MovieChat Forums > Ultramarines: A Warhammer 40,000 Movie (2010) Discussion > Space marines IN THIS MOVIE are pussies.

Space marines IN THIS MOVIE are pussies.

posted 13 years ago by jernej-tojersu
53 replies | jump to latest

Let me first say that I love the space marines. I love everything about them, the lore, the look, the badassery that just permeates their very essence.

However in this movie, they look like panzies. I seriously think they do.

First of a space marine is over 7 feet tall, with many being almost 8 or even beyond 8. Considering they're extremely muscular physique, they must weigh anywhere from 350 to 500 kg, and that's without the power armor on.

The power armor itself weighs anywhere from 500 to 2000 kg. It's hard to find an estimate but even if we take the lowest estimate, the average space marine in armor, weighs more than a TON.

They are a car on feet, but when you watch this movie, it really doesn't feel like it. The ground should shake when they approach.

Imagine 12 guys where each of them weighs more than a ton, walking, anywhere. The earth would literally tremble beneath their feet. I mean just imagine them running. Imagine 12 cars on two feet running towards you. You would hear it, you would feel it, you would fear it and if you're two bits of crazy you might get aroused by it.

Yet in the movie we seem them jumping onto pillars of a collapsed bridge like they're fairies and to make it even worse you can see them walking over a WOODEN BRIDGE. All of them, at once. That is just not going to happen. I have yet to see a wooden plank like the one seen in the movie that could carry that much weight.

Plus they are genetically engineered to be virtually indestructible yet in the movie we see one of them go down with one shot, hell we see many of them go down with one shot if you count the chaos marines getting slaughtered.

I mean they are supposed to be able to "suffer wounds that would kill a lesser being several times over, and live to fight again.

There's even a space marine that gets knocked out when he is thrown against a wall. I mean jesus christ people.

These are supposed to be monstrously overpowered he man people on steroids wearing super suits of awesomeness.

Plus the bolters they have in the movie aren't even bolters that they should have. Bolters have exploding rounds, yet we never see that. Why don't we see that. If you shoot a guy in the head with a super advanced exploding bullet shouldn't that be followed by an exploding head that was lucky enough to stop that exploding bullet?

Ah damn this movie just pissed me off to no end.

[–] Hadakan 13 years ago

Word.

[–] familyofjokers 13 years ago

From jernej-tojersu: "Imagine 12 cars on two feet running towards you."

If you've seen either of the Transformers films, you would know what it might be like to see a gang of walking vehicles stomping around and fighting. You're right; they make the ground shake, and you can see them coming from a mile away. To a lesser extent, it makes sense that Space Marines should give a similar impression.

[–] c-eriksson82 13 years ago

No it doesnt, you are over exaggerating... Sure, Space Marines are huge but their power armour makes them nimble aswell. The suits are packed with high tech gadgetry and dampeners to lessen the blow from being as big and heavy as they are, but 12 cars??? C'mon... They're big, but not that big...

[–] jernej-tojersu 13 years ago

A big space marine can weigh up to a ton. Thats the size of a small car, ok small to medium car.

12 space marines walking across a wooden bridge, 12 small cars walking over a small wooden bridge.

And to SkyMashallZ, the stone and wood in that century is going to be the same as today.

[–] Strazdamonas 13 years ago

i fail to see how you deduct that a space marine weighs a ton?
being 7 feet tall and muscular does NOT make you weight 300 kg. try more like 100-120 kg. if you want to weight 300 kg, go fat. also those are heavy armors, but they are not 700 kg each either. i woudl say 200 kg tops, so that brings us at 300 kg each marine, meaning we got a 3.6 tons of total weight on a bridge. yeah no wood on earth can hold that, but were not on earth. also the suits are probably full of mahinery to help them move it, so raising thier hand they probably dont fee thesuits weight as the suti reacts and helps raising it, so walking and jumping is possible. sure jumping like that would probably make the whatsl eft of the bridge start collapsing but maybe its some super-bricks anyway. we often see such things in games, where a small thing can hold huge mass.

