I watched this film a couple of days ago, and it's still going round in my head.
I'm going to have to watch it again in order to get more out of it than my initial viewing.
Hoyte Van Hoytema's cinematography was brilliant, and Dan Berridge's original soundtrack was just haunting.
I have actually just bought the soundtrack from Amazon.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e3tGxnFKfE
http://tinyurl.com/LTROI-story
I just watched this the other day, and I did not like it. The soundtrack was beautiful and the cinematography was very good. I thought the story was dreadful. First the aunt, then the neighbor's cousin were awful people. Both should be in jail. The old men asking for a kiss was weird.
I couldn't finish watching it. There was a song that played while she was opening the gate at the end of her drive that I thought I recognized (it was the first time she left on her own to go shopping). If you have the name of that track, I would like to hear it again.
Edit: I found the song, it is called "There is no one in this place" -- it's a beautiful piano piece.
👿 I know something you don't know ... I am ambidextrous!
"I just watched this the other day, and I did not like it" - Realbullet
"I thought the story was dreadful" - Realbullet
"First the aunt, then the neighbor's cousin were awful people. Both should be in jail" - Realbullet
"The old men asking for a kiss was weird" - Realbullet
"I found the song, it is called "There is no one in this place" -- it's a beautiful piano piece." - Realbullet
It was a "coming of age" story, they're not usually full of good things until the end, where the protagonist emerges from their experiences a better and wiser person. Seriously, if the protagonist just has good times and never has to deal with any unforeseen negative consequences, then it wouldn't be a "coming of age" story.Yes, I'm well aware of what coming of age stories are about. I think the character was a little young for some of the experiences.
Yes, the aunt was weak willed and easily manipulated by The Girl, but "awful"?, no. She was an example of what happens when a person doesn't fully mature, a foreshadowing of what The Girl wanted to avoid becoming. She didn't think too hard about the possible consequences of her actions, what I took from the film was that she had commitment issues and was just floating through life where the currents took her. Not an upright pillar of the community, certainly, but "awful"?Yes she abandoned a nine-year-old girl in whom she had responsible care. That's not just bad behavior, that's criminal behavior. (I should point out that this case happened in the United States. The parents traveled to Africa leaving their nine-year-old twins in care of an uncle who did not care for them. The Uncle was arrested and the children were placed in foster homes until the parents returned. I don't know what they outcome of the Uncle's case was, but he was charged.)
The neighbour's cousin was a bratty teen, that was probably going through her own "coming of age" story, and you want her thrown in jail? How's that police state coming along?I had a tough time placing the age of the neighbor's cousin, but she sexually assaulted Ola and committed financial fraud. These aren't minor offenses.
I'm going to chalk that up to American sensibilities.Could be, but the men seemed to be on to them from the beginning (which is part of why the scene with the old men seemed weird.) In other words, the scam seemed ridiculous to the absurd.
"I think the character was a little young for some of the experiences." - Realbullet
"Yes she abandoned a nine-year-old girl in whom she had responsible care." - Realbullet
"That's not just bad behavior, that's criminal behavior. (I should point out that this case happened in the United States. The parents traveled to Africa leaving their nine-year-old twins in care of an uncle who did not care for them. The Uncle was arrested and the children were placed in foster homes until the parents returned. I don't know what they outcome of the Uncle's case was, but he was charged.)" - Realbullet
"...she sexually assaulted Ola and committed financial fraud. These aren't minor offenses. " - Realbullet
"Could be, but the men seemed to be on to them from the beginning (which is part of why the scene with the old men seemed weird.) In other words, the scam seemed ridiculous to the absurd." - Realbullet
Well, "I thought the story was dreadful" didn't convey that idea.I guess that I did not explain why I thought the story was dreadful -- mostly because the story dragged and the troubles the girl faced seemed extreme. Most of the true coming of age stories have more focus to them -- for instance, the classic is Stand By Me where the focus is to find a body.
Not exactly. She was manipulated by The Girl to leave, it's not like The Girl woke up one day to find herself alone. That would be abandonment.Yes, the girl did not wake up one day to find herself alone -- but she was still abandoned by the responsible care giver. I'm not sure how she was manipulated.
This is not a story of crime and punishment, this is a story of what happens to The Girl over the course of a few weeks, in a Swedish Summer, set in the early 80s. American laws and ideas of propriety do not apply to this film.It was just a point of comparison -- America laws do not apply, but my perceptions sure affect me.
No, there was a point of realisation, where the old men seemed to twig that something wasn't all above board. They didn't know from the offset that it was a scam. Would you have preferred it if the old men have held the girls captive and called the police to cart them off to juvie hall?It's hard to say how I expected them to react. I expected a little more anger and a demand of a refund.
