MovieChat Forums > The Baby Borrowers (2008) Discussion > Get off your high horse!

Get off your high horse!

posted 16 years ago by suecat1967
44 replies | jump to latest

Just an observation from a 40 year old mother of 3 children: 17 years old, 11 years old, and a 7 year old. Personally, I think some of the parents that are "observing" from their close circuit TV's are a little harsh on these teenagers. These parents expect them to be anticipating and managing stressful situations that take YEARS to manage. For example, the mom of Alecia's baby was very harsh with her. Yes, Alecia was definitely not nearly "up to snuff", but this mom had NO PATIENCE at all with her! I can remember having a new baby at the age of 24 (which is several years older than these teens) and wanting to curl up in a ball and just shrivel because I thought, "I just can't do this". And, this was after working as a full time critical care nurse for 2 years! So, parents, give these teens a little break. They are NOT going to respond perfectly to stressful situations the first time. I'm STILL learning.... and I've been a mom over 17 years!!!

[–] chocolate478 16 years ago

I have to beg to differ. These kids are wanting kids and they need to know that a baby isnt simply arm candy or source of attention: its a human being. Alicea was going to let the poor kid starve. I am 17, no kid, but I think what that mom did was justified.

[–] suecat1967 16 years ago

I really doubt that her boyfriend would have let the poor kid starve. And, I think that some of these parents' reactions have something to do with better drama if they are a little harder on the teens. It's just funny to hear these "seasoned parents" telling these kids to behave in a manner that is so much above their maturity level. I know you're 17 and not a child, but, until you have kids of your own and "mature", you have no idea what it's like and how long it really takes you to get there.

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] rickfan1971 16 years ago

Jeez, my 9 year old son couldn't believe that girl said"starve then" to the baby. He was saying "you have to feed them." It is sad that a 9 year old boy know better how to take care of a baby than this "of age" girl who supposedly wanted a baby.

[–] joeykeo 16 years ago

Yeah the point of the show is that these teens think they are ready for babies. Which means the parents have every right to let those kids know they aren't ready at all. (Or they are ready if any are)

Jo

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

the parents absolutely have the right and the responsibility to be honest even brutally honest with the teenagers.

the teenagers know from the beginning that they have a safety net, more than one, in real life many parents don't, there will be no consequences beyond a talking to if they fail to properly care for the children,

there are very few backups or second chances available every minute of every day for real parents and the result in either case (and when the one left while her boyfriend was in the shower) could have been an injured child

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] starline 16 years ago

I agree with the OP... :)

And I get the point of the series...Show teens how miserable it is to be a parent. (Although it's only been since probably the 1960s on...that women have been waiting till later to get married and get pregnant. (When was the pill invented?) Before then...I don't think it was unusual for a girl to get married right out of high school and start a family...and I think they did okay...since the main thing for raising a child is Love.)

I do think the show is a good idea... when teen pregnancies are in the news...like the 17 teens pregnant at one high school...(was it or wasn't it a pact?) And especially when they say teen pregnancies are UP for the first time in a Long time.

And I'm not saying the some of the teens haven't made some mistakes...or haven't acted immaturely...But...to be fair...First off when you bring home your own baby...a brand new newborn mostly sleeps for the first 2 weeks... so you have a chance to hold it, stare at it...and fall in love with it... Even more than you were already loving it while it was in your tummy.

Then you have months...years... to get to know your child...and you kinda plan and set it's schedule. So you know the routine...like a habit... like the back of your hand... and even then you have "bad" days... Off schedule, cranky days. Although there's much literature...and classes and such...Parenthood is pretty much a learn-as-you go skill. And there ARE days you might let your baby cry them self to sleep... cause nothing else worked.

Second off...this is a whole 'nother experience for these babies...and maybe they are SO fussy because they just want their parents...and their own house...plain-N-simple...and NO one could please 'em. I'd like to see these "expert moms" take care of someone ELSE'S teething baby...in a unfamiliar house ... following some other mom's demands. And if they didn't follow exactly...and the baby was fussy...the baby's mom would come insult them. How well would ThaT go?

These parents...who are so critical...and act like they're perfect parents... are also the ones who allowed their kids to be guinea pigs on tv...(so they could make money)... so it seems funny that they can be so harsh of others. Stomping over to the house just to complain.

I really liked the black dad...who came over with concerns and was so patient and understanding with the teens... and gave constructive advice. He was Great. :)

In all honesty...the 7 month old...who was teething...Carson... would not have "died" even if he did just live on formula for 3 days. Of course baby food IS part of his diet...but I don't think the babies were technically there for 3 whole days ...for 36 hours. Probably more like - Day one: arrive at teen's house after breakfast...spend night... Day two: spend another day and night...and Day three: go home after breakfast. So the little guy surely ate at home day one...and would eat at home day 3 also. So he would Not die on formula alone. Plus the nanny on guard...at All times...would step in... if it was truly harmful. And...who knows...Alicea might have had better luck on day two getting Carson to actually eat.

But... Carson was Teething... and that can be miserable for AnyOne to handle. I can't believe the Only tip the mom had was orajel. There ARE other things that help.

I did think it was ODD that the Carson's mom growled at Alicea that Alicea was holding the baby too much because Carson is Never held. Why not...why does that mom never just sit and hold her baby?! He's Only 7 months old! What...No cuddling?

As far as the blonde mom coming over...well...I didn't really like her anyway. I didn't like when she said she had Such potential...but had kids instead. SO...Why didn't she quit having babies ...(that 6 month old baby girl is the youngest of their children)...and go use her "potential"...if she felt so "cheated". She was on a talk show...and said she got pregnant on Purpose when she was so young...(what ever ThaT means) But why hasn't she Stopped getting pregnant?

