I'm new to the series and have a question. - Black Sails (2014) Discussion

It gets worse in the 3rd season when Flint opens a disco in Nassau

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It gets worse in the 3rd season when Flint opens a disco in Nassau

Ok , lol you just made me spew coffee all over my keyboard..... That was hilarious.

Oh boy, another one who has problems with one teensy gay kiss. It bothers you to watch two men kiss but I'll bet my right arm you enjoy watching all the violence done to people in this show. Think about that: one is a sign of love and the other a sign hate. Yet you're bothered by a show of affection. Go figure! 

I WILL NEVER GIVE UP! 

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[–] IntestinalFortitude 7 years ago

Pretty disgusting and insensitive wording there.
There were hints to flint being gay and having hidden motivations since the first season, rewatch his conversations with miranda (mainly episode 7 of season 1) him lying about the maria elaine ship there are others but id have to rewatch.
He wages this war because 'civilized' society destroyed his life all because of something he had no control over (who he loved) it makes sense that this would make him become the character we know and is much better backstory than him just trying to get rich and powerful.

One of the themes of this show is how society creates its own monsters, all the main pirates have their own reasons for despising england and for the most part are pretty well justified.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

Nothing I wrote is disgusting or insensitive. I was just stating facts. May be you are too sensitive. I wouldn't know. I agree that there were some hint that Flint's past could be complicated.

it makes sense that this would make him become the character we know and is much better backstory than him just trying to get rich and powerful.

That is the most cliched concept ever. Man betrayed by country and government turns against it. It would have felt cliched even if Flint's lover was a women.

Men didn't turn to piracy because they felt betrayed. They became pirates because they didn't like how the countries ruled. They didn't bend or bow to law. They were outlaws. They saw something they took it. At least that's how history tells it.

So Flint's actions are a means to an end, that he really doesn't care about being a pirate, he just wants to build Nassau and then may be he'd give up piracy. Tell that to his crew who know nothing but piracy and do not have a score to settle except steal some gold.

You don't become a pirate to achieve some life goal. Once you become a pirate, you die a pirate. Bet that's not Flint has in his mind.

The very Idea of Flint becoming a pirate to convince other pirates to renounce their piracy and work for a colonial rule is appalling. Atleast that's what has been the storyline up to S02.

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[–] Bioparadoxous 7 years ago

Men didn't turn to piracy because they felt betrayed. They became pirates because they didn't like how the countries ruled.



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There's no such thing as the establishment. Everyone knows that!

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[–] IntestinalFortitude 7 years ago

"This totally rewrites the character's goals and motivations. As a straight guy I'm not really interested in watching stories written with gay leading characters. I'm sure some of you out there felt this way. So I just want to know if this is how the rest of the story is going to be? "

This is disgusting and your inability to see why its insensitive and disgusting is disgusting.

Dont really care to address your other points the shows clearly not for you.

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[–] TheFirstStormAndTheLast 7 years ago

"Men didn't turn to piracy because they felt betrayed. They became pirates because they didn't like how the countries ruled. They didn't bend or bow to law. They were outlaws. They saw something they took it. At least that's how history tells it. "

Because they don't like how countries rule? You mean like persecuting and outlawing your sexual preference limiting you to be less than what you are because some uptight prick is mad about what you do behind closed doors. S in other words he didn't like the way they ruled and their laws about his sexual preference. You literally destroyed your own argument.

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[–] Bioparadoxous 7 years ago

Because they don't like how countries rule? You mean like persecuting and outlawing your sexual preference

You literally destroyed your own argument.

That's why "lol" emoji. I think he's goofing. Nobody defeats themselves in one breath like that, there's usually more breathing room between contradictory thoughts, makes them easier to compartmentalize.

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There's no such thing as the establishment. Everyone knows that!

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

but you have no problems with all the lesbian sex since the show started?

Yeah rightyo. Brace yourself for the graphic sex scene between them then. They also organise a gay mardi gras on Nassau. It's great fun.

Hilarious that in Sir Reginald Trollington's thread you said whiners need therapy. Calling Dr Freud.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

No straight man in his right mind would complain about lesbians sex on t.v except may be when it's over used. And when did simply asking a question turn into whining?

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

Quit your whining. It was a two second kiss. if that's enough to make your balls shrivel you obviously didn't have any to start with.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

If you are offended because you think I didn't like the two second kiss I'm sorry. It's not like I set out to offend gay people. I'm just not accustomed to PDA of gay men.

