MovieChat Forums > Stake Land (2011) Discussion > The roadside trap - SPOILERS

The roadside trap - SPOILERS

posted 13 years ago by HanktheHobo
9 replies | jump to latest

Was anyone else bothered by the roadside trap that the brotherhood set for the protagonists? I'm talking about where they apparently set up a revival tent, left a recording of a baby crying in an empty carriage and then had a bunch of members play dead as if they had all drank poisoned kool-aid. Then when the protagonists come in they all jump up with guns and take them prisoner.

What a ridiculously complex and stupid way to set-up a trap. Did they just lay there all day, hoping someone would come by? You get the impression there aren't too many folks out on the roads - so what if no one ever came by? Would they just lay there all day hoping to get someone? And what if whoever came in noticed they were breathing, or checked someone's pulse before they walked all the way in? What if they opened the flap, saw a bunch of dead people, and then decided to just take off?

Its just a really contrived and silly way to catch someone. As we learn later in the movie, the brotherhood has helicopters, so they must have decent resources. You would think they could throw spike strips out on the road and blow out tires of passing cars, or just leave a burned out car in the middle of the road thereby forcing any oncoming cars to slow down and either go off road around it or get out and push it out of the way. Or they could just build a barricade out of debris, forcing any oncoming cars to stop, then have some guys come out of the woods behind them.

Heck, they could just set-up shop in the woods along the road and take pot-shots at cars as they pass by.

This is an incredibly contrived and silly way to try and capture someone, and it is completely unrealistic. This was the first really stupid plot point in the movie - the second was the dropping vampires from helicopters fiasco, and the third was having the leader of the brotherhood randomly become a rational, thinking vampire when all other vampires up to that point were brainless animals.

This movie is an example of taking an awesome idea and then completely ruining it with terrible writing.

[–] BrunoAntony 13 years ago

Well, the brotherhood was aware of Mister and his rep. I assume that the trap was perceived to be the best way to a) capture him alive and b) get the drop on him without a lot of collateral damage.

If it was anyone else, they'd probably just stick a gun in their face or use the methods you suggested.

That's just my take. It was a goofy trap, but it didn't ruin the movie for me or anything.

Also, I thought the "dropping vampires" idea was pretty good and an original idea. But I wholeheartedly agree that making the brotherhood leader a super-vampire terribly contrived ... that was awful.

[–] brushfyr 13 years ago

I don't know, I wasn't bothered by it. It seemed the Brotherhood were everywhere, I assumed they had spies in alot of places, had an idea where he was going. That may not have been the only trap they had set up, either, I just assumed they had traps set up on the various routes up North, and since they were driving they and there are only so many roads they only had to set up in a few places.

[–] prinjon 12 years ago

It was stupid indeed.

Nothing a normal being would doin such case : enter a tent and no checks.

That is why while the idea and shooting was original, the rest was low quality.
Not a too bad movie but average.6/10

[–] alexthewriter 12 years ago

"Did they just lay there all day, hoping someone would come by?"

What makes you think they laid there all day? They probably had spotters down the road or heard them coming and had everyone take their places. I'm sure it takes less than a minute to push "play" on a tape recorder and then collapse into a chair.

"You would think they could throw spike strips out on the road"

"leave a burned out car in the middle of the road"

"take pot-shots at cars as they pass by"

Spike strips can be seen and easily avoided. If not, with four flat tires you can still drive for several miles. Same with a sniper blowing out your tires or even your radiator; you can still drive for several miles, or at least get yourself to cover and get your own weapons. When you try to attack someone this way, you alert them to your presence and give them time to react.

Luring your enemy into a trap and then ambushing them is actually a much smarter tactical move than a frontal assault. It's not perfect but it was actually a good element of the movie, as opposed to just another Hollywood loud and overblown shootout. The Loven character obviously thought it out more thoroughly than you did.

[–] HanktheHobo 12 years ago

"What makes you think they laid there all day? They probably had spotters down the road or heard them coming and had everyone take their places. I'm sure it takes less than a minute to push "play" on a tape recorder and then collapse into a chair."

Point well taken - I hadn't thought of that.

"Spike strips can be seen and easily avoided. If not, with four flat tires you can still drive for several miles. Same with a sniper blowing out your tires or even your radiator; you can still drive for several miles, or at least get yourself to cover and get your own weapons. When you try to attack someone this way, you alert them to your presence and give them time to react."

