Isabel is a whore
True definition of a cheating whore
shareand then her husband conveniently kills himself so she can now leave with out guilt.
it seems a little to convenient.
MovieChat Forums > Ironclad (2011) Discussion > Isabel is a whore
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Yeah but her "husband's apetites don't include [her]" so she's bound to be a bit itchy and damn it James Purefoy's hot. ;)
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Total wench.
Back in that time period/place, she had EVERY WOMAN'S DREAM. A husband with no signs that we were given of physical abuse. The chance to out live him and become a wealthy widow with a SHOT of owning lands/titles in her own right, and there by determining her own destiny. Clean, well fed, well sheltered, lice free,free of phycical labor with time on her hands to think about art/culture/sewing/poetry. Come ON! She was living it up for the time period. Of course she has to be-moan this and go wanking.
>>>Back in that time period/place, she had EVERY WOMAN'S DREAM. A husband with no signs that we were given of physical abuse.
Hmm, yes, she didn't know how good she had it. Much as all of my victims that I didn't torture before beheading never really appreciated how lucky they were for the particular time and place of seven-in-the-evening in my cellar that they were living in.
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>>>most women tend to turn out to be whores, sad but true..
Unlike men, who are all lovely and models of sexual morality.
Obviously the lack of sex with her husband had made her horny as hell as she pestered and followed Marshal around for months until he would bone her. In the end he was like "OK I'll screw you, just quit bugging me".
shareTrue. All that "oh, I must treat your wounded neck", but she doesn't treat it at all, or even clean it effectively, just strokes it with a wet cloth. Actually she's a real medieval misogynist stereotype - Woman as Eve the Temptress, whom all honest men, and especially chaste monks, should flee like the devil (whose accomplice she is, of course).
share>>>Actually she's a real medieval misogynist stereotype - Woman as Eve the Temptress, whom all honest men, and especially chaste monks, should flee like the devil
Well, this would be arguable if the impression was given that the film actually meant us to think this for a second. Obviously it doesn't, and goes to some pains to depict Isobel as courageous, and to mitigate her dalliance with our hero, to the extent of depicting her husband as gay and therefore lacking an emotional stake in their marriage (implied to be a motivating factor in her interest in another man, the complete lack of significance in her husband's life). I think probably what is closer to a mediaeval stereotype is a thread entitled 'Isabel is a Whore'.
...nothing about the behaviour of the men in the film, or the fact that our hero not only commits adultery with Isobel, but additionally does so in contravention of his own holy vows. He's WAY worse than her if one wishes to be puritanical - unless one factors misogyny in, of course.
I disagree he's way worse than she is. She pursued him relentlessly the entire time even though he kept telling her his vows forbid it. Yes, she could tell he was attracted to her (duh) but it was pretty obvious he wanted to resist her. I don't even fault her for cheating on her husband because she was pretty much forced to marry him and he denied her sex......BUT the way she pressured Purefoy's character did not sit well with me.
She was made more sympathetic at the end when she fought alongside him, and when he revealed he had wanted her all along and abandoned his sword for her, so to speak. BUT his behavior before that clearly indicated he wanted her to leave him alone. She was too pushy. If a guy had behaved that way, women would be crying foul.
>>>I disagree he's way worse than she is.
Well, consider the 'wrongs' that are on the table here. She commits adultery, while he commits adultery AND breaks his vows AND betrays an ally and confederate by bedding the man's wife. In any meaningful sense his transgressions are greater than hers, not least because he's living at a time where he's assumed to be capable of greater moral responsibility than Isobel. On the other hand, the likelihood of his being burned as a witch if Isobel claims he used his wizardly powers to seduce her is a WHOLE lot smaller than would be the case vice versa.
>>>She pursued him relentlessly the entire time even though he kept telling her his vows forbid it.
Er..? Is this all you've got on her? She's hardly a sex pest - and the film carefully establishes that her betrayal of her husband is not a betrayal of a man who loves her, and by implication her wounding of him is reduced beyond the naturally empathetic. She's actually looking for what she wanted from her marriage, and we're initially shown her trying to be an active and involved wife
>>>it was pretty obvious he wanted to resist her.
Hmm. You know, I'd say it was pretty obvious that he wanted to resist King John, because he put up quite a spectacular fight in doing so. He didn't appear to put anything like the same vigor into fending off the five-feet-and-a-razor blade girl as she lay siege to him. If he couldn't be bothered to try fending off a tiny girl armed with a viscously sharp dress, and aggressively combed hair, I'm not really persuaded that he wanted to resist her very much. And I'm afraid, no matter how attractive a stranger is, if we shag them when they proposition us, WE are at fault more than they are for offering, because WE are responsible for our actions... no matter how tempting the offer was.
>>>I don't even fault her for cheating on her husband
Well if you're going to judge the character morally, then you should - because in the context of this story what she's doing is a major betrayal of her lord and master, not to mention a humiliation of the man.
>>>because she was pretty much forced to marry him and he denied her sex...
No, it wasn't just that she was unfulfilled in the bedroom. She's more of your Dorothea Brooke, trying to be involved in her husband's life but being met with a complete lack of interest.
>>>...BUT the way she pressured Purefoy's character did not sit well with me.
What pressure did she apply? Asking twice? Fluttering her eyelashes? Any person incapable of saying no when propositioned is saying a good deal more about their lack of self-control than they are saying about the person who did the asking.
>>>She was too pushy. If a guy had behaved that way, women would be crying foul.
Well, not in the middle-ages they wouldn't have. I take your point, that you feel Isabelle's behaviour is being given a free ride where it wouldn't have been considered acceptable behaviour from a man. I don't think you've successfully argued that however, as I'm completely unpersuaded.
Moreover, you should consider the context of this very thread. It's called 'Isabel is a whore', and began with the sentiment that Isabel is a bad person because she ditches a man who couldn't care less about her in favour of somebody with whom she's developed a relationship.
If you feel it's acceptable to argue that Isabel is a whore because she had extramarital sex (not saying you do, but you have posted on that side of the discussion on this thread, so be mindful of that), then we HAVE to apply the word 'whore' to soldier-boy as well. Two to Tango; what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander - however, the unpleasant side to this thread is that it's assumed that the female character can be denounced and derided as something she isn't (a prostitute) because she behaves in the way that male characters do without criticism. Ironically that seems to be the point you were trying to make, but it weighs more heavily against you than with you for this very reason.
I'm prepared to be proven wrong, but I'm willing to bet that if you check the posting history of every single person advocating criticism of Isabel on this thread, you won't find them banging on about the sexual immorality of male characters who do the same or worse.
She had the mark of the hore!
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Yeah, I like it when she looks him in the eyes and says, "I am no sin", when in fact, it's adultery plain and simple. She might have hoped the Templar didn't read that commandment!
shareWow! This really brought the Neanderthals out of the cave, trying to jack off while dragging their knuckles! If all men were like you lot, I'd become celibate. You didn't even mention the male character who bedded everything that moved. God spare me from such sanctimonious jackasses. Obviously, you've all been cheated on, and let me commend the intelligence and taste of those women. Maybe you should consider that the reason she cheated on you is that you are a poor excuse for a real man.
Beauty is truth, truth beauty.
>>>You didn't even mention the male character who bedded everything that moved
To be strictly fair I did point out the stupidity of the double-standard being applied here in my posts above, small exception though that might have been.