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"Common sense is not so common."
- Voltaire

[–] cmyates42 13 years ago

Yes,they are genticaly altered to have better than olympic/superhuman agility but the armor doesn't have anti-gravity compensators. No matter the lightness of step, it still physically weighs at least a half ton.

[–] wildfire160 13 years ago

I feel your pain brother..im not a huge Warhammer fan but it must really grate when they muck it up ..
I had the same feeling with Starship Troopers as a very big fan of Heinlein seeing the troopers in that annoyed the bejeezus out of me ..watching them walk around almost in their t-shirts instead of the powered armour pissed me off in much the same way

[–] ChefC 13 years ago

I thought the same thing.

They were going down to single shots in their arms or chests, why wasn't the suit flooding their system with drugs to over ride the pain so they can keep fighting while cauterizing the wound, they have more organs that regular men so a single shot wouldn't stop them, apart from in the head ofc.

The Astartes in here were panzies, and what was with the ship? a massive ship for just 12 ultramarines, where were the crew?

All in all a bad film, I can understand if they had restraints and wanted to keep the animation to a minimum, they could have thought of a better story that would account for there being so few.

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Who would have guessed it, we all have different opinions about subjective things!

[–] TheAdlerian 13 years ago

I've read many of the books and in spite of their size they're supposed to be graceful and light on their feet. Also, their armor has artificial muscle in it to help even more.

Their bodies were designed to be better than human and so theu aren't just big clunky guys but perfectly designed works of art.

I haven't seen the film yet, you have it a little wrong OP.

[–] alexnazarov 13 years ago

I have an answer to why they were such pussies.

Ultramarines.

If there were 12 Grey Knights on that rock, not only not a single one of them would have fallen, no daemon would have lived, the taint of Chaos would have been wiped clean.

A Captain falls to forces of Chaos? It's disgraceful. This shows clearly the Ultramarines inexperience when dealing with daemons.

[–] banished_one 13 years ago

I thought the demon just killed the captain and wore his skin ? It would be pretty disgraceful indeed if a captain was tainted.

[–] TopGunSGA 12 years ago

I thought the demon just killed the captain and wore his skin ? It would be pretty disgraceful indeed if a captain was tainted.

Yeah the daemon either killed the captain or the captain die in the fall from the keep and then took his skin

---We will rule over all this land and we will call it... This Land.---

[–] Shoghi 13 years ago

They also have redundant organs so a chest wound would not kill a marine as seen in the movie. I agree, the earth should shake where they walk.

The general atmoshphere of the movie was well designed though IMHO.

[–] Scruffy_Swede 13 years ago

what about the fact that they ignore that Space Marines serve as combat Scouts for decades before being honored with Power Armor. Space Marines have to prove themselves as soldiers before even becoming Tactical Space Marines... so how come all the Marines in the movie are rookies???

And why is a Captain leading a single squad?
Why is a single squad stationed on a Battle Barge ( one of the most powerful vessels in the Galaxy! )

When fighting a horde of Berzerkers, why dont they call in airsupport; they have a Thunderhawk with them after all, carrying missiles, rockets, Heavy Bolters AND a Battle Cannon!!!
Not to mention the Battle Barge in orbit!

The movie is utter crap!

[–] FreedomFighter08 13 years ago

Dude they did call their air support when they stood their ground at the standpoint and told the pilot to pick them up, and it came in the end and offered air strike.
Captain? Haven't you played the DoW games, the captain is the squad leader there is only 1 squad leader not 2. And then you got the bannercarrier and the heavy assault marine, and one flamethrower and the rest common weapons, just like in the game, well divided squad plus a apotechary
But one thing that made me disappointed is that they talk about the ultramarines being the best soldiers of the space marine race. Now these guys weren't better than any other space marine i've seen in action so that was bad...

[–] dude_101uk 13 years ago

Generally Boxaren, A Captain is a Company Commander, not a squad leaader, nominally he'd be in charge of any squad he's attached to.