Spike strips are only easily avoided if they are sitting on the road already - the ideal use, and the way that the police use them, is to stand by the road and then throw them down at the last minute. In this case, they could have a spotter - as you pointed out - who radios them. They sit in the ditch, wait until the right moment, then jump out and throw the spikes. Not ideal, but still way more practical than arranging an entire mock religious revival / suicide complete with tent.

As far as sniping from the woods - there were quite a few people in the tent. If you have 10 - 20 people open up on a civilian vehicle with a combination of hunting / assault rifles, you will almost certainly disable the vehicle. And so what if the vehicle is able to chug along for a mile or two - if the brotherhood can maintain a fleet of helicopters and can arrange a fake revival, surely they have a truck that the assailants can hop into to tail the critically damaged car until it sputters to a stop.

In either case, the cons of spike strips or outright attack still do not justify this ridiculous trap. Besides, you missed the easiest trap, which I mentioned in my post - just block the road. Knock over a tree or leave a derelict car in the middle of the road. The victim will most likely either A) get out to scavenge from the car / see if they can move the blockage or B) stop the car and then turn around. In either case, you have an excellent opportunity for the 10-20 people who were playing dead in the tent to come rushing to the car from both sides of the road.

This is a tried and true tactic which has been used in almost all urban combat scenarios in the world in modern time and which is also a frequent favorite trap for bandits, both in real life and in fiction. This is because it is simple and requires few resources. Just block the road and then wait in the woods until you get a victim.

"Luring your enemy into a trap and then ambushing them is actually a much smarter tactical move than a frontal assault."

Yes, which is what I said about blocking the road and then swooping in for attack. But the revival trap itself is ridiculous. It requires a lot of setup (either raise or find a revival tent at a strategically convenient location, make a recording of a baby and maintain a supply of batteries for the portable audio device, post a lookout several miles ahead with a radio and provisions), it is resource intense (10-20 men just sitting around using up resources and not producing anything), and it has a high risk of failing (in a post-apocalyptic world infested with ravenous vampires, how many travelers are going to decide to get out of their car in vampire territory, in the middle of the woods and alone, and go into an ominous looking revival tent?).

Furthermore, it is risky for the goons who are springing the trap - it requires them to do one of the worst possible things you can do - lose line of sight of your enemy. For the trap to work, they have to go inside a tent, playing dead, blind to the world. They have no idea what the person outside is doing - what if he doesn't immediately come in? What if he sits in the car for 20 minutes, smoking a cigarette or taking a nap or just scoping the place out? They just sit there for that whole time? What if the traveler is cautious (as anyone who has survived this long in the bleak apocalyptic world of the film would surely be) and decides to take a few pot shots into the backs of the supposedly dead bodies from the entrance just to be sure? There are just too many possible points in which the entire plan could collapse and fail miserably, and it leaves the assailants very vulnerable.

"It's not perfect but it was actually a good element of the movie, as opposed to just another Hollywood loud and overblown shootout."

No, actually it was just another typical Hollywood-style convoluted scheme that would never work in real life. Leaving a junker in the road and then jumping out with guns isn't sexy, but it is simple and proven to work.

"The Loven character obviously thought it out more thoroughly than you did."

The fact that the writer for the movie has the characters act in idiotic and unrealistic ways is no reflection of the amount of thought I have put into this. Had the writer given this moronic plot device even an iota of critical thought, it would have immediately been obvious how overblown and silly it is.

[–] alexthewriter 12 years ago

"the ideal use, and the way that the police use them, is to stand by the road and then throw them down at the last minute. In this case, they could have a spotter - as you pointed out - who radios them. They sit in the ditch, wait until the right moment, then jump out and throw the spikes."

Except that Mister was cautious and you'll note drove very slowly around anything even remotely populated. Remember how they slowed down at the end when they came upon the diner? Driving 100mph down a highway to avoid cops behind you like on TV chases makes a spike ambush ideal, but not for a slow driver with guns at the ready, who also has a passenger that could easily take out someone suddenly jumping into the road with spikes.

"Knock over a tree"

With what?

"leave a derelict car in the middle of the road"

I assume you mean burning or else you could just drive around it. I imagine gas and other fuel would need to be rationed carefully. A large fire also means smoke, which to me would mean a signal that there's something to be avoided, or at least to be cautious.

