MovieChat Forums > The Wolfpack (2015) Discussion > In defense of Mr. Oscar Angulo:

In defense of Mr. Oscar Angulo:


Every movie needs a villain. Unfortunately, in real life, things are not as clear-cut black and white.

In defense of Mr. Oscar Angulo:

1. The couple met in Peru. He left his country, culture, language, and traditions to follow her to her country, her culture, her language & her traditions.

2. Housing projects, welfare, home-schooling vouchers, none of these social services exist in Peru. So, Mr. Angulo would be oblivious to their existence. The only one that would know how to apply for these programs would be the mom, Susanne.

3. Mr. Angulo grew up in Peru. His first language was probably some indigenous dialect or Spanish. Yet, his children grew up speaking English, their mother’s language.

4. Mr. Angulo is a dark skinned immigrant man with a thick accent. He probably suffered discrimination. The cold, hostile stares probably made him think that America was an evil, cold place. The only place he felt safe was at home with his wife. That is probably why he wanted to protect his kids from the cruel outside world.


5. Why didn’t they interview Mr. Angulo in his language, whether it be Spanish or some other indigenous dialect?

Addendum to my previous list of comments:

6. The family practiced the Hare Krishna religion. How did a Peruvian Indian boy hear about this weird, American hippie religion based on ancient Hindu scriptures? Most Peruvians are Catholic! The only one that had visited Tibet was the mom, Susanne.

7. If you see pictures of the mom, Susanne, when she was younger, she was a stunning beauty! The dad, Oscar, not so much. Poor guy didn't stand a chance! He followed her to a whole other continent!

8. The mom, Susanne, is much older in age and has much more world experience from her travels, she should have known better!

I wish someone would interview Oscar's Peruvian mom, and ask her what she thinks of the situation. In her eyes, some older blue-eyed "gringa" stole her little Indian boy, took him far, far away, and she never saw him again!

9. The father taught them how to play the guitar, so now they can pretend to be rock stars.

10. The greatest gift that their parents, their father and mother, gave them was each other. How many people have the privilege of growing up with 6 brothers? You will always have a friend that will understand your childhood completely, because they were there, too.

Finally, the children look more Peruvian than white. If it weren’t for the novelty of the movie and them being all together and so similar looking, things would be different. In other words, a Latino male in New York City suffers discrimination just like a black male. Sometimes, even worse, because people assume they are undocumented.

I would like to see the boys reconcile with their father and together visit the land of their Peruvian ancestors. The land of the Inca warriors and Spanish conquistadores.

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Mr. Angulo is a dark skinned immigrant man with a thick accent. He probably suffered discrimination. The cold, hostile stares probably made him think that America was an evil, cold place. The only place he felt safe was at home with his wife. That is probably why he wanted to protect his kids from the cruel outside world.
In other words, a Latino male in New York City suffers discrimination just like a black male. Sometimes, even worse, because people assume they are undocumented.


Through what window are you looking at the world from? Your assumptions as to NYC's lack of cultural diversity are very, very incorrect to say the least.

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Well said, Thrill.

💀 The Faceless Men

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Interesting thoughts.

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You have a fertile imagination and expressed opinions that assume 'Facts NOT in Evidence'!

To begin with, Your 'snapshot' of the balance in the Angulo relationship is not objective; it is biased to steer readers to your view.

Point (1) you highlight how Mr. Angulo left his country, culture, language, culture, & traditions, and followed hers.

Why do you see him as an Outlier or Victim?



Point (2) While it is true that each country has its own welfare system, you seem to assume that Mr. Angulo has no brain or the intellectual resources of a turnip. Peru is not on another planet for goodness sakes! It IS a civilized country with a welfare system of its own. Also, immigrants from other countries adapt to our own welfare system all the time. One more thing to consider is that generally speaking, most other countries have educational systems FAR BETTER than our own public education, which would help a new emigre in adjusting to our welfare system.therefore, your assumption that 'poor Mr. Angulo was incapable of figuring it all out' just doesn't make sense.



Point (3) What is your point? Obviously when he met his wife the two of them could communicate. I'm guessing that perhaps the two of them are bi-lingual. If so, then the entire family likely is. He lived in a BI-LINGUAL household, which happens to be extremely common in America (and increasingly more so).

Thus, what does the fact that two languages are spoken in his home have to do with anything?

When a person intentionally moves to a new country, should they NOT be surprised for their native language as well as the first language of their new home country to be spoken?



Point (4) The claim that is skin color led to his behavior is also without merit. Have you ever been to New York? His skin color would help him blend in!


You asked why they didn't interview Mr. Angulo? They tried but he refused., that's why they did not interview him.



One final thought: his reasons for isolating his family may not be 'rational' or 'reasonable' at all.
It could be that he loves his family very much but suffers from some form or anxiety or fear and doesn't understand how to cope.


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So he owns a collection of over 2000 American movies (in English) applied for welfare and home schooling stipends,, rented an apartment and buys groceries for his family but he is so ignorant of American culture he can't understand how to enroll his children in school or seek social services?

NYC is a melting pot of many different cultures, especially on the Lower East Side where the family lived. There is no excuse to deny your children an education and lock them away . Especially when the kids are so clearly bright. Think of what they might have accomplished if they were able to go to school.

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You do more of a disservice to Oscar than those who want to lock him up!

Oscar isn't some sort of naive fish out of water. I believe that he and his wife travelled extensively before landing in NYC. They were bohemians and lived in a commune or two if I recall. Whatever caused Oscar to act that way, it wasn't culture shock and I doubt there is a language barrier.

