Greatest Quote Ever
"In all the years to come in your most private moments, I want you to remember the one man who beat you." - Batman (After beating the crap out of Superman).
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MovieChat Forums > Batman: The Dark Knight Returns, Part 2 (2013) Discussion > Greatest Quote Ever
The "one man" who beat him? What about Lex Luthor? Is Green Arrow not also someone who contributed to "beating" Superman?
How does it feel to be deconstructed?share
Green Arrow did contributed, but it was Batman who came up with the plan of defeating him. Even if Green Arrow wasn't there he would have still found a way to hit Superman with the Kryptonite.
As for Lex, I never believed he truly beat Superman. He may have weakened him before, but not really beaten him because Superman kept coming back.
Batman even explained that he only used enough kryptonite to weaken him to tell him something, otherwise he could have seriously finished him off.
This moment reminded of Justice League: Doom
SPOILER ALERT!!!!!
Batman collected data on everyone's strengths and weakness, so in case he would have to fight them one day he would know how to beat them.
Even still, it's not the same if Superman was battling Batman like he was an enemy. Throughout a lot of the fight, Superman didn't really want to fight Batman.
Once Batman's helmet came off, Superman could have smashed his face in if he punched it. But he always aimed for his armor in the chest area so he could hurt, but not kill Bruce.
Which isn't to say Superman didn't deserve to get beaten, cause he did. He was a total moron in this. But it's really not quite the same to say "I BEAT YOU" to someone who is barely trying.
How does it feel to be deconstructed?share
But that's percisely why and how Batman got the better of Superman in the fight; Superman didn't take it seriously and avoided putting a stop to Bruce rather than treat it like a serious threat. He really did deserve to get beaten if he thought so little of his opponent to only defend or take shots at Batman that weren't vital.
Gotta say it, going into the fight being the underdog helped out tremendously in Batman's favor. He was underestimated, physically outmatched and overpowered by Superman's strength even with the nuke and little sunlight, and no superpowers whatsoever but his intellect. Plus, it always helps out to have a few friends to deliver the distracting or finishing touches.
But that's exactly why the fight was so BAD (not from a visual standpoint - I enjoyed it in that aspect). Superman and Batman have been "friends" (or at least colleagues) for years. It just makes Superman look like a MORON. Not that he isn't already one for giving up ALL of his freedoms to be a pawn for the US government (as if a man who could survive a nuclear missile would ever answer to any authority like that - seriously, Frank Miller... That's like a human taking orders from ANTS).
Superman KNOWS or at least SHOULD know Bruce's determination, willpower, and intelligence. The very fact that we are to believe that he would think that way now is stupid. No, he doesn't want to hurt Bruce, but you'd have to be really stupid to not even take advantage of a situation and end it quickly. Seriously, all it would take is a flick of a finger to Bruce's face and he'd be out cold. And Superman wouldn't have had to have done any physical harm at all.
How does it feel to be deconstructed?share
In that universe, Earth-31, Bruce hasn't befriended Clark like he did in the mainstream comics. Bruce took to Hal Jordan after joining the Justice League. After the government starts to crack down on the superheroes most give it up, Superman goes to for for the president, Wonder Woman goes back to her people, Oliver Queen gets fed up with it and goes much the way Bruce does and Hal leaves Earth. Superman considers Bruce a friend but he sees that the government is only using him.
Miller clearly set it up to where no matter what Superman would look like the bad guy and Batman had to show him, and the city to a larger extent, they were wrong.
I'm not much of a Superman fan to begin with. Honestly feel like he's a bit of a cop out of a character that can even survive death. Got all the powers under the sun but this one radioactive meteorite from his homeworld gets him weak in the knees. Batman's obviously human and has none of that, only his intellect and gadgetry to get by. Instantly more relateible, but I did enjoy the first two Christopher Reeve movies and this upcoming Man of Steel doesn't look horrible.
You know that superman not seldomly is a bit a Moron? :) He has goodness in him down to the bones. Thats why he always acts automatically morally. And thats his real weakness and the reason why it is even possible to trick him now and then into doing the wrong thing. Superman has godlike powers, but he is for sure not the smartest superhero. Batman instead acts moraly only because he desided to do so. And often his smartness is his strongest weapon. Superman may be able to push a planet out of its track, but he would for surly not win a game of chess against batman :). And that is what this battle was about and the reason why batman won.
sharePrecisely. Batman knows that Supes is a boyscout, and will try to go easy on him. It is Superman's primary weakness. Batman knew he would have time to beat on Superman, and get the kryptonite into the air for him to breathe...and never worried for a second that he would lose.
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I just have to lol at the people who insist on "what if this" or "what if superman did that..". The fact is he didnt, and got beat up. He underestimated Bruce, and got sent back to boy scout school.
What If's dont amount to much after a fight ends, because the result is written in stone.
P.S. Also have to roll my eyes when i read "just hit him with kryptonite", which is of course, found everywhere on earth? lol
Yes, because the rare fragments of Superman's homeworld are just all over for anyone to pick up. Bruce even says that "it wasn't easy to make. It took years and cost a fortune." Unless you're someone with billions to spend like himself or Lex Luthor, doubt just any Joe Schmo would have Kryptonite in their back pocket.
Superman truly got his ass handed to him by a lowly human, a real man without all the natural-born gifts Clark takes for granted. And the reason why he didn't just float in the air and melt Batman's armor is simple: he didn't wish to harm or hurt Bruce, he just wanted to put a stop to his vigilante activities in Gotham City.
So what if he flew around the Earth really fast in the opposite direction of its rotation and turned back time so Bruce never put the suit back on and then flew the correct way around Earth to resume time? Why didn't he do that? Because it wouldn't have made sense, nor would any other "what if" scenarios. Wasn't part of his mission in the first place. Secondly, he still thought of Bruce as a friend even if the feeling wasn't mutual.
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This movie wasn't "Superman: The Animated Series" or the other live-action shows revolving around the character. It's not even in the so-called "DC Animated Universe" that was created from the starting point of Batman: The Animated Series and went through to Batman Beyond and Justice League Unlimited. This movie is part of the DC Universe Animated Original Movies that are usually their own self-contained movies, though a few have related to each other.
Superman's got that one weakness, and of course, Batman is going to utilize it like any other skilled tactician would in his position.
I get that Superman was just laying there and taking it for the most part, knowing what he could do to the aged Bruce Wayne if he tried. And that's the whole message he was delivering in that quote, that Superman grossly underestimated just exactly who he was going up against based on the fact that he was a human and therefore not as powerful as himself.
And if I remember right, Superman didn't let him go or anything. The fight ended because Bruce faked his death with a simulated heart attack and "died". If it was anything, it would be the other way around with Batman having the upperhand on Superman who was still reeling from the powdered Kryptonite in his lungs. But Batman doesn't and wouldn't kill, even if the government or the president asked him to.
It's funny tat you say Batman doesn't kill, because he just killed The Joker... Even though he should have killed him years before hand.
And it's not that Superman underestimated him, Superman did not want to fight his friend plain and simple. An dim sorry folks but this is not Superman any way. Superman is not a government puppet. He doesn't interfere with wars or anything like that, he's made that speech many times. He never imposes his power.
All in all,, Miller can't write Superman... Fact.
Hmm, I didn't see The Joker flat-out keel over and cease life functions when Batman broke his neck. He did it in a precise way to paralize him to keep him from continuing his little "Look at me, I just broke out. I killed people. I give up, take me in. I'm sorry, let me out, I've changed. Really!" routine. I'm guessing you missed the part where Joker is berating him after breaking his neck for losing control.
Yes, Batman does feel responsible for all the people The Joker has killed over the years and even admits to it at one point. "All the people I've murdered by letting you live..."
Anyway, that's just my opinion that Superman underestimated Batman as stated in the reasons above and even in part of your reasoning why the fight was lacking. I did feel Superman was a bit like Dr. Manhattan in Watchmen being Reagan's go-to guy for whatever ruckus was going on in the world. Maybe that was Miller jabbing at Moore's work on Watchmen.
Simply put, if you're watching a movie called "Batman: The Dark Knight Returns", you're probably not watching it for the appearance of Superman. We all know why you came and probably watched both parts.
Ummmm, I did see the movie lol. Sorry, Batman killed Joker. You don't "break someone's neck to stop them" you do it to kill them. It reminded me of the storyline in the comics when Superman had to kill the Kryptonian criminals from that pocket dimension otherwise they were going to kill everyone on Earth.... And then it drove Superman crazy.
Obviously I saw that scene, no need to be rude..... Yeesh.
Ad I've stated before that this is a Batman story so I don't expect Superman to come out on top or anything, but I am not a fan of how the character was handled and I don't believe that Batman technically beat superman since Superman didn't want to fight him in the first place.
Ok, so you saw how after Batman twisted his neck, it made the cracking noise, Joker fell down and was still talking. There is such a thing as people breaking their necks and living. I believe it happened to Lucy Lawless from Xena: Warrior Princess, singer Gloria Estefan, and even Christopher Reeve who's portrayed Superman in the 70s and 80s live-action movies. You can actually recover from it, too, depending on where the break occured and the severity.
So, yes, it is possible for this to occur and Batman did this to The Joker to stop him because there was no other way short of killing him, which he doesn't do.