The scenario of blocking the road with a burning vehicle and then moving another behind the car as it approaches means keeping a large vehicle running, which means an engine to be heard. That sound alone might make Mister stop the car to investigate or take another road. If I was driving through dangerous territory and saw a car blocking the road, not just to the side and stalled, and heard another engine I'd think something was up. I'd think something was up even if there was a car stalled in the middle of the road and nothing else. It's also been done a bazillion times; they did it in District 9 the year before this release and I don't know how many other times. Maybe they did want to avoid doing the same thing over and over again.

"What if the traveler is cautious (as anyone who has survived this long in the bleak apocalyptic world of the film would surely be) and decides to take a few pot shots into the backs of the supposedly dead bodies from the entrance just to be sure"

And? You think Loven gave a flying crap about anyone around him? You think a bunch of crazed religious nuts care about sacrificing their life for their preacher? Taking potshots also makes no sense, since Mister didn't know they were with the brotherhood and not just innocent people that were poisoned like the cups on the ground seemed to indicate; testing someone's pulse is better, but even then, they could spring into action the minute he touches one and realizes they're not dead.

"What if he sits in the car for 20 minutes, smoking a cigarette or taking a nap or just scoping the place out? They just sit there for that whole time?"

You can't sit still for 20 minutes? Most Americans I know can sit on their fat asses for hours. And again we're back to a spotter, watching him to keep track of what he's doing, letting everyone know where he's at. If it were me, I'd put someone in a few trees to take potshots if he did try to leave before the trap was sprung.

"If you have 10 - 20 people open up on a civilian vehicle with a combination of hunting / assault rifles, you will almost certainly disable the vehicle."

You're forgetting the entire point of the trap ... Loven wanted him alive. 10-20 men firing and Mister probably would have been hit and killed. Following their disabled car with a chopper or truck might get Mister killed. Loven wanted to taunt him, and probably wanted him to fall for a trap. It wasn't just about killing Mister, it was about letting him know why he needed to be "punished." When you want to catch live prey, a full frontal assault is not your best option. Besides, if this one didn't work and Mister just kept driving, he could certainly regroup and figure out his next trap. It's not like this would be their only chance to catch him. Sorry, but it wasn't a moronic plot device, it was a reflection of the mentality of the character.

[–] HanktheHobo 12 years ago

"Except that Mister was cautious and you'll note drove very slowly around anything even remotely populated. Remember how they slowed down at the end when they came upon the diner? Driving 100mph down a highway to avoid cops behind you like on TV chases makes a spike ambush ideal, but not for a slow driver with guns at the ready, who also has a passenger that could easily take out someone suddenly jumping into the road with spikes."

Even with these disadvantages, it still makes more sense than the ludicrous and convoluted fake revival lunacy. Which is my point - neither spike strips or full-on assault are ideal - blocking the road is ideal - but either is better than the fake revival trap.

"With what?"

Chainsaws, axes or even good old fashioned saws work quite nicely. Again, the Brotherhood has a fleet of helicopters, it isn't out of the question that they could procure an ax.

"I assume you mean burning..."

You know what they say about assuming... you shouldn't do it. No, I did not mean a burning car. Just a good old fashioned car left parked across the road, preferably with the doors open to make it look abandoned and scavenged.

"... or else you could just drive around it."

Only if you do it like an idiot. But anyone with half a brain will pick a choke point - perhaps a small bridge over a creek or part of the road with no shoulders and steep ditches (very common in rural areas), thus precluding the ability to drive around. If you have a full brain, you'll find a choke point that is around a curve or just past the peak of a hill, meaning you won't see it until the last minute.

"...and then moving another behind the car as it approaches means keeping a large vehicle running, which means an engine to be heard."

I didn't say anything about another car. But if you wanted to do that, you certainly wouldn't need to keep the engine running. The few seconds required to start a car would not be long enough to let the victim turn the car around in a highly confined space.

However, a much easier method would be to have another junker "abandoned" on the side of the road a bit ahead of the trap. Once the victim reaches the road block, have a few goons strategically hiding in the woods or in the ditch push the second junker over the road, thus blocking any hasty retreat. At the same time, other goons approach the victim from both sides with guns. There is no where to go. Victim surrenders begrudgingly once he realizes any resistance will get his young companion killed.

"It's also been done a bazillion times..." "Maybe they did want to avoid doing the same thing over and over again."

Its been done a bazillion times because it actually makes sense. People walk through doors all the time. Does that mean if I want to avoid being cliched I should have all my characters magically teleport through walls instead? Attempting to be original doesn't make ridiculous and illogical actions suddenly become logical.

