MovieChat Forums > The Big Short (2015) Discussion > Good film but totally ignores the govern...

Good film but totally ignores the governments role in the collapse


the banks were simply following the laws and regulations imposed upon them by the federal government. For example, the Housing and Community Development Act was signed into law in 1992. The bill enacted new “affordable housing goals” for two giant government-sponsored enterprises: Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Remember them?

The Dept. of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) mandated that Fannie and Freddie to meet a certain quota of loans to low-income and moderate-income borrowers when they purchased mortgages, which required them to devote a certain proportion of their mortgage purchases to lower-income borrowers.

Before 1992, Fannie and Freddie would buy only prime or traditional mortgages. This usually required a 10 percent down payment, a low debt-to-income ratio, and a solid credit history. Mortgages not meeting these standards were called “subprime” if the weakness in the loan was caused by the borrower’s credit standing, and were called “Alt-A” if the problem was the quality of the loan itself.

HUD continued to direct that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to relax their requirement standards on mortgage loans. By 1995, they were accepting mortgages with 3 percent down payments, and by 2000 loans with no down payments.

By 2008 about 30 million of the subprime loans were held by government agencies or government-backed entities.

You can read more about it here: http://dailysignal.com/2015/02/27/governments-role-financial-crisis/


That said its a good fine with some fine performances. It's too bad more people didn't speak out before 2008.



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More horse dung blaming the gov't for 2008. Reagan's administration initiated the banking deregulations (established under the Republican's anti-Christ, FDR, thank you) at the behest of the banking industry. The gov't did not put a gun to the banks' head and force them to sell sub-prime mortgages.

OP: Isn't there a Trump rally you should be attending?

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The subprime mortgages are one thing, but bundling them into securities is another. That's what people mean by greed.

The gov't can be kinda dumb with influencing Frannie and Freddie, but they never told them to be flat out irresponsible with the homeowners. If a person qualifies for subprime, let them borrow a lot less, avoid balloon payments, refuse multiple purchases. These geniuses were buying five houses and renting them out. I can't feel bad for them declaring bankruptcy when I know they collected $100K in rent over a couple of years.

I'm better than you.

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This is no deregulation. This is regulation, there is a difference.

The gov't did not put a gun to the banks' head and force them to sell sub-prime mortgages.
Yes, the government did. The Clinton administration has been suing banks on grounds of racial discrimination for not giving loans to minorities.

And today Hilary Clinton is repeating this narrative that banks are discriminating against minorities. She will force banks to write bad loans again.

A cynic is what an idealist calls a realist - Sir Humphrey Appleby

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Really? What banks were sued?

Didn't know strippers were considered minorities. LOL!

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The following class action case is an example showing Obama Sued Citibank on the grounds of racial discrimination in 1994 https://iusbvision.wordpress.com/2008/09/30/obama-sued-citibank-under-cra-to-force-it-to-make-bad-loans/:

Case Name
Buycks-Roberson v. Citibank Fed. Sav. Bank Fair Housing/Lending/Insurance
Docket / Court 94 C 4094 ( N.D. Ill. ) FH-IL-0011
State/Territory Illinois

Case Summary
Plaintiffs filed their class action lawsuit on July 6, 1994, alleging that Citibank had engaged in redlining practices in the Chicago metropolitan area in violation of the Equal Credit Opportunity Act (ECOA), 15 U.S.C. 1691; the Fair Housing Act, 42 U.S.C. 3601-3619; the Thirteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution; and 42 U.S.C. 1981, 1982. Plaintiffs alleged that the Defendant-bank rejected loan applications of minority applicants while approving loan applications filed by white applicants with similar financial characteristics and credit histories. Plaintiffs sought injunctive relief, actual damages, and punitive damages.

U.S. District Court Judge Ruben Castillo certified the Plaintiffs’ suit as a class action on June 30, 1995. Buycks-Roberson v. Citibank Fed. Sav. Bank, 162 F.R.D. 322 (N.D. Ill. 1995). Also on June 30, Judge Castillo granted Plaintiffs’ motion to compel discovery of a sample of Defendant-bank’s loan application files. Buycks-Roberson v. Citibank Fed. Sav. Bank, 162 F.R.D. 338 (N.D. Ill. 1995).

The parties voluntarily dismissed the case on May 12, 1998, pursuant to a settlement agreement.
Plaintiff’s Lawyers Alexis, Hilary I. (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-7500 | FH-IL-0011-7501 | FH-IL-0011-9000
Childers, Michael Allen (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-7500 | FH-IL-0011-7501 | FH-IL-0011-9000
Clayton, Fay (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-7500 | FH-IL-0011-7501 | FH-IL-0011-9000
Cummings, Jeffrey Irvine (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-7500 | FH-IL-0011-7501 | FH-IL-0011-9000
Love, Sara Norris (Virginia)
FH-IL-0011-9000
Miner, Judson Hirsch (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-7500 | FH-IL-0011-9000
Obama, Barack H. (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-7500 | FH-IL-0011-7501 | FH-IL-0011-9000
Wickert, John Henry (Illinois)
FH-IL-0011-9000

Followings are quotes from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortgage_discrimination:
In 1993 President Bill Clinton made changes to the Community Reinvestment Act to make mortgages more obtainable for lower and lower-middle-class families. In 1993 the Federal Bank of Boston issued a report entitled “Closing the Gap: A Guide to Equal Opportunity Lending." The 30 page document was intended to serve as a guide to loan officers to help curb discriminatory lending [10] "Closing the Gap," instructs banks to hire based upon diversity needs, sweeten the compensation structure for working with lower income applicants, encourages shifting high risk, low income applications to the sub prime market, by saying "the secondary market [Subprime Market] is willing to consider ratios above the standard 28/36," and "Lack of credit history should not be seen as a negative factor."

