Most effective form of martial arts in real life situations - Yip Man 2 (2010) Discussion

[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

in real life against normal people, you kick them in the balls, punch them with your keys, or mace them in the eyes then run like hell, especially if they have a knife. brazilian jiu jutsu works very well in those situations too, but it takes years to learn. the application of it is relatively simple and versatile, plus it's not reliant on athleticism. generally, the idea is you just need to temporarily disable them and run away if you're in dangerous situation

a boxing right straight is pretty useful too if you find yourself in a bar fight and don't wanna bust anyone's genitals. people naturally swing very wide when they punch, so you'll always connect first and they'll probably go down right away cuz they're drunk

the problem with martial arts like krav maga is that they're too complicated. they teach you ridiculous 10 step processes to disarm someone pointing a gun at your head that involve turning really fast and grabbing the gun without looking while grabbing a certain part of their wrist with your other hand then twisting in a certain direction, while at the same time putting one foot behind theirs and some other stuff. I promise you, when someone is pointing a gun at your head, you're not gonna remember some incredibly specific 10 step combo and do it quick enough that the other guy doesn't catch on and just pulls the trigger on you, not to mention the incredibly high chance that you're gonna mess up because you're panicking. against normal people, it'll either be completely overkill or you're dead anyways. against someone that actually knows what they're doing, you'd definitely be dead

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] orihalperin 14 years ago

Training properly in any martial discipline includes repeating the same move over and over until it's automatic. Krav Maga is used in the israeli army, especially in the commando units. So nothing about it is ridiculous.

Therefore, it would be inaccurate to say that "you're not gonna remember some incredibly specific 10 step combo and do it quick enough that the other guy doesn't catch on and just pulls the trigger on you, not to mention the incredibly high chance that you're gonna mess up because you're panicking".

And saying something is too complicated usually means that you can't be bothered to look it up properly or spend any time studying it.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

they have a different 10 step combo for just about EVERY POSITION. yes, it'll work if you know all of them and pick the right one. but honestly, what do you think the chances of that are when you're under tremendous pressure and panicking. remember, regular people aren't commando units, nor are they gonna dedicate 16 hours of their day training in it

besides, how many wars do you see where israel is winning by krav magaing everyone to death?

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] maxloh-1 13 years ago

I have never herad of krav maga being complicated. It prides itself with simple to learn techniques.

http://www.maxloh.com/
http://www.weirddreamsblog.com/

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[–] DurakSuka 11 years ago

Of course you would support Krav Maga.

Hama cheez ba-Beer behtar meshawad!

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[–] Shinobi_Cloud 14 years ago

Huh? Krav Maga is like Wing Chun in the fact it aims to be simplistic and conservative with its movement and energy of the practitioner.

Maybe it's just me BoswerLK, but you seem to be a MMA fanboy based on some of your earlier posts. Nevertheless, Brazilian Jiu Jutsu is indeed effective for one on one situations, but if you take a scuffle to a ground; it is a bit dangerous. After all, you're left defenseless to other people who can to stomp or kick you. You also have to watch yourself for any broken shard of glass or debris on the ground.

In general, any genuine martial arts you learn can be applied for self defense since that's why they existed in the first place. This is as long as you don't learn the downgraded, competitive sport version of the martial arts - IE: Performance wu shu, Taekwondo for competition, etc. Don't listen to the naysayers who say that "the only effective martial arts are the ones that are used in the UFC or other MMA competitive sports." The keyword in that statement is "sports."

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

I know. that's what I'm saying, krav maga sounds incredibly good in theory. except by the time you train in it long enough to learn all the forms/techniques (if ever), you'd be old and don't have the speed/strength/reflexes to use it anymore. that's what I mean by too complicated

BJJ has some upper body throws too if there's broken glass on the ground, but yeah, it's useless outside of one on one. some kind of rudimentary form of kickboxing would be your best chance, which isn't very good. just fork over your wallet if you're outnumbered, would be my advice

I wouldn't say any martial arts. aikido, capoeira, and tai chi don't do squat for you, besides getting you in shape. but yes, most fighting styles are gonna work on normal people that don't know what they're doing, except there's always a decent chance that someone who IS picking a fight with you actually does know a thing or two about real world fighting, in which case, I'd like a fighting style that works against actual opponents also, and not just random fodder

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] kjpsychology 14 years ago

BowswerLK,

You couldn't be more wrong about Krav Maga.

