MovieChat Forums > A Better Life (2011) Discussion > my one annoyance...

my one annoyance...

posted 13 years ago by call-betelguese
15 replies | jump to latest

the father speaking so much English.

I had the same reaction when it came to "Real Women Have Curves," or "How the Garcia Girls Spent Their Summer"

They want to portray East LA illegal immigrant workers (maybe not Garcia Girls) and they speak too much English. I'm not trying to say these type of people (like my own parents) don't know English. Some know enough to get by, sure, but when they're at home, and I'm just judging by what i've lived and seen my whole life, English is hardly spoken.

No one ever wants to highlight the language barrier between the american born children who speak a mix of Spanish and English and immigrant parents. If the father in this movie, would have spoke solely spanish and his son spoke more that just "Papa" it would have been more realistic.

I dunno, just something that irked me.

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] oneseat 13 years ago

I agree that the father was unrealistically fluent in English, though he seemed like the kind of dad who would at least try to learn some of the language his son had picked up so easily. The director should have had the actor speak with a heavier accent and have more grammar and vocabulary problems.

He was probably trying to make Carlos more sympathetic to people who don't like to read subtitles.

[–] marteenuz 13 years ago

I agree with both posters above!
I am Mexican (yes, legal) and my parents didn't let us kids speak English at home to them at all, only among ourselves. Those who turn up your noses at this, imagine it was French or Chinese and you will understand how fortunate I was and how well that turned out for me. It did not damage me; I went to college and have a BA and two masters degrees.

My folks did speak more English in the house (not a lot more, but some) to my youngest brother, probably because we older ones had acclimated him to English earlier than we were, and he probably needed it more than we had. And my parents had probably just gotten worn out... :)

But lastly, most people don't believe me when I tell them that Mexico actually has a respectable literacy rate; this is because -
1. Spanish is a much easier language in which to become literate, and
2. Mexicans see a lot more foreign language (read English) films than Americans, so you get a lot more practice, even if you did not have a lot of schooling. Americans - not so much. It's like what is happening to peoples' bodies as we become more sedentary when you don't have to exert yourself - you use it or you lose it. And - it makes you really lazy.

There is a professor in Washington State who does brain research on babies, and she has proven that people who learn two languages store the information in different parts of the brain, which a., means the bilingual map out more mental real estate than thos who speak only one language, and b. the constant translation process involves left-right brain interaction, which makes the mind more nimble and better at analogous thinking and problem solving. This provides great defenses against memory loss, Alzheimer's, and it increases the odds of recovering from stroke and traumatic brain injury. Pretty neat, no?

I would like to express my appreciation to all the posters in these threads who recognized the desperation that leads a person to do what Carlos did once, and - we can only hope - lived to do again.

When I think about how hard my parents worked to bring us here and give us a chance for that Better Life, it was not surprising to me last spring when the OECD published a list of the hardest workers in the world - guess which country was at the top of the list? :)

http://www.oecd.org/document/60/0,3746,en_21571361_44315115_47567356_1_1_1_1,00.html

[–] oneseat 13 years ago

Thank you so much for the insights about your family's immigration experience, Marteenuz.

I have learned passable French and Spanish and a little German, but as someone who has worked with English learners a lot, I recognize what a difficult language English is, especially compared to relatively consistent Spanish.

I have read the same studies as you and wish I had been encouraged to become fluent in another language as a child. Crosswords, Sudokus, foreign languages! Stave off Alzheimer's, folks.

[–] estradajake 13 years ago

You know what my father was born in Puerto Rico, never spoke english until he came to NYC, moved to NJ, then Philadelphia and I will tell you what. My father spoke perfect english. No accent, and was mistaken for an Italian. I have more of an accent then my father did. So to say it was unrealistic that the father spoke so much spanish is not that far from the truth. Just because some have a hard time learning english doesn't mean every hispanic does. I know spanish well, my father taught me and my sister. Yet he felt it was important to know english.

[–] johnnycashak 13 years ago

If I moved to a new country, I'd learn the language and my children would speak the language. And both linguists and neuroscience disagree with your assertion that "spanish is easier to learn than english," or any other language for that matter. It was only easier for you because it was the first one you learned, and that is how the language centers of your brain developed. Had you learned english first, or Japanese or German for that matter, this wouldn't have been the case.

[–] aGuiltySoul 13 years ago

Easy to say, but the people who are depicted in this film reflect the typcial attitude toward their native language vs. their adopted homeland language....particularly if almost everyone you meet speaks your native language. That the lead character speaks so much English is clearly a subtext. It shows how much effort he has put into being an involved parent.

BTW, my sister and her husband emmigrated to Brazil and were part of a large English speaking community. She and her husband were two of the VERY few that ever became conversant in Portugese. The children all spoke it, of course. But even some of them learned it on the street because the families insisted on English speaking private schooling.

