MovieChat Forums > Mitt (2014) Discussion > Would have been better off.....

Would have been better off.....


If America had been able to get past the media onslaught to what the real man was like, then yes, I think he would have won. Some of that responsibility falls on him for not making free market principles more of the core of what he said. He and his team were trying to sell the nation on the idea that free markets and free enterprise is the best way to raise everyone in the economy. Which is absolutely true, but it seemed at times like they were embarrassed by those facts.

It may sound nice and sweet to say "spread the wealth", but it has never worked anywhere in the history of the planet. And yet "we" are scared to point out Reagan and Eisenhower, and Coolidge. Why?? It has worked every time.

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Ugh we get it, you're a republican. But know this, most democrats are exhausted with the level of ignorance among American voters and you're certainly not helping that cause.

Liberalism favours market capitalism and despite all the rhetoric, income inequality increases year after year?the concentration of wealth is not being spread around.

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Argh that shouldn't be a question mark

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Income inequality increases because more and more people are becoming dependent on the government rather than getting off their behinds and making something of themselves. Barack Obama believes that anyone who has millions of dollars is just evil and greedy (although he himself makes a base of $440K/yr AND $5M/yr from book deals AND who knows how much else from back door deals). Mitt Romney is worth $250M and he believes that everyone should have $250M.

But, how does one attain that much money? By gaining knowledge & skills and then applying them by working like crazy. You never see our current president encouraging people on welfare to go make themselves more valuable, contribute to society and earn wealth. No, he wants to keep them dependent so he and the succeeding Democrats have ample voting stock (see President Lyndon B. Johnson for how he'll "...have those n**gers voting Democratic for the next 200 years.")

More people have been put on food stamps than have gotten jobs under President Obama. If the president really wanted to create jobs, he would slash as many taxes as possible and remove the Corporate Tax. By doing so, the economy would ignite bigger and faster than it ever has. Every company in the world would be headquartered in the U.S. The more money freed from taxation, the more money a company has to invest back into itself and into other companies and that results in creating a larger economy, thus more jobs.

The president certainly understands this, but he doesn't want the economy to grow. He wants to shrink and eventually remove the middle class and only have the lower class (the Proletariat) and the super rich (the Bourgeoisie). And how do you succeed to remove the middle class? By touting the illusion that you're "for the middle class!" Brilliant, no? While saying that you're for the middle class, it keeps them distracted because they believe everything you're doing is for their benefit, while you destroy them through endless regulations and lawless executive orders that override and don't even include Congress. ObamaCare is nothing more than redistribution of wealth. The president even had to find a Constitutional loophole just to implement at a point when 70% of the American people were against it. By implementing ObamaCare as a tax, he can now force people to purchase something and fine them if they don't. How is that "caring for the American people"?

The president made his goal quite clear when he spoke to Joe the Plumber in 2008. "...when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody." That's not how America works. If you don't like the Capitalist system, where hard work is rewarded and do-nothings get nothing then move out of America. Don't try to change something that obviously works (look what all we've built, created and done in our short time as a country).

Spreading the wealth helps absolutely no one in society. If Marxism/Socialism were implemented, you would see an immediate drop in innovation and creation. Why? There would be no incentive to succeed from the fruits of your labor and inventions if all your wealth was distributed around without any say on how it's done. Remember this: forced charity is not charity, it's slavery.

If you're for redistribution of wealth, here's an idea. I'm going to take your cell phone, computer, TV and your car. We're going to sell these items and we should get roughly $10,000 for these items. We're going to take that $10,000 and go downtown to the projects and distribute this money. "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need." This is what you believe, right? Fair game!

Or how about this: You make $60,000/yr and I make $20,000/yr. Well, I don't think that's fair at all! Sure, you worked hard to get where you are, but I'm perfectly happy with where I am, but that doesn't mean there should be this gap between us. So, here's what we're going to do: We're going to add our incomes and split the total. We both get $40,000/yr while we both still perform the same jobs that require the same skills. Nothing has changed except for the redistribution. You don't mind taking $20,000/yr paycut to help me out, do you? Do you? Of course you do! You worked hard to reach that income level and here I am, a person with no ambition to succeed benefiting from your accomplishments while doing no extra work on my part.

