MovieChat Forums > Before Midnight (2013) Discussion > I'll tell you what Celine's real issue i...

I'll tell you what Celine's real issue is----Jesse's fatal flaw


A great job has been done here analyzing the ins and outs of their disconnect and who's 'right' and 'wrong' on what points, but here's what it all boils down to, deeper than Chicago or her career or either's infidelity....

She ain't getting laid proper.

Jesse's clearly sunk into a sexual complacency of the very worst kind. Her infamous attack on his prowess isn't just a cheap shot....his foreplay before the phone rings confirms it. Nothing exciting is going on here, erotically. Actually, I found it disturbing. Almost like he was paying some creepy homage to the Mother before plunging in to get his rocks off.

The ripples of this are endless. OF COURSE any woman erotically unfulfilled will lash out in the end. He takes it for granted (in a very American way) that enthusiasm equals ability. She complains in 'Sunset' that French men aren't near horny enough, and that may be true---but she also doesn't want to just get railed by an American teenager. There's an entire world of subtlety in sex that he seems to have missed.

This wasn't always the case, evidently. She's looking pretty satisfied that morning in 'Sunrise,' and I don't at all doubt their reunion in 'Sunset,' minutes after the film ends, was electric as all hell, for both parties. But somewhere down the road, he got complacent. She's known real passion and he just ain't providing it lately.

If anyone objects that there's more to a relationship than sex, of course there is. But sex is the bass line, the inner dynamic and rhythm of a union. It doesn't have to be constant or fiendish---unrealistic after many years---but it's got to have depth and be right on the money. And it isn't. This sounds pretty out there, but I truly believe that their outer problems stem from this. We can only hope he makes good on his word at the end, and redeems both the evening and their alliance together.

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We can only hope he makes good on his word at the end, and redeems both the evening and their alliance together.

...like the saying however goes, you can't teach an old dog new pricks.

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Maybe Jesse isn't getting laid proper either, hence his diminished prowess ?


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Of course it goes both ways---but to go with the old double standard, it's all a little more dependent on the man. Though she probably, with her constant domestic worries, didn't exactly make things erotic. A general malaise, I suppose---whatever its origin, the results we see are disturbing.

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Impugning his cocksmanship is an amusing thought, but I think the bad sex is a symptom, not a cause. The problems obviously run much deeper than just uninspired sex.

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Yeah, it's hard to really tell what's cause and what's symptom---impossible, really. They're probably so deeply entwined that it makes no pragmatic difference which. A disconnect will always be sexual, either at first or later.

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Itsmedrooms, darling, saw that in a relatively state British movie, the not-so-unique barb about 'impugning one's "cocksmanship"...'....boooring...come up with an original, dahling...

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Ummm...it's 2 am ... That was 'stale' British movie...trés apologetique...

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You seem to care very deeply, from your name and all. I don't strictly know what I'm missing, of course, but I've always found shagging rather amazingly pleasant. There are worse things out there, sex-crime-wise. Just ask King Solomon.

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Well. What exactly is good sex? Is it more than kissing and fucking? She did called him a pervert on a few occasions. Women need to tell their men what they expect otherwise we thing enough is enough. But women are EPIC at hiding their feelings and their personal needs.

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