MovieChat Forums > The Sunset Limited (2011) Discussion > My Take On The Film

My Take On The Film

posted 13 years ago by TheGutterMonkey
12 replies | jump to latest

Just a quick theory:

I believe that the conversation between White and Black may not be — or may not only be, rather — a conversation between two men. I believe it may simultaneously be a representation of the thoughts which may go through this particular mans mind while staring his own death in the eye.

That is to say, perhaps the conversation between White and Black may represent the contradicting feelings one educated man may feel as he's contemplating suicide. Through all he's learned about the history of the world and the fallacies of religion, he comes to the inevitable conclusion that life is meaningless. Yet, at the same time, he also has the vague ideas of the opposing side lingering in his head — causing him to question whether or not his decision is the correct one, and if life is truly worth living.

At the end of the film, his more nihilistic ideas of life get the better of him and beat out the reasons to live that he (in the form of Black) was battling. So he heads out to try his suicide once again.

As White leaves the room, intent on trying to do himself in again, Black screams to him that he'll be there with him when he tries. I feel that, although this may be the case in reality, it may also be representative of the fact that when White gets back to the tracks, facing death, he'll once again begin this inward battle of "should I, or shouldn't I."

squidoo.com/EvolutionIsReal

S.C.W.
"We're all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars"

[–] pathetic1-1 13 years ago

And what would that add to the film? I sincerely don't intend to be rude, but I see these sorts of interpretations all over IMDB and almost 100% of the time it's the viewer layering stuff onto the film that simply isn't there. There's absolutely nothing going on in The Sunset Limited that would suggest it's all taking place in White's head. The movie offers plenty to think about as it is - wouldn't a weird, second layer like that be superfluous?

[–] TheGutterMonkey 13 years ago

Well that's my intention: to lay more on the film than there is; not to the plot as you see it laid out, but to the added symbolism of the plot.

I'm not suggesting that the man has a Tyler Durden-esque double personality, and I'm certainly not say that is what the film is about — if for no other reason, than for the fact that each character appeared to have aspects of their own individual lives that were unknown by the opposing character. I don't mean to say that the film was actually taking place in Whites head.

All I'm suggesting is that there could be dual layers which have no other purpose than of symbolism — while the film itself remains to be, simply, a real discussion between two men of opposing beliefs.

I'm not saying that the film was taking place in White or Blacks head; they, each, were clearly two different people. I'm merely suggesting that the discussion in which they go through — the battle of "is life worth it?", if you will — could also be a representation of what one man on the brink of suicidal despair could be going through.

In this view (whether it was the intention or not) the characters remain to be as real and true as you see them and the conversation remains as real and true as you see it. It's merely an added depth to the analysis of the mind of people in general.

So while Black is literally telling this other man that he will be there with him the next time he tries to jump, it could be simultaneously representing the fact that Whites doubts about his conclusion of life will be there too.

I don't find that superfluous at all.

squidoo.com/EvolutionIsReal

S.C.W.
"We're all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars"

[–] simplyfsl 13 years ago

I totally agree with you, many people come to these boards to get some enlightenment of what they didn't understand but over-interpretation and digging more deep what actually is, confuses even more..

Now for a complex layered movie like Inception, 2001 interpretations on Imdb might make sense, but for a beautiful movie like this, which explains itself excellently , to create alternate plot-lines 1000 miles away from what the makers wanted or to over-interpret ruins the experience..

Why so Serious ?

[–] gigadragon12 13 years ago

Listen,

I don't think OP is trying to suggest an alternate storyline, or that this is the real storyline of the story. A story is a story, everything that happens in a story REALLY HAPPENS.

Inferring meaning and metaphor from a movie is something completely different. I think what OP is really getting at is the fact that both men are representative of viewpoints and conflicts that afflict real people (as in outside of the movie, if we can get you there for a minute). Real People struggle with being faithful and faithless, real people struggle with wanting heaven or wanting nonexistence (btw, someone said it, but White isn't looking for Hell, he's looking for nonexistence, a black void, nothingness), and another great point is that NO MATTER WHAT you can rarely convince anyone else of anything, especially if you are trying to impress the opposite of their belief onto them.

An Atheist will never convert a Christian and vice versa. Things like morals and things are a personal choice for the person. Whatever works, works. Note that in the movie its important to remember that neither party "wins", White succeeds in being stronger at the end of the movie (whereas Black was stronger at the beginning (could also say that his argument was more malleable over time, though I don't believe that's entirely true)) yet he is going to die. He won the argument, but what did he "win?" Same goes for Black, who appears desperate and on the verge of defeat, lonely in his apartment, hoping to God that he is right. But what did he "lose?" Even if White somehow persuaded him that his opinion of things were true, that doesn't warrant Black jumping out of his apartment window.

It is that viewpoint of these ideals that really take in this movie, and I completely agree, every person is made up of White and Black, and exist constantly in a void of Gray.

Of course, its best to just say that, the Art (the movie) is unchangeable, The Message is what matters. And the message, just like the philosophies argued, is personal, and we're all going to take something different out of it. The best thing to do is share and "debate" (read: Not fervently argue against no matter what) those ideas. Debate is the refinement of a strong idea.

[–] smontg0001 13 years ago

My take is that they are both dead already, Black died in prison, White by the Sunset Limited. The apartment is Purgatory. Black is seeking redemption, and White would rather return to the hell he knows.

