MovieChat Forums > Triangle (2009) Discussion > The Scene That Says It All

The Scene That Says It All


I managed to view Triangle again yesterday (I’d first seen it late last year) and appreciate the film now far more than ever. I realize I’d forgotten certain episodes of the plot that I’d overlooked in my earlier post. And I've also rethought the mixed-bag geometry of the three-way solution.

In a nutshell, the pocket universe of spiral fractals and Seth Lloyd experiments does seem to offer us a second-degree answer as to the ‘how’ without giving us much about the ‘why’. Unfortunately, it requires us to do hours of carving square pegs to fit those round holes. Having to reconcile the sense of a movie by rebooting its plot 80 times (give or take a couple) makes for far too many hoops to hop. “The Elegant Universe” this is not. And it doesn’t inform (me at least) as to the quantum mechanism that allows Jess to both arrive at the docks for her sailing trip yet still get killed before getting there during her 'pilot loop'.

The purgatory explanation, on the other hand, fulfills the ‘why’ yet skimps on the ‘how’. Perhaps, because it doesn’t need to. After all, when God or the gods is/are pulling the strings the plot holes aren’t ours to fill. His physics are eternally one step beyond. Yet in this scenario we still have to come to grips with when and how Jess has died. If the auto accident is her undoing, from where do we even begin to explain the existence of the sailboat party. The film gives us no cues for eventual references in Jess’ past. Viktor a chef from the restaurant? Sally a teacher from Tommy’s school? Unless of course we opt for everyone’s death at the hands of the storm. Which in turn negates the car crash business and makes for an overall bleah situation.

Finally, the psychotic angle. The schizophrenic Jess in a sense works in all cases. Yet, it doesn’t make for a sufficiently stand-alone theme to carry the movie. Or at least one that’s not already been done to death. Yet it does provide the necessary seeds that frame the development of the rest of the story. And one might even ask if her madness itself is the source of her son’s autism.

In the end, I’ve opted for the limbo-land theory which this film explores like none has ever done. One truly feels what it must feel like to be in a nether world caught between the land of the living and the dead. And unlike the time-travel schema of collapsing possibilities and a finality of redemption (Jess is allowed to move on), the bigger horror of the Sisyphean paradigm is that it will never cease.

The beauty of this film then lies in Christopher Smith’s ability to weave impossible threads into a fabric of the believable. But such an art can only tolerate so much deconstruction before the magic unglues. Unless of course someone can convince me that the number of dead Sallys, dropped necklaces and seagull cadavers are precisely one and the same. And then maybe I'll see these phenomena in a light other than simply reminding us, and Jess, that she has "been there, done that".

The mirror scene. It is my favorite and the one that best exudes Triangle’s sensibilities. The previous Jess has fallen overboard. Our present Jess hears music and finds the room where it is playing. The record is skipping. She lifts the needle and places it at the beginning of the album. The music starts again… and with it the cycle of the loop. The drowning of Jess ended the last loop. But only here, perhaps with a little help from the gods, does she hit the replay of the song of her eternal fate. Simultaneously, Jess awakens on the beach, all the while as she’s coming out of her dream on the sailboat. It is this very gesture which provokes the reappearance of the Triangle’s capsized crew. When Jess crosses the threshold of the mirror it is as if we were witnessing the split in her character. Jekyll or Hyde? The ‘mean’ Jess goes through to greet the starboard arrivals while the ‘good’ Jess exits left on this side of the mirror to greet the port group. In chorus, consecutively or with overlaps? Either way, the symbol is that of symmetrical universes, dual personas. Jess returns to the ‘music room’ and bumps into the phonograph. The needle sticks again. The record plays neither forwards nor backwards. 8:17? For Jess, time has stopped in its tracks once more. The visual responds to the audible as Jess stutters three times before locking into the groove. Her existential rut reforms. Until the next Jess restarts the cycle all over again.

A final comment or two on the opening act that most people seem to downplay for its banality. Beyond the simple introduction of our characters, there’s a good deal of second degree foreboding that isn’t readily apparent on a first viewing. As they take to sea, an aerial shot depicts growing swells alongside an ambiguous musical phrase that already looks to the coming disaster (especially since the digital waves appear to run nearly perpendicular to the natural surge). There’s the deeper meanings of Heather’s “Bad dreams cure you of real life stress” or Jess’ “You did (come to the restaurant just to invite me)? I especially liked Greg’s fitting slip of grammar: “You can’t be everywhere all of the times”. What I found slightly odd was the repeated reference to Victor as the ‘boy’ when he’s barely 8-9 years the junior of the others. Downey seems to insinuate an even homo-erotic affair with his odd, “Do you guys sunbathe together? “ query. And Sally clearly hasn’t forgotten Greg since their ‘high school’ affair. Curiously, the 8th grade is in fact part of junior high. An innocent slip or sly allusion to the notion of time going haywire that is to come? Or I’m only reading too much into this soon-to-be red herring material.

Anyone in favor of a sequel?

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Lots of interesting thoughts there. I particularly like your comments on the "mirror walