MovieChat Forums > Scenic Route (2013) Discussion > Evidence for conclusion.. (SPOILERS)

Evidence for conclusion.. (SPOILERS)


Hey guys,

Pretty impressed with this one, wasn't sure what to expect. Ended up being good, and I did like the ending.

I've just been reading a few posts on here and people seem pretty certain of what direction the end went in (both died in the desert).

Just wondering if any of you guys wouldn't mind explaining as to why you are so sure that the end sequence was not reality. I think it was pretty hard to call either way. And I am still undecided.

Looking forward to hearing other thoughts.

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I think it is medically implausible that after Carter was beaten to a pulp and lay dehydrated and unattended to in the punishing elements that he would suddenly come to and be coherrent and able to make their journey . I think Mitchell actually was also dehydrated and delusional and succombed to the elements. The facade of sudden reversal of fortune----Finding water,shelter,telephone service and transport to hospital was Mitchell's final descent into madness and of course the euphoric ending was what he wished for before he died in the ditch with his former best friend Carter--- I was so distraught by coming to terms with their demise but love that one could envision a wonderful scenario of "What If"....
I thought film was thought provoking and remained with me. I watched it twice for clues and found some to support my theory which I wish did not hold up.
I much prefer the idea that they got a second chance to live a more fulfilling authentic life.

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@lamensterms-- Spoilers-I just reread your post and realize I did not offer evidence for an alternative ending which is what you were seeking..I'm sorry because sadly I subscribe to the Ditch-Demise theory but would love to hear from those who could mount a compelling argument for survival and happily ever after...

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I also watched it a second time, and it confirmed the conclusion that they expired. Like you say, I was looking for evidence that they found a more fulfilling future, and I was sad about the ending. Also, the film really stayed with me, going over various scenes. The only other explanation for the ending was PTSD, which would be expected after such a harrowing experience.

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excellent summation of the ending, theexfoliator.. i too was so damn impressed with the characters and the acting in this film that once it dawned on me that the ending was merely a mirage representing mitchell's dying wishes for what might have been in his mind's eye, i wept a little on the inside..

this film just blew me away!!!!!!!!!!!!

it wasn't the fall from her 16th-floor penthouse that killed her, it was the landing

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didn't you guys pay attention? at the last scene we see the broken phone. so it means it was all a dream (or the delusions/hallucinations when someone is close to dying)


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Yes--I paid close attention. My thesis was proving that they could never have gotten to that juncture. What you pointed out I thought was obvious.
No--sometimes a broken phone is just a broken phone--You need to connect the dots to get there...

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Yes--I paid close attention. My thesis was proving that they could never have gotten to that juncture. What you pointed out I thought was obvious.
No--sometimes a broken phone is just a broken phone--You need to connect the dots to get there... I do appreciate though very much how this film has really made all of us wonder what really did happen. Initially my husband actually thought they survived before we started discussing it and working through all the scenarios.
The final image of that broken phone is very jarring...

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I thought Mitchell might be exhibiting signs of PTSD from the trauma in the desert. Tossing his phone in the bathroom could have cracked it or he imagined it because of the trauma. That's my only evidence that it did work out.

Honestly though, I think the film makers made it a point with the music montage and everything going too well, and especially the tear. The realization tear, haha. They're absolutely dead as far as I'm concerned.

Although the bickering at the beginning was nagging at me, the film really finished strong and I gave it a 7/10. Really solid writing, directing, and cinematography. I'll definitely watch it again at some point.

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GenusHomo--Love your thoughts--Kyle Killan who also wrote tv series Awake always writes these multi layered alternate reality scripts which I totally appreciate.
For me there is no better sign of good writing than that it stays with you, gnaws at you, makes you think and apply it to your own life experience.
In actuality, I think the ending is supposed to be a bit ambiguous or atleast jolting. What it left with me was a wish that I could rewind certain moments in my own life and get to live them out differently.

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you forgot the importance of the phone. during the movie it we saw it breaks and the camera made sure we know it.

at the end his new phone rang but this time it had the exact same broken screen as before.


thats the best proof i can give without any thing to argue it.

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Were they in a state of purgatory between the time they layed down by the old building and when he saw his broken cell phone ring? Then he finally died when he was imagining he was laying next to his wife in bed?

I was totally caught off guard by the ending. Great, thought provoking movie!

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The ending was too fairy tale as well as they even said they were probably dead in the desert in the last scene.

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Consider only that this movie seems to make the following point:

The only reality that matters is the reality we choose to accept.
Do you accept that the world is unjust and that your childhood dreams were naive musings to be discarded to make way for the "roots" Mitchell puts down, working an unsatisfying life, trapped in an unhappy marriage by your own lack of passion?

Or do you draw a better picture of your life and become the musician you always wanted to be, sacrificing the "dream" of stability in which you've grown so disillusioned?

Are you free or stuck? Are you stable, or engaged? Are you satisfied? These things all come down to perspective and choice, and all choices have sacrifices: if we give ourselves the elbow room to find displeasure and misery in life, we will always succeed in finding both, no matter what we do, if we can't wake up every morning and acknowledge the existence of choice and free-will.

You choose your own reality; and when you choose a reality, you live that reality.

Did they die out there in that desert, huddled together for desperate warmth, praying for the warm embrace of death to deliver them from the physical and mental torment of their final moments?

Or did they persevere and survive the night, allowing the events in the desert to change their perspectives and reshape their tortured lives?

This movie won't hand you an easy meal because the answer is that both of these events occur. Which is canon, however, depends only on your--the viewer's--perspective and which reality YOU choose to accept.

