wanted to, but did not like it...

>>I think the film strongly implies Church's character sexually abused his daughter so I dont know how much sympathy he deserves<<

I didn't get that from it... not saying it wasn't there, but I did not catch it.

It would make sense as I really had trouble understanding why she refused to have anything to do with him.

Seems like Ellen Barkin would have just blurted it out though, she was not holding back much.

What do you think indicated that? That's an interesting idea.

I dont think it implies that he sexually abused her, but mentally abused her and physically and mentally abused Lynn. I think if that were the case, Lynn would have just come out and said it in the psychiatrist's office or at the Living Room summit.

I did get at the end, tho, that he was looking at Patty in a way that might suggest that she will be his next victim of abuse.

Swing away, Merrill....Merrill, swing away...

Paul didn't sexually abuse his daughter, Alice. He beat the crap out of her mother, Lynn, and was absent from her life for seven years.
Then -- when Alice asks if they could have lunch ALONE -- the prVck says, "She's my wife, Alice" and looks over at Patty. The SOB can't even see his own daughter without that witch by his side, even though the daughter requested it.
This broke her heart, she recoils and runs into the parking lot in hysterics. Her mom, Lynn, tells her, YOU'RE STRONG, don't let these people tell you who you are.

So when Paul asks to speak to her alone later, she says NO. Alice FINALLY stands up to Paul and most importantly for HERself and Ben, her little brother even tells her, "That was the most badass thing I've ever seen."




"the only way through it is through it " -Jackson Browne

If you come from a dysfunctional and fu>ked up family (as I did) you wouldn't see this movie as melodramatic at all.

It's very realistic and sad versus "annoying."

There was no need to tone down Ellen Barkin's character - I thought she handled herself AMAZINGLY well with all she had to deal with with her ex and lunatic son and emotionally wounded daughter as well as her half-azzed parents.




"the only way through it is through it " -Jackson Browne

I agree. I did not find Ellen Barkin's performance especially noteworthy at all. In fact, I so loathed her character that by the end, I could find little to sympathize with her about. One thing, this is not a comedy and not a black comedy either. I know the difference. Death at a Funeral (I much prefer the Englsh version) was a black comedy. This is a dark tale about a spiteful and vengeful family who are too busy cutting each other in places no one can see (much as Kate Bosworth, only maybe worse). And yes, Ellen Barkin and really her entire family are targets here, except her strangly dissociated second husband. I rooted for her kids, too. Ellen Barkin's parents were not living on THEIR estate, as is stated over and over in the reviews. The house belonged to Ellen Barkin which was brought up in his usual inoppotune timing by Ben. So this family was living in her home and treating her like absolute garbage, and her children, as well. By the end of this film, I did not feel anything but emptiness and fury at a woman who had 100 opportunities to be something other than a doormat. The daughter, Bosworth, standing up to her abusive father, was a pivotal scene and the youngest son's reaction was as well. The scene where Ellen Barkin talks about Thomas Church hitting her in the face with his fist, while the little girl clung to her leg, and then George Kennedy reached over to Thomas Church and sympathized with him, I almost threw up. I do not suggest anyone with a family with these dynamics watch this film. I guarantee, you will not feel very well after you watch it.

I think there was a sexual thing with Paul and Alice. Lynn never mentioned it because she knew Paul would never admnit to it. so she got him to admit the physical abuse towards her, which he quickly did. So that was easier to say he sexually abused his daughter, and in front of her family, and I think Lynn and Paul both knew what was hapening, so paul was quick to admit abuse than sexual abuse.Maybe lynn never really knew it was true.

Later I goty the feeling aloce cuts herself cause she wants the attention of hewr father even after the 7 years. she wants to meet him alone and he has a very wierd reaction....

I don't think her father was in any condition to take a stand against Lynn's husband. He was kind out there in La La Land. Also, what he said to him wasn't really him being serious. At this point it should have been her mother, as a woman protecting another woman, to stand up and take the play. But she didn't.

That was a sad moment in the film, where Lynn realizes after the confrontation, that no one would ever stand up for her.

Swing away, Merrill....Merrill, swing away...

You can say that, psmith, but i have known women like Lynn, who's every breathing moment is lived for her broken kid. It's not pretty when you see a woman being humiliated like that, where no one takes the time to really see the pain that the woman is going through.

and Thanks, Thiang. At least you acknowledged my question. My guess at this point is that the dog died. But you never know.

Swing away, Merrill....Merrill, swing away...

I of course think the movie was exaggerated a ton but I think there are million real lynnes out there..i didnt find the movie melodramatic at all...i found it depressing as all hell and funny in some places i liked it a lot...it had great acting and great scenes...i found it a little draggy in some places but i found the lynne and doris characters to be my favorites...i will say one thing it def makes me feel better about my own problems lol