MovieChat Forums > Üç Maymun (2008) Discussion > MAJOR SPOILERS: Questions I have.... abo...

MAJOR SPOILERS: Questions I have.... about a character in the film.

posted 15 years ago by DogtownGirl
15 replies | jump to latest

SPOILERS AHEAD ..... SPOILERS AHEAD ...... SPOILERS AHEAD ......

What was the significance of the dead, battered younger brother of Ismail, returned TWICE as a ghost-like presence in the film?

How did he die?

Did dad batter him?

First he confronts Ismail, calling him "brother" as if awakening Ismail out of a restless slumber, all dripping with what looked like honey, after having been beaten about the face (by Dad?), then later on in the movie, after Pops gets sprung from the joint, wraps his arm around him, as Dad is laying in bed intensely ruminating, and likely regretting what life has wrought him.

Any guesses to to why this ghost-like presence was even brought into the film, what the boy died of, or .... any other thoughts?

Thanks!

[–] Emreka 15 years ago

I had the impression that he was drowned. But I dont think it's very important how exactly he died. At first it seemed pretty irrelevant the boy haunting them, however, loss of a young son explains a lot about the blues in the family, you know how families never fully recover after something like that. But I still and did not like the "ghost-like" appearences of the boy, I think the grave visiting scene would work by itself.

[–] DogtownGirl 15 years ago

I think the grave visiting scene would work by itself.

Oh ... soooo, when the father and the elder son visited the grave, they were mourning the loss of the dead younger brother then? Huh ... I wasn't too clear why they were there.
There were a few non-sequitorial jumps back and forth in time, that kind of took me aback, in the movie.
I got the feeling that the director was after keeping us deliberately in the dark -- letting us know that this family was no different than any other insofar as that they all have 'dark' places and secrets that others are never meant to know.

so, you think the younger brother was drowned? Well, that would explain our first seeing him dripping with very viscuous water, wouldn't it? I mean, the liquid he was in was almost like ... honey!

But, if the kid was drowned then what would explain the battery about his eyes?

For some reason, I feel I need to know just HOW the youngster died!
I think he was beaten to death, as the father's temperment was amply shown to us in the film later on ... And, the dad was so short tempered with his elder son when shown "in the clink", too, wanting him not to quit school, etc., etc., etc.

[–] Emreka 15 years ago

wow I'm a terrible viewer. I just remember him being wet and dripping.

[–] DogtownGirl 15 years ago

Emreka,

Terrible Viewer? Nahhhh, I wouldn't say that.
I mean, no one can catch, or, see every little detail, correct?

What really got to me was the blackened eyes of the boy, indicating to me that someone had beaten him up, at some point in his life, maybe even shortly before he met his Maker? I always thought that the father, with his FIRE-brand temper, was behind the younger brother's murder / demise. That dad was not one to have won any good parenting award, to my mind. Also, the water dripping off of the boy looked to be especially viscous, and ooze-y. Even the sound effect of it dripping off of him, as the audience sees him, from the older brother's POV, was rather creepy, and ... well, resonant. I mean it really echoed, didn't you think? .

[–] comage 15 years ago

Didn't you guys notice that when the little brother appeared for the first time while Ismail was lying on the bed, and when the scene cuts to a closeup of Ismail peering at the doorway, the sweat bead on his forehead was flowing *upwards* back into his hairline?

It was almost like time going backwards when the little brother appear.

I'm not sure what that meant, but the theme of water recurs throughout this film:

- When the man was knocked down and Servet flees the scene of the crime, it begins raining.
- Servet and Eyup negotiated the deal beside the sea.
- Ismail gets a drink from the fridge, and spills water all over the kitchen floor.
- The first scene we see when Ismail picks up his father from the prison, his father takes a bottle of water and pours it all over his head to cleanse himself.
- At the last scene after Eyup negotiates with the kid who works in the teahouse (Bayram?), he stands on the rooftop and the rainclouds burst over him in a downpour.
- ... and several other scenes which I probably missed...

[–] AssetsonFire 15 years ago

I thought maybe the receding sweat was just to signify that he was regressing backwards, i.e. remembering his brother. Also, the first 'brother' scene cut directly to the graveside scene. During this the family poured water over the grave to clean eat, further implying that he drowned.

[–] DogtownGirl 15 years ago

Or, maybe they were really just cleaning off the head-stone .... Or, maybe blessing it with water? I don't think it was meant to signify what you thought it was.

[–] AssetsonFire 15 years ago

Of course they were cleaning the headstone. The subtly blatant symbolism of this cut and other references to water suggests more besides though. If not from drowning, what is your explanation for the 'honey' covering the son, or for the cause of his death? And where was the suggestion that father killed his son? His treatment of his wife was much more restrained could have been expected, and to include another implied murder would added nothing to the film, which was about the resurgence of grief over their son's death, not guilt.

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[–] javillol 15 years ago

I see that my original post, the one that made you reply like this, has been deleted, I am guessing at your request. I really don´t remember what I wrote, but I know for a fact that I am never disrespectful and I never insult, so I wonder what is it that I could have said that made you took the time to write and have somebody ban my post, and I cant help but think that your spread of tolerance is quite narrow.

I can´t apologise, because I don´t remember what I wrote. I must have written like 15 posts on this movie that day. So, if can be so kind to refresh my memory then I could make an apology or at least understand what is it that made you feel this way

[–] louisecracker 15 years ago

These scenes had me and my friend jumping and screaming in our seats.
I also think he was drowned (the dripping and eyes).

[–] jiemeic 15 years ago

Maybe when the little brother was around, it was the best times for the family... There was warmth and human touch etc. The father thought about the comfort of someone close and so he thought about the little brother??

In this movie, there's only one scene or so that we can see the father, the mother and the son in the same frame, which is really sad!!

[–] eris_herself 14 years ago

the dripping and the boy being naked suggests strongly he drowned while swimming (this happens relatively often at the bosphorus because of the chaotic currents). although it is possible, i don't think the boy was beaten to death by the father. there is nothing to suggest this in any of the characters' behaviour. also, the father's not especially violent. he is harsh, definitely, but he didn't beat up his wife or anything after he discovered about the cheating.

the drowned boy is one major character in this film. we could say that all the missing dialogue in the movie belongs to him. it's his silence. the silence provided by his death. all the members of the family are miserable, there is no trace of joy anywhere. the boy is practically evident in every single scene.

[–] DogtownGirl 14 years ago

Thank you for this, eris.

All the input is helpful to me. The first sighting of the boy took me aback.

-- I admire celebrities who muck in & get dirt under their "sport" manicures. Charity rules!