This movie was hilarious, raunchy and funny as hell. But the same people who loved Hangover don't like it because women are doing it and only men are allowed to be obnoxious, use poop humor or crazy sexual situations?? Ug. I realize some might not enjoy this kind of humor - no problem. It's not for everyone but DAMMIT I am sick and frickn tired of seeing, yet AGAIN the double standards.
shareThank you for the sane input, could not agree more.
shareI loved both Bridesmaids and the Hangover.
shareIf you get your opinions of men from IMDB message boards...or the internet in general...you're doing it wrong. Just sayin'...
You people and your slight differences disgust me.
Lol :) no, that day I had another real life encounter that was totally sexist and then read some hate here. I realize not all men are like this either but I often find myself dealing with men like this and it makes me a bit crazy. Wish they were all just Internet trolls rather than *ahem* people I actually live with!!
shareYeah, I'm not saying they ain't out there! lol But internet hate is that special kind of anonymous faceless rage that we all like to partake in every now and again.
You people and your slight differences disgust me.
I disliked both Bridesmaids and Hangover, just not my kind of comedy. However, I do find it ironic how some people praise Hangover while saying Bridesmaids is *beep* when they are basically the same thing - difference is, one is made of female cast and has dynamic between women, and the other is mostly a male cast and the dynamic is between men.
The double standards is there since the beginning, why do you think movies with mainly female cast are called "chick flicks"? While movies with male cast are just...movies? Why do you think women laugh at comedies written by men while a lot of men feel the need to make fun of comedies written by women (as smart as they can be)? It's a male dominated industry. There's a reason why female comedians have a hard time getting a job, while rape apologists are PRAISED by their fanboys. Of course not all are like that, Arrested Development was mainly written by a man (the second biggest writer was a woman), and it's possibly the best comedy ever written. My problem here is not with men writing comedy, but with people thinking it's okay and hilarious for men to do X and it's gross and unfunny when women do the same.
However, I think that's slowly changing...with movies like Bridesmaids and Pitch Perfect, shows like 30 Rock and Parks & Recreation...women are slowly opening their way into the comedy business and allowed to be "funny" in the same way men are. :)
I have never noticed anyone having issues with women being in comedy. I appreciate female comedy as much as male (Lucille Ball and Carol Burnett being among my favorite comedians).
If people have problems with women doing raunchy comedy, though, I totally understand and agree (not judging Bridesmaids, since I haven't seen it yet). Some people, myself included, do hold women to a higher standard...not because we're sexist and don't want to let women have fun, and not because we think what men do is justifiable, but because we believe women are better than that. Women have always been the moral backbone of society. Traditionally, they were held in esteem, they were treated with respect, and they were considered above locker room humor. And call that old-fashioned, but I believe it's something worth keeping.
Nailed it, Smitty. My comment says the same :) (I'm a woman).
shareYep, I saw your comment just after I posted that. Good to know there's someone out there who feels the same way...
shareWhat you're doing is just defending men for being pigs while women should always behave better. Which is BS. Believe it or not, women do POOP, get drunk, have awkward sex, burp, swear and act like idiots JUST LIKE MEN.
shareOh, I'm well aware women act like that. In fact, they're the majority, so I don't know what your point is. I've met very few real ladies in my life.
And as I said in my original post, I'm not defending male behavior at all. But with men, it's at least natural...men have always been crude and base. Women, on the other hand, have been corrupted by men and the general degeneration of society in the last century or so. Neither of my grandmothers would've ever been as crude and tasteless as the majority of contemporary women. That's because they were ladies. And I doubt they saw the lowest common denominator as something to aspire to or as something that was necessary for their equality.
I disagree. Women were never naturally 'ladylike.' They were conditioned, trained, and expected to act so. Men and women are both naturally coarse; men and women both act mannerly only by learning to do so.
share@smitty1941 Benevolent sexism.
sharePlease elaborate...
shareCan I just say first that I feel as if people are over-reacting to this movie when you start bringing in morality. I don't see what was so morally contemptible in this film.
smitty1941,
I assume you already looked up the term but I'll just say what I think anyway.
This is what you have said:
"men have always been crude and base"
"hold women to a higher standard"
"we believe women are better than that"
"Women have always been the moral backbone of society."
"Traditionally, they were held in esteem, they were treated with respect..."
Your view of women is so much more insidious than blatant (or hostile) sexism because you mask it under what appears to be a compliment.