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

I'm not the least bit offended you didn't like it I'm just looking forward to your disgust at the raunchy sex scene.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

Well you might get your wish of enjoying yourself to my disgust of the "raunchy sex scene", if that's your thing.

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

http://38.media.tumblr.com/814b37573048b230b81e12806940ff50/tumblr_nk611i1MOC1qacgvvo1_400.gif

http://www.newnownext.com/wp-content/uploads/backlot/2015/02/black-sails-rupert-penry-jones-toby-stephensb.jpg

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c1/65/6d/c1656db08ab88036b34953e41f5e3a5f.jpg

There you go. Knock yourself out, champ.

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[–] Bioparadoxous 7 years ago

Flint just kissed a guy. I don't have anything against homosexuals but I kinda feel disappointed because I was lead to believe that Flint's motivations was to make war against the world and loot for himself, now it seems he does it all to be with some guy he loves. Pfft.

 Is this a joke?

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There's no such thing as the establishment. Everyone knows that!

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

Anything can be a joke, if you try hard enough.

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[–] skeletornumber70 7 years ago

Pretty sure it was the plan from the beginning, just a twist that was built up, so it doesn't rewrite any history. You just didn't know the history until now. And Flint's sexuality was never the focus of the show so it really changes nothing about the character. And I'm a straight man as well, I'm just glad instead of shoehorning a gay character in for pc reasons they actually introduced a homosexual relationship that served the story. Believe it or not these types of relationships were always part of the world, and in this period of time would have been met with similar consequences, so it's interesting to see how that would affect a man like Flint in how he views the world.

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

I thought the reveal was very well done, and on a rewatch all the hints were there but they were clever in their subtlety. I found the kiss beautifully done, not the least bit offensive, and the reveal of Flint's banishment while the love of his life was incarcerated in a mental institution by his own father very fitting to explain his outright hatred against the establishment. Really don't see why some people found it so outrageous. didn't feel at all shoehorned, unlike the homosexual element in Tyrant which went nowhere and they really could have done something interesting with homosexuality in the middle east. The kiss was beautifully tragic, and very well done by two very blokey actors.

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[–] christianhgrey 7 years ago

Pirates had no problem with being gay, they were more accepting of it. I cant believe that bothers you.

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[–] TheFirstStormAndTheLast 7 years ago

Don't feed the trolls. Especially the ones who aren't even good at it.

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[–] RomaVictorrrr 7 years ago

I'm sure some of you out there felt this way. So I just want to know if this is how the rest of the story is going to be?

Dude! Don't you know that ever since the show was revealed as having gay characters, fans have formed a kind of protectorate with it, ready to shield it from any potshots coming from "enemies" or "homophobes"? Now you're the "disgusting", "insensitive" villain. :)

But if your question is if there's more, the straight answer is NOT REALLY. Except for a few mentions, they practically drop it. And when Flint is going through his hallucinations early in Season 3, it's Miranda he dreams about--not sweet Thomas.

Unless they have another...surprise in store for Season 4.

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[–] IntestinalFortitude 7 years ago

It's one thing to make valid criticisms about the show or the reveal, it's another to say I'm straight and not watching a show with a gay character. Sorry you or OP can't see the difference but then again some people just like being contrarian more than they want to try to be morally decent.

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[–] RomaVictorrrr 7 years ago

Well, I'm straight and I've got plenty of criticisms and I thought the reveal was a big misdirection and I still watch the show even with a gay character. So there. :)

Still, you have to see why SOME people were put off by that reveal.

Can you imagine John McClaine in the middle of Die Hard revealing that the real reason his wife left is because...he was loving another man? Or James Bond saying the real reason he was a womanizer was because...he was almost disgraced once for a gay tryst and had to over-compensate? Or a pirate captain in a Michael Bay-produced pirate show, a character almost as driven and desperate as our favorite manly TV characters (Vic Mackey, Tony Soprano, Jack Bauer, Walter White), revealing that his real reason for doing this is because...of a gay lover? It changes things. Drastically.

It's jarring. Right or wrong, I'm sorry, people are going to find it jarring. No amount of shaming or yelling at the person that they're DISGUSTING or INSENSITIVE will change that. But I guess it'll shut them down.

I'm still on board. Because I enjoy the show, not out of some obligation towards...moral decency...(read: political correctness? Is this the real reason critics shy away from critiquing this show?)...