I have been practicing Krav Maga and all defense tactics are drawn from instinctual reflexes everyone would have - for example, if someone points a gun at you, you instinctively raise your hands up. Using this reflex, you incorporate the next moves, which are repeated over and over until it becomes part of your muscle memory. In my first class we learned how to disarm a gun, using the EXACT same move no matter how the gun was pointed at you, (left hand, right hand, side grip, from the back, front, with tiny adjustments. It is EXTREMELY easy to learn, and not a "10 step process" as you would say.

You learn the most basic concepts of human kinetics and leverage and therefore will be able to remember it easily. We constantly practice over and over with "surprise tests" to ensure we have made the moves 2nd nature.

And a lot of the moves can be used in different situations, core moves such as joint locks that can be applied when a person is armed. We practice it so much in one class we don't have to think about what move to make. That is the point of Krav Maga: fast, easy to learn, basic concepts, based on natural reflexes.

Your argument about the Israeli army winning any war with Krav Maga is irrelevant and ignorant. War tactics and a self-defense system are 2 different things. Israeli soldiers constantly face violence everyday on a micro level on the streets with multiple attackers with knives, guns, hostage taking, Krav Maga has become a break-down science of how to handle individualized violence efficiently, fast, and then get the hell out of there.

The first choice if being held up by a robber, is to give your damn money. Not worth getting killed over a few bucks. If you give the money, and you're still in danger, then you act. No martial artist would be stupid enough to be a hero until it is absolutely necessary.

Krav Maga is not just a theory. It is tried and tested every single day. Israeli soldiers depend on it to survive. I don't know how much more convincing anyone needs from that statement.

Another important factor in Krav Maga: It is constantly evolving. There is no one set system. The KM branches have conferences in which they meet and try to improve the system everyday if they see flaws, and make adjustments to improve the effectiveness.

And also, Krav Maga borrows from all sorts of martial arts as well, extending from grappling arts, and even Wing Chun

Bursting in Krav Maga = Tan Da in Wing Chun

Clearly you've never taken Krav Maga before. I recommend it to anyone who wants to just try a quick-to-learn self-defense system, that doesn't require a heavy commitment, common in most martial arts.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

clearly, the branch I looked into was not up to date. they had a completely different process for whether the gunner was to your side, behind you, or in front of you, which could end either with throwing the attacker to the floor, breaking his grip and taking his pistol, or just beating on his head while twisting his gun arm

besides, my main point was that it only works on people that don't know what they're doing (civilians), which applies to almost every martial arts. against an attacker who also knows some martial arts themselves, krav maga will be even against them at best. why not learn a higher tiered MA that works on everyday fodder AND actual opponents?

oh, and let's not forget that the israeli army, in addition to being actually trained, is much better armed and equipped than civilians. american army has to deal with other armies, domestic violence, pirates, and a whole bunch of other crap they feel the need to stick their nose in. does that mean we should all learn how to fight from ken shamrock?

I'd rather learn how to fight from a panda than ken

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] orihalperin 14 years ago

1. Any MA would be harder to execute against a skilled opponent. Rarely do you manage to incapacitate someone with one move in such a case.
2. When a guy is pointing a gun at a (uniformed) soldier's head, he doesn't want his money, believe me.
3. Krav Maga is not mediocre. Since you are dealing mainly with guns and knives in the army, it is a lot more effective to learn an art that was developed for those situations than one that was adapted to them. When it comes to quick and brutal, not a lot can stand against KM.

Good videos are: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGAE99qawps
and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnZ0sfOiuIM

Notice that among the main target areas are: The throat, the groin.
The first movie has a bit of a biased commentary (best in world etc.) but the main interest is the actual moves. In the second there are some showcasey impractical moves but you can see most of the moves are simple and effective.

And keep in mind they slowed themselves down as not to hurt the opponents (too much, anyway...) and for us to see what is happening.

Again, i'm not saying this is the best MA, but it's definitely not second-rate.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

....I'm watching them now, and it looks even worse than when I saw a live demonstration. who the hell runs straight at people with their fist forward like that?! what, is that supposed to be a superman impression?

this is the first time I've seen krav maga knife defenses, and I can tell you right away that trying this WILL get you killed. it seems to be almost completely reliant on grabbing the guy's wrist while the knife is in motion. so, unless you're a pro baseball catcher...right, good luck with that

I love how it also likes to assume the attackers will just stand there every time you stop one of their attacks and not bother defending themself, or following up with another attack. yeah, hold the guy's knife wrist and punch him with your other hand. that's brilliant...if the guy is a complete moron and doesn't realize he ALSO has another arm

believe it or not, in the real world, people don't suddenly turn into crash test dummies the second you touch them, like these video demonstrations show. it's like me showing you this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwFwSIMmq4g) and saying aikido is brutally effective. I mean just look at that simplicity, all you have to do is touch the guy and he rolls 15 feet away! how are you gonna beat that?