On the subject of Superman himself in this movie, you can clearly tell Miller didn't much care for the character or was trying to make some alligory between him and Dr. Manhattan from Watchmen. But seriously, guy might as well be called God Man if he can survive a nuke going off in his face and being struck by lightning. Bruce forced the issue by continuing his vigilante crime fighting against those that would tear Gotham City apart in the blackout, and it didn't have to come to that which is what Clark tries to convey to him in that meeting and several times during the fight.
batman has dope karate skills
joker killed himself foo
plus supes is a pansy school boy he's not very bright
Good arguments from both sides until I read "batman killed joker." -__- no he didn't. He paralyzed him. Joker was talking to batman after it happened for crying out loud. It's joker that ends up killing himself claiming batman will be blamed for his death
shareI am watching this right now... Joker breaks his own neck batman is a good 10 ft away .... He even says they'll blame you.....and we do...lol
shareThe Batman quote? Don't know what you were watching but this was said right after the Batmobile goes into a crater and Bruce picks up Superman. Then he promptly has his fake heart attack.
shareOkay so everybody's arguing that Superman held back and he coulda finished it quick BUT in the same respect Batman could've used full powered un-engineered kryptonite and took sups down pretty quick. If you're going to over think the plot and story overthink it for both sides.
shareYeah that is true, this wasn't really the all out battle of Superman and Batman. They are both holding back, because Superman could have burned Batman to a crisp at any time, but chooses to let him pick a place so they can fight.
Batman also holds back too, he doesn't want to kill Superman so he makes sure he uses a cheaper version of kryptonite. He wants to show Clark the error of his ways, and then fakes his own death so he can continue his work, and Superman can continue his.
I much preferred the line " So who do they send after YOU?"
sharePeople miss some of the points in the fight.
Bruce kinda knew that fighting Superman could kill him. He just needed to weaken him enough for Green Arrow to deliver the Coup de grâce or finishing blow to the "Man of Steel"
Whats the point of a signature?share
I think people are missing the point of the entire fight. Neither wanted to kill the other. They both knew that Clark could kill Bruce anytime he wants from orbit if he was really trying to kill him, and Bruce mentions he could have used a lethal dose of kryptonite. The contest they were having was to see if Clark could capture him alive, in a "fair fight".
And Batman won the contest. I think they both understood the rules, and Clark wasn't able to bring him in without killing him.
Agreed, the OPs line was great but this line really clinched it.
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"You're feeling it now, aren't you? What the rest of us live with every day, your own mortality."
"A hero can be anyone."
I was disappointed they skipped Clark's arrogant thought as he rips off Bruce's helmet, "You're just bone and meat, like all the rest." I know people will claim that's "not Superman", but I always figured that's what someone like him would probably think to himself sometimes:)
shareCome to think of it, that's similar to Dr. Manhattan's line as he's recovering from disintegration and telling Ozymandius "the world's greatest man, to me, is little more than the world's greatest termite". I agree, I wish it had been in the movie--it's a very telling moment.
shareYep, good line, but he wasn't the first, Doomday was the first. I guess he was the first human.
Cult Leader my mind's frightening, I drink blood from a human skull like a Viking
Bada$$ quote, but in reality Superman didn't fight seriously with Bruce and he is not vain, so I doubt that he'll beat himself about it.
shareLol is that the excuse Superman fan boys tell themselves to help them sleep better at night because deep down they truly know that Batman is and always will be the better man? People act like Superman's invincible... get a dime sized piece of Kyrptonite and the Man of Steel becomes the epitome of weak. Batman could have easily ended Superman and sent a message to the Government but he didn't because hes the better man. Always has been.
shareI guess batman CAN beat superman...if superman is weakened by a nuclear weapon and several missiles and tank attacks, while taking it easy on batman trying to reason with him, being concerned with his health AND being struck from behind by a kryptonite arrow by green arrow and.... I guess he can beat superman when all those things come into play
I'm the guy who makes the "worst movie ever" thread in your favorite movie board
When you say it like that, you make it seem as if Batman showed up to Clark Kent's house and he'd morphed into a defenseless two year old and proceeded to brutally beat him within an inch of his life.
It's not as if Superman was that two year old; he had his laser sight, power of flight, ice breath, near invinciblity, and X-ray vision. Let alone he was aided by the national guard to block off the area and if it weren't for Robin and Green Arrow, they would have interfered if it looked like Batman were gaining the edge in battle.
It wasn't just a physical battle, but a battle of ideologies and morals. Clark Kent's had been corrupted by the president and the government in all those years and Bruce Wayne continued to stand for what was just. In the end, Batman's will persevered over Superman's altered perspective and he even acknowledges this by smiling to Carrie Kelley at the funeral when he knows Bruce is still alive and she will dig him out.
Superman "lost" only because he wasn't really trying. Had he treated Batman like the enemy and not tried to keep reasoning with him, he'd have killed him in no time. Fortunately for Batman, Batman KNOWS this about Superman; he knows he won't just kill him outright, so he uses that to his advantage. But in a straight-up brawl, with both of them out to win at any cost, it's no contest; Superman wins 100% of the time...if he wants to.
Here's to the health of Cardinal Puff.
What a load of nonsense. Batman wasn't really trying either, genius, otherwise he'd have mixed a different kryptonite batch.
In a straight up brawl, with the intention being the death or permanent disablement of the other, Batman wins 100% of the time. all he needs is to release a deadly or permanently dibilitating kryptonite into the air as Supes approaches, and Supes is a goner.
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