These Chimps Are Horrible!


I'm sorry, but I think these chimps are just horrible! I'm sorry they were abused and I'm glad they've been rescued, but they're just so nasty and violent with one another. The abuse the male chimps heap upon the females is especially repugnant, and frankly, I don't see why the females have to be subjected to it when they're not permitted to breed anyway! Cussons just laughs and says the girls have to be put in their place by the males. Why? It was upsetting to see the girls running for their lives in this so called"Eden", and then they were raped,bit, and beaten when the"boys" caught up with them! It's no wonder that one girl chimp tried to break out of the place after receiving a savage bite on her arm. She needed medical treatment, but at least the boys had put her in her place!

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Ok, what if you were abused and poorly taken care off for most or all of your life. You wouldn't be all giggles and sunshine to another person. And when the female was put in her place by the males, that's exactly what was happening, it may not seem right to you, but its what must happen in chimp society, just like with wolves. Plus, when that was happening, she was being introduced to the other adults, the keepers can't exactly keep them on leashes so they can sniff each others butts. And another thing, when Cussons finally approached th female, he can't give her medical treatment right then and there, he had to get her back into te enclosure, what kind of place would if be if they didn't give meical treatment? When an animal is abused there are alot of psychological problems after that. Things don't just go away after a week or two.

"Human hair...from my back."-Captain Jack Sparrow

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I know these chimps have emotional problems. I just don't understand why the non-violent ones have to be locked in with dangerous ones! Why can't the males and females be housed separately? Haven't the females been abused enough already? It may not be normal to keep the genders separate, but those boys aren't anywhere near normal. Wasn't that one boy thrown out of a zoo for constantly trying to have sex with everyone? If you've been locked in a cage your whole life, do you really want to move in with him and his psychotic friends on your first day of freedom?

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[deleted]

Okay, so you're saying that those male chimps are normal and that male chimps who weren't abused won't kick their weirdo asses when they're rereleased into the wild?

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totally agree with prosportsattic. Maybe not as harshly, but still I agree.

myspace.com/kaba2008

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Since chimpanzees and humans are a different species, things are done differently. You can't expect them to be civilized. They are doing what is natural to a chimp. If "Chimp Eden" was a zoo I would agree with you a little bit. But the purpose is to teach the chimps to live in the wild.

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As I understand what you're telling me, all male chimps are violent and all female chimps live in abusive relationships. If that's normal, then I get it, I guess.

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YES! That's the way life is for chimps. They may seem a lot like humans but they have a totally different lifestyle. There's no equal rights for women in the jungles. In the wild, male chimps fight with each other to become the dominant chimp. This affords them the good life. They get to mate with the females, are groomed, etc. I watched a Jane Goodall documentary where she was recording chimps who were in the jungle and had not been exposed to humans. The "rehabilitated" chimps at Chimp Eden act exactly like the chimps that have never had human contact.

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its not a "chimp thing". most wild animals are like this. most animals that stay in packs have a hierarchy. if you watch orangutan island, meerkat manor, growing up... or Lemur Kingdom you will see that. even dolphins have a hierarchy. thats how dolphins get scratched on them from other dolphins to put them in there place (i asked the people at seaworld how dolphins get cuts/scratches)





"As I understand what you're telling me, all male chimps are violent and all female chimps live in abusive relationships. If that's normal, then I get it, I guess."

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that's true, in the wild many species have a male hierarchy, but some have a female hierarchy where in most cases the "adult" males are sent out on there own at a certain age. It seems inhumane to use that many species of animals act like this to become the alpha male/female, but that's exactly what they are - not human.

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The first post of this thread really made me laugh, I love it :)

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I'm shocked at not only ignorant some of you people are, but you didn't even attempt to do any research on the chimp species before making such harsh statements. Chimps are a patriarchal society. The alpha-males are the only ones in the family with the right to mate with the females. They 'display' which looks violent, but is their way of showing who is boss. The females don't have babies because the sanctuary does not have the proper licenses to do so. Also, they were taken from their own families at such a young age that they wouldn't even know how to protect an infant and it's likely a male would kill a male infant preventing him from becoming a future challenge to his dominance. Last thing, because I may have used too many big words already, but those half-hour episodes only show moments of the female to male introductions. They can see each other in their sleeping quarters for months before physically meeting. Then they meet indoors, in a controlled environment several times before being let outside.

If you're not going to do any real research on something you don't know about, there's always wikipedia.

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I haven't got round to watching this yet - in the planner - but having watched just about every episode of Monkey Business and Monkey Life, It sounds like I already have...

I know that the males displays may seem aggresive etc, but chimps are so much tougher than us. If someone took your foot and bit it (not that hard) it would hurt, wouldn't it? But if a Chimp was the one being bitten I don't think they'd mind too much! I think they're skin is at least twice as thick? Anyway just thought I would explain,

I'm looking forward to watching this...