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] kjpsychology 14 years ago

Yes, we're assuming that Krav Maga will work against people who are a direct threat to you who probably don't know martial arts (robbers, thieves). But having the knowledge and having the techniques down as 2nd nature can help build a foundation.

Krav Maga is designed specifically for a common person to learn the basics of common threats (robbers), because they are probably not looking to fight "actual opponents."

Even if I go along with your theory; Say we are concerned with running into "actual opponents." Most of my classmates in Krav Maga are also advid practioners of other traditional martial arts, and recognize the importance if 2nd nature reflexes, which is not easy to absorb in their traditional martial arts. Krav Maga is an upgrade to no-nonsense defense tactics, which can be incorporated into their already built-in skillset from their traditional MA background.

My KM teacher is a 7th degree black belt in Isshinryu Karate, 3rd degree KM instructor, and has been doing Eskrima for 10 years.

He tells us it's important to learn the discipline and earn the results from traditional martial arts but also recognize the importance of gaining knowledge from other martial arts in terms of knowledge, practicality, and efficiency. There is no "one" system that is the best, but the person who needs to keep an open mind to everything.

My argument is that any martial art, self-defense system deserves to be looked to, in order to gain a greater perspective. Krav Maga to me has built a good foundation. I also practice Eskrima, Wing Chun and jiu-jitsu, and all my masters have said the same thing. Don't listen to what people say how good a martial art is. I can never shoot down any martial art because chances are, I don't understand it. No point in criticizing. What's important is to ask questions

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

the thing is this, krav maga's 2nd nature reflexes will get you killed if you do them on a real opponent

but yes, like all other practitioners, I do agree that one should look into as many martial arts as they can to increase perspective. I don't agree about not judging them, however, as I think that's kinda the whole point. you learn their philosophy and techniques, and compare it to other styles, and sort out the most effective techniques and incorporate those into your 2nd nature

I do not want to incorporate a fighting style that relies on other people running straight at you with their fist out and suddenly turning into a crash test dummy the second you touch them into my second nature. unless the thief/robber is literally mentally retarded, I'm quite willing to bet that they're ready for a fight if THEY CHOOSE to engage

I grew up in a terrible neighborhood, and have been a part of at least 25 attempted muggings. almost all of them I could just walk away from by making it clear that if they wanted my money, they'd have to actually fight me for it. the 2 times they actually attacked me, they were actual opponents who knew how to fight and not just stand there like an idiot the second I touch them and let me 10 hit combo them and flip them around all over the place and do flying armbars

so basically, if you take krav maga, the only people you can beat up are the people that didn't want to fight you in the first place, and you'd just be using it to bully around some bullies. in any situation where YOU are forced to fight, you're at even odds against the attacker AT BEST. that's why I believe krav maga is a terrible MA

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] orihalperin 14 years ago

The difference between you and me is that you only look to point out the fact that demonstrative videos are demonstrative videos, and therefore represents situations real life where people stand like dummies and take hits and the action is in slow motion... wait... that doesn't make sense!

That's because the videos are meant to show you the technique. At the "Full contact KM..." vid, 0:38, the opponent doesn't use his left hand. Why, you ask. Well he probably would, if the other person hadn't been hitting him in the jaw. Try hitting your chin with the palm of your hand. And then hard. Your head snaps back, you may bite your tongue if your mouth is open, and a hit to the jaw in itself stuns. And notice that he uses his first instinct: raising his hands to protect himself. He then uses that to start his attack.

Following that sequence he kicks him in the groin, another move that stuns, disorients and can even cause a blackout. Kick to the head, and disarm.

Any demonstrative vid will show you a sequence of attacks that you will be lucky to manage straight away in a fight. So you can say that about any demo of any MA.
The point is to understand the ideas and techniques used.

And the steven seagal fight was a joke. So are his movies.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

And the steven seagal fight was a joke. So are his movies.

right. and it's not any more or less of a joke than the KM videos

grabbing the dude's wrist mid punch and hitting him with a 10 hit combo while he stands there is not technique. neither is having some guy push you with a punching bag from behind then stand there and wait for you to hit him back with a 25 hit combo from your gun. or get beat up, stand up and point a gun to your head and stand there while you beat the crap out of him. or run straight at you with a handgun pointed at you so you can flip him all over the place

instinct? please. yeah ok, you can have perfect reflexes and instincts to block everything and they won't, sure. you instinctively grab people and throw them all over the place and the other guys don't. you instinctively flying armbar guys and they can't instinctively just not stand there like an idiot and just drop you on your head, sure

if you have that kind of speed and accuracy to pull even a fraction of what those videos do, you should just dash in and punch them in the face/balls, and dodge some bullets while you're at it. they'll never even know what hit them. you'd be like a real life matrix character

and trust me, unless you're flash KO'ed, you do not suddenly forget to defend yourself with your other hand when you're only stunned by a hit to the jaw. worst case scenario is you turtle up until you recover