I could NOT believe that blonde mom was back with another kid. (I felt sorry for the teen) So ...that mom has a 6 month old AND a 2 year old?! In all honesty...I wouldn't be surprised if she was Not potty training her little guy at home at all...but just told the teens she was...so the teen could potty train him...lol If the mom already has one baby at 6 months in diapers... what's the biG deal of having 2 in diapers. It's a lot less stressful than cleaning poop-N-puddles all day. And a lot easier to potty train them when they can actually understand ...like closer to 3...(especially boys)...and can be excited about sticker rewards and pick out their own fun "cartoon" underwear. They have "motivation". Seriously...what does it matter if it's age 3 instead of 2...Does AnyOne actually start kindergarten who Isn't potty trained... lol

But when that blonde mom came huffing over to the house to fuss at the teens for not having the 6 month old in jammies... that was ridiculous! Does she really think a 6 month old knows the difference in a play outfit...from pjs. They don't. So for her to tear into the teen was just mean. I wonder if that couple has another kid at home...that they'll be leaving with those teens.

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] starline 16 years ago

Didn't you watch the show?

I really find a response like this childish.

Are you Carson's mom or something? I also talked about the blonde mom. What? No comment there?

I'm not saying Alicea...(or any of the teens)... are ready to be parents. (But in reality...there's LoTs of people...not just teens...even "adults"...who wouldn't make good parents)

And I'm not defending Alicea...as much as saying a couple of the moms were over the top and annoying.

The black dad was a perfect example of how to handle a stressful situation. He spoke to the teens like he understood what it's like to be in their shoes. He came across as sincere and Was helpful.

I did NOT see Carson's mom patiently explaining things. She came across as confrontational. Alicea was already feeling over-whelmed...the mom did nothing to calm the situation.

What exactly were the tips the mom shared? I did watch the show...and I mostly heard criticizing from her.

And Yes...the boyfriend stepped up to take care of Carson...and in the end of the 3 days ...Carson's mom still had nothing to say but criticisms...even for the boyfriend. Alicea may have been acting her "age"... like an immature teenager... but what was the mom's excuse...she came across "immature" her self.

My point was ...a couple of these moms were untactful...(and maybe even unrealistic) in their complaints to the teens... about their First-Day of "parenting".

I did see a different person... a better "parent"... in Alicea... when she had a different child with different parents. That 3 year old was SO adorable. :)

I can't wait to see the pre-teens... (although realistically a 17 year old teenager...18, 19...whatever they are...like these couples...couldn't actually have a biological pre-teen. lol And what's the thought behind the senior citizens... how would a teen have one of those?)

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] starline 16 years ago

You're kidding right?

Then who were you talking to...when you asked...

"didn't you watch the show?"

Who were you saying to "Stop making excuses for alicea" to?

Why wouldn't I think you were talking to me?

You already responded Above my post... saying Carson's mom was in the right. I assume that would have been to oppose the OP's point of view. You said you would have acted even less composed than Carson's mom.

After your post...2 people responded...and agreed with you...about the parents.

Then I post saying the parents were over reacting...

And you responded After my post... taking Carson's mom's defense - Again.

Why wouldn't I think you were talking to me? So...that was directed to the OP - Again...and NOT me? Sure...whatever... lol

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] lrbe817 16 years ago

(although realistically a 17 year old teenager...18, 19...whatever they are...like these couples...couldn't actually have a biological pre-teen. lol And what's the thought behind the senior citizens... how would a teen have one of those?)

Many adults have to care for elderly parents, while raising children. I have been in that situation and so have other people I have known. It is not an easy task.

The teens are learning the various stages of child development through the care of children at different ages. I made sure I took child development courses in college along with my major courses, because I wanted to know about the subject before I chose to have children. My daughters, one in college and one in high school, are also planning to or are taking child development courses. Any knowledge is helpful when navigating the unknown waters of parenting.

I have also worked with parents of young children and have had parents speak to me in that manner. It is not that the parents are being snotty, they are speaking in that manner out of love for their child. If you see where the parent is coming from then it is more easily understood.

Some teens are going to react badly and some are going to react better to a given situation. Some people handle criticism better than others.

This is all edited for maximum drama, so keep that in mind.

[–] b_michelle718 16 years ago

I agree completely, Alecia thinks that having her own child would be different but in reality all babies are mostly the same they cry, sleep, poop, and cry sleep poop again. Obviously with her behaving like that she is not responsible enough. Why don't they learn to wait a while longer? They have their whole life ahead of them to do their own thing so that when they do have a baby atleast they wouldn't have so much of a burden. It seems that having a baby young is a trend these days... i hope that all teenagers can open their eyes a little and realize the responsibility and the job it takes to have one.

[–] KricketSC80 16 years ago

As far as the blonde mom coming over...well...I didn't really like her anyway. I didn't like when she said she had Such potential...but had kids instead. SO...Why didn't she quit having babies ...(that 6 month old baby girl is the youngest of their children)...and go use her "potential"...if she felt so "cheated". She was on a talk show...and said she got pregnant on Purpose when she was so young...(what ever ThaT means) But why hasn't she Stopped getting pregnant?

Because that was her choice in life, several mothers who got pregnant at a young age being 17 to early 20's wonder what there lives would have been like if they had children a little later in life, but are happy being what they are and don't regret it. I think the blonde mom was trying to tell Kelsea (or whatever her name is) that she saw a lot of her young self in the teen and nothing more.