Nostalgia can be dangerous. I don't know how far back you're reminiscing, but the further we go back into the 1800s, the 1600s etc. the less freedom women had to be who they wanted to be, to decide their destiny. I have no wish to regress back to those days.
Remember women were viewed in dichotomous terms; she was either a madonna or a whore. There was no gradation. In this case, I feel as though you are viewing women as madonnas. You have unfair, unrealistic expectations of a sex. If you're going to be disappointed and say "I know you're much better than this", be fair and apply your judgement equally. I also believe people can be better, but I don't hold one sex to be more morally responsible for their actions than the other sex. That's what I feel as a human being.
I'm generally wary of arguments about what's "natural" and what's not but I essentially agree with willard69. In what way are humans "natural"? To what extent does society factor into this? How would we know? How would you first define "natural"? Morality, to me, is a concept. Animals (if we hold them to be the standard for what's "natural") have no such concept of morality. It's something unique to humans, and we have built civilizations on them. My point is, smitty1941, where does your "standard" of women come from? I doubt you were just born with those conceptions of women.
"Women have always been the moral backbone of society."
"Traditionally, they were held in esteem, they were treated with respect..."
If you seriously think this is bad or harmful, or needs masking, you've got a big problem. No one said anything about the frickin' 1800's or 1600's.
That's all you got from my post?
shareYes, that's the gist of it, that he's somehow likely to wish for severe regression or wrong for noting that women, heaven forbid, generally prefer to be more tidy and less gross. If there's any problem here, it would be that men aren't considered any higher than that.
shareWhose society? The whole thing is laughable. In Somalia and a few other places men cut out the clitoris of most women. I suppose that would make it easier for them to be the moral backbone of that society...one temptation removed anyway. And which morals comprise this backbone? I can imagine. All this is just cultural crap anyway. Women have traditionally been whatever men allowed them to be. It is changing slowly. Very slowly. I'm sure some of it is because of fear of the unknown and what it might mean to have to share, or take what they perceive would be a subordinate position. I get that. I just don't have a lot of sympathy for a gender that's had it their way for a long, long time. And if there are chick flicks, then the opposite must be true- dick flicks. The yin and yang of stupidity.
shareFirst of all, thanks for the reply. I actually wasn't aware of the term, so it was helpful. And as I stated above, I am not judging this movie since I haven't even seen it. I was merely responding to another poster who couldn't understand why some people objected to women doing crude comedy.
Nostalgia can be dangerous. I don't know how far back you're reminiscing, but the further we go back into the 1800s, the 1600s etc. the less freedom women had to be who they wanted to be, to decide their destiny. I have no wish to regress back to those days.I agree to some extent with this statement. Historically, women have suffered a lot of prejudice and repression. They should absolutely, for example, have the right to vote, own property, hold a job, receive equal salaries to men, run for office, choose their own husband etc. - all privileges denied to women at one point or another. And in that sense then, I wouldn't want to go back, either. But along with those bad things, there were some good things. Women were treated with respect. You may consider it sexism, but I consider it respect. Men didn't cuss or tell dirty jokes in the presence of women. They opened doors for them, helped them out of vehicles, gave up seats for them, let women go first in line, etc. And that definitely wasn't because men thought they were better than women. It's because they respected them. My point is, history isn't all bad. What we need now is a balance between the sexism of the past and the current refusal to acknowledge the basic difference between men and women.
You have unfair, unrealistic expectations of a sex. If you're going to be disappointed and say "I know you're much better than this", be fair and apply your judgement equally. I also believe people can be better, but I don't hold one sex to be more morally responsible for their actions than the other sex.Well, I actually see many shortcomings on the part of males as well. Men today have a very sexualized view of women; they see women as an object for their sexual satisfaction rather than as a person. Men often shirk their duties as a husband and father, and they are far too entertainment-oriented, which often leaves a lot of the responsibilities to women. So I don't have unfair expectations of women; I simply expect different things from each sex. And I'm not saying that I expect anyone to be perfect. Obviously, we all have shortcomings.
This sentence is interesting, “the current refusal to acknowledge the basic difference between men and women”. What is this basic difference? How does acts of chivalry that you mention, “opened doors for them, helped them out of vehicles, gave up seats for them, let women go first in line” tie into this basic difference?
