MovieChat Forums > Dynamo: Magician Impossible (2011) Discussion > My view on this series... (A magicians p...

My view on this series... (A magicians point of view)

posted 12 years ago by matt-the-great2008
20 replies | jump to latest

Not hating on Dynamo but I think he is a little too overrated, well the series is a little overrated.
As a long time follower of Dynamo (Well before Magician Impossible aired) I was hoping these series's would be a lot LOT better... Unfortunately for me they weren't.
Mainly because I'm a magician as well and we tend to criticize fellow magicians more then non-magicians. However, he is obviously doing something right to have a second series so he obviously appeals to a lot of people.
I saw someone had put here that everything is evidently unprepared which is highly wrong. Without spoiling any secrets of any sort i can tell that pretty much 80-90% of the tricks he performs on the television are either mostly achieved by camera trickery and editing or have had a lot of preparation off screen i.e. stooging.
The other 10-20% though is great. This makes it more like a TV show with all the camera tricks etc. then an actual street magic show.
If you want to see some proper street magic then invest in Dynamo's older tv specials he did for channel 4 a few years ago such as concrete Playground, that's Dynamo at his best. Every David Blaine special is what street magic is and it was actually the specials that started the whole street magic craze. Also check out a japanese street magician called "Cyril Takayama", he was also one of the first people to perform the matrix lean in public on TV, which he does through an entertaining little segment wherein he wears a prosthetic grandpa mask...
That's another thing wrong with Magician Impossible, there's not much new with it or anything that's really entertaining. Again maybe it's because I'm a magician and I've seen millions of tricks and shows on this stuff but I just find it too over-produced but underwhelming. Nothing really breakthrough considering the amount of production value, however I'm giving series 2 a try.
I, however am not calling Dynamo a bad magician because he's released two of his own dvd's to the magic industry which he created which shows he is a creative guy and he is talented... The show just doesn't really do anything for him but like I said go and look at Dynamo's previous specials, they are much better but have very little production cost, which is what street magic is essentially about.

[–] alesisqs61 12 years ago

Chris Angel killed magic so no one is really that interesting at this point. Since he actually used after FX type effects on his show...it simply killed illusion all together.

I'm watching season 2 episode 1 of Dynamo and his first trick is a waste of time so far.... hot hand???? Seriously...how are TV viewers supposed to think anything is actually happening? Ridiculous.

OMG hilarious....the glass/shoes trick...obvious camera edit when he blocks the camera...it's pathetic. Is this guy really making money doing this... Good grief.

http://www.youtube.com/user/alphazoom
http://www.vimeo.com/1986276

[–] matt-the-great2008 12 years ago

I wouldn't say Criss Angel killed magic. Maybe for you but he must be doing something right if he has series after series after series. Personally I don't like Criss Angel for the reasons you stated, especially since now if someone doesn't know how something is doing on a magic tv show, they automatically put it down to camera trickery and/or special effects.
I agree also that people have generally lost interest in magic. David Blaine did a great job of sparking peoples interest in the 90's only to have it fall again w/ Criss.
That's also the reason why I'm not keen on "Magician Impossible", because there is little to no interest in magic nowadays (aside from Derren Brown who is probably the only entertainer I would pay to watch several times and one of the best mentalists in the world) if something comes out like Magician Impossible and with such production values it has to be something amazing and something that excels the art of magic and sparks the interest in it like Blaine did back in the 90's. Unfortunately a load of the stunts and tricks have been performed before on TV and like you said, a lot of it is untrue to what you would actually see in real-life... Ask Dynamo to perform any one of the tricks you watch on Magician Impossible and I can guarantee you he can't perform 95% of them, now ask someone like Blaine to perform one of his tricks on his specials, he will be able to perform about 85-90% of them...

I haven't seen episode 1 yet so I can't say about those tricks you mentioned.

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] sumtim3s00n 12 years ago

So swapping drinks in closed containers with random people is done with camera edit ?

[–] matt-the-great2008 12 years ago

"80-90% of the tricks he performs on the television are either mostly achieved by camera trickery and editing or have had a lot of preparation off screen"

I didn't say every single trick was done by a camera edit -.-, in this case it was preparation off screen.
It's just a variation of this trick http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xO6_nnaCMXI.
...and how do you know they were "Random", he could easily have gone up to them before shooting and asked the girl to hold the can and the guy to hold the coke...