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] orihalperin 14 years ago

Look, you completely ignored my point. So I'm going to stop posting now because it seems you haven't come here to discuss but to repeat your opinion over and over regardless of reactions.

http://cache2.asset-cache.net/xc/200348188-003.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&; amp;k=2&d=31D8FB54DE31AA509B1F0F4509D08A59454C2FB7C74824DA9AB6DC11 136B18F900123AA3B5A18ED0 - this is what comes to mind.

You haven't even bothered to look at what I wrote beyond the general idea of "he's disagreeing with me". So it's been nice, but I have better things to do than bang my head against a wall.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

no...you're completely missing my point. you showed the video to make a case for krav maga's effectiveness, I said the video was stupid because it's some guy beating up on idiots. you AGREED and said krav maga works awesome in real life situations anyways, and all you have to do is to do the same thing the guy does in that video. so basically, what you've just said is that what works on demo dummies is going to work on real people, regardless of the fact that the demo dummies act like retards (which you just acknowledged)

it's like me saying that aikido video is just a demo, therefore it doesn't matter that it looks stupid. therefore, it kicks ass in real life, just do the same thing steven seagal's doing. you're banging your head because your own logic doesn't make sense and you can't wrap it around your head that maybe you're wrong or just used bad videos for your case

or even better, it's like me saying carrots explode when cut, then showing you 8 videos where the carrot doesn't explode when cut, then saying it doesn't matter because they were demonstrations, and the important part is cutting them. therefore in real life, they explode if you cut them. brilliant logic there, smart guy

honestly, I had much more respect for krav maga before seeing those video demos of supposedly the "best krav maga trainer in the world". the random nyc branch I looked into at least demo'ed techniques that look like they're designed to take down real people, but were just overly complex to the point of impracticality. your videos showed techniques that were just overly retarded, and only worked because the attacker was even more retarded

and that new link doesn't work, btw

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] kjpsychology 14 years ago

You're wrong again.

Any KM instructor worth his salt will tell you that there will be resistance, and we recognize that these techniques would work under "ideal" conditions. Like you said, if the guy is an idiot and won't fight back and "let you throw a 10 hit combo"

What you're also forgetting is that in KM, we are trying to survive. You must do everything in your power to disable the person first, before disarming him. If you don't at least stun the person, injure him with killing intentions, you will not be able to disarm him because he still has fighting capabilities.

People always relay to typical fighting techniques to "win" a fight: landing punches, kicks, but they always forget that they can do everything else: Stabbing in the eyes, kicking in the groin, pressure points, punching the throat, etc. anything to injure the person enough, can and must be applied.

Everyone assumes a fight will always be fair in any situation, but there is no fair game, in which you can't use "dirty" fighting to survive.

But we learn that even when you're trying to disarm, there's a chance that they will resist. We have looked at several ways a person will resist. This is done by giving one person a chance to be a "robber" and react ourselves how we would try to diffuse the KM technique.

In my school, our instructors tell us to go full out, and ask each person as if they are fighting for their lives, including the "attacker." In some cases, the "attacker" can overpower the KM person. But this is why we practice. If there's one place where we want to make mistakes and fail, it is when we are practicing. We re-visit the situation and break down what the KM person had done wrong. We re-apply again and again. We worked on one KM move for 2 weeks, because the instructor wanted to make sure we could do it.

In addition, we recognize the importance of knowing how difficult it can be to fight a person who has a weapon. Because my teacher was also an Eskrima practitioner, he showed us how a skilled person with a knife can do some major damage. This is why he explained that in the more advanced classes he can teach us how to handle more skilled opponents, as he can incoprorate Eskrima into his teachings.

You're right, in most martial art demonstrations, the reactions of the "attacker" are exaggerated. But this is also dependent on the organizations themselves. Who says that that specific KM school can represent all of the other KM schools? To make that generalization is unfair.