In any case, if you put those acts of chivalry the “good things” in context i.e. they occurred alongside institutional sexism (which you acknowledge), then those “good things” honestly doesn't chalk up to much. The chivalrous actions are just social gestures. I have a female friend who will pause to let others go through the door before her out of politeness, even if it's a man. This often ends up in very frustrating stand-offs. If these empty social gestures are tailored to the situation and not reserved for a single sex, they might actually be helpful. I would think these days that you would hold the doors open, help out of vehicles, give up seats and let go first in line anyone who obviously needs it, regardless of sex and age. If a man looks like he's struggling with some packages, I'm sure he wouldn't feel offended if a woman held open the door for him. If a man is old, I'm sure he wouldn't feel offended is a woman held open the door for him. If a man is on crutches, I'm sure he won't feel offended if a woman gave up her seat for him. But it's your right to continue being chivalrous, no one's going to dissuade you or stop you. But so that you know, those acts of chivalry has been pointed out before by feminists as examples of benevolent sexism. Some women don't see it as benevolent sexism and still enjoy it, but not all. So don't be surprised if it's taken the wrong way some day.
OK, fair enough. No semantics. But I still press on with my point. You admit that we all have shortcomings yet you still persist with unrealistic expectations. “I believe they play a great role in maintaining the structure of civilization.” No pressure, right? You're imposing on women, by virtue of the genitalia they're born with, with so much more responsibility than is fair. Your expectations that men will “break with those traditions and mores far more quickly than women” sounds kind of like the response to boys behaving badly, “Oh well, boys will be boys”. It is making excuses for their behaviour. It actually may be a self-fulfilling prophecy. It isn't helpful.
“Men today have a very sexualized view of women” - is it any different from before? “Men often shirk their duties as a husband and father” - once again, any different from before? What is different now, I believe, and what makes it a little better, is that women can have much higher expectations of the men in their lives and they can break with them if they don't meet it, instead of accepting it or making excuses for it. What it is hoped will happen is that the men love the women in their lives enough to be better. Obviously, this also goes both ways.
And no problem, I don't have any issue with the length of posts as long as it's readable. And well, it's not like my posts are short either, so thanks for actually taking the time to read it. But yes I think we are going a little off topic to why people object to women doing crude humour. As I said before, I do feel as if you would be over-reacting to this film when you bring in morality.
Men and women are only human. Enough said.
shareAaaaand we've gone from a "semi-vulgar silly comedy" to "what is sexism/schauvinism/feminism" in topic yet again.
lol.
What all this has to do with the movie; I have no idea.
But apparently anything can be made into a sexist arguement these days.
Let's all just agree to love the movie because it has some women in it or something, without actually stating opinions about the actual content and I guess then no woman is being oppressed and men no longer dominate the... uh.... something here in IMDB forums.
No but seriously, this is getting silly.
The title of the thread is: I'm so OVER what's ok for men NOT being ok for women! Surprise, surprise. A discussion on gender issues. Surprised you even clicked on this thread.
shareWomen are not worth more than men. Women are not any better than men. It's absolutely ridiculous to believe that women should be held to any sort of different standards due to a difference in chromosomes and typically body. The fact that you've met "very few real ladies," is because you don't know what a woman is. You're a sad relic of the past where women were too delicate to vote. You and anyone else that agrees with you would do well to have some counseling. And, for the record, no, men are inherently nothing lower.
shareI'm women and think your moral backbone society comment is nice thing to say.
shareI think IMDB reviewers look at The Hangover with rose tinted glasses, and probably accuse Bridesmaids as being a female copy.
Kristen Wiig worked the lead role quite well in Bridesmaids, I'm just not a fan of Maya Rudolph. I liked Kristen's scenes with Chris O'Dowd, it kinda pulled the movie away from the toilet/drunk humour in the bridesmaids scenes.
I agree with you completely as a man who loves monty python, an all male comedy troupe with 1 female. I do however feel that a significant part of the hate towards BM is the fact that its seen as a copy of the hangover, regardless of the cast. I've heard just as much hate about the hangover pt 2 being a copy of pt 1. I personally feel that kristen wiig made the biggest impression on me in terms of comedy. she was hilarious regardless of her genitalia.
share...why can't I even remember over-exaggerated poop, vomit and fart humor from "The Hangover" if it's the same thing as Bridesmaids?
The other movies I've REALLY disliked because of the stupid and vulgar excrement humor are the "Movie Movie" series - which, might I add, are pretty much filled with male characters and written by men.
Absolutely hated those movies.. And I don't consider myself above laughing at a fart or take offense in something like that, but that's just not good comedy.