[–] blitzmut 12 years ago

I think that Criss Angel initially grabbed on to the coat-tails of renewed interest in magic/illusions generated by David Blaine and other street magicians in the late '90s/early 2000's.
But after 3-4 seasons of Mindfreak people eventually caught on (through whatever means) that a large percentage of the series was camera tricks/special effects and the use of stooges, or just like any "trendy" celebrity, they got sick of seeing him on TV and just started rolling their eyes. That's not to say that he isn't still entertaining. However his 6-season series, which aired every week just as any other TV series, constituted a large percentage of many Americans' (and the residents of other countries where Mindfreak was syndicated) exposure to magic for quite a while.
Penn & Teller are sort of America's go-to magicians, but the only recent TV they've done in America (as far as I know): "Penn & Teller's *beep* wasn't about magic, and was on premium TV. I'll come back to them later though...
Unfortunately, Derren Brown's distribution over here in the US has been fairly limited, which is too bad, because that guy is one hell of an entertainer. And I think his format is far more interesting than Angel's-- the only series he's had (to my knowledge) haven't gone more than 5-6 episodes per season, and he rarely performs similar stunts/illusions in different episodes. And Brown's specials are FANTASTIC! Something like Derren's "Russian Roulette" or "The Heist" here in America (if you could get it on a major network of course) would certainly change many minds about what magic can be.
In addition to a Derren Brown special, I would LOVE to see Penn & Teller's "Fool Us" here in the USA. That show was astounding! And gives many magicians the chance to be noticed.

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] matt-the-great2008 12 years ago

Not all Camera Tricks and Stooges but a massive amount is... This is what gets me, I assumed you were annoyed when you found out it was all editing and stuff and it does put you off, I'm sure, of not only Dynamo but all tv magic in general and usually Magic in general.
Yeah, the reaction shots are typically used in many tv specials and if you've ever seen a magic product advertised on youtube, they use it then. If the director asks someone to give a reaction that's probably because they haven't had any decent reactions which is sucky because any half-decent magician performing a half-decent trick can get a good reaction.
Another clever camera edit that was put on TV was when David Blaine was doing the levitation, he used a genuine technique that allowed him to "levitate" 3-4 inches off the ground but he also filmed him being pulled up with a crane in the same setting and he spliced that into where the spectator was reacting, thus they were reacting to him lifting 3-4 inches off the ground whereas the viewers at home thought they were seeing him lift a foot off the ground. I didn't mind this AS much though because at least the reactions where geniune...

I'm not sure about any other camera tricks or stooges used by David Blaine in his specials as pretty much every trick he does can be bought or is in print, or has been created for him by one of his consultants (funnily enough Dynamo and David Blaine share some of the same consultants). Criss Angel is just pretty much pure camera tricks and stooges, despite he can still perform good sleight of hand, I guess he just chooses not to...

Thanks for the Penn Jillette podcast, I haven't heard it so It'll be interesting :D.

[–] moveguy 12 years ago

Nice to know, Ive been wondering what magicians would think of this guy. I was telling my girlfriend it would make a cool show if he and David BLaine went head to head and did street magic and try to fool the fellow magician, not just the audience. But that would pretty much break the main code of us non magicians finding out the trick of the trick, still love to see it though.

If Jesus and Mohammed both came back to save their people would they debate on tv?

[–] alesisqs61 12 years ago

The camera edit was on the shoe/glass trick...and the final illusion for sure.

Just terrible...plain unwatchable junk.

David Blain was at least watchble for quite awhile. Once I figured out how some of his tricks were done...of course it's lame.... but he wasn't like this guy....who's clearly doing things straight outta the gate wrong.

Alot of guys can do sleight of hand magic very well.... and on camera in front of real people that would still amaze me. Then you gt this kinda stuff....just makes me laugh really. Any trick that looks completely impossible...is. And by trick... I don't mean illusion. Copperfield did illusions on the grandest scale and if they failed...they failed right then...on TV. If you figured out his trick...then you figured out the illusion. To my knowledge he did REAL illusions and not camera tricks. If there was any camera tricks, it would be for his TV specials. But alot of his REALLY big tricks even on TV were done for real but using the camera as a tool...not as a gimmick.

http://www.youtube.com/user/alphazoom
http://www.vimeo.com/1986276

[–] matt-the-great2008 12 years ago

The shoe/glass trick I assume your referring to the one where he "imprints" his hand print into the glass... That I see as a long convoluted/impractical set-up before-hand, which again is not street magic.
Yeah, David Blaine pretty much started the whole street magic trend, or at least bought it to the publics eye.
If people see one camera trick/or at least assume something is a camera trick, then anything else in the program unexplainable is a camera trick even if it isn't and in some instances, they write every TV magician as someone who uses camera tricks... Derren Brown is someone who gets accused heavily as someone who uses stooges and camera tricks because of this.

You'll be surprised though, there are a lot of stuff people find impossible and tricks that seem impossible... As a close-up magician, I can tell you from experience that sometimes even the simplest tricks performed right are totally impossible, without the need of camera tricks... and imo it weakens the art of magic especially to the public who don't see magic very often, which very often turns them off which is bad because there is already a massive lack of magic on TV nowadays opposed to say the 80's-90's.
I don't mind if there is one or two camera tricks as long as there is a lot of good, pure magic, especially when it's labeled as "Street Magic". Hell, even Blaine and Copperfield have used camera tricks but nowhere to the extent of Dynamo... but yeah, copperfield and Blaine are examples of good tv magicians since what you see is what you get (or at least 99% of the time).