If you read the Comic that comes with the collectors edition, you get your answer as to why he was leading a squad and why they were newly promoted scouts.

As for the ship, it was a Strike Cruiser, not a Battle Barge.

They also have redundant organs so a chest wound would not kill a marine as seen in the movie.

Except they would, as the enemy they are facing are chaos armed with bolt weapons, a bolt weapon is going to make a mess of even the insides of a Space Marine.

[–] Scruffy_Swede 13 years ago

BOXAREN:
Have you ever played the tabletop game that DoW is based on? I have been a great fan of 40k and Warhammer Fantasy Battles for 17 years or so.

A Captain is in charge of a Company of 100 Marines. Seeing as these guys are Ultramarines, they would follow the Codex Astartes to the letter. The Ultramarines are the most fanatical of all Chapters when it comes to the Codex since it was their Primarch who after the Horus Heresy and the death of the Emperor reorganized the Legions into Chapters.

So.. yeah, i have played the DoW games, basically because I play the tabletop game and love the universe and the background and the books revolving around 40k.

As for the airsupport... Like you said, it came at THE END! After some 50 Berzerkers had charged them, then they called in the airsupport. Rubbish!

And Space Marines are not a race. They are handpicked recruits from all over the Imperium that undergo the most insane kind of training imaginable. When that is over, they become Space Marine Scouts, and as scouts they have to prove themselves worthy of becoming Space Marines by fighting in wars for decades. Only the most extreme veterans, by human standards, are even allowed to become a Space Marine.

EDIT:
And yes, I confess, it is indeed a Strike Cruiser. My bad =)

[–] FreedomFighter08 13 years ago

Well they are not a race but they are special beings of the imperium of man which almost make them unique compared to the imperial guard who are common humans, I would call them a race because they are humans with superpowers, without them the imperium wouldn't survive, also the god emperor was space marine. And when you study the lore and play gamestories and listen to their conversations you notice that they see them as special individuals and that the imperial guard is nothing but a bunch of loosers, like they were racists or something, that's why I see the space marines as a race, they have their own units, own vehicles, own god, their god emperor, you don't notice the imperial guard saying when going in to battle "For the emperor, the emperor protects, the emperor shall guide me" Do u understand what I'm trying to tell here, there are so much difference between commons humans and space marines, even if the space marines are a military force of the Imperium of Man, I see them as a race.

[–] Scruffy_Swede 13 years ago

Oh really? The Imperial Guard doenst believe in the God-Emperor, but the Space Marines do?

As it happens, it is the Guard, the ordinary humans, who believe in the God-Emperor. The Space Marines refer to him simply as the Emperor of Mankind, since the Emperor tried very hard to convince mankind that there are no gods in the universe ( in an attempt to limit Chaos influence in the galaxy ).

Ever heard of the Adeptus Ministorum? You see, the Ecclesiarchy are pretty big on the whole cult of the God-Emperor, anyone who deviates from it are essentially executed, in civilian life as well as in the Imperial Guard; the Commissars of the Commissariat play a big part in this by the way.

As for racists... Yes, the entire Imperium are racists. Space Marines are the biggest racists in the galaxy more or less, with possibly the Inquisition being slightly more insane. The three main enemies are aliens, demons and mutants, and a mutant is anyone not considered human by the agencies of the Imperium. Some are ignored, such as the Ogryns and the Ratlings, but most are hunted down and killed outright.

And lets see what makes a Space Marine special beings... Recruited at a young age, pre-teen often, put through immense physical and psychological stress, having several implants, several of which are fatal to but a few strong individuals. Survive all of this, then you end up as a Marine Scout, earning your place in the Chapter by waging war for a couple of decades. Survive all of this, and you will become a Space Marine and be honored with Power Armor. And then, all you have to look forward to is a couple of centuries of warfare, since Marines can live for 300-400 years. Yeah... that would make them kinda special, compared to ordinary Guardsmen.

You actually want to discuss the Lore of 40k? When you obviously have no clue what that Lore includes.

EDIT:
Oh yeah... The Emperor was not a Space Marine.