"almost all of them I could just walk away from by making it clear that if they wanted my money, they'd have to actually fight me for it. "

No offense, but that's just really stupid. You don't know who that person is. He could be concealing a gun in his pants for all you know, and once you say that, not only will that trigger an adrenaline rush, but you just gave a reason for the guy to kill you. If you lived in a neighborhood as rough as you say you did, you would know that killing means nothing to most people who are willing to rob. I don't care how skilled you are at any martial art, if you have an option, the best option is to not fight at all.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

I did made generalizations based on those videos. as they seem inaccurate now, I apologize

my neighborhood was rough because everyone there was so poor, including me. if they can afford a gun, they wouldn't rob someone that dressed like I did. they were people who thought I'd be easy pickings, and all I did was let them know I'm not. I never directly threatened them, I just remained calm and made it clear that I'm not just gonna fork over my money because of their threats

shootings were common, but usually not on someone like me. if someone was gonna spend a bullet, it'd be on a drug dealer or someone in a business suit

$20 doesn't sound worth defending for most people, but back then, it was a lot to me and my family. I was in the same boat as the people trying to mug me, only difference was I tried to get out of it by working instead of robbing

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] kjpsychology 14 years ago

Well there's nothing I can say about that, even though that money may seem a lot, it's still not worth risking your life over. But like I said before, it's a choice, and if you fell like you need to use physical force, Krav Maga can prepare you for it, then help you ESCAPE. Staying back and fighting is not what Krav Maga prepares you for. Injure, diffuse, and run.

I don't think I said it explicitly, but KM is essentially a MMA. They consider every aspect of every martial art so it can be used as a complete self-defense system. It is constantly evolving, if they see flaws, there are conferences in which they meet up to improve it.

There are chances some techniques won't work: so that's why there is such a huge emphasis on constantly "upgrading" the system.

It all comes down to who your teacher is. I am fortunate to have found a decent teacher who knows what he's talking about. You have to do the research if you want a legit KM teacher.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

yeah, upon retrospect, it wasn't smart. but you know the cliche, I was young and stupid, what can I say =/

I do like the KM philosophy, it's why I looked into it to begin with. I just haven't dug deep enough to find a teacher that can deliver on it yet, I guess

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] maxDOPE 14 years ago

Right.
This Bowser person does clearly not know what he's talking about. BJJ is basically a sport, useless with many oponents.
Krav Maga is simple and to the point. Some things are illogical, but then show me a system that makes perfect sense all the time.
Oh yes, Wing Chun. But Wing Chun has no groundwork.

Study Krav Maga for about 3-5 years, after many many years of Wing Chun.
These 2 combined will give you an excellent base to deal with street violence. It is for a reason that these 2 are studied by all major SWAT teams and police forces over the world. And body-guard training: the same.

Both systems are in the core very simple. Not 100s of movements and complicated stuff. You are learning reflexes, so you can act without thinking. This requires a lot of time, repeating the same base movements over and over again... until it's a reflex.
Then you're done.

You have no time to think in a real fight. And real fights are over pretty fast in general - it's not a movie.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

I didn't say to use BJJ to deal with street violence. I said "in real life against normal people, you kick them in the balls, punch them with your keys, or mace them in the eyes then run like hell". that should be your entire standup game. BJJ is just for groundwork. almost all of krav maga's groundwork is just second rate BJJ anyways, so I don't see what your point is

by the time you master both wing chun and krav maga (if ever. that's a big if), you'd be old and unable to use most of your techniques effectively anyways

from what I've seen from krav maga, at least 80% of it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. you seriously think if someone attacks you on the street, that you'd be so much stronger/tougher than them that you can grab their arm with one hand and punch them with your other arm, and win?

and if you are that physically superior, then only complete retards will be attacking you. you don't need technique to beat someone that incredibly stupid. SWAT teams aren't normal people. they're all in tip top shape, carry many weapons, and have a team backing them up

you may as well just take a *beep* of protein and lift some weights. it'll take less than a year and will have more or less the same effect as spending 40 years mastering KM and WC in terms of street defense

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] DurakSuka 11 years ago

Absolutely agreed. Martial arts are going to do squat when you have the physique to pulverize the *beep* attacking you.

Hama cheez ba-Beer behtar meshawad!