I could NOT believe that blonde mom was back with another kid. (I felt sorry for the teen) So ...that mom has a 6 month old AND a 2 year old?! In all honesty...I wouldn't be surprised if she was Not potty training her little guy at home at all...but just told the teens she was...so the teen could potty train him...lol If the mom already has one baby at 6 months in diapers... what's the biG deal of having 2 in diapers. It's a lot less stressful than cleaning poop-N-puddles all day. And a lot easier to potty train them when they can actually understand ...like closer to 3...(especially boys)...and can be excited about sticker rewards and pick out their own fun "cartoon" underwear. They have "motivation". Seriously...what does it matter if it's age 3 instead of 2...Does AnyOne actually start kindergarten who Isn't potty trained... lol

Actually coming from a mother of a 5 yr old I started potty training my son at 2 yrs of age also, children that young do understand the concept if you must know and most doctors agree that starting there will get them out of diapers faster. It can take up to a year to potty train a boy so by the time he is 3 like my son was he was potty trained completely. Secondly if you must know diapers cost a freakin' fortune and if you have 2 in diapers its usually nice to have one attempting or out of diapers. Besides these are her children and she has every right as most mothers do to raise the children they want to.

But when that blonde mom came huffing over to the house to fuss at the teens for not having the 6 month old in jammies... that was ridiculous! Does she really think a 6 month old knows the difference in a play outfit...from pjs. They don't. So for her to tear into the teen was just mean. I wonder if that couple has another kid at home...that they'll be leaving with those teens.

I'm sorry but most parents know a child that young doesn't understand the concept of jammies and play outfits, but most parents would like there child in night clothes when they go to bed since its usually part of a schedule that most parents start their child in. I never have let my child sleep in the clothes he and she had worn the day. What upset the mother was the teens didn't even check her diaper OR give the child a bath the entire time she was there the first day which would piss off any parent including myself and husband. She was giving the teen couple corrective critism plain and simple which is part of the show to understand what it is like to be a parent and the reponsiblilities that come with it.

Once you have children you might think differently since from what I can see in most of your posts you act out against the parents and not the teens as if it they are critizing you and not the teen couples on the show, so I'm going to assume that you are not a parent. I was a daycare teacher before hand and babysitter and I thought I knew everything when it came to children, but guess what when you have kids of your own its a major wake up call from that. IF you think you can do better then these teens or the parents of these children maybe join the show and see how you fair then maybe you won't be so judgmental of the parents! Also I think Alicea needed to calm down a bit she was acting childish after the mother came over just b/c you don't like what someone tells you doesn't mean you ignore your responsiblities you bite the bullet and keep on going that is what adults do when you enter the adult world and if she wants to be a parent she better be able to take critism!

Also to something from your previous post, I hate to tell you that yes a newborn sleeps most of the time for 2 weeks, but usually that sleep pattern is about an 1 hr to an 1 1/2 hrs, so looking at it and cuddling it yes does happen, but most of the time you are too exhausted from every 2 hr feedings to care and just want to sleep yourself thats why most new parents look like the walking dead.

http://somewhereinhereyes.blogspot.com/

[–] joeykeo 16 years ago

When I was a baby my mom put rum on my gums to help with the teething. (someone earlier asked for suggestions or complained that the mother didn't offer any)

I think the parents had every right to come over and say what they said.

I think that the parents should have been kinder to Cory because he really stepped u when Alicia freaked. I think these kids ned to learn to take criticism and that because some one gives advice it doesn't mean they think you are stupid, They are trying to help.

Jo

[–] starline 16 years ago

The mom could have suggested a damp frozen wash rag to chew on... That would have even been something available in the teen couple's house.

Or terry cloth toy...a baby toothbrush...chilled rubber teething ring or chilled teething biscuit. :)

Didn't the mom send Any of that stuff? She didn't suggest anything but Orajel.

This is all edited for maximum drama, so keep that in mind.

That’s SO true! lol Reality tv isn’t always as “real” as they imply it to be.

Some teens are going to react badly and some are going to react better to a given situation

True...and the same can be said about adults.

Some have made the point that when the teens signed on...that they knew the parents would be critical of them. Well... the same can be said of the parents. When they signed on...they should have realized that these teens would not be as capable as themselves...as experienced parents. So...they shouldn’t “react” in a ticked off manner towards the teens...What does that help AnyOne? The moms did Not get what they wanted...instead the teens "shut down".

Like I’ve said... my complaint was the way the moms addressed the problem... not so much that they spoke to the teens at all. I had no problem with the parents marching over to the house and giving the teens suggestions... it’s just they way those 2 moms I mentioned... did it. Again the black dad was a perfect example of How to confront a problem. He was tactful and understanding... he actually made things “calmer”.

Typically before you criticize someone...it’s best to start with a compliment. Or like the dad did...understanding what it must be like for the teens dealing with this all New experience.

And yep...I also said I think you should Pick You Battles...and I’m not sure jammies are a ”crisis”.

I still think they did the potty training bit for “good tv”...because that 2 year old seemed totally clueless... like this was the first He heard about it... lol

Yes...I have kids...3 boys all 2 years apart...and I did wait till they were 3-ish to potty train...and bought the stickers and the cartoon underpants... and it took about a week to potty train them. I’m shocked it would take a whole Year to potty train a 2 year old. I’m SO glad I waited! My guys all started pre-school around age 3...mostly for socializing...and never had any accidents. :)

(And just to say...No...I wasn't a teen mom...Closer to 30 and a stay-at-home mom)

So...yes... I know how newborns are too. My point was ...how in love you are with your brand new baby...that’s a strong bond that makes parenthood easier. These teens don’t have that advantage with these stranger’s children.

I also put my kids in jammies too...and of course they always had baths each day...(sometimes more depending how messy they might get lol). So again...if the blonde mom wanted to tell the teens about the pjs ...that’s fine... but it was the way she “delivered” her instructions...confrontationally. (And I'm sure the teens changed the baby's diaper at some point...they just didn't edit it into the episode)

But seriously... the blonde mom putting her babies on a tv show where they were kept apart from their parents for 30 hours...staying with teenage strangers...is way more “harmful” than the child not being in pjs One night. It was the teens First day parenting Ever...and yes there was definitely need for improvement...but the teens did nothing life-threatening. (The emergency nanny would see to that) And ...yes the mom had every right to visit and try to correct the situation...but she came over mad...and acted mad towards the insecure frustrated teens. That wasn’t really “helpful”.