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Well said. :-)

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Here are the reasons why both perished in the desert:

1. They've been in the desert for 3 days without food or water. [Day 1 = afternoon at the start of the movie to Day 2 = afternoon on the day the old lady got scared away to Day 3 = afternoon on the day that they were too tired to notice the maintenance vehicle that stopped briefly.] On the 4th day they discovered the water tank so they had water to drink. Most people can go for about 2 days without water or 7 days without food, but you have to remember that they were in the desert where days are scorching hot (sweating a lot) and nights are freezing cold. They only had 6 ounces of water in the form of ice cubes and a few jelly beans from the start of the movie. From a biology standpoint, there's no chance that they survived long enough in the desert without water to reach the water tank, especially with all their physical exertion (you lose a very tiny amount of moisture whenever you breathe, the first thing that survival schools teach students is to find drinkable fluids).

2. Mitchell (Timothy Oliphaunt) drank wiper fluid. It is poisonous and if you drink it, it is advised that you call emergency services right away, it's no joke. Mitchell's dehydration combined with poisoning may have contributed to his delusions of getting out alive with Carter (Steve Wozniak).

3. Carter died after their fight and his corpse was either dragged into the ditch or carried by Mitchell. Why did Carter die after the fight? Because when Carter came back to life, Mitchell said he felt Carter's pulse and there was none. A long time passed between Mitchell checking to see if Carter was alive to the time when Carter came back to life just before he was dragged into the ditch. No pulse means no blood flow, no breathing, and your brain dies due to oxygen starvation within a few minutes. The only way around this would be that Carter suddenly had a pulse again when Mitchell stopped checking Carter's pulse. Why would Mitchell carry Carter's corpse with him? Because when Mitchell got to the abandoned settlement, a coyote was eating some type of meat. Coyotes are usually scavengers and they made 2 appearances in the film: once when they were around the ditch (sensed death and a meal) and again when Carter/Mitchell were at the settlement, eating that mystery meat (from Carter's corpse that Mitchell couldn't carry anymore due to his near-death state).

4. Mitchell's phone is clearly a Blackberry. Regardless of the phone, his phone lasted 4 days from the start of the film to the end when Mitchell received that call. To receive calls, the phone has to be on. Let's assume that Mitchell turned everything off (WiFi, 3G, Bluetooth, no push/fetch, etc) except the necessary phone functions. I don't think any smartphones can last 4 days enduring extremely hot/cold temperatures in the desert.

5. The shot of the cracked phone screen and the last frame of the film (Carter/Mitchell lying motionlessly in the desert) signify that they died in the desert. Towards the end of the film, Mitchell threw his phone in or around his sink after he lost his signal on his call to Carter. We see that the screen was cracked exactly like his Blackberry was in the desert. I don't know about you, but a moderate toss of your phone into your sink, that's right next to you, usually doesn't result in a cracked screen - at least not to that degree.

The shot of Mitchell crying in his bed next to his wife was what he imagined when he was about to expire in the desert next to his friend. There are many emotions that he's feeling at the time. He missed his family. He missed his now dead friend who he killed. He can't believe that this is actually happening, he was about to die from an event that started from an argument with his friend. He is sorry for everything that's happened and can't help but wonder if he made different choices in life, maybe things would've been different. It's the last thought on his mind and he died with feelings of longing, wonder, and regret.

But talk about a messed-up friendship. I can't help but get the feeling that deep down they hated each other. I can understand throwing around insults and elbows to your friends, but what they did went way overboard (derogatory remarks about family, and they were like animals while fighting - like they wanted to kill each other, uncontrollable). I didn't like this movie at all until the third act. I couldn't really root for Carter, his attitude/actions/mouth was too abrasive and annoying.

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Who are the Timothy Olyphant and Steve Wozniak people you speak of?

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lolz

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Just like to add on #5, that he threw the phone top up (based on the way he was holding it when he tossed it and it was still top up when he picked it up). The glass wouldn't have shattered like that from being thrown on flat surface top up. It's definitely more a crack from the "got pounded on by rocks during a fight" type of impact.

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All very good points.

One thing is for sure, this movie messes with a logical mind. (and I love it! LOL)

I didn't think about the battery situation with the phone. I was thinking that a broken screen does not necessarily indicate a broken phone, but it was the phone scenes at the end that helped me come to the conclusion that they died in the dessert.

I think Carter died from the blow to the head. Because of the blackout screen, and because Mitchell felt for a pulse and didn't find one. (however in his state he could have missed a faint one)and it's possible that Mitchell actually died while dragging Carter to the grave and fell into it or near it. Mitchell was severely dehydrated from vomiting, etc. and was probably near death then and this is the point when Carter suddenly wakes up (or is Mitchell actually dying?).

After Carter is "revived", things get a little surreal. It's almost as if Mitchell is vaguely aware of things that are going on in the "real world", but unable to see everything, almost like he is living in a dream. When Carter "climbs" into the hole with Mitchell, his body jerks and rolls, almost as if some unseen force is manipulating it and rolling it into the hole.
Mitchell saw the first coyote that night, and I think that was another indication that they were dead. Coyotes don't attack people, they just scavenge big prey, so I think (viewer discretion advised) the scavenging began that night and when Mitchell saw the second coyotes, they were actually the ones being eaten, however Mitchell's "dream" state turned things into him getting meat for his friend.

Their inability to move when the first tow truck came by, even though they were "physically" able to walk several miles after that, also indicates to me that they were already dead, yet Mitchell was vaguely aware of the events going on around him. When the second tow truck comes, he looks around warily as he is collecting the truck, yet doesn't see them at all. Is he looking for the crazy guys who scared the woman driver? Or is he looking for whoever may have killed Carter and Mitchell? Something about that scene bothers me as well, but perhaps it's just that there have been so many missed opportunities that things are getting a little ridiculous.

I think that everything after they leave the area is Mitchell's dream and is actually their spirits leaving the area. Until he begins to realize that he is actually dead.





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