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[–] rhopmans 14 years ago

I THINK YOU GUYS ARE GETTING A LITTLE LOST FROM O.P.S TOPIC.
WHO CARES WHATS COMPLICATED AND EASY OR NOT TO LEARN.
SOMEONE ABOVE SAID IF YOU PRACTICE IT ENOUGH IT WILL BECOME NATURAL.
THATS TRUE.
IV'E BEEN DOING MARTIAL ARTS EXTENSIVLEY MY WHOLE LIFE, JUDO, KARATE, KUNG FU, LEARNED A LITTLE BIT OF DIFFERENT STYLES OF KUNG FU.
NOW I'M STUDYING WING CHUN AND IT SEEMS TO BE THE FASTEST TO LEARN AND APPLY. ITS EXTREMELY EFFECTIVE, AND THE WHOLE APPROACH IS TO BE SUPPER AGGRESSIVE.
I THINK TAI CHI (PUSH HANDS) IS BY FAR THE BEST MARTIAL ART ONE COULD LEARN BUT IT TAKES A LOONG TIME. BY THE TIME YOU MASTER IT THOUGH NOONE CAN LAY A HAND ON YOU. BUT PEOPLE ARE IMPATIENT AND DONT WANNA WAIT 20 YEARS.
HANDS DOWN THE MOST EFFECTIVE MARTIAL ART IN REAL LIFE IN MY OPINION IS NINJITSU. EVERYTHING ABOUT IT IS DECEPTIVE. SNEAKY WAYS TO TRICK YOUR OPPONENT. ESPECIALLY GOOD FOR TAKING LARGER OPPONENTS DOWN. BUT WHERE CAN WE FIND NINJITSU SCHOOLS? NOT MANY OUT THERE AND THE FEW THAT ARE, ARE HARDLY AUTHENTIC.
STEVEN HAYES HAS GOT GOOD BOOKS OUT THERE. CHECK IT OUT FOR THE CONCEPTS ON FIGHTING AND YOU'LL BE AMAZED.

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[–] ring911 14 years ago

Brazilian Fujitsu, it's a no contest.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

....fujitsu? =P

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] solomonmethod 14 years ago

I took Russian Military Martial Arts (aka systema) for a year. Imagine taking all of the most effective moves from just about every martial art, remove all of the artsy stuff and make it pure martial. It relies heavily on being loose and relaxed, much like drunken style kung-fu, with moves taken from aikido and wing chun. Grandma and grandpa could utilise this form easily, and the amount of damage you want to do is completely up to you. Anything goes and you walk away with real experiences to show for it.

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[–] ring911 14 years ago

Jujitsu, sorry. Simple typo, both f and j are positioned on the index finger spot on the keyboard.

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[–] rhopmans 14 years ago

I DIG YOUR OPINION.
BUT THAT FUJITSU MADE ME LAUGH. I'M GLAD YOU MESSED UP YOUR SPELLING.
I THINK BRAZILIAN MARTIAL ARTS RELY TOO MUCH ON 1 ON 1 THOUGH.
YOU CANT GET A GUY IN A JOINTLOCK WHEN HIS BUDDIES ARE ABOUT TO KICK A FIELD GOAL WITH YOUR HEAD AND SCROTE.
I TAKE WING CHUN AND ITS REALLY EFFECTIVE HOWEVER AS I BELIEVE THERE IS NO NUMBER ONE SYLE I HEARD CHOI LI FUT (SP?) IS GREAT FOR TAKING OUT MULTIPLE OPPONENTS AND HAS ROOTS IN WING CHUN. BRUCE LEE SPOKE HIGHLY OF IT, HE SAID IT WAS ONE OF THE ONLY STYLES TO LEAVE A MARK AMONG THE MUI TAI FIGHTERS IN TAILAND.
BUT I STILL AWNSER WITH NINJITSU. ALL ABOUT PRESSURE POINTS AND DECEPTION.
IMHO

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[–] waldomarek 12 years ago

did bruce lee have an opinion about caps lock as well?

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[–] gngovrlrd 14 years ago

I think a lot of what people talk about and refer to is a bunch of "ok, you come from this direction and kick this or grab my hand and do this." Its all untested. What works in professional level mixed martial arts where everything is tested on the best fighters in the world? Muay Thai boxing, western boxing/kickboxing, Sambo, and Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu. Go learn Muay Thai and BJJ and you will be able to fight anyone.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

well, if you learn muay thai, no one will want to mess with you period, since you'd be buff. muay thai, boxing, and wrestling are heavily reliant on athleticism

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] kjpsychology 14 years ago

You said it, professional level, which means there are rules. Can't attack here, can't stab here, can't punch there.

Unfortunately in the real world, those are the rules that hold you back from putting in maximum damage to your opponent. In a life/death situation, you better make sure that happens. Because you're sub-consciously living by the rules, you may be held back on the potential damage you can actually deliver.

That's why you have to understand on a survival martial art, rather than just traditional professional sport MA.

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[–] thornsthorns 14 years ago

best martial arts i've come across is bruce lee's jeet kune do (for understanding proper techniques and mindset), mixed martial arts (mma which is everythign really for a well rounded basic technique) and south east asian martial arts like kick boxing, and eskrima for the killer aspect, knives etc.

They seem the most practical, simple, and street & war effective.