Jerseyporter

"The end is where we start from." (Captain Jack, "Torchwood")

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Have any of you actually been to Chimp Eden? I went there this summer to volunteer and they film for nine months of the year for a handfall of episodes which are half hour long. If you want more information on these chimps visit www.janegoodall.co.za or go there. Then feel free to comment.

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[deleted]

I'm shocked at not only ignorant some of you people are, but you didn't even attempt to do any research on the chimp species before making such harsh statements. Chimps are a patriarchal society. The alpha-males are the only ones in the family with the right to mate with the females. They 'display' which looks violent, but is their way of showing who is boss. The females don't have babies because the sanctuary does not have the proper licenses to do so. Also, they were taken from their own families at such a young age that they wouldn't even know how to protect an infant and it's likely a male would kill a male infant preventing him from becoming a future challenge to his dominance. Last thing, because I may have used too many big words already, but those half-hour episodes only show moments of the female to male introductions. They can see each other in their sleeping quarters for months before physically meeting. Then they meet indoors, in a controlled environment several times before being let outside.

If you're not going to do any real research on something you don't know about, there's always wikipedia.


This is the type of post that is begging to get you cussed out. First of all, everything that you've said has already been covered by other posters, therefore you really haven't enlightened anyone with any new information so you can stop trying to act like The Chimp Whisperer, now.

Secondly, nobody made you read the post on this thread, nor were you made to respond. I don't recall anyone asking you, personally, to explain anything or reply at all so why must you come across as some azzhole, who's annoyed because you have an obligation to inform everyone of your extensive knowledge of chimp behavior? What were you expecting, anyway, a bunch of "oohs" and "aahs"? Did you think that your knowledge of chimp life would be impressive to everyone? When you discover the seed that will grow a money tree in my back yard, then I will be impressed but you are going to have to come up with something a lot more significant than your expertise of chimp society and behavior if you're expecting some type of enthusiasm.

Thirdly, if someone is uneducated in chimp society that does not mean that they are totally ignorant to everything in life. All people have different interest and no one person knows everything. The same people who you're trying to belittle because they aren't knowledgeable in the behavior of wild apes, could be doing something more important with their lives (i.e., doing research on a cure for cancer, trying to make society safer by putting criminals behind bars or even teaching your child how to read and write) so you making the comment, "Last thing, because I may have used too many big words already" just because some people may not be as informed about chimps as you are, was just an ignorant and unnecessary statement to make.

Lastly, as much as you think you know about chimps, you obviously don't know everything about them. For one thing, your comment about the female chimps being prevented from reproducing because they wouldn't know how to care for or protect their young is ridiculous. Motherhood, for wild animals, is not so much of a learned behavior, as it is a natural and instinctive behavior. Although there are some mothers that will reject their young, it's not because they do not know how to care for it. It's usually because of a birth defect or an illness in the infant or even an illness with the mother. By your logic, none of these chimps will ever be good mothers because they missed out on the opportunity to learn from their own mothers so how will they ever learn? Do they offer them planned parenthood and child development classes? Also, male chimps do not kill infants because they are afraid that they will grow up and over power them or take their spot. Adult males will sometimes kill, both the male or female infant offspring of another male, in order to mate with the mother. By killing the offspring, the female's milk will dry up in her breast, her hormones will respond with her menstrual cycle returning, therefore causing her to become fertile again and enabling the male to mate with her.

As you said, "If you're not going to do any real research on something you don't know about, there's always Wikipedia".



Don't Worry Be Happy.

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Let me guess:.... you're a vegetarian. Probably of the vegan sort. For moral reasons only. And you love french fries.

Stay close to the candles.The stairway can be treacherous.

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[deleted]

When I wrote that original post over a year ago, all I knew about chimps came from Tarzan movies, Red Rose Tea commercials and Disney movies like "The Monkey's Uncle". I had no idea chimps were naturally violent with one another and I was shocked by the brutality of their attacks. I still think chimps are horrible, but I know now that they're supposed to be that way.

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I hear that great white sharks can get rough at times also.

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Humans drop bombs on each other and shoot bullets. Are chimps really that brutal compared to humans? If you think chimps are horrible, then humans are the most brutal species on the planet.

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LOL Then I guess she hates every animal in the world, this includes humans. ;)

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Is this a post from The Onion?

So you've discovered that animals in real life aren't like they are in Disney movies? Basically, that's what's been expressed, with all sorts of politically correct, gender-feminism words thrown in.

Surprise, surprise, females submit in the animal kingdom. Babies aren't self-realization exercises or choices. They are necessary for a species to survive. While there are often rituals for determining what male is the best (from a survival of the fittest perspective), animals don't take "Eat, Prey, Love" tours of Thailand and Rome to find themselves instead of furthering their species... and, animals don't know that sex makes babies (hey, a lot of human teenagers can't make that leap either). The female chimps don't postulate about these things, nor do they have book readings about how bad the males are.

Truth be told, if women didn't demonstrate similarity with chimps, Donald Trump would never get a date. Women are attracted to all males who "act out" and strength wins. This isn't learned behavior, ie, it isn't nurture. It's nature.