"I guess that I did not explain why I thought the story was dreadful -- mostly because the story dragged..." - Realbullet
"...and the troubles the girl faced seemed extreme. Most of the true coming of age stories have more focus to them -- for instance, the classic is Stand By Me where the focus is to find a body." - Realbullet
"Yes, the girl did not wake up one day to find herself alone -- but she was still abandoned by the responsible care giver. I'm not sure how she was manipulated." - Realbullet
"It was just a point of comparison..." - Realbullet
"It's hard to say how I expected them to react. I expected a little more anger and a demand of a refund." - Realbullet
In those comparison coming of age stories, notice the ages of the protagonists. That's what I meant about the character being young for some of the experiences. Twelve to Fourteen are pretty standard ages for coming of age stories. Nine and a half seems young to me for a coming of age story.
The only one of those stories that I'm familiar with is Hick (which I've read, but I didn't see the movie.) The story itself was not that believable, but the prose was very good. I suspect it helped the movie that the extremely possessive man was played by a future Oscar winner.
Yes, the girl has it pretty easy compared to some of these stories -- but those other stories sound like they have a little more focus (i.e. a series of events which escalate into more and more problems). That's as opposed to a series of random events which she learns from. In many ways, life is like that -- but that doesn't make them interesting stories. In Hick, Lulu heads off on her own to find Vegas. She learns about life from the obstacles that she experiences.
I'm not sure why you felt the need to make that comparison though, seeing that you've just said that it is irrelevant. I get the impression you're watching this film through an American lens, and trying to make sense of it from an American perspective, which is fine, but it's never going to work with a film like this.The point of comparison was to show that I understand these things can happen, but the results should be completely different. I can't imagine that a drunken neighbor would allow himself to be blackmailed by a nine year-old girl. I'm pretty sure an anonymous phone call to child services would have fixed that problem.
The Girl wrote to her aunt's last boyfriend and got him to come for her aunt, she then convinced her aunt that she can look after herself. She used her aunt's weak character as a tool to get rid of her. I'm sure The girl thought she could do better herself, after seeing her aunt failing at being a good carer. Initially, The Girl seemed to be coping quite well, but then the steep learning curve kicked in.Somehow, I missed that in the story. I remember her writing the letter, but I thought it was to someone she liked. Initially, I thought it was the neighbor boy, but the names did not match.
"Nine and a half seems young to me for a coming of age story." - Realbullet
"Yes, the girl has it pretty easy compared to some of these stories -- but those other stories sound like they have a little more focus (i.e. a series of events which escalate into more and more problems). That's as opposed to a series of random events which she learns from." - Realbullet
"I can't imagine that a drunken neighbor would allow himself to be blackmailed by a nine year-old girl. I'm pretty sure an anonymous phone call to child services would have fixed that problem." - Realbullet
I totally agree, Flickan isn't the most focused story in the world, but I don't see that as necessarily a bad thing. Too much adherence to a rigid structure can be stifling, and lead to predictable films.This has been done, but it is extremely difficult. The classic version of this version of a coming of age story is Diner (even though the guys in that story were much older than the girl in Flickan.) Many people were critical of Diner because it had a very weak focus (mostly Steve Guttenberg doing everything he could to keep from getting married.) The difference is that Diner had a lot of strong, natural conflict built into the characters. When the protagonist is just a watcher, it becomes very difficult to maintain the tension.
But Gunnar was a friend of the family, not just a neighbour. He seemed to have an individual friendship with The Girl (not in a creepy way) where he taught her that dance and song about a sailor, and insisted on her performing it when they met (the sort of thing uncles do to much younger nephews and nieces).But, I honestly think this supports my view that he would not accept her blackmail. A friend of the family will typically swallow their pride and do something about it -- even if it reflects poorly on them.
"The difference is that Diner had a lot of strong, natural conflict built into the characters. When the protagonist is just a watcher, it becomes very difficult to maintain the tension." - Realbullet
"But, I honestly think this supports my view that he would not accept her blackmail. A friend of the family will typically swallow their pride and do something about it -- even if it reflects poorly on them." - Realbullet
I can't help but feel you were expecting a different film to the one you got. Flickan doesn't not have "strong, natural conflict built into the characters", or huge amounts of "tension", and nor does it need to. What it achieves it does so through a gentle process of awakening, not a trial by ordeal. Not every film has to have tension in order to work.I'm sorry, but that is not true. All stories need tension and conflict to work. This is simply one of the few fundamental requirements of story telling. You can find this in any basic textbook. Most will tell you that stories are conflict as though they are interchangeable terms. You can find this all over. For instance, here is some requirements from the very first random site that I opened on the question of story telling:http://www.natashakern.com/fiction_checklist.htm
SITUATION (PLOT/ACTION) CONFLICTS
1. Lacks central conflict, simply a string of episodes.
2. Conflict not believable or seems contrived.
3. Too many subplots or not enough.
4. Lacks dramatic tension. (Fails to create sensation of tension) This is the most important and most serious consideration.