About the elderly people...The series is to show teens how difficult it is to raise a baby...It’s called Baby Borrowers. It’s to try to encourage them to wait till they’re older...before becoming a parent. I would have preferred for the Whole series to be about raising little ones. I would have preferred for the series to have remained a bit more “realistic”. Teens will probably Never be responsible for a 70...80 year old. I think it’s silly for them to put old people “acting” crotchety on the show. What’s that suppose to encourage the teens to do? I would hope by the time these teens turn 50... they might have the sensibility to take care of their aged parents...if need be.

The old people “acting” ...seems to be about making “good tv”...funny reality tv stuff. Same with the teenagers...because it’s not like the teenagers or the old people will “listen” to the teens...or respect AnyThing the teen-couples will say. The teen-couples already Know teens can be jerky... lol So what’s the point...other than to show the teen couples how jerky old people can be. Why teach them that...So the teens will plan ahead to put their parents in a rest home? The series shoulda just stuck with the little kids. :)

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] mulika112 16 years ago

I completely agree. All of these girls are proving themselves to be bigger babies than the babies they are caring for. If I was any of their mothers, I'd slap them if they even thought about getting pregnant again.

I dont know what a hollaback girl is, all I know is I want her dead. -Brian Griffin

[–] starline 16 years ago

That IS true...

I would definitely be embarrassed by Most of these teens' behavior. Starting with the girl throwing a fit over wearing the tummy!

I can't wait to see tomorrow night with the "pre-teens"...I would totally be embarrassed by that screaming girl's behavior too. Being called a pre-teen means she's a little too old for "toddler" behavior like ThaT. Do you think she was told to "act"?

But...rmcrae...Why does my post make you so mad? I'm just saying I can see the situation from both sides.

I'm Not saying that a mom shouldn't react strongly to a Paid Professional... if they were not taking appropriate care of a child...a parent Should! Maybe even fire them... but these moms put their baby on a Reality Show... for Money...as guinea pigs... so they can't expect perfection from inexperienced teens.

I'm just saying the mom could have treated the situation a little more with "kid gloves" ... considering she was talking To Kids.

I do wonder since most of my previous post was about the blonde mom... and jammies and potty training...why do you make it sound like I was talking about alicea...

ARE you Carson's mom are something? Seriously...since you have such disdain for Alicea...some girl on a reality tv show who has been edited for drama... someone that we'll never see or hear of again.

Why so much defense for that mom? Just because she's an adult...and a mom... doesn't mean she can't do things better or differently herself. Like learn how to react calmly...and productively.

I still wonder why NO teething tips from her...and WHY she said Carson is Never Held?

Alicea may have called the child a brat... which was NOT right...I personally don't like cussing either...but I don't think she was "neglectful"... or we would have seen the nanny step in. I did see total frustration from alicea... but she WAS taking care of carson...trying to handle his fussiness... (probably because of the teething...AND him missing his mom)...but Alicea WAS holding on to Carson and giving him formula the night the mom stomped over...and got in-her-face. So Yes...after that, Alicea did shut down and Cory had to take over. A LoT of teens would react like that... "forget this"... why would you expect a teen to act like a responsible adult? That's the Whole point of the show...how teens are Not mature and ready for parenthood. (How old are these kids 17? Fortunately not all teens are quite this unpleasant and irresponsible) Yet, even though Cory came thru...and really did act as the responsible one... the negative mom couldn't say One positive thing to Cory.

But...WHERE did I say Alicea Should be a mom... and Now? I didn't. I think Alicea has a lot of maturing to do before she can be responsible for AnyThing ... a job, a marriage... a Dog. lol

Generally...I think ALL the teens Should wait to become pregnant... NONE of them should become parents Now... not even the ones who did "okay". Teens Everywhere should Wait...(unless already pregnant and it means abortion. Then I'd hope for the teens to marry...Or put the baby up for adoption... Or for the teen's family to help raise the baby)

But about Alicea... she did fine with the second little boy she got... so if that child had been the First we saw alicea with...you might have a completely different opinion of Alicea.

Carson's mom is gonna have troubles with Carson as he grows up...if she herself doesn't learn how to handle stressful situations a little more tactfully... with a bit more of an open mind.

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

sometimes softpedaling the situation is the worst thing that you can do particularly with teenagers, and there are few situations with higher stakes than bringing a child into the world and these teenagers think they are ready to do that.

in those cases where the teenagers flipped out on the actual moms do you really think constructive, strength based criticism would have had ANY effect whatsoever? i don't.

the entire purpose of this show is to put a mirror in front of these children and yes most of them are acting like children (although the boys are far more mature than the girls when it comes to parenting as a group) and the mother's that have been somewhat harsh, i'd argue, have a better understanding of what's at stake than the parents who took the softer approach. particularly the single mother, the odds are that if the girls got pregnant, not every guy would stick around for that. and as a single parent you don't get to freak out, walk out or take a break. that mom wasn't out of line in any way shape or form in my opinion, she was doing exactly what needed to be done.

the teenagers who got only strength based criticism are less likely to rethink their decisions.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] starline 16 years ago

WHERE did I DENY that alicea was not the best match for that baby...or she couldn't use improvement...or wasn't immature... or wasn't frustrated and simply "shut down"... or wasn’t stubborn...or was ready for parenthood...

Alicea's attitude on the lumber job wasn't much better... she definitely needs an adjustment in attitude!

(But it Was nice to see a different side of her last week with the adorable 3 year old)

I also think Morgan is not doing very well herself....dragging the child... not cleaning him well...or cleaning the bottles ...or cleaning after the party. Plus she was SO disrespectful to her own mom!

Kelsey "shut down" that first week too. Making boyfriend miss work...yet she didn't go either.

Kelly started off with the worse attitude...refusing to wear the tummy. And then leaving the twins unattended... when Austin was showering...endangering the twins...so she could go next door to complain. And after the nanny talks to Austin...and he tells Kelly... Kelly... the girl who threw a tantrum about the tummy...tells him to Get Over it....not saying she's Sorry...even though he had been SO understanding about the tummy thing. And even though the boys could have got Hurt. She has some growing up to do too.

And Sasha was Very disrespectful ... (and Jordon too)...to their last baby's mom... when the mom tried to tell Sasha how bad things had gone... and how upsetting it was ...as the mother... to watch. Sasha and Jordon told that mom to just Get Out!

What if that had been Sasha’s First child to watch... the First week...people would have a totally different opinion of her.

I really don't know why you can't see what I'm saying. Seriously you seem SO blinded by your disdain for Alicea... you obviously can Not see what I'm saying.

Both alicea AND Carson's mom...went into the show knowing things could be hectic! Carson's mom put her own baby thru this tv experiment For Money. Why is alicea any Worse than the mom?

Again... I can't help BUT wonder if you ARE carson's mom.

(Which...Oops...technically it's Karson...to (I guess) match mommy's name Kristy)

You say...Forget Carson's mom...well no...Carson's mom was an important factor for a situation that went from bad to worse. Carson's mom could have made a difference and made things better...but she didn't...and she didn't even share anything of value with the girl about feeding carson...or teething tips.

In fact...it was funny...odd funny... Because when Carson’s mom went over and was scolding Alicea...not Once did Carson seem to want to go to his own mommy. He did Not reach out for his mom...or cry for his mom...or show any interest when she left. He seemed perfectly content being with alicea. Carson and mommy didn’t seem to have much of a “connection”...(but then the mother DID say she Never holds him).

This mom seemed to have "attitude" herself...before she even left Carson with alicea.

Alicea WAS trying... she was not avoiding the baby...she's just wasn't successful and was getting very frustrated.

It's funny because the mom said the baby can sense frustration... yet the mom could have cared less about the teen’s frustration....She could have helped alicea calm down.

But when Carson's mom came to the house...she had a very snippy demeanor...and with her confrontational body language... Hands-on-Hips... ordered ...You Gonna Feed Him...and when alicea said she had tried and wasn't having any luck...the mom said Very Snottily...That's because Alicea had been holding him...and Carson is NEVER held...

Which I don't understand that statement about a 7 month old. Never Held?

But that wasn't true anyway...Alicea HAD tried feeding him IN the high chair... and she failed there too. The mom said it was because Carosn was “playful”…which he didn’t LOOK very playful…he looked sad and miserable…like a Teething baby does. The mom was Not helpful but only confrontational... which made alicea "shut down". Immature of alicea YES...but if someone had treated that mother the same way...I'm sure the mom's reaction would not have been pleasant either.

Both alicea and Carson's mom could use attitude adjustments.

It'll be interesting to see how things go tonight. :)

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] starline 16 years ago

Dear, I'm nobody's mother because I'm 21 and not ready to have children.

And...So? Did someone think you were a mom? *confused*

Ohhh...I get it...cause I asked you if you were Carson's mom... lol

You just seem defense very of her...Carson's mom... and dislike alicea SO Much.

I have commented on the other teens on other threads, but I'm talking about Alecia on THIS thread.

THIS thread is about...

Just an observation from a 40 year old mother of 3 children: 17 years old, 11 years old, and a 7 year old. Personally, I think some of the parents that are "observing" from their close circuit TV's are a little harsh on these teenagers. These parents expect them to be anticipating and managing stressful situations that take YEARS to manage.

NOT necessarily about Alicea.

So...what DO you think about Sasha...because after Sasha's outburst last week...and her Very Rude behavior to the mom...I think Sasha is the Worst teen.

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

what interests me about your viewpoint starline is this, you've stated that the teen mother wasn't WELL MATCHED with the infant, as a parent you DON'T GET TO CHOOSE and as a family therapist with court appointed clients who've physically abused or neglected their children i can tell you exactly what happens when girls like these become mothers and you won't like it. most of my court appointed clients had their first child by 18 or 19 years old and thought they had all the answers just like the girls on this show and their children have paid an unbelievably horrific price.

the real mothers with two exceptions haven't been blunt enough, you can argue style of criticism all you want but a headstrong teenager particularly the two or three who've had tantrums themselves don't need the mothers to back off and play nice, they need brutal truth.

the two who've blown up at the real mothers and the one who had an actual tantrum and refused to wear the belly are in no way shape or form ready to be parents and that's EXACTLY what they need to be told.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] starline 16 years ago

I'm sorry. I did say baby...but I meant was not a good match Period...as in with the "real" mom. I had the "mom" on my mind. :)

As you may have guessed by now...lol...I DO think if the mother had been different...that whole episode may have gone differently... and alicea and Carson ...and the mom...may have ended on friendlier terms.

Alicea proved again tonight...that with a little understanding and kindness from the "adults"...she can reflect that same kindness and understanding on to the children.

As I see it...this show isn't suppose to just discourage the teens...but to be a productive learning experience too.

i can tell you exactly what happens when girls like these become mothers and you won't like it.

I won't like it? Is that for Me? Again...did I say ANY of these teens should become parents?!

the two who've blown up at the real mothers

I think I musta have missed one...because the only one I saw "blow-up" was Sasha.

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

your focus appears to me to be solely on the experience for the teenagers rather than the well being of the child both real and imagined in the minds of these girls.

obviously my focus is different because i'm looking down the road to the parents these people hope to become and the life that child will have and to be brutally honest any of the three that i've mentioned could easily be the parents i've got on my current caseload, the only difference (and it's not of course insignificant- is that these teenagers all appear to be from at least a comfortable economic background) but in attitude and ability to handle the stress of a child i could close my eyes and hear the same attitude from the clients who've had their children removed by the state for abuse or neglect.

because of my profession i couldn't possibly care less for the egos of these teenagers (you obviously do) i'm looking at the potential well being of the children they are caring for and those they plan to have sooner rather than later.

and again you very often as a parent don't get to choose who you're stuck dealing with, there's going to be another parent or a teacher or some other service provider that you're going to clash with, it's inevitable and if these girls cannot handle criticism in any form, even bad (although i don't think any of the criticism was at all out of line) with some shred of maturity they have no business even considering becoming a parent.

i'd rather the mothers do exactly what the one you seem to have a major problem with than coddle these teenagers, it's the kids who'll pay the price. a bruised ego does not call for a screaming match or profanity, walking out or giving up.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] starline 16 years ago

Oops...double post.

[–] krisluvkev 16 years ago

It's a tv show so we have to remeber that it's played up in order to keep it interesting. No one really expects the teen parents to be perfect or even good if they were there wouldn't be a show or an audience to watch the show.
But teens today need to see a little unreality in their reality tv shows especially the dippy ones that that think having a baby is soooooooo cute and fun.
And now that Jaime lynn Spears has come out saying how great being a mom is it's not surprising that so many teenies are believing that having a baby is fun and cute. Hopefully watching this show will help them understand what you are saying that being a mom is a learning experience and takes time, pacience, and some maturity.

[–] Stellrmn 16 years ago

here here

Reeves : Superman :: Tennant : Doctor Who

[–] achope246 16 years ago

I'm still annoyed by the comment about the baby not knowing the difference between PJs and regular clothes. Would YOU be comfortable trying to sleep in denim shorts and a cute little frilly shirt??

Don't even get me started on the other comments because I agree with a lot of the other posters, so I don't need to restate my opinions.

[–] joeykeo 16 years ago

I agree with the poster who said all these teens went into it (with the exception of Sean) that they want to have babies and think they are ready. I think the arents should be harsh because with most teens if you start by giving a compliment or if you criticize but in a way that doesn't seem like criticism. They will focus on the positive parts and forget the negative. SO will look at it as a good overall experience rather than maybe they should have done better.

I don't think any of the parents have been out of line. The mother complaining about the pjs came over early because her baby was, in her opinion, being neglected. Seth's mother this episode came at the end to complain about the teeth brushing (or lack of) that was her choice. Had she gone over at 11 pm and said get out of that tent its bed tie and he needs to brush his teeth I wouldn't have thought she was out of line at all.

Jo

[–] starline 16 years ago

achope246...Restate your opinions? Did you post 'em on this thread?

First off...I said the jammies were not a Crisis. So the mom could have spoken to the teens less confrontationally...since it was Not a Crisis.

The baby did NOT have on denim shorts and a frilly top...it was a red check outfit. Not ThaT different from pjs.

Of course pjs would have been better...but the teen-couple ...who this was their First day of parenthood Ever...were not as organized as the experienced mom with a couple kids. The mom could have explained things with less annoyance.

What have I said that is SO hard to swallow...that an adult should use tact?! That has been my point all along.

Are you guys saying adults should Not use tact? Seriously?

How else will young people learn how to treat others...if adults won’t use tact themselves...especially in a stressful situation?

I’m a strong believer in the golden rule...and that would include tact, understanding and patience. Like the rule says ...how I would like to be treated.

So...I think people should generally try to use tact in all situations...not just on this show... not just with these teens. I suppose tact is a “skill”... but if a person normally does use tact...with spouses, in-laws, co-workers, customers, strangers, etc etc ...then it would come naturally... even in stressful situations.

I also believe ...you get more flies with honey than vinegar... :)

That black dad is a perfect example of how to get your point across in a non-confrontational way...which...since he was SO sincere, patient and understanding in the way he explained things... he himself got what he wanted...the kids listened to him...and took care of things... like he suggested.

The 2 other moms went into the house with attitude... talked down to the kids... and did Not necessarily get what they wanted.

To the poster who thinks these teens should be treated with a strong arm...you may have a point in your line of work...I'm sure it's Very hard to see such ugliness...such sadness everyday! But for these tv teens... I don't think a harsh approach should be used till after trying a more understanding approach First.

IF the mom had come over and treated the teens more sincerely...and the teens still did Not take care of her concerns...then I can see a stronger approach.

No...I’m not concerned about the teen’s feelings... per say...or "egos"... (and adults can have inflated egos too)...But if the bottom line is the babies' care...then I would Especially try to explain calmly what the teens needed to do for my child...so the teens would actually listen, learn and respond properly.

I just saw those 2 moms dealing with an already over stressed situation... in a Negative way.

(Wait till those 2 moms have teens themselves!)

But I think some teens on the show have done worse things than no jammies...

Sasha’s behavior towards that mom was Horrible! If this show has a reunion at the end...she needs to Publicly apologize to that mom that she treated SO rudely!

Watching Sasha scold a baby not yet 2 ...for acting like a “baby”...proved Sasha doesn’t know it all...like she Thinks she does.

I was also Appalled that Kelly left the house...(to go whine next door)...when Austin was in the shower...leaving the twins alone Unattended. Technically the nanny should have scolded Kelly for leaving... but when Austin told Kelly what happened...Kelly shrugged it off as no biggie... Get over it. That could have been a dangerous situation.