[–] FreedomFighter08 13 years ago

No actually I spend more time studying our lore, the real life-lore, that obviously describes why I do not know as much as you do, I described what I felt about the space marines being a race of its own, my reaction to it. That's probably also why the game developers make space marines and the imperial guard two different sides in Dawn of War and not one side, representing one race, this doesn't need to be facts but my point strenghtens this idea I believe, because that's my natural reaction to the imperium of man, and I don't think I'm the only one who agrees about this.

[–] Scruffy_Swede 13 years ago

So you basically dont know anything about 40k, yet you got into a discussion about it, despite not knowing anything about 40k, or Warhammer Fantasy for that matter.

This movie is not a movie based on Dawn of War. It is based on Warhammer 40,000, the tabletop game, and the extensive IP that comes with it ( that includes several books, not to mention background info found in various rulebooks for the game and so on ). So, DoW has nothing to do with this movie, there are other sources, however, that are far more significant to consider.

EDIT:
As for your Lore comment...
"And when you study the lore and play gamestories and listen to their conversations you notice that they see them as special individuals"
Really, you are not, in this sentence, refering the Lore of 40k?

[–] FreedomFighter08 13 years ago

Well thank you for enlightening me it was cool

[–] erokdarksteel 13 years ago

As a gigantic dork and 40k fanatic, I thoroughly read each of your posts for accuracy or the chance to argue some tiny point.

You sir, have your lore down pretty damn well.

It disappoints me that Dan Abnett (IMO the best writer who does BL books) would not point out some of these glaring inconsistencies in the film, given how very detailed he is in his writing.

[–] angrymonkey_911 13 years ago

@BOXAREN 163: Ok, first off i play the tabletop game (I play Space marines AND Imperial guard.)and you got it all wrong about the Imperial guard. first error, they DO praise the emperor in combat saying pre much the same quotes as the Astartes. The Imperial guard are basically the best you can train a regular human to be. While the Space marines are individually badasses, there are about 100,000 guardsmen for every Space marine. The imperium would not be as successful, but it would Survive just fine without the space marines. It even sais in the SM codex there is only about one space marine for every 5 or 6 planets under Imperial control. The SMs are only a very small part of the Imperium, there is the Space marines, Sisters of Battle, Witch hunters, Inquisitors, the Ordeo maleus (Grey Knights) and, the backbone, the Imperial guard. Without the IG the imperium would not have the manpower to survive.

'I'm sorry, I was too busy... Being Delicious!'

-Judge Fudge

[–] erokdarksteel 13 years ago

It is worth noting that while the rank of Brother-Sergeant is far more appropriate for leading a squad in battle, it is not uncommon for Captains to have their own "Honour Guard" or Command Squad. I have not seen the film yet so I do not know the circumstances, but this does not seem outside the realm of possibility.

The Ultramarines in particular are recognized for their usage of elite honor guards in surgical missions, which are most certainly allowed by the Codex Astartes.

[–] familyofjokers 13 years ago

From boxaren 163: you don't notice the imperial guard saying when going in to battle "For the emperor, the emperor protects, the emperor shall guide me"

Just to add my voice of agreement to what Scruffy Swede has said about this: yes, actually, the Imperial Guard DO worship the Emperor as a god. I don't know how obvious this is in Dawn of War, but the tabletop game certainly makes this very clear.

However, I can relate to what boxaren 163 is saying about Space Marines being like a separate race from the Imperial Guard (and the rest of mankind). They do seem distinctly different, what with all the genetic modifications, etc.

[–] jannispetersen 13 years ago

Of course they say they are the best marines chapter. Fact is, every Space Marines chapter says they are the best or the chosen. Any why shouldn't they say that - it doesn't make them automatically the best though.