While, "Closing the Gap" was not an industry-wide mandate, it illustrates the efforts banks took to meet public pressure to overcome mortgage discrimination. Under the Clinton administration community organizers pressured banks to increase their loans to minorities. Karen Wegmann, the head of Wells Fargo's community development group in 1993 told the New York Times, "The atmosphere now is one of saying yes." [11] The same New York Times article echoed "Closing the Gap," writing, "The banks have also modified some standards for credit approval. Many low-income people do not have credit-bureau files because they do not have credit cards. So lenders are accepting records of continuously paid utility bills as evidence of creditworthiness. Similarly, they will accept steady income from several employers instead of the length of time at one job."

Because of looser loan restrictions many people who did not qualify for a mortgage before now could own a home. The banks issued loans with teaser rates, knowing that when higher variable rates kicked in later the borrowers would not be able to meet their payments. As long as housing prices kept rising and borrowers could refinance easily, everyone appeared to be doing well.


Following are from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Reinvestment_Act:
Federal Reserve chair Ben Bernanke has stated that an underlying assumption of the CRA – that more lending equals better outcomes for local communities – may not always be true, pointing to "recent problems in mortgage markets". However, he notes that at least in some instances, "the CRA has served as a catalyst, inducing banks to enter under-served markets that they might otherwise have ignored".


Quotes from my another post:

Why were adjustable rate mortgages getting popular? From what I understand is that Clinton administration established a task force to sue banks refusing give loans to people on the grounds of racial discrimination because a lot of people with bad credit ratings are minorities. But banks do not want to lose money on this, so they are forced to write the loans but sell these money losers right away. But you can't sell the loans if you know people are going to default very quickly because you have to pool thousands of loans before you can sell. So they give very low interests on the first few years of the loan so people can pay, then they have enough time to sell the loans as bonds before people default. Of course bankers were naughty, but between losing money and being naughty, they choose being naughty.

Were bank customers, the consumers, stupid? No, they were actually not. They thought they could live in a house for few years and pay less money on mortgage than rent. And in few years they will sell for a profit or refinance. But that only works if housing market always go up, and looking at history (before 2007) they were not wrong or stupid.

You think the big banks are the problems, well, actually investment banks securitizing these loans noticed big pick up on demand of mortgage securities. They were buying these loans from small mortgage houses mostly because big banks were not writing enough subprime loans, and they were making so much money the big banks were just catching up.

The difference is that the small mortgage houses don't get rescued. You think breaking up big banks into smaller ones are better? Think what happens if all banks were small and none of them worth of rescuing and they all failing then what you do? Having big banks means government could at least do something, instead of choosing doing nothing and let every bank fall or rescuing every bank which would have costed many times more money that no government could afford.


A cynic is what an idealist calls a realist - Sir Humphrey Appleby

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rorey seems to have given up on this argument

I'm better than you.

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How did the government force the banks to convert all of these bad mortgages into deceptive securities?

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The government never forced banks to give loans to people with rock bottom ficos or without the means to pay them back. I think providing a path for low-income homeownership was a good thing, but the government did not regulate it properly or it got stripped away, so before it was all over (the first time) massive greed and fraud was being committed by the banks, mortgage stores, the rating agencies, and the SEC. FHA and other like programs were not meant to let people buy quarter million dollar and up homes, but that's how it wound up.

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They didn't force them, but they sure as hell opened the door. Would you leave a delicious steak on the coffee table and expect your dog not to eat it?

I'm better than you.

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So in essence the Banks and Wall Street created the Housing Bubble. It's easy to blame the government because it's a broad definition perceived to be one ominous entity controlling people's lives, but it isn't. That's like blaming the supreme court because it favors certain laws and upholds certain lawsuits, but not blaming the plaintiffs or the defendants.

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Long_Ball_Larry seems to have given up on his argument.

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kek so you come here 5 years later after being btfo'd on the previous comment chain, that's just too funny really

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LOL! And you need to make snide comments about year-old posts.

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Yea I just watched the movie and came to check what people were saying. You are here everyday seething about some comments from 5 years ago that destroyed your ego and bringing up a comeback 5 years later.

We are not the same.

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It’s actually amazing seeing these messages from 5 years ago referring to a Trump rally as some kind of insult, LMAO. Especially now looking back at Trump’s A+ economic and world peace record, and with Bidinflation looming. Pure ignorance.

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Your heading is spot on accurate. But it seems at least half the electorate wishes to continue this delusion.

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No. You are wrong.

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Agreed. Hollywood always wants to blame the business world.

I'm better than you.

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The business world is total scum, thanks.

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I read that this giving away houses began during Carter's reign.

Can you fly this plane?
Surely u cant be serious
I am serious,and dont call me Shirley

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Nope, houses aren't given away or controlled by the branches in govornment.

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Bump worthy. The OP and nuhor are right. Lefties in denial.

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You know it's true when Lalaland completely ignores the root of all of this. How on earth did this movie completely ignore why any bank would give out subprime mortgages? It all started under Carter and Clinton and the Bamster made it worse.

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