Does that sound fair to you? Here you are a person that worked hard for all that "stuff" and now people who watch daytime TV while not contributing anything to society gets to benefit from your hard work? Tell me you're not for this. People who think that Marxism/Socialism is a great idea is all for everyone's wealth being redistributed back to them, but not when it's their wealth being redistributed to others. The system must work both ways for everyone to benefit and be happy with the results. Under Marxism/Socialism, everyone is a number. That's not how America sees people. We see them as people of virtue, value and valor. Is that how you see people?

In the end, which is the better message? Be dependent on the government or work for your own living? We both know which parties reflect these respective messages; they are undeniable. Start seeing people as valuable instead of numbers. People of lower income will remain there as long as they're repeatedly told that's all their worth.

You be positive, I'll be realistic.

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I'm not positive, my post was not positive. I think democracy is a failed attempt at governance; simply because it allows irrational, uninformed people such as yourself to vote on matters in which you are not adequately able to form an analytical conclusion.

It's quite easy for me to reach the conclusion that you are likely uneducated and from that I can assume that you have a middle or lower class income. You, observably, have little understanding of international finance or monetary economics and yet you're asked to make far reaching decisions about their implementation. That is what is truly frightening.

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That's my signature, it wasn't part of my post.

So, I guess you would just love a country where one dictator rules everything, huh? And you say my misunderstandings are frightening.

I do something every day that the federal government hasn't done in years: balance a budget and spend within my income. I'm a web programmer and I make over $65K/yr. Not exactly lower/middle class, but not living it up either. I'm a little higher than people like you and the president want me to be.

America was founded on one basic idea: people can govern themselves. The only flaw is that it requires people of virtue to make it work. But, I'll take trying to be a virtuous person over standing in lines all day to get one potato, because I believe that people have value. People like you want to silence everyone because they don't conform to your set of ideals for society, which is the very definition of a dictator.

Since you're playing the guessing game, I guess I'll play, too. I'm only guessing, but you seem like a sad person. If you really believe that people can't self-govern because they're not "educated" to what you would deem appropriate as "education," then you'll truly never be happy.

You be positive, I'll be realistic.

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I certainly do not espouse any virtue towards fascism and though I recognize the importance of ideology, it does indeed support many false beliefs. One of which is the misappropriation of fascism as a leftward political structure; fascism does not adhere to any notion of equality, this has no duty to those obligations. While I do support specific ideals of social market economics I am also of the believe that, generally, members of society are not equal.

This can be attributed to my education in international finance, but nonetheless it reinforces my liberal progressivism -- which does attribute a great deal of attention to liberal or free market economics. As to my personal well-being as well national governance, I am left with nothing but doubts and questions. No absolutes and certainly no strong-held ideological assumptions.

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I think democracy is a failed attempt at governance; simply because it allows irrational, uninformed people such as yourself to vote on matters in which you are not adequately able to form an analytical conclusion.


This and your presumptive judgement of others is terrifying elitism...and the scariest part of your position is that I can guarantee there is someone out there who thinks you don't have the intellect/information to vote properly either. So where does that game end?

I think the concept of one person/one vote is a beautiful concept of our republic. It is certainly corrupted by financial influence, but the ideal still stands.

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EternalSummer247-
A brilliant post and from someone who is capable of telling it like it is. The 'occupy wall street' types hate capitalist success stories and just want freebies.

Your position is not extreme but measured. I worry about the 'ultras' and extremists because an extreme point of view is only a half truth. Therefore seek truth by not looking for information that just supports what you wish were true but read and listen to both sides especially that which you reject outright.

The truth is somewhere in the conflation of both liberal and conservative worldviews and and the subsequent filtration of extreme biased ideology.

That is unless it turns out there is indeed a God then God's truth wins. Now if we only had that situation resolved.

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Go to youtube and listen to the words of a Reagan Administration cabinet member, David Stockman, talk about the absolute corruption of capitalism, about markets that are rigged and micromanaged and CPR'ed by the Fed to pay off in big ways only for a select group of people in the 1%.

You talk a great game, ideals and all that, but that's not what's really happening out there.

Redistribution of wealth is happening today, FROM the poor, TO the rich. Every gallon of gas that some poor working class guy pumps into his car, there is a casino economy premium added to that per gallon price, money that is stolen from his pockets and ends up in the pockets of the gambling elites.

The poor grab the rich man's money through taxes, while the rich grab the poor man's money through financial algorithms. Based on the widening wealth gap, who do you think is winning that tug-o-war?

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...well said.


On November 6, 2012...God blessed America

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