Another thing that had concerned me...was some big white thing in baby Miley's mouth when Morgan was holding her...and Miley was Crying. Not sure What it was... but Choking came to mind. I would have taken it out of her mouth... Whatever it was. Morgan dragging the little boy Colton...by one arm ...was Not a good move either.

Personally watching the behavior of the little girl with Cory and alicea last night...makes me think the mom at home is not raising the child “right”. The child does act out for attention... to get her way... and should be ignored in that situation. Or time out. Cory did an excellent job of parenting last night... yet the mom implied she wouldn’t even try to reason with a 7 year old. Maybe the mom needs some parenting classes herself.

The 3 boys were ill behaved too...I have 3 boys myself...all 2 years apart...and they would Never act like that...in my home or anyone else’s. Ripping up grass and slinging mud at the fence...I wonder how they act at school.

The vegetarian family...the parents and their boys... were a bit judgmental too.

I did think it was a nice moment...when the father of the 9 year old girl told Jordan...that he...the dad...had learned something from watching teen Jordan.

The thing about parenting is... you could get a room full of experienced parents all in one room...and they would probably all have different approaches to parenting. Although it wouldn’t necessarily make one approach better than the other. Parenthood IS an ongoing learning experience for parents. But if there’s Love...and Respect in the home...in the family...for Everyone...hopefully everything else will turn out alright. :)

[–] achope246 16 years ago

achope246...Restate your opinions? Did you post 'em on this thread?

First off...I said the jammies were not a Crisis. So the mom could have spoken to the teens less confrontationally...since it was Not a Crisis.

I should have said I don't need to restate THEIR opinions, to make it easier to understand what I meant.

As far as the PJs, it may have been a "crisis" to them. The other parents aren't necessarily seeing how the other teens are handling the other babies/kids, so they don't know what's going on in the other situations.

I agree with all your other opinions in your latest post beyond that one, though!

Just out of curiosity, are you a parent? If so, what are their ages? I'm not trying to be confrontational or looking for something negative to say. It just makes me wonder the age and experience level of some of the posters on this board...

[–] starline 16 years ago

As far as the PJs, it may have been a "crisis" to them. The other parents aren't necessarily seeing how the other teens are handling the other babies/kids, so they don't know what's going on in the other situations.

I'm not sure what seeing the other teens handling other babies has to do with anything...

But yes...I think the parents may know what's going on...because a few times...the parents have commented on they saw other teens with kids.

I agree with all your other opinions in your latest post beyond that one, though!

What have I previously said...other than about the jammies...that is SO upsetting to you? If you agree Now...maybe you should re-read All my post in this thread... because they All say the same thing... exactly what my last post said.

Just out of curiosity, are you a parent? If so, what are their ages? I'm not trying to be confrontational or looking for something negative to say. It just makes me wonder the age and experience level of some of the posters on this board...

I get the point from your previous hostile post to me...that you think you're more mature than me and know more than me...

Do I sound immature and clueless by saying adults need to use tact? Or by saying the parents should try addressing the teenagers in a way that might be helpful? Just because I can understand how the frustrated insecure teens may feel...makes me immature and clueless in your eyes?

I'm not sure why you ask if I'm a parent...because as I Just mentioned in my above post...(and before in the thread too)... I have 3 boys all 2 years apart...They're now 26, 24 and one soon to be 22. Just so you'll know...I was married at 24...and had my first son when I was almost 29...

I'm Not clueless...I DO know what I'm talking about.

Now...tell me about You. What makes you the "expert"?

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

your posts don't read as immature but they do read as out of touch. and your approach assumes the best of the teen parents and while that's a lovely sentiment it is not putting the safety and well being of the children first.

honestly would you be at all comfortable leaving your children when they were children with these teen parents, particularly the ones who've gone off the deep end at some mildly harsh but completely true criticism if you didn't KNOW that there were qualified nannies and cameras in the home? and do you honestly believe that if these girls had babies in the next two years or so that they'd be capable parents?

i wouldn't even consider allowing those parents to babysit let alone care for a child for three days without the protections the show has in place and i don't believe that any of them are ready to be parents and the key point that many of us are making and you seem to be ignoring completely is that these girls ALL think they are ready right now and more than capable of parenting. THEY AREN'T and need to be told that they aren't.

tact as you put it will very likely go in one ear and out the other. brutal truth might at least get them to think.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] achope246 16 years ago

starline, I don't understand why you think I'm being the hostile one. THe only thing I have done was try to make you understand where the parents were coming from regarding the PJs. It may not be a big deal to you, but obviously it was to them.

As far as rereading your posts, I don't need to, because I said I have agreed with some of the things you have said. (I do think you defend the teens a little too much, though.) Maybe I missed the part about the ages of your children, etc, because your posts are so long I was skimming by that point.

I also mentioned I wasn't trying to be confrontational about asking if you had kids. I was just curious, because for the most part, you seem to know what you are talking about. I just thought maybe YOU had a confrontational personality that seems to be more of a "teen" thing.

I never claimed to be an expert at child rearing. I just know what I would and wouldn't do as far as my children are concerned, and one of the minor things would be having them sleep in different/more comfy clothes than the ones she wore all day. I am big on routine, and our bedtime routine is bath, PJs, brush teeth, read books. My girls are 2 and a half and 7, and I am a stay-at-home Mom. I am 31 and I have a college degree in the medical field, but I've not worked outside of our home since my first was born.

Every parent is different, so I guess things that matter to some don't matter to others.

[–] starline 16 years ago

achope246 ...I'm sorry if I sounded ticked off...I guess I was getting a little frustrated. :)

I can't help but feel a bit "ganged up against" ...lol

Bailey...

read as out of touch. and your approach assumes the best

Out of touch? Maybe you just assume the Worst. Maybe we have such an aggressive, thoughtless world today... with angry selfish people that would even hurt kids...because people don't witness something so simple as manners, kindness and tact any more.

