenges or struggles it makes them a very boring character. Another scene that I thought was so cringeworthy is when Han and Leia both talk about what happened to Ben yet they both already know what happened, that exposition was so poor they'd might as well just break the 4th wall and announce to the audience everything they need to know. Another example is when Snoke refers to Han in front of Kylo "your father, Han Solo", no one would ever talk that way but Snoke had to so the audience would know that Han is Kylo's father. So poorly written.

reply

The directing and writing standards have certainly deteriorated since the glory days of 1980s movies.

reply

Another sign there was bad writing in the script is, a lot of stuff that was left out is in at least 1 or 2 companion novels, and you'd have to read them to get in all the stuff JJ was too stupid to include with his script. Most well-written movies don't require you to have to read a book to get the whole story.

reply

Yep that means the movie can't stand on its own.

reply

He's a hack that got big people in Hollywood lobbying for him that's it he has connections. From what happened to Star Wars and Star Trek I hope studios stop putting him in charge of direction or projects again.

reply

Oh yeah! Did you know both his parents are big Hollywood producers? That's how he was able to get in on the producing/directing scene: he has parents already in the 'biz who could speak for him! That, and they could afford to pay for his film school fees.

reply

I know and he's the not the only one. I have no issues of someone following the footsteps of his parents or doing the family business.

But there is a difference between talented and talentless and this is the issue with some Hollywood hacks today, the controlled media is just shoving them at the public as super stars and great directors/producers with barely a history to back it up.

reply

IMHO TFA sucks and ST09 sucks, and they're meant to be his most popular movies in those franchises.

Who's bright idea was it to insert a frickin' REVENGE plot in a movie of a franchise devoted to EXPLORATION, anyway? Yes, some of the old Trek movies did it too, but out of the first ten movies, only THREE had revenge as a primary motivation:

Motion Picture: Investigate an alien entity approaching earth
Wrath of Khan: Revenge, basically
Search for Spock: Seeking Spock's body to restore him to life
Voyage Home: Enterprise crew try to save earth from another alien entity
Final Frontier: Enterprise crew accommodate a religious cult figure seeking God
Undiscovered Country: Enterprise crew try to broker peace with the Klingons and stop those against it

Generations: Enterprise crew try to stop someone destroying planets on his way to a place of bliss
First Contact: Enterprise crew try to ensure First Contact happens and stop the Borg from preventing it
Insurrection: Revenge, basically, just not so obvious this time
Nemesis: Clone of Picard seeks revenge against him, when it's not his fault (???)

And the new ones?

ST09: Revenge, basically
STID: Revenge, basically
STB: Revenge, basically

Total lack of originality in the new movies.

reply

[deleted]

LOL

reply