Using words like "horrible" to describe this or any type of animal behavior is the silliest extreme of anthropomorphism... which used to be explained in school and was understood to be a BAD/ignorant thing. If someone stated after watching a documentary on weather that "tornadoes are big bad meanies!!!" because they devastate women and children, it's silliness would be apparent. Thinking chimps are "horrible" for their behavior is THAT silly. Tornadoes don't rationalize/contemplate kind and ethical behavior because they lack a conscience and intellect. Ditto animals. Unless someone is truly confused, there should be no value judgments about nature. It just is what it is.

Humans may use their intellect to rise above their animal instincts, although there are far too many examples where humans seem incapable of it, but that's what differentiates humanity from our beastly origins. Animals cannot do that, nor do they ponder it. From a metaphysical standpoint, Adam and Eve was a parable to describe when humans developed a soul, a conscience, with the realization they could or should trump nature (and thus becoming different from beasts)... How odd that the greatest moment in human history is so often ignored, as people search to put more "nature" or natural things in their lives. Nature isn't something to idealize (nor anthropomorphize), despite all efforts of they Disney Corp (and PETA) to do otherwise.

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[deleted]

Surprise, surprise, females submit in the animal kingdom. Babies aren't self-realization exercises or choices. They are necessary for a species to survive. While there are often rituals for determining what male is the best (from a survival of the fittest perspective), animals don't take "Eat, Prey, Love" tours of Thailand and Rome to find themselves instead of furthering their species



WTH are you talking about? You sound just as ignorant as the other fool who posted earlier.


and, animals don't know that sex makes babies (hey, a lot of human teenagers can't make that leap either). The female chimps don't postulate about these things, nor do they have book readings about how bad the males are.



You can't be serious...who told you this? Seriously, do you even know anything about what you're talking about or are you just guessing and assuming that if you throw in a couple of big words, people will just take your word for it? Why do you think the females willingly have sex with the most dominant male or do you think that they just like his sex better and have no idea where the baby comes from, time after time and pregnancy after pregnancy? Some males will actually try to kill a baby that is not his offspring so if they have no notion of sex and reproduction, how do the males know which offspring is his or do you think they just go around killing all the young? Also, why do you think the alpha male gets so angry if any of the other male chimps mate with the females? Some things don't need to be taught in schools or books; they just come naturally. Just like I hope nobody had to teach you who your parents are or that a baby has a mother and a father. Even if your father was nowhere in sight, you knew that he exists somewhere and even before you knew the details of reproduction and sexual intercourse, you knew that you had a mother and a father.


Truth be told, if women didn't demonstrate similarity with chimps, Donald Trump would never get a date. Women are attracted to all males who "act out" and strength wins. This isn't learned behavior, ie, it isn't nurture. It's nature.



This couldn't be any further from the truth. For one thing, I am all woman and I am in no way attracted to a man that "acts out". If this is so then please explain lesbianism for me.

Using words like "horrible" to describe this or any type of animal behavior is the silliest extreme of anthropomorphism... which used to be explained in school and was understood to be a BAD/ignorant thing. If someone stated after watching a documentary on weather that "tornadoes are big bad meanies!!!" because they devastate women and children, it's silliness would be apparent. Thinking chimps are "horrible" for their behavior is THAT silly. Tornadoes don't rationalize/contemplate kind and ethical behavior because they lack a conscience and intellect. Ditto animals. Unless someone is truly confused, there should be no value judgments about nature. It just is what it is.




So now we're comparing wild animals to a natural disaster? Anyway...

hor·ri·ble
/ˈhôrəb(ə)l/
adjective

adjective: horrible
A. causing or likely to cause horror; shocking.
B. very unpleasant.

I think the OP is using definition A in his/her assessment. Everything in the OP's post suggests that the chimps behavior was unpleasantly shocking, therefore the OP was correct in his/her use of the word.

You may be entitled to your own opinion but you are not entitled to mine.
Arimas, Samira

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LMBO @ all the comments. I understand your concern. I thought chimps were all like those cute little ones that you see dressed up on tv as pets. The first episode that I saw was shocking to me also. It was the episode about Zack. I was horrified for those small baby chimps. The way he was throwing them around, jumping on their backs, and smacking them against the walls and trees I wanted them to just shoot him up with something and take him and tie his ungrateful ass back to that tree that they got him from. I didn't realize that was their natural behavior. I thought that he was just mad because he couldn't have his beer and cigarettes, LOL.

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These chimps are, indeed, horrible, as would ANY two or three year old human be if they were subjected to what these chimps have experienced. In fact, watching this should give the parents of toddlers some valuable insights into behavior, as we also receive from watching Cesar Milan. dko29 seems to have forgotten that these chimps are wild animals who have been stolen from their natural environment then rescued. Their behavior will be atrocious, until they learn the valuable lessons even humans must learn of how to interact with others of one's species, a skill that MUST be taught, as socialization is NOT an inherited skill.

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