So... Your answer is... forget all that ...manners, kindness and tact...and just talk down to people? Loud and demanding.

Can a person NOT tell someone the "brutal truth" in a calm way... a non confrontational way?

Which way do you think the average person would Actually Listen to suggestions...and allow them to seep in? Someone talking down to them...or someone talking calmly to them? Seriously...Talking down to AnyOne will only have them thinkin' about How they were talked Down to...not about what they were suppose to learn.

I'm sorry you see so many terrible cases in your line of work...but EveryOne is NOT bad...and people...all ages...can be talked to kindly...maybe you forget that.

As someone said someplace else...

Quoting..."In general, I'd like to go further and say: bullying rarely works, asking nicely often does wonders."

and do you honestly believe that if these girls had babies in the next two years or so that they'd be capable parents?

I DO find it SO surprising that you keep addressing me like I think it's a good idea for these kids to start a family...when I have said ...More than Once...that they are immature and it's Not a good idea for ANY teen to have a child.

would you be at all comfortable leaving your children when they were children with these teen parents, particularly the ones who've gone off the deep end at some mildly harsh but completely true criticism if you didn't KNOW that there were qualified nannies and cameras in the home?

No cameras or No nannies... like this show DID provide for these parents ... which I'm sure this series checked out these teens...and tried it's Best to pick teens that they felt would Not abuse, hit, or harm the children...because NBC does not want lawsuits on their hands from injured or dead children...

But to answer your question...In a day-to-day situation...I would have never left my kids with a STRANGER. I was fortunate enough to be a stay-at-home mom...so I never had to leave my kids with day care...or the such. When they were 3-ish they started going to pre-school like 3 mornings a week... mostly for socializing. That was as close as they came to a "stranger" watching them.

I would Not have put my babies on this show. Preteens and teens (for the teen-couples' children) is another story... maybe I would have...but the casting crew wouldn't have wanted my kids...because my boys were well behaved... and the show obviously wanted "good tv" with some craziness.

But in all fairness...in "real" life...if I saw alicea with the toddler and the "pre-teens"...I would think she is most capable to watch my kids. Even with a baby like Carson... with a cell phone and constant contact...things probably would have been alright. And MORE teething suggestions. Although I'm sure I would have had alicea over to my house... so she could get to know the baby with me there... First...probably at least a Couple times... And babysitting in my own home around baby's things... I'm sure things would have gone (at least a bit) better.

So...please tell me about your experience as a mom...and how old are Your kids?

[–] achope246 16 years ago

starline, I was editing my post (while you were posting) to shorten it so I could write about myself - in case you care to go back and read it. Not to offend you about your age or anything (lol), but you could look at things more like my mom. She thinks some of the things I make my kids do or won't let them do are over the top.

[–] starline 16 years ago

Ahhh...Thanx for sharing. Seven and two are FuN ages. :)

Nothing wrong with Routines...and your bedtime routine sounds Perfect... :)

I always Loved reading to my kids too. Our library had storytime ...that we went to every week...and would come home with an arm load of books...some with the most incredible artwork! :)

(My "boys" are Still avid readers to this day :0) )

But...as all my post said...lol... I was just saying how sometimes things get off schedule...like pjs ...and it's not a crisis. And things may have turned out differently...(like kelsey not shutting down, getting sick from insecurity, and making Sean miss work)...if the mom hadn't acted so disgusted with the teens... but used a calmly understanding approach to help the teens get back on track. Know what I mean... lol

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

not that you'll welcome my jumping in but i think your approach would be great and necessary if these teens were already parents and it is how i approach teen parents but they are not and the point as far as i'm concerned is not to simply improve the teens parenting skills but to show them that they are not ready.

what i'd like is for these kids to leave the show, knowing they aren't ready and spend the next few years getting ready, gaining experience, figuring out who they are and their relationships.

i most definitely do not want these kids so bolstered by this experience which is what would certainly happen if all the parents were positive in their critiques that they try to start a family in the near future.

this show is not a parenting class, it's a reality check.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] bailey96 16 years ago

i'm not trying to be hostile either and i've mentioned that i'm a family therapist with quite a few court ordered clients all of whom have either abused or neglected their children and all of them started having children in their teens and all of them think or thought that they have all the answers.

i don't deny for a second that i'm looking at the worst possible outcome because i've seen it, and i'm NOT willing to overlook their issues and hope for the best, i see it every day, it is my job to work with parents who've abused and neglected and with the victims. and i'm picking up the pieces.

i'm not sure why my position is so difficult to understand. yes some of my clients have significant deficits or addictions that greatly impact their ability to parent but i've got others who were simply too young, too arrogant, to self involved, impatient with a low tolerance for frustration and thought that parenting would be fun and yes it very often is fun and wonderful but it can also be terrifying and frustrating and incredibly hard and the one thing that you absolutely do have to do when you bring a child into the world is put your own bloody ego aside and these girls flipping out because they feel they've been insulted offends me. if they thought that mothers were lying or exaggerating or abusing them that's one thing but from what i've seen their reactions have been ego driven nothing more. and as such i'm not at all inclined to stroke their overblown egos.

and i do think it's completely ridiculous to compare the actual mothers comments to bullying. they did nothing of the sort.

being normal is not necessarily a virtue... It rather denotes a lack of courage!

[–] uirisg_halfling 16 years ago

I agree with the original poster...I'm a fairly new mom. My son is 4 and i still get the "am i really ready for this" thoughts and i'm also still learning. Parenting is partialy about learning. That mom was just thinking about the cameras, i heard the tone in her voice and it was rude, condescending and haughty. There are so many ways better to approach a teenager or anybody for that matter.

"...So rip off our halos & pull out our pitchforks..."