[–] Ace_Moonshot 13 years ago

No offense to the OP but yours makes more sense if we are going to make stuff up not supported in any way in the film.

Don't trust reality. After all, it's only a collective hunch.

[–] dreamcandyy 13 years ago

Hah, I can see that youre simply giving your honest opinion about a certain aspect (or another) on your interpretation of the film, in general. And yes I like your symbolism, it reminds me of the battle between "Black, and White" in the series Lost, as they were symbolic as well.

So, unfortunately some of the others say that YOURE "digging in too deep", when in fact they're the ones making things complicated.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, they are very sound.

[–] pathetic1-1 13 years ago

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, they are very sound.

With all due respect, they're not particularly sound. Although OP's interpretation is more plausible than the 'they're in purgatory' theory, there's absolutely nothing in The Sunset Limited to suggest anything is happening but what's shown to us. Black prevents White from jumping in front of a train, takes him back to his apartment, attempts to save him and fails. For the most part, every idea is laid out bare in the dialogue - even to the point where it occasionally doesn't even sound like natural speech. Successful metaphor and symbolism should support and enrich what you're already being shown literally, not change the entire meaning of the film. Symbolism fails when it serves no other purpose but to contradict or muddle.

[–] dreamcandyy 13 years ago

Hah, have you read Shakespeare?

Case in point.

He has his characters rant over this and that, yet astonishes the hearts of many people with his particular writing style. You can probably easily edit out a few pages worth of words and his stories would STILL get the point across. These are again, my claims.

Or how about the film Inception? Or you think you've got every single angle of it? That's impossible because that is the point.

But, I have a feeling you don't comprehend that that is the point..

[–] pathetic1-1 13 years ago

I've read Shakespeare, yes.

I've only watched Inception once, and my impression was that it's a brilliantly executed action movie with a bit more to say about the nature of consciousness and memory than mainstream action films usually offer up. I'd also agree that the ambiguity and being unable to say 'this is what happened' was part of the point. Overall I quite liked it.

But I still think that The Sunset Limited boldly lays everything right out on the table. If there was an indication that White was struggling with faith, particularly the Christian faith, that would support OP's theory. But there's nothing in the piece to even suggest that. He's alive and talking to Black because Black interfered - no other reason. The man is wholly committed to dying and that's the point of the character.

But I share this just for sake of discussion, people are welcome to enjoy it any way they like. It just surprises me how often I see this sort of speculation on the IMDB forums.

[–] drharris1212 13 years ago

With all due respect to you,

the fact that you are so ready to dismiss the idea of purgatory, to me, means you didn't really pay attention to the movie.

No line is by accident. The fact that SLJ doesn't have a phone or the questions (like the worst thing SLJ has done) they purposely don't answer.

Go ahead and read something written by Cormack McCarthy ( I recommend Blood Meridian). EVERYTHING has meaning.

How could you possibly take a movie done about such heavy things (life/death/God/nothingness) in a script written by a good Southern Man like McCarthy, and take everything at face value.

The purgatory idea is definitely possible, or just that SLJ had already died and he is trying to save TLJ's soul (worst thing SLJ has done, which they leave out, I took as it could have been failing to save TLJ). SLJ could be in purgatory because he lived his life as that of a sinner, but found God in death, and his penance is to try and save his Brother, from eternal damnation.

Now I am not saying this is right, only Cormack (and maybe now TLJ and SLJ) really knows what all the meaning actually is supposed to be. I am just saying there is a TON of "more than meets the eye" type of stuff from this movie. I also don't believe it to be McCarthy's intention to have everything be concrete, he wants us to interpret it our own way, just like it is up to man to interpret God's message himself.

[–] Thespear 13 years ago

I am with the OP on this one. I don't think he is reading something unreasonable or extraordinary into the story and I absolutely detest those who insist "everything is exactly as it is shown". It is as if they are too scared to consider other possibilities. I hadn't thought about the dual parts of a single mind before but there is a lot of common sense in seeing things from that pov imo.

It is unclear whether White and Black are alive or not. Some of the references they make suggests that the suicide is already over. At the very least their conversation appears to be an attempt to do over or reconsider something that has already occurred. There is a contemplative nature to their talk that does mimic the workings of an intelligent person considering a dilemma. Why not consider that possibility?

Those who don't want to look any further beyong the most pedantic facts, let me ask you the following. Does the existence of Black seem reasonable to you? Does his explanation of how he met White seem reasonable...that he "fell into his arms"? Why didn't White see him? Didn't you get the impression Black knew he answers to some of the personal questions he was asking White, before he asked them? I certainly did. There is definitely a level on which each man seemed to know the other that is not common with big city strangers. Perhaps what might appeal more to your "as it is " mind, consider this. White does not appear injured, dazed or unbalanced in any way, right? Black too does not appear to be a medical professional of any kind right? Why the heck would Black be given charge of or take charge of a complete stranger in a New York train station? These men never knew each other before today yet White is prepared to remain behind multiple locks with a strange black man? Do you recall a portion of the movie where it seems Black is reading Whites thoughts? How and why did Black and White end up together in one apartment?

There is more than meets the eye on this one and I think the OP might have touched on at least ONE possibility. It is a shame others are to narrow minded to even examine that possibility.

"We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are". Nin