[–] matt-the-great2008 12 years ago

@moveguy It's not I don't like the guy as much as it is about I don't like the series... In a way I feel like he's sold himself out with camera tricks just to be the "next big thing". If I were to compare it to music it'll be like a guy who is great at singing acoustic just him and his guitar and then going mainstream and becoming autotuned and over-produced... If you get what I mean... and some magicians like him, some not, that's just my opinion.
Yeah, there is a show where magicians try to fool a fellow magician called "Penn and Teller: Fool us" maybe you've heard or not but it aired for a season in the UK with UK magicians and it's also been a season filmed and aired in isreal, same format. If you don't know about it, check it out. You'll enjoy it :D.

[–] moveguy 12 years ago

Ya I watched Fool Us and do enjoy it, only you never get to see how the good tricks are done. Would you put Teller up there with a real magician? Ill leave Penn out of it since he has no problem admitting how Teller is the real talent.
And is Derren Brown fully legit? Ive seen a few of his things and the guy seems to have so much skill I wonder why he doesn't do his mind trickery to help turn governments back to serving the people instead of corporations and really do some good instead of just entertain.

If Jesus and Mohammed both came back to save their people would they debate on tv?

[–] Sky-666 12 years ago

I agree, a lot of his tricks are absolutely impossible and I have said before that the people he asks to do the tricks must be in on it. Obviously not all of them, but a lot of them. The public do sometimes look genuinely shocked, so it does make me wonder sometimes. How did he do the whole walking on water thing? Or the walking through glass trick? It is entertaining, but I will never be genuinely impressed until I am actually stopped in the street and have a trick performed for me.

"Sammy, I get all tingly when you take control like that" - Dean Winchester

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] matt-the-great2008 12 years ago

Your partly right... This was Derren Brown before he got signed by Channel 4 and commissioned to do all of his shows and tv specials. He was doing close-up magic 20 years ago (and hypnosis) in clubs until he got picked up by Channel 4.
Now he doesn't do this type of magic and he doesn't do AS much sleight of hand as he did back then. The things he does now sometimes do consist of sleight of hand (especially in his stage tour, or at least the last One I saw) but he does actually involve psychology (and even NLP) in a lot of his work so in that respect he is not a magician. He's a mentalist and a hypnotist.
At the start of every television show he states that he mixes magic, psychology, misdirection etc. so it's not a secret, he is not a magician though like he was 20 years ago, now he is a mentalist and one of the best.

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] matt-the-great2008 11 years ago

LOL, actually the experience would be totally different if you were there, so it's definitely not used to give the TV viewer the same experience... In fact something quite the opposite, which is very common nowadays with TV magic. In other words if you were there live and watched it, it'd look 10000 times better on TV.

In regard to filming a trick, it's much harder to reveal to the cameras how it works then it is to a spectator, mainly because there's a fixed POV from the camera rather then a spectator whom can walk around and see easily. The camera's in these types of shows are usually filmed by people who have an insight to magic anyway (or at least is typically filmed by these people) so that shouldn't be a problem anyway. The position of the camera is supposed to be from the audiences view anyway since that's where the magic is happening...
Some tricks do require stooges however it kind of makes you question what magic is supposed to be when a lot of the stuff on his show is stooges acting surprised... Again a stooge as a useful and necessary device is one that is objective depending on your views, to me it's somewhat of a cop-out. There's nothing satisfying with telling someone to say a certain thing and then play it up for the cameras.
I'm not talking about 30 second preps before a trick or loading cards in peoples pockets (Most tricks nowadays take 30 seconds to a few minutes to prep). I'm talking to the point where it's stupidly set-up i.e. the phone in bottle trick, duplicate phones (it's a slowed-down video on youtube so many people know it). An hour or so set-up... Again totally useless if he was going to perform it in real life (that clean anyway).

On the subject of Derren Brown and the use of actors. In fact 90% of the stuff he does in his specials can be explained and performed without actors...

Ha, "any proper magician (Which you are obviously not)" made me laugh. Thanks

[–] matt-the-great2008 11 years ago

...but I can't be bothered with arguing with people anymore on the topic. These were my views, if you don't agree that's your right. It ain't going to change how I feel about the shows.
Props to Dynamo for working to get a show (Like I said in the OP he had two shows prior to this, each on low budgets and from what I remember filmed by his friends), my main argument that was magic shows on tv are now filmed like music videos and it's becoming less about the magic and the connection with the audience (which is my main reason why i don't like Stooges). It's sort of sad to think that we have to make these shows with a cut every 5 seconds and fancy camera work just to keep the audience interested... It's somewhat of a insult to most people and a sad, but mostly true, look on the attention span of many tv viewers.
I know you can get reactions just as good without stooges or fancy camera work as a magician who has performed to many people and who has seen a lot of magic done to people live so it's such a shame to "hollywood" it... Soon they'll be explosions and whatnot and then it'd just be a tv show full of actors.
It's very unlikely that these threads will change anything and at the end of the day it's just people arguing on the internet idly whilst other people go out and actually do something about it.
Regardless it's been fun seeing people argue (some with good valid points) and then it's been even better seeing people who think they know it all, to the point of insulting others, whereas they are just insulting themselves because of that...

[–] wolfmansgotnards11 10 years ago

You say 'then' instead of 'than' therefore you are not a magician and I cannot take you seriously.