The other guy is right in that most fighting schools are way to complicated routines that really don't work as bruce lee said. In real life trying to use such routines won't increase your chance of surivival, it will still be 80% pot luck whether he kills you before you can pull the move off. Most fights are 80-90% pot luck, if opponents are of similar levels either in competence or incompetence. Whoever gets the first real serious hit tends to win. Its only when one person is an expert and the other novice do these moves even come close to being remotely effective. Not worth the time and effort to learn them to be honest.

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[–] maxDOPE 14 years ago

JKD = 90% Wing Chun.

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

the difference is, wing chun is anally insistent on proper forms and stances. JKD is about delivering those techniques from a loose, versatile, "formless" stance

be like water

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] maxDOPE 14 years ago

Have you ever studied WC for some time? 'Anally insistent' is exagerated.

Forms and stance are the base, the rest is build on that. You can not deliver a perfect punch if your

stance is sloppy, i.e. The forms teach you among other things how to focus. JKD is not a fully developed system [BL died before he ironed out all the problems], so the teachers are just improvising on the basics they were taught. Danny Innosanto actually came to NY to study Wing Chun @ Moy Yat, so he could 'teach' JKD better after that. And he is considered the no.1 teacher. Just sayin'

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[–] meldavid 14 years ago

The way of teh Jedi is the strongest. Nuff said.

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[–] hattifnatt 14 years ago

Get me one of those kick-ass laser swords that you can pull up of your pants any time, and show me some nifty tricks with teh Force and I'll gladly follow you on the way of teh Jedi. Gay said.

"If you wait for luck to turn up, life becomes very boring." --Mikhail Tal

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[–] rhopmans 14 years ago

THE JEDI THING WAS A WEIRD POINT.
I THINK THEY ARE COOL AND ALL BUT NEVER DO YOU SEE ONE DOING HAND TO HAND COMBAT. ITS LIKE WITHOUT THEIR SABER THEY ARE CLUELESS AND WEAK.
SILLYNESS

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[–] BoswerLK 14 years ago

shoot the force at them

-BoswerLK
My reviews blog: http://boswerlk.wordpress.com

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[–] PizoDeMadera 14 years ago

When I am in a dangerous situation I use a pretty good and effective technique. If a guy wants to punch me or stab me or shot me I usually do this. I tell the guy there's something behind him. When the guy looks back I start running pretty fast in the exact opposite direction. The thing is that u have to be very convincing for the guy to trust you. Your facial expression is escencial, you must apply at least 45 facial muscles to get the wanted effect. You have to aim to get a mixed effect between fear and disbelieve of what you are witnessing. Other school of this technique uses the 'funny thing going on behind you' wich is effective if the guy is drunk, but not so much if you touched the guy's girlfriend or something like that. Btw, while you are running u must be screaming at the top of your lungs to get help.

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[–] griffinresurgent 14 years ago

Kali/Eskrima = very practical, relatively easy and fast to learn, and quite efficient/economical.

Griffin

Evolution takes no prisoners.

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[–] MetalgearSldSnk 13 years ago

If you can take but one art, I would say boxing would be the best mainly due to it's simplicity. The best two to use, though, would be a mixture of boxing and wrestling just to avoid some of the takedowns.

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[–] the_bamboo_spear 13 years ago

I would say jujutsu or judo. I like jujutsu because it has striking and "dirty" techniques, whereas judo is "cleaner" and more competition-based, but Judoka know their stuff, and if they get their hands on a "pure striker", it's over. I also like wushu, karate, kempo and especially Western boxing, but it should compliment your grappling, not be a substitute for it.

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[–] Tsiakkos 13 years ago

Ok no one mentioned ninjutsu which is the absolute martial art and its also proven in the documentary Fight Science of National Geographic.

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[–] the_bamboo_spear 13 years ago

The unarmed component of ninjutsu is pretty much jujutsu. It can be called taijutsu, jutaijutsu, dakentaijutsu, etc. There are skillsets like koppojutsu and koshijutsu, but it's pretty much jujutsu with some Chinese Kempo added in. Lots and lots of grappling, less flying kicks like you see with movie ninja.

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[–] Tsiakkos 13 years ago

No my friend. You are confused. To become ninja you have to master 18 skills similarly to samurai, some of which you have mentioned, along with the art of espionage, there are not an alternative forms of ninjutsu. Jutsu means art and nin ninja arts, the higher order of ninjutsu.

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[–] the-regicide 13 years ago

In a regular street brawl, IE while NOT fighting profesionally trained mercenaries, soldiers and 5th dan black belts or whatever, there are two things that will never fail you:
1. Boxing. Most fights end with one punch. Deliver that punch and you're golden.
2. Judo. Most fights end on the floor or in zero range. Bull rush. Armbar. Done.
These two will train you to deal with 90% of the street threats in a very short amount of time, and the only defense against them is equal or more experience with other MAs. Sure, a Boxer or a Judo practitioner will lose to a KM or WC practitioner when you compare them at a high level after, say, ten years of experience, but you're not likely to see guys like that on the street, looking for trouble.