He initially intended to do something about The Girl's predicament, he was going to alert the authorities. This was when he would appear as the hero, saving a child from an irresponsible adult (her aunt, not his neighbours, he might not have wanted to get his friends into trouble but he didn't know The Girl's aunt). So far, he is fulfilling your expectations, but that all changes when his car ends up in a ditch. He now has to consider the fallout that will land on him. He won't be a hero, he'll be seen as an idiot who can't handle his liquor. He'll never hear the end of it, his wife had already criticised him for getting his clothes wet while washing the car "I washed the car, like you told me to", she's the boss, he does as he's told, and still gets criticised.All of that I understand (and this is about where I turned off the movie.) I just didn't buy it. That's all fine, well and good that he is a weak character -- but what will a weak character do as soon as his wife asks him about the girl. If he's truly a weak character, then he would immediately confess the crime. But, if he cares even a little about the girl, then he would surreptitiously try to get her some help.
A weak character chooses the path of least resistance, keeping quiet about The Girl was easier for him than raising the alarm.
"I'm sorry, but that is not true. All stories need tension and conflict to work" - Realbullet
"...but what will a weak character do as soon as his wife asks him about the girl. If he's truly a weak character, then he would immediately confess the crime." - Realbullet
"But, if he cares even a little about the girl, then he would surreptitiously try to get her some help." - Realbullet
AS I wrote -- that was the first site that I pulled up. Any screenwriting workshop will tell you the same thing. Plot = Conflict. It's such a basic guideline that some books/workshops start out with it as foregone conclusion.
Conflict and tension don't necessarily mean fighting. Usually it's conflicting objectives or goals. It works best when the goals are clear and realistic. For instance, in Flickan it is not very clear why the girl wants to be without supervision. My nine year-old son always needs to know who is in charge if we go out.
2001: Space Odyssey has tension & conflict. The basic story is a computer with two competing objectives that it can't meet. Space travel is fraught with tension. A better example would be "Boyhood" -- it had tension, but most of it went unfulfilled. It was so boring that it made my eyes bleed.
You don't know that he didn't, you stopped watching there. Also, you can't argue in one instance that he is so spineless he can't even lie to his wife (to support your view of him), and in the next that he could go behind his wife's back in a way that would be seen as some kind of disloyalty.Yes, I know I stopped watching, but I also read the dust case where it said that she convinced the neighbors not to check on her. So, it's not like I stopped watching in the blind. I find that spineless people avoid conflict -- which is not the same thing as not caring. In other words, he would have done something to ensure her safety while avoiding conflict with his wife and the appearance of disloyalty.
"Conflict and tension don't necessarily mean fighting." - Realbullet
"For instance, in Flickan it is not very clear why the girl wants to be without supervision. My nine year-old son always needs to know who is in charge if we go out." - Realbullet
"2001: Space Odyssey has tension & conflict. The basic story is a computer with two competing objectives that it can't meet" - Realbullet
"A better example would be "Boyhood" " - Realbullet
"It was so boring that it made my eyes bleed" - Realbullet
"it's not like I stopped watching in the blind" - Realbullet
"I find that spineless people avoid conflict -- which is not the same thing as not caring. In other words, he would have done something to ensure her safety while avoiding conflict with his wife and the appearance of disloyalty." - Realbullet
The Girl had no choice about being without her parents, she didn't choose to be without them. It is clear why The Girl doesn't want her aunt "looking after her". It's because the aunt got bored with playing happy families with her niece and decided to have fun instead, something The Girl recognised as a destructive influence. As for her neighbours, they represented a stifling of her new found freedom and independence.Intellectually, I can understand this, but emotionally, I can't. By the time that her neighbor is looking in on her, it seems that she is specifically trying to be alone. In other words, by then she seems to be rejecting her independence and searching for relief.
I'm not sure if it is that common. It has to do with taking your next step in life -- you either take it blindly, without forethought, or you give it thought and anticipate the next step.
That's an unusual expression, at least for me it is. I can work out what it means from the context, but that's new to me. Interesting, is it common in America?
Except that is not what you initially said he would do if he was to be a believable character, you said that he would have confessed all to his wife if he was a weak character. Having confessed all he couldn't then go on to surreptitiously help The Girl.I really meant for that to be one option of what he could do -- not that it was the only possibility. In other words, he could have confessed all to his wife when she demanded it (breaking down in sobs) or avoided conflict altogether and reported it to the authorities. Another possibility is to whisper to the tractor-driver asking him to check up on her. These are all ways to avoid conflict.
" By the time that her neighbor is looking in on her, it seems that she is specifically trying to be alone." - Realbullet
"In other words, by then she seems to be rejecting her independence and searching for relief." - Realbullet
Are you suggesting that she is looking for relief in the form of friendship with Ola, relief from being independant and alone, or that she is looking for help, relief from being independant and failing, making her dependant on others?I think that she is becoming used to the idea that she is failing on her own.
"I think that she is becoming used to the idea that she is failing on her own." - Realbullet
I don't want to get between you and Realbullet's complete misunderstanding of the film, but I agree with you completely. Especially when you said:
"it's still going round in my head"
Same with me. And that's the sign of a good film, in my opinion. One that sticks with you for a while, and one that makes you want to see it again. I've watched the film 3 times, and get a bit more out of it each time. It still resonates with me.
Some people just don't get it, and you can't convince them otherwise.