Jim vs. Tony

Tony was awesome - very likeable, friendly and engaging. Jim was a bit distant, and in the book he admitted he had very few friends due to his taciturn personality. (taciturn = think of Eilis when she was first working at Bartocci's). But we know Jim was an only child - Tony grew up in a large, emotionally expressive family.

He did say he wanted to go to London and Paris and travel. And his family seemed to have money. So I don't think it would have been a boring life. Tony was middle class (at least at that moment, maybe later with the company he'd have money) so they would have been stuck in Brooklyn.

Just to say I share your view of it, as i've elaborated in two other threads here. Well said, annievtex.

Hi annlevtex!

I don't think she should have been with either of them. I wonder if she actually would have married Tony if she hadn't been grieving her sister's death? Tony put passive-aggressive pressure on her her to get married before she left. He wanted her to be tied to him so she would have to come back. She tried (not nearly hard enough) to get him to accept a promise rather than get married. He came off a bit desperate imo.

But I don't think Jim was the answer, either. I agree with what you said about her needing to go back to NY. The film didn't even touch on the aspect of the RC Church in Ireland. It was ten times more oppressive for Irish Catholic women in Ireland than in the US.

There's a reason why people are encouraged NOT to make life-altering decisions (such as getting married) within a year of experiencing the death of a loved one.

I didn't find the Eillis-Tony love story very convincing. To me, it seemed like Ellis was so glad to see Tony again when she got back to Brooklyn, because she was glad to be back in Brooklyn, period. I think she sort of equated him with what her life in NY meant to her. But life in Brooklyn in the 1950s Is only slightly better than in Her little village in Ireland, if you're married, Catholic, and a woman. She'll spend the next 15-20 years up to her elbows in diapers -- so much for a career in bookkeeping.

Funny that you should mention Anne of Green Gable. When I watched this movie, I mentally put Tony on my "best guys in books" list right next to Gilbert Blythe. I think Tony compares more to Gilbert that Jim does. He comes from a low-income family and had to work hard for his future. He can easily be viewed as the boring choice, but he is devoted beyond words and often wears his heart on his sleeve. Both Tony and Gilbert had to let their sweethearts go before they came back to them.

The thing about class and money, though, is that in Ireland that was far more stagnant. You saw from the start of the movie how Miss Kelly let the more upper-crust woman butt in line at the store. Tony wasn't as set in life, but he was on his way up and there was so much room to grow. It was a time of enormous economic mobility and social change in America, unlike in Ireland where your role was more set in stone.

It did bother me that when she was "caught" she chose to return. But at least we saw her reading Tony's letters finally and writing back before that happened (didn't we?). Also, hearing from that judgmental, gossipy cow reminded her of why she shouldn't stay, why America and Tony were what she had always wanted. He and America were sort of a package. I wish the relationship had had more time to grow but to be fair they didn't have unlimited time to tell the story, and people did marry younger and more impulsively then.

I think it was meant to be seen as a risk, just like her choice to leave in the first place. But she realized that risk was worth it.

And for the record I absolutely believe she was in love with him and thought he'd be a good husband. There are no guarantees, but it probably had as good a chance of being a happy marriage as any other.

I think she was very much considering staying in Ireland, but that witchy general store owner that showed her true colors again to Ailis...that sealed the deal. She said she had forgotten how things were there and remembered part of the reason she wanted to leave in the first place.

'Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect'-Mark Twain

It was Eilis that initiated the sex with Tony. He didn't force her at all. If you watch the deleted scenes, after she agrees to marry him, he walks her back to the boarding house and she asks him to come in and he responds "really" because he's surprised.

Tony mentioning kids and marriage was, imho, a sign of his passion and devotion for Eilis, never coming across as forcing her into anything. And in fact he was wise about the importance of their marrying before her trip, but he didn't 'force' her too and when she decides she agrees with him, as noted here by another poster, it comes across her recognition that she also wants that pre-trip officializing of their love for her own reasons as well.

Jim's "love" for her was following a sort of 'village script' - which was exactly what Eilis had from the outset opted to get away from, with her sister Rose's blessing .. To come back to that scripted life (whether it included travel to London etc or not) would have been a surrender by Eilis to something status quo in contrast to the passion-inducing risk-taking that it meant to start life in a new country and with a man who had singled her out from a crowd as his true love.

Eilis's chemistry with Tony was much better. Drawing from the book, Eilis held back from Tony because to her, he represented giving up on the idea of having a home in Ireland ever. Even though she'd moved to America, she wasn't 100% committed. The character in the book was beyond passive - practically the walking dead. At one point she thinks she'd be perfectly happy if Rose went to America and she just lived with her mother the rest of her life.

The movie makes it so she wakes up in Ireland, and when she returns to Tony she's committed. The big point being he belongs to her alone. That's in the voiceover, that's something Saoirse Ronan said. Everybody in Ireland has a piece of her, but nobody but her knows about her and Tony - it's all hers. She'll have a better life with Tony. Jim was good on paper, but kind of boring for the long hall. Tony was fun, his family was fun, close, hardworking, smart, and focused on building a better life. FF ten years, Tony and his brothers and their construction company in Long Island will be better off than Jim owning a pub. There's more growth with Tony, more support.

When I think about it, Eilis had to fight against inheriting the traits of her extremely passive mother. Sometimes passive aggressive, but her mother basically relied on others to make her life go in any direction. Eilis had those tendencies and when she hooked up with Tony, she was more energized. Also, I feel that the glamor and assurance that had attracted Jim and others in the town would dissipate once she stayed on in Ireland, because she wouldn't be up on the latest styles, wouldn't be living the same life with challenges.

>I will also say that I personally probably would have gone with Jim. I have a thing for the tall, quiet types. <

I feel the same. Ellis looks good with tall, white-collar, intellectual and somewhat refined Jim. As for the profession, she is better educated and is slightly taller than Tony. When Ellis and Tony are sitting in the restaurant, dancing in the hall, and walking side by side in the street, I couldn't stop eyeing on their height. The size matters.

She was an excellent catch for Tony.

Irish and Italian is a very common mix in America. Both ethnicities tend to be Catholic.