Why does a movie about classical music/musicians always have to rely on this type of fantasy and fiction?
Musicians who haven't played together in 30 years suddenly playing perfectly?
A conductor who hasn't conducted in 30 years?
Gypsy musicians suddenly turning into symphonic musicians?
They perform without days of rehearsal?
And no one in the audience suspects that these are not the actual orchestra of the Bolshoi?
capcanuk on Tue Jul 13 2010 07:33:08 writes:
Why does a movie about classical music/musicians always have to rely on this type of fantasy and fiction?All movies about classical musicians? Shine was only slightly glamorized from what really occurred.
Musicians who haven't played together in 30 years suddenly playing perfectly .... [etc]
d'uh, maybe because this forum is for a film about classical music?
sharecapcanuk on Wed Jul 14 2010 05:39:40 writes:
d'uh, maybe because this forum is for a film about classical music?My point was that classical music is little different from any sort of fiction in that respect. You seem to be objecting to having fiction in any story if it's about classical music. Is that so?
I agree this movie was pretty annoyng with is total lack of veracity.
shareno, I don't object to fiction in a film about classical arts.
I loved The Red Violin, which is pretty much all fiction.. but it's all "plausible". It's safely couched in historic reality, artistic reality, and the reality of life as a classical musician. It doesn't rely on "miracles" like people who haven't performed together in 30 years suddenly sounding brilliant.
No wonder so few people respect classical musicians. They all have these illusions that musicians just pick up the instrument and WOW! music comes out, and it's perfect.
capcanuk on Wed Jul 21 2010 08:08:32 wrote:
.... and the reality of life as a classical musician. It doesn't rely on "miracles" like people who haven't performed together in 30 years suddenly sounding brilliant.I didn't think of it as a miracle; it was part of the humour. Not all classical musicians are humour-free zones. Buster Keaton did wonderful gags that were utterly preposterous, but so what? They were still very funny. Depends on how you look at it. Since I enjoyed the music so much, I was prepared to give the benefit of the doubt anywhere else. Of course, you can choose to think differently about it.
No wonder so few people respect classical musicians. They all have these illusions that musicians just pick up the instrument and WOW! music comes out, and it's perfect.That word "all", again? Evidently you didn't think that of The Red Violin. share
[deleted]
Why on earth did you delete my answer? How about saving that function for abusive replies or non relevant answers.
It is true to say they don't make the type of films you probably want to see because they wouldn't be commercial.
Sorry to butt in, but I'm afraid you must have accidentally deleted your own answer. It says "deleted by the poster" - that means you, not another poster. It's easily done.
shareImagine following scene:
An American in Paris is asking a person in the road: "Are you speaking English?" The person is saying: "Yes!" The American is asking: "Could you tell me the way to the Louvre, please?" The answer is: "Mais bien-sur! Vous êtes tout près. Suivez cette route encore trois cents mètres et vous y êtes!"
What happened? The French guy accepted a language, which he did not want to speak. Ok. The original Poster, capcanuk bought a ticket for the cinema, but refuses to speak the language of the film. This is ok so far. Now, comes the problem: he is not choosing his friend, to tell him, that this film is not realistic; he does not shout it loudly in front of the public in cinema, no, he tells it to the world in the internet: I realised something, what everybody oversaw: the film is not realistic! In other words: I am so smart and you are so silly. Instead of choosing an other detail, - for example: it is impossible to make the distance by foot from Red Square to the airport Sheremtyevo in two hours, make new passports for 50 people with visa and check in ... No, he chooses a detail which he believes only he realised, because he is smarter than all people out there in the world wide web: it is impossible, that an orchestra plays on this high level with soloist having never rehearsed before since 30 years. Do you think really, that anybody out here, the film director included, thought seriously, this would be possible? You did not understand the film language at all. This is a film in a grotesque language, as often do comedies; this film is telling us a moving story, about a girl finding his parental roots and an orchestra and director, who is taking revenge for a destroyed artistic live. This film never wanted to tell us a realistic history about the professional live of musicians; everybody understood this, except you. Do you know, what means "miracle"? The IMPOSSIBLE happens. And this is all about story telling, since stone age.
Would you shout out loudly in the imdb forum: "I saw 'Cloverfield'. But I tell you something: such kind of monsters are not existing at all. This film is not realistic!" ???
An other example: you are buying a ticket for an opera. You are bored, probably because it is over your head, such strange mixture of arts; but instead of speaking to your neighbour about this experience in opera, you chose to go into internet, telling us: "A women would never talk to his lover like that, singing and making these artificial movements! It is really not realistic!" You misunderstood the language of opera! It is simple like that. And you are not smarter as everybody, telling us, that you alone understood the film. You are wrong, you are not accepting the language of the film.
Please stop going to cinema, reading novels or poetry, if you ever did. Keep up with your newspapers, watch some documentaries, but leave us alone with your opinion about arts, what's ever.
To finish: this film is one of the most moving I saw this year. An overwhelming plot, deeply human, smart dialogues, plenty of imagination and an INCREDIBLE story!
Not quite sure why you chose to answer my post, considering on this particular thread I expressed no opinion whatsoever.
shareSorry Ambrosia-I
I was clearly speaking to the OP, capcanuk
To answer in a thread on imdb I click to the last posting "answer", to keep everything in chronological order. Is this wrong?
Greetings
marek
No problem at all, marek. If you want to answer a particular person, it's best to click on their reply button, then they'll usually get an email telling them you've answered their particular post. I've just realised my posts on here have all been user instructions! I actually rather enjoyed the the film, which is what I'd said on another thread.
sharethx Ambrosia-I
I am just realizing, that I made all my postings wrong on imdb! What I would be without your instructions :-)
greetings
marek
I don't think there's wrong and right ways, marek. Just that, if you wanted someone to reply specifically to your points, you'll probably get more sense out of them than me, lol. If you're just talking generally, I'm sure it's fine to add on to the end of a thread. Hey, at the end of the day, I'm not the arbiter of how things should be done!
Happy posting!
So true, so true!! Art doesn't have to be realitic to be great. Actually rather the contrary. Anyhow.... I never go to the movies with high expectations and neither did I to watch this one. What a joy it was.... funny, heartwarming, inspiring and the music and end wasd just WOW
You can bring all the super-duper high tech most expensive special effects you want, but what is seen at the end in this film is by FAR more powerful than any effects can portray.
Yeah, I totally agree. The difference is that I was expecting to love this film because I ahad already loved Train of Life and my sister had told me this one was also excellent.
share[deleted]
"Gypsy musicians suddenly turning into symphonic musicians?"
Nope - not suddenly... takes a lifetime. Caliu is an actual violin prodigy - see here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loZd4dPow4A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnNCidccbG8
I agree.
I´m musician.
From this point of view, this movie is offensive to my inteligence.
Oscar
Hablo mejor español :)
As a person who used to be trained to play the violin professionally but switched careers due to circumstance, I agree with you. Even though I played the violin off and on through the years, only in recent years that I started to play symphonic music again, and it was tough. Individually it was already tough, but to play well with other people as an ensemble it was even tougher, because skill levels can be all over the place, and many people, having left music for so long, can lose the "ear" to play music correctly. To be able to play with little rehearsals are unheard of even for the pros.
It's one thing to play salon music. It's another to play real classical music. I haven't seen the movie, but the soundtrack lists Mahler's Symphony No.1 and Khatchaturian's Sabre Dance, which are both demanding pieces (the former, in interpretation, and the latter, technically) for an orchestra to play well.