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[–] IntestinalFortitude 7 years ago

If they fit with the character/story then no I wouldn't mind any of those things. There are enough clues in the first 13 episodes that Flint being gay isn't just thrown in out of left field it just takes a rewatch to see that. Anyways Flint came to agree with Thomas about his vision for Nassau and I guess the whole world before they even kissed, their relationship and the subsequent unnatural end of it forced him to go the lengths we see in the show.

And lol just saw you mention political correctness not sure why I respond to types who associate political correctness with trying not to be a jerk. Hate to be political but it's sickening Trump normalized this garbage with his obsession with not being PC.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

Good Lord finally someone who gets it. Was wondering why the people over here were so damn defensive or offensive to be precise. I admit that a mere kissing scene is what made me ask the question but that was really my shock to the misdirection and the reactions over here are uncalled for. There was even scene where a characters comments that Flint had an affair with a women. I'm not used to watching homosexual content which is may be why I didn't pick up on those clues. You get what my point is and you also wrote down exactly my thoughts on the subject.

Just because someone doesn't like watching gay themed stories on T.V doesn't mean they are homophobic or disgusting and insensitive. I watch lot of movies surrounding male and female characters. But I also don't like watching chick flicks. Does it make me disgusting and insensitive for saying that? Also it is not like I knowingly went to a message board of an openly gay themed T.V show and questioned it. It's like they perceived that I set out to offend the entire gay community and all came rushing to attack.

And I did watch the show further and it looks promising so far. Some talk about moral decency and then themselves resort to indecent name calling.

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

Also it is not like I knowingly went to a message board of an openly gay themed T.V show and questioned it.

Since when was it an openly gay themed tv show? You seem to have your nuts in a knot about a 2 second kiss, mate.

all came rushing to attack.

LOL.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

I hope you get a second look at what I said cause you don't seem to understand what I said.

I said

Also it is not like I knowingly went to a message board of an openly gay themed T.V show and questioned it.

You ask

Since when was it an openly gay themed tv show?

The important thing to notice here is IT IS NOT LIKE I WENT TO A .....

What it means is I did not go to an openly gay themed t.v show and ask why the character is suddenly revealed as being gay.

I asked a plain and simple question and was met with only ridicule and hate which is what has dragged the conversation this far.

It's because of people like this who attack anyone who does not concede to your understanding, IMDb has decided to shutdown it's message boards.

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

You seem to have your nuts in a knot about a 2 second kiss, mate.

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[–] itz_theo 7 years ago

I hope you are able to come up with a better response in a real life conversation and I see no point in continuing this convo with you further.

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[–] danloki 7 years ago

You're really getting into a lather, lad. Try hosing yourself down.

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[–] dbpantera 7 years ago

After reading all the responses, many with very direct opinions on the matter, I would simply suggest doing a little google search using pirates and homosexuality.

As others have stated, upon re-watching the series, there was definitely subtle clues to Flint's sexuality (he has a very bored look on his face while having sex with Miranda Barlow). However, his sexuality is never a driving force to the story's plot. It can be assumed Peter Ashe knew of Flint's relationship with Thomas Hamilton (end of season 2) and Flint openly tells John Silver upon burying the cache of pearls on Maroon Island (end of Season 3) about his story in which Silver never raises questions specifically about his sexuality, most likely because pirate culture was much more progressive in their ideologies toward sexuality.

Another thing that may be of interest is to read about how and why men and women became pirates during the Golden Age of Piracy. While the stories are quite scarce and often embellished, it may provide insight as to the motives of why someone would seek out the life of a pirate. I lived in this part of the world for two years, and have always found the history of each of these islands to be quite interesting.

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[–] RomaVictorrrr 7 years ago

Silver never raises questions specifically about his sexuality, most likely because pirate culture was much more progressive in their ideologies toward sexuality.

it's more likely Silver himself had no issue with it. Information comes to him and he decides quick whether or not he can use it. But he's never freaked out by things. He walks into a murder scene and immediately thinks of how to clean it up. Vane murders a wretch Silver used to negotiate the sale of the Urca schedule and he quickly finds another wretch to use.

Flint could've told Silver he was a secret cannibal that worshiped the devil and Silver wouldn't have been too bothered.

But the show NEVER shows us this alleged "sexual progressiveness" of the other pirates. Even if you believe it was "most likely" there historically, you can't really use that to explain a character's actions here.

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