We can't know without hearing both sides of the story (which Oscar refuses to give) but the mother seems to have that look about her that you frequently see on people who are in or recently out of a cult. Whatever happened in that apartment she clearly did not feel free to leave. She was also totally astranged from her family, so much so that they hired a private detective who couldn't locate her! This is consistent with emotional abuse and brain washing. While nobody claimed physical abuse, the fact that both she and the children geared what would happen if anyone tried to leave indicates that they were familiar with whatever type of punishment he doled out and feared it enough to not leave the house without his permission for years. If I were to guess, I would say that the reason that it happened at that particular time and that nothing happened had a lot to due with the fact that there were 6 teenage boys and he knew that they were strong enough--be it physically or emotionally--to fight back.

As I said, we can't know for sure what happened and there are certainly people who doubt the veracity of the story all together. But from what we do know, there is absolutely zero evidence that indicates that Oscar didn't speak the language and was too naive/stupid/whatever to navigate life and the social services system. To be honest, I don't like your subtle hints that somehow the wife was the one in control...that he left his home to move to hers, that only she would have the ability to figure out how to access social services. Remember that the two of them lived in various places and that he was the only one with a key to the apartment. If you were not trying to flip the script and place the bulk of the blame on the wife, then I am sorry for reading that into your comment.

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Addendum to my previous list of comments:

6. The family practiced the Hare Krishna religion. How did a Peruvian Indian boy hear about this weird, American hippie religion based on ancient Hindu scriptures? Most Peruvians are Catholic! The only one that had visited Tibet was the mom, Susanne.

7. If you see pictures of the mom, Susanne, when she was younger, she was a stunning beauty! The dad, Oscar, not so much. Poor guy didn't stand a chance! He followed her to a whole other continent!

8. The mom, Susanne, is much older in age and has much more world experience from her travels, she should have known better!

I wish someone would interview Oscar's Peruvian mom, and ask her what she thinks of the situation. In her eyes, some older blue-eyed "gringa" stole her little Indian boy, took him far, far away, and she never saw him again!

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I didn't know about Susanne's family hiring a private eye, where did you read/hear that? It was obvious to me that she had been denied contact with her family for several years, though there was no probing to make he say why on camera. There was also no context as to why she finally phoned her mother after so many years. Before I saw the movie, I had a dozen questions; after seeing it, I had three dozen!

May I bone your kipper, Mademoiselle?

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"Serrano"! "Cholo"! Those are the words of contempt, "high-class, white" Peruvians use to describe poor Indians from the mountains.

Poor Indians suffer discrimination in their own country!

*Just imagine how they would get treated in the United States.

How do you think Susanne's white American family treated this poor Indian from the Andes Mountains? Do you think they welcomed him with open arms? Do you really think they were happy for the couple?

P.S. You don't have to wonder, you can see it for yourself, here are some links:

ABC What would you do? Latino Hate Crime Episode

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ru1F29vuVKI

ABC What Would You Do? Accent Discrimination Episode

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juSWh_EWneY

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"MOVE!" screams Mukunda and then he KICKS his father!

You don’t treat a dog like that! Let alone your own father!

For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death. Matthew 15:4 King James Version (KJV)

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That's not fair for you to say, you did not live that kids life, you don't know what that man did to him, for all anyone outside of that family knows his father could have sexually abused him, he could have simply beaten him for speaking to him the wrong way as a child. Now as an adult he is going to come in there and try to be his controlling self, a light kick isn't out of line to remind him that you are not a little boy that is going to continue to be pushed around.

I'm not even going to bother addressing the religious text as it has no place in this discussion, and I don't see the need to escalate this into a discussion about peoples beliefs

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[deleted]

[deleted]

"We'll do better."

"You grow and learn."

In the words of Jesus Christ, "Forgive them for they do not know what they do . . ."

These are the words of Mr. Oscar Angulo in the documentary.

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How completely offensive for you to inject your religion and your religious views into something that has nothing to do with them. If they are Krishnas, then your religion has ZERO involvement and coincidentally, it is YOU who are violating your own religious tenants. In one of the Ten Commandments, is specifically says that you shall not take thy Lord's name in vain. By you telling people what is right buy God, you act as if you are doing it for God. Sorry buddy, God can speak for himself and that commandment specifically means that you shall not act using his name to justify your actions. If you knew Hebrew, like the original is written in, you would know that. Instead, you start to inject your religious views here when your racist defense starts to fail from previous comments.

Yes, there is racism in South American countries against darker skin amongst the same groups of people and I don't need ABC to tell me that but you speak in very ambiguous terms and generalities. You also try and influence people into your hypothetical imaginations that are construed as if you had information that you do not.

The previous commentors mention the diversity of NYC. You obviously have never been to a large city where there are sections of people who speak little to no English and NYC probably has more of those than anyplace in the world since it is THE place immigrants have settled in small groups from all over the world since it was established. I still want subtitles when some of them speak English...

There is no defense of a hypercontrolling man and he is so lucky that so much good came from such terrible judgement. He just is one of those guys who happened to get lucky enough to find someone he could control and then raised a family under that submissiveness. I "speculate" that he refused to be interviewed simply because it was not within his control and he had already lost control of his family the way he knew it. They were not out of control, just out of his control.

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How completely offensive for you to inject your religion and your religious views into something that has nothing to do with them.


Wow. Defensive much? The poster was quoting some the very limited dialog of the "antagonist" of the film...the one we all love to hate.

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