Not when men do it, not when women do it.
And I find it simply retarded that this movie is creating such "gender wars" because of it's all female main-cast.
Does that mean I'm not allowed to have a say, because I'm a man and it's a comedy including more women than.. uh.. some other movies...
I mean sure, "The hangover" is well over-exaggerated aswell, but I don't really remember any excrement humor... should I watch it again? Was the farthumor in there? :/
I disliked both Bridesmaids and Hangover, just not my kind of comedy. However, I do find it ironic how some people praise Hangover while saying Bridesmaids is *beep* when they are basically the same thing - difference is, one is made of female cast and has dynamic between women, and the other is mostly a male cast and the dynamic is between men.
The double standards is there since the beginning, why do you think movies with mainly female cast are called "chick flicks"? While movies with male cast are just...movies? Why do you think women laugh at comedies written by men while a lot of men feel the need to make fun of comedies written by women (as smart as they can be)? It's a male dominated industry. There's a reason why female comedians have a hard time getting a job, while rape apologists are PRAISED by their fanboys. Of course not all are like that, Arrested Development was mainly written by a man (the second biggest writer was a woman), and it's possibly the best comedy ever written. My problem here is not with men writing comedy, but with people thinking it's okay and hilarious for men to do X and it's gross and unfunny when women do the same.
However, I think that's slowly changing...with movies like Bridesmaids and Pitch Perfect, shows like 30 Rock and Parks & Recreation...women are slowly opening their way into the comedy business and allowed to be "funny" in the same way men are. :)
I found Hangover funny. I did not find Bridesmaids funny. That does not make me a sexist. Get over it. They are not basically the same movie. Finding one funny and not the other is not sexist at all.
I don't think there is anything wrong with the type of humor displayed by Bridesmaids being done by women, I just don't find it funny in this case.
The sh!t in the street scene would have been gross with men too.
To the OP: THANK YOU. Totally agree.
shareInteresting that you assume the only reason that people who like the hangover don't like this is down to sexism, and not that in Bridesmaids the jokes are laboured, the timing is poor and the story is entirely predictable.
Believe it or not, Coakie, in this case people are unhappy because women are generally held to a higher standard. Why do we need to be as crude and gross as some men to be "equal"? My BF and I went to see this film, and even though we liked it overall, we were both sitting there stunned during the food poisoning scene. My bf's pretty darn liberal, and she felt the same way; afterwards she said, "I know it was supposed to be "Hangover" for women, but we thought they'd be acting like...women." In other words, if "poop humor" is what women are left straining themselves fighting for equality in..grow up.
shareI don't see why this is so crude. Going to a restaurant and eating bad food just before trying on insanely expensive wedding dresses isn't an impossibility. It could happen. I guess the whole point is to find the funny in situations that would leave you - I may be exaggerating - scarred in future. It eases the embarrassment.
This was a good movie, even with the poop aside.
I don't think the problem with this movie was the raunchy humor , it was that the relationship between the bridesmaids and bride wasn't like the relationship between the guys of the hangover.
In hangover at the beginning the guys didn't like Alan but later all had fun and worked very well together to find Doug.
So if they want to make a good female version of hangover they should stop with the backstabbing and jealousy plot.
They have to make all great friends and all in the same page having fun, ofCourse they can have a few fights but all have to be great friends.
The relationship between them has like the girls of sex and the city.
I thought in the end they did make up? Was it too late to be worth it?
____________________
Would a Cupcake kill you?
I guess your girlfriend never watched Sex and the City, or if she did, was grossed out. Like the person below you replied - things like that happen to women, as we are human, like our male counterparts. I think you two are reading too much into it. Even though we are women, and many of us aim to be perfect, and "ladylike" and all that, crap happens, and there's no two ways around that, but to try and laugh it off and move on. Trust, if your girlfriend accidentally "passes gas" in public, someone is going to laugh - no matter how hard she tries to pretend like it didn't happen. I think the pretending part will probably garner more laughs.
True story: I entered a restaurant restroom, and was about to zip up my pants, and finish gathering my things, when this girl came in, did a number two, and quickly left me with a room-filling stench I will never forget. She tried to rush out of the bathroom - but I saw who she was, before she let out this enormous laugh. I was completely disgusted, and she thought it was freakin' hilarious. And if that had been a movie - I'm sure others would have been cracking up. That's just the way it is (which I eventually realized after staring her down in disgust for like 20 minutes).