"You think a bunch of crazed religious nuts care about sacrificing their life for their preacher?"

Yes, yes I do. Being a religious nut does not automatically equal willingness to die in a stupid and pointless way. Even for the closest comparison - a modern suicide bomber - the act requires only that you summon the courage to take a single action - pull a trigger or push a button. That is far different than laying prostrate with yourself fully open to attack for a prolonged period of time.

"...Taking potshots also makes no sense, since Mister didn't know they were with the brotherhood ..."

So? A cautious person might reason that they are dead either way - why not take a few shots to see if this highly suspicious situation is real or a trap?

Let me get this straight - taking pot shots at dead bodies doesn't make sense, but stopping to check out an apparent revival in the middle of the woods during the vampire apocalypse makes total sense. Right, got it.

"You can't sit still for 20 minutes?"

Of course I can. I can also grab my house key, climb out the back window, walk around the house, unlock the front door from the outside, go back to the window, crawl in and then open the door to get the mail. Or I could just unlock the door from the inside and avoid all the other nonsense. The point is not whether something can be done, its whether it makes any sense to do a very complicated thing that is highly risky and has a very low likelihood of success when there are numerous other easier, less risky and more realistic options at hand.

"You're forgetting the entire point of the trap ... Loven wanted him alive. 10-20 men firing and Mister probably would have been hit and killed. Following their disabled car with a chopper or truck might get Mister killed."

The possibility of Mister being killed is ever-present. Even with the idiotic and overly-complicated plan of the fake revival / suicide, there is the high possibility, given Mister's stubborn personality, that he would resist and choose to die taking a few of the enemy with him rather than submit peacefully. So you have the same likely result with 100 times the complexity and about a 1,000th the chance of success as a more conventional trap.

"Sorry, but it wasn't a moronic plot device, it was a reflection of the mentality of the character."

No no, I assure you it was moronic. See the above post for supporting evidence.

[–] alexthewriter 12 years ago

No, it wasn't moronic. See my above post for supporting evidence. Look, I can play that insulting game too.

The best way to capture him alive was to get him out of the car and surrounded. Loven said he heard about him so probably heard he was traveling with an older woman (Sister), so getting her out and in a vulnerable spot so he wouldn't do anything brash to put her in danger makes sense. If they stayed in the car, they have cover, have time to get their weapons, could get away even in a disabled car, and Mister could be killed. And yeah, he might get out and investigate a seemingly abandoned revival. In a post-apocalyptic world, you would probably investigate anything that might have supplies you could scavenge. They got out to investigate the dead things outside Peggy's diner when they could have kept driving. No, it's not a stretch to assume he'd get out if he came across the tent, especially if they heard a crying baby inside.

Look, you can continue to argue your points all day but like I said before, it wasn't perfect but neither are your ideas. Putting a car on a bridge or one-lane road ... how do you know he'll take that small type of back road? You said yourself, why stage a fake revival and assume he'll find it. Well, why stage a fake car abandonment on a bridge or one-lane road and assume he'll find that? Lotta work, having to constantly move your car to a different road as Mister drives around and around. "Aw crap, he turned left at Main ... all right, Billy Bob, you get this car off the bridge and Jimmy Sue, you move the tanker. Let Big Mike know he's coming up I95. We're gonna try this thing again..."

Starting another vehicle's engine behind you when there's an abandoned vehicle in front of you ... that too alerts him that something is up, so he can respond by grabbing weapons or even backing up before you can get that second vehicle in place, since his is running and yours isn't. Being in a car, trapped and surrounded, how do you know he wouldn't kill Martin and Sister and then take his own life? Ever see "The Road" or even "The Fog"? That would rob Loven of his prize.

You can go ahead and argue about it all day but no one idea is perfect and without potential problems, so why you think one idea is "moronic" whereas another idea is logical and the best way to go escapes me. They all have different potential outcomes and none of them are 100% perfect. This is the one the character in the movie chose, it was actually something someone with his mentality would do, and it had its pros as well as its potential cons. If you can't accept that sometimes this is just what happened, don't watch movies.

[–] SimplyirreBraggissible 12 years ago

No... its actually a really brilliant trap.

They think/aren't sure that Mister and Martin know they are a religious organization and cults are notorious for mass-suicides. By having them think everybody in the room is dead; they lower their guard. And by having the baby crying, they appeal to their human nature to lure them towards the crib and turn their backs to check on the baby. Then they spring the trap and jump up, every one of them packing a weapon.

It was genius.

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