[–] iluvmallow 13 years ago

"When fighting a horde of Berzerkers, why dont they call in airsupport; they have a Thunderhawk with them after all, carrying missiles, rockets, Heavy Bolters AND a Battle Cannon!!!
Not to mention the Battle Barge in orbit! " - The fact that visibility ont he ground was about 15 meters maybe?? I doubt the thunderhawk could have seen much

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] wraith-king 13 years ago

i agree with u in the earth shacking thing
but disagree in the bridge and their flexibility
and before i say why i have to say that i dont know that much of the universe but i will guess
the bridge in probably made by the imperium engineers so they will make it super strong so that their main forces -sm- can use it i mean it would be incredibly stupid not it make that way so their own troops cant use it
as to flexibility think about it
it the 41 millenium and the Imperium of man is the strongest in the universe
they have super human soldiers they have super armors and ships and other stuff
yet their most basic important unite of them all -sm- the one that have super armor and genealogy improved to do some serious ass kicking
yet they move like turtles?
and about them getting *beep* for some wounds they are made to stand i did not get that either
however i though it maybe have something to do with the chaos influence in that world
maybe they rearmed they troops with some sort of more powerful bullets or something after all they are some serious threat to man kind so i wount expect them to use laim weapons

and if i may add something

that was laim i guess does not the Imperium look very weak and fragile ?
i mean in the movie a single tanted dude could have destroyed the Imperium
dont they do a check to troops coming from combat ?
that was laim imo

[–] Dragooner 13 years ago

"the bridge in probably made by the imperium engineers so they will make it super strong so that their main forces -sm- can use it i mean it would be incredibly stupid not it make that way so their own troops cant use it"

The one thing that you will quickly learn about 41k universe is that everything(and i mean everything) is broken/decaying/rusting/in a general state of decline. Kind of a metaphor for the Imperium itself.

"it the 41 millenium and the Imperium of man is the strongest in the universe"

Actually one can argue that the the Imperium of Man is barely hanging on. They have to worry about external threats(xenos/Chaos). And have to also deal with threats from within(heresy/rebellion)

[–] general_sug 13 years ago

The strongers force is the Orks, if they would ever unite.

[–] jernej-tojersu 13 years ago

That's exactly what I'm saying.

The marines in the movie had no mass to them. They didn't have that presence.

I know people in real life that have a more intimidating presence than the marines in the movie.

[–] Nebraxis 13 years ago

Right, this thing about the armour weighing a lot and having the ground shake etc.
Yes, they are heavy, but they also have millions of tiny little servos and motors that:

A) Distribute the weight
B) Compensate for the weight

I don't play the game, but I absolutly love the lore and background on the WH40K universe. They are mechanised combat suits connected directly to the nervous system of the Marine. It is essentially like a second skin. In fact I recall reading somewhere that the gauntlets for example actually feel like a thin pair of gloves. To a marine the suit weighs next to nothing. I would go so far as to say it probably feels like they are wearing a suit of combat gear today's modern military might wear.

As for the ground shaking... do you realise how much force would be required to actually make the ground shake? Far more than is depicted in films and tv shows, which is done for dramatic effect. Personnaly I thought the film was very good and actually remained quite faithful to the lore. And the argument over their size etc. When one of the marines was having his honour seals attached did you see the size comparision between the marine and the servitor who was placing the seals?

The hamster ate my nuts...

[–] Scruffy_Swede 13 years ago

well, according to "Deathwatch" a Marine weighs between 500-1000 kg ( 1000kg being a ton ) all in all. Sure, with Black Carapace, the Power Armour does become the "body" of the Marine, but the overall weight is still substantial.

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] jernej-tojersu 13 years ago

In the movie, they are seen jumping onto an OLD STONE PILLAR. And NOTHING happens, we don't even see stone chipping away. They weigh almost a ton. JESUS CHRIST MAN.

Imagine a car jumping onto an old stone pillar.

Ok if you can't do that, Imagine 10 guys each weighing over a tong going across a wooden bridge. Because that's what they do in the movie.

10 TONS GOING OVER A WOODEN BRIDGE.

Thats some tough ass wood my friends.

That's almost the kind of the wood Hefner had. The movie makers should be proud.

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] moleogod 13 years ago

super suits of awesomeness. legendary wording