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[–] the_bamboo_spear 13 years ago

We are not talking about "becoming a ninja". We are talking about the unarmed fighting arts of the ninja, which can be studied without "being a ninja", just as one can study jujutsu or kendo without "being a samurai". Most of the ninja unarmed arts were grappling-heavy and pretty much jujutsu, but with more striking. Some of them had a heavy Chinese influence.

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[–] sirbingo 13 years ago

I would have to say Gymkata is brobably the best of the martial arts for what you ask. Ningitsu is a close second. I have actually invented a style myself called Bas Rutan / Gymkata. Very effective in Bars and sidewalk alleys.

Here is the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3K-mrlYG7Y

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[–] waldomarek 12 years ago

jujutsu is indeed a very effective martial art. i'm training in it atm. the art is truly a contact sport whereas kung fu for example (which ive done for several years as well, shaolin kung fu to be precise) is much more form/kata training.

the only thing lacking for me atm is a "free style" sparring where we don't attack in a certain way, but in any way we want, but i guess that's a level issue. i'm currently green belt, moving on to blue probably in the coming half year. so, still 3 belts to go, i guess we'll go randori more.

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[–] Hans_Landa 13 years ago

I've started with Judo and normal Boxing, from that I went on to Kickboxing and later switched to Vale Tudo (basically MMA for those who have no idea what it is). After our VT Trainer moved to a different city I had to look for something new, so I tryed Krav Maga and loved it from the beginning.
I cant understand that some people here are saying that KM is to hard or complicated, because it is definitly not. As someone mentioned before it aims to be simple and easy to remember so that it becomes natural. Let me tell you from experience, KM does all of that.
I really respect all kinds of martial arts, even though some of them are only effective in tournaments and might even be mostly used for showbording - thats fine too. But if you are looking for something that is effective in real life situations go either with systems that were developed for real life like Krav Maga, Wing Chung, Ninjutsu or some of the "simple" martial arts like Boxing, Kickboxing or Muay Thai.

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[–] Trumerica 13 years ago

I am no expert but I studied Kung Fu when I was 12 and I was shocked when I fought this big football player and I will tell you why... when we use to fight we would take our stance, attack, defend, wait, attack, defend, etc. However in real life the guy just ran at me full speed and was randomly attacking and doing crazy stuff to where I really couldn't take the extra second to form my stance to do a kung fu move. So I had to fight regular as well against him.

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[–] wears-alan 13 years ago

Technically, he brought you into his dojo!
Now let me educate you and everyone else as to what is the most effective martial art of all.
ROAD RUNNER- DO.
You see, the roadrunner never gets hit or caught in what must be hundreds of attacks by that Wile.E.Coyote. There is no more effective art.

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[–] A_Fistful_of_Pennies 13 years ago

I'm sure it's not the most effective, but I'm currently taking a Judo class and I find it to be very useful. Although certain things are outlawed in the spirit of competition, it teaches you very useful techniques. For one thing, it toughens you up after being slammed into the mat. Also it teaches you how to use chokes and submissions which many martial arts don't deal with a great deal. It also teaches you many throws which could work in real-life situations, and teaches you how to turn your opponent's momentum against them. If Judo weren't limited by certain rules it would be a strong contender for best martial art.

I keep hearing Brazilian Jujitsu is an extremely effective martial art and probably more effective than Judo. It's big on submissions and mat work. I loved how Royce Gracie could always beat much bigger and stronger guys in the early UFC days using that discipline. He would end up on his back a lot and would still be able to find a way to win from that position. He was comfortable being underneath his opponent. It was really quite amazing to watch.

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[–] wears-alan 13 years ago

Judo eh!
I was out one night and as usual ended up at a takeaway shop. Outside there was this big guy pestering 2 girls who gave him short shrift. One of the girls boyfriend arrived in his car to pick them up and received a barrage of abuse off the big guy.Now this guy was about 5' 6" and no taller. The other guy was about 6' 3". The little guy asked him what his problem was and the big guy pulled his fist back to swing a punch. The little guy swivelled, catching the big guys' arm and flipped him over his shoulder and onto the floor. Then he calmly got in his car and drove off. The big guy got up to his feet a bit dazed and said " lucky he left". I burst out laughing and said to him "Yeah mate, lucky for you"!
Met the little guy a week later and told him I witnessed the previous weeks events. He told me he did judo and had done so for a number of years.

Pretty impressive it was.

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