MovieChat Forums > 47 Ronin (2013) Discussion > Between Keanu and Tom Cruise

Between Keanu and Tom Cruise


Although this movie was more fantastical and Keanu had far less dialogue than Tom Cruise in the Last Samurai,I prefer Keanu's Kai.
Tom Cruise brought his typical Tomcruiseness to his Nathan Algren and even when he went native I still feel like he was just an American playing dress up. It's not his fault Tom Cruise has a habit of doing that in every role he's played. Don't get me wrong,I love him but I didn't realise this until I saw 47 Ronin.
I know someone will say that these are two different films completely and it's incomparable but both films featured two major Hollywood actors in lead billing.

American Horror Story
Being Human UK

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I totally agree with you. In Last Samurai everything, but everything, is made to serve Tom Cruise's inflated ego. He gets the dramatic wounds and recovery, he gets all the big scenes of 'superior white guy absorbs quaint foreign culture and teaches the simple natives their own art of war', he supplants the daimyo's own hatamoto, he survives the battle and the slaughter by the magic forcefield of American nationality, he gets to advise the Emperor and he gets the girl. The excellent Japanese actors all around him are just there to service all this.

In 47 Ronin, silly though it is, Reeves's character is quite low-status throughout. OK he's a super-powers fighter, but there is an almost-believable reason for this, his upbringing with the oni in the forest. And he's not on the screen the whole time. Hiroyuki Sanada, an actor who can wipe the floor with both Reeves and Cruise, is allowed enough screen time to carry the film; which given the subject matter, absurdly fantasised though it is, is how it should be.

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Thanks for making my point much clearer. I know what I wanted to say but I didn't phrase it well. I totally agree with the bit you said about Tom Cruise.
You have to take it in context. I've seen some Asian films and to me this wasn't very different. It just happened to have a familiar Hollywood face. At no point was it about Keanu leading those men to avenge ummm I forgot the Lord's name. If anyone is at the helm it's Sanada.

I think it's a hate popularity thing again. People just like to criticize Keanu Reeves. It's been so since the early 90's.

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Actually there's a very interesting parallel in the great Chushingura of 1962 - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0055850/

In this far more accurate telling of the 47 Ronin story, or at least the story as retold in contemporary bunraku drama, no less an actor than Toshiro Mifune is brought in to play a fictional character, presumably also to increase the box-office appeal. He's not on screen the whole time, he plays a supporting role and doesn't get in the way of the main plot.

Anyone who is interested in the true events and hasn't seen this film, I do recommend you seek it out.

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Suzume-san: In Last Samurai everything, but everything, is made to serve Tom Cruise's inflated ego. He gets the dramatic wounds and recovery, he gets all the big scenes of 'superior white guy absorbs quaint foreign culture and teaches the simple natives their own art of war', he supplants the daimyo's own hatamoto, he survives the battle and the slaughter by the magic forcefield of American nationality, he gets to advise the Emperor and he gets the girl. The excellent Japanese actors all around him are just there to service all this.
Well said.

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[deleted]

Hey, interesting link, C-G, thanks. Particularly the bit about Hijikata and the Shinsengumi, subjects of many another fairly barmy drama.

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completely agreed. I also think people behind the making of this movie were probably aware of this

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[deleted]

I dub this most accurate thread on the board.

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Last Samurai is one of the greatest films of all time. If Keanu were in it, it would have been horrible.

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In that movie Tom Cruise's character IS an American. Keanu Reeves is born and brought up in that land.

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THIS x1000



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manojlds
In that movie Tom Cruise's character IS an American. Keanu Reeves is born and brought up in that land.



actually Keanu was born in Beruit



Chrispa76
Are you saying that Canada is not in America?




Thats exactly what he is saying canada and america are not the same





Thoughtz
It's not plausible he is a half breed, he literally is one. His mom is half Chinese/Hawaiian and his dad is English.



Yeah but do people care no! there angry his in the film because his white


armageddonkitten-136-903448
Keanu has a warm presence on the screen (even when he's being a badass in The Matrix). I haven't seen 47 Ronin yet, but I bet you dimes to dollars that I'll like Keanu better than I liked Cruise in The Last Samurai. It's Keanu's warm, subtle presence which wins me over--the one that doesn't hit you in the face like a brick the way Cruise always does.




He was good what some people say its true he doesnt have an presence like Cruise but in the right roles his good








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Couldn't care less about the actors. As long as they aren't annoying then I don't care, and I didn't think either were.
The characters however, are very important. One was well developed and had good dialogue, the other was a one-dimensional silent type who only had one emotion. Got nothing to do with the actors.
The point is, The Last Samurai is a good movie with a good lead character, despite how idiotic the actor is. 47 Ronin is a stupid movie with a one-dimensional lead character that barely speaks, has no emotion, awful dialogue and inexplicable magic powers. That and he's also a half-English, half-Japanese man that talks with an American accent.

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That and he's also a half-English, half-Japanese man that talks with an American accent.
Canadian. Keanu is Canadian and so is his accent.

---
It's the question that drives us. I know the answer is 42.

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Are you saying that Canada is not in America?

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Canada is in the North America continent. So what you're saying is that Japan is in the Asia continent and so is China so Japanese people are Chinese. Even people in the same country and in the same family can differ in religion an ideology.

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The difference is that Japan and China are countries(with completely different languages) whilst America are the combined continental landmasses of North America and South America, hence claiming that Keanu Reeves dialect should it be Canadian sounds American is indeed correct. I know that most people(Including myself) in daily speak wrongly refer to the country USA when they say 'America'. I assume that this is indeed what the poster 'jamieparsons1' meant, a USA dialect, as well as wrongly writing 'English' instead of British accent.

My point being that whether it being a USA or Canadian dialect makes no difference. Generally speaking, all North American English dialects sounds much more similar to each other than any of them do to British English. To a non natively English speaking person, it is much easier to spot the difference between British and American English than it is to spot the difference between Canadian and USA English.

We all know what 'jamieparsons1' meant, so there is no point in trying to be smart with such a reply.

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If you're speaking in Spanish, that may be true. But that's not the convention of most English-speaking countries (including Canada).

Canada is part of the Americas (notice the plural). But Canada is not part of America, and nor are Canadians American.

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If you're speaking in Spanish, that may be true. But that's not the convention of most English-speaking countries (including Canada).
Not entirely sure which part of my post you are replying to :S What may be true if I'm speaking in Spanish?

I speak four languages(no Spanish). English is only my third language, and not my mother tongue.

Anyway, I was taught by a history teacher that technically, The Americas and America(plural or not) is the same thing, the combined continents of South America and North America. The country's name is United States of America.

To call USA 'America', is merely common speak(I do it too), but not factually correct.

The only reason why I replied in such a way was because Anakin_McFly tried to be smart by correcting jamieparsons1 completely unnecessary. We all knew what jamieparsons1 meant. So I thought that since details and correctness was so important to him/her, I should provide it.

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Actually, please do!

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It's just an idiomatic quirk, like the "Midwest" referring to the Middle Eastern part of the United States, or Asian (the collective demonym) not referring to Russians, even though they live in Asia.

It's a little confusing, but that's just how mainstream conventions have developed.

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It always bothers me, because anyone living in the Americas is technically American. It seems lazy to me to call someone from the United States an American (thus assuming the exclusion of all other American countries). But what else do you call us? United Statesian? U.S.A.ian? Lol. Unless something better comes along, it's gonna have to be American, I guess.


"Congratulations. I'm a hundred years old."

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Hey sorry for late reply, just went through my history.

When I write, I try to call them/you 'U.S. Americans'. In my own language though(swedish), that would sound completely ridiculous to say or write. Sometimes you can reword it to 'people from the US(A)'.

But yes, in daily speak, I very often wrongly use the word American as well. It is just easier :P

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with that logic, I guess Mexico can also be considered American, since it's in North America and all, right?

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with that logic, I guess Mexico can also be considered American, since it's in North America and all, right?

As far as I know, Mexico's national language is Spanish.

EDIT:
Sorry I might have misunderstood what you meant. Can Mexico be considered an American Country? Yes, all countries in north and south America(or 'The Americas') are American countries. Can Mexican be considered the same as American English? No, the majority's primary language is Spanish, and a small percent of the Mexican population speaking various native indigenous languages. Yes English is indeed common in Mexico, as a secondary language. I would call it Mexican English or possibly something like General English. However, I guess their English is much more influenced by American English than it is British English.
/EDIT

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...and he's also a half-English, half-Japanese man that talks with an American accent.

That is such a moot point. You did notice they all spoke English, right?

I hate when for example in a sci-fi movie they invent some language, like it's more believable this way. It's so ridiculous it can spoil a movie for me.
In this movie, they speak English, but you as a viewer should be aware that it is spoken in native language, and only for your convenience, so you can understand the story without the need of subtitles.
(somehow I can't phrase it properly, but you know what I mean)

People are just jealous, because "voices" are talking only to me...

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[deleted]

47 Ronin did something that both surprised and impressed me and that was seamlessly merging Keanu Reeves into an all Japanese movie. The script was perfectly suited to this, him being a half breed (which actually could be plausible with Keanu), the perfect casting of young Keanu was to me the best casting i've ever seen in regard to casting a child version of an actor....as well as the way Keanu speaks suiting this role perfectly.
Tom Cruise in Last Samurai still impressed me, i've always liked Cruises ability to take risks with scripts although he doesn't take too much risk with his acting style, the movie still worked well. I think the difference is that 47 Ronin blended Keanu into the movie whereas The Last Samurai blended the movie into Tom Cruise. 47 Ronin was a lot harder task to pull off.

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Keanu is a passive by nature kind of actor. You simply WATCH what he does in a film. If what he happens to be doing is interesting, more the merrier.

Tom Cruise has a more commanding presence. I was looking forward to each scene with Tom in it, wondering what would happen next. Each offer a completely different performance. I feel between the two, Tom pulls away with the win on this.

BTW. If any have not watched Keanu's last film - "Man of Tai Chi" - which he also directed - I suggest you check it out. I personally was pleasantly surprised.

Your one opinion away from being wrong, yet again.

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by CriticismHurts
ยป 6 days ago (Fri Mar 14 2014 23:29:35)
IMDb member since December 2010
If any have not watched Keanu's last film - "Man of Tai Chi" - which he also directed - I suggest you check it out. I personally was pleasantly surprised.

OMG, that was bad movie. Many ppl including me, called it "a really bad, Chinese Lionheart"
Of course it all depends on personal preferences, but for me it was bad, although choreography of fights were quite well done.


People are just jealous, because "voices" are talking only to me...

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Completely agree, Man of Tai Chi was a badly acted and directed movie.

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It's not plausible he is a half breed, he literally is one. His mom is half Chinese/Hawaiian and his dad is English.

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I believe Tom Cruise's character in The Last Samurai was always meant to be an American in dress up...when he survives at the end he wears his old US military uniform, he doesn't commit 'seppuku' like a true samurai would etc.

Anyway, like it or not The Last Samurai introduced a whole ton of good Japanese actors who went on to star in a lot of Western films to my pleasant surprise (OK only 2 that I know of but still).

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About introducing Japanese actors to a Western audience?yeah thank god. Hiroyuki Sanada and Ken Watanabe (whom I've grown fond off)

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