BTW, I agree that Spanish is the easiest language to learn. It has the least exceptions to its rules of spelling and grammar than any other language (ever tried to count in French?) And once you learn the alphabet you can so easily spell that it is not a course taught in school, unlike English where it is sometimes so difficult that we have contests between students.(spelling bees)

"I'd never ask you to trust me. It's the cry of a guilty soul."

[–] Sweet_Canela1 12 years ago

I disagree, I think it was a the right amount for this movie. He spoke Spanish with his sister and the guy he worked with. His child was obviously one of the kids that wasn't all that interested in speaking Spanish, so he spoke to him in English.
He also told his story and he'd been there for at least 14+ years since his son was born there. If his son spoke English I'm thinking there is a good chance in 15 years he could speak as well as he did.
I speak Spanish and have been speaking it for over 16 years, boy did I have to laugh at the subtitles though. I'm really glad I know Spanish!

[–] monstermayhem32 12 years ago

I would have said that Luis was one of the minor annoyances in the film since he was unlikable at first especially towards his dad but I liked it when they bonded.

[–] RCeditor 12 years ago

I am Mexican (yes, legal) and my parents didn't let us kids speak English at home to them at all, only among ourselves. Those who turn up your noses at this, imagine it was French or Chinese and you will understand how fortunate I was and how well that turned out for me. It did not damage me; I went to college and have a BA and two masters degrees.

It's interesting that you say that, marteenuz. I hear many people who have parents from another country say that they only spoke the original language at home.

My mother was also from another country, but I spoke English at home & at school. Mom started picking up English. By the time I was as old as the character in this movie, my mother could easily communicate with people who were born in the US (like me). So the situation in the film is indeed possible.

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[–] Gaimcap 12 years ago

I don't know. Never lived in East LA and the details are slightly different, but I posted this in another thread and I still think it applies.

This movie actually is almost 100% spot on in the dynamic I have with my father.

As soon as I began to watch it and realized what was going on, i almost wanted to turn it off because it felt too real. My father came here as an illegal alien and has worked hard his whole life to provide us with a living. Like the son in the movie, I've always known that deep-down an respected him for it, but at the same time taken it for granted because he's never really there to be seen. The struggles the father goes through are ones that I know for a fact that my father does as well. He feels guilty because he knows he's not there, but his culture and guilt don't allow for him to say anything to his kid so he compensates by focusing on his work, thinking his son will live better and have the opportunities and education he never did.

As the son you're trapped because you don't want to let down your father who worked so hard for your success, but at the same time you see what's going on around you and are sucked in by it, so you forget to pay him respect and you forget and maybe even become ashamed of your heritage, and then you grow to resent them because they made you feel trapped to be something you think you can't possibly be.

I wasn't born in the barrio or had a particularly hard life. My father lucked out and managed to build a business with his bear hands. He went from picking fruit in fields, mowing lawns, and washing cars to starting and running a multimillion grossing small business. I've lived a pretty decent white-washed middle-class life with two parents to raise me (neither of them are native born incidentally, mother's korean). I consider myself a conservative republican(too many half-assed socialistic policies are cropping up) and lived life with no real hardships. Even so, this movie connected with me and I completely got it.

Before he arrived here, he spoke almost no English. Maybe bits and pieces from what he could remember learning in elementary school (before he had to start working, and that's as far as his education ever got) but that's about it. Although I said I had a middle-class life, I do remember the starting years before the business began when we lived dirt poor. Spanish was the only language spoken in those areas, but even so my father made it an effort to only speak English when it was just us. He knew that English and education were key to becoming successful in this country so as soon as he got here he made sure he could speak it; and he would make sure his kids did too. It's to the point where my younger brother speaks almost absolutely no Spanish now and he has more Mexican friends than I do (Still raised in a mostly Mexican town and school, but it's in Orange County and a good chunk of the population is middle-class WASPs). Thirty something years after his arrival, sometimes people get confused when my dad starts speaking Spanish because his English is so perfect. He actually speaks much better English than my mother, and my mother emigrated here when she was young enough to still be in high school and did graduate from college here.

[–] usherman 12 years ago

There are many who try to learn as much english as they can. He is probably one of those parents that forces the kid to learn english and wont let them speak spanish at home. Notice that he spoke mostly spanish to his boss to accomodate him. It's not like there is anyone else at home to speak spanish to. Also he's been here awhile so it's possible he could have learned that much english. He is most likely the exception to the rule though.

[–] jasticology21 12 years ago

Yea but you know. They have to Americanize it. A lot of people would have disliked the film a lot more if they spoke mostly Spanish. Like me I don't like reading subtitles that much..

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] MisterSky 8 years ago

The reason for this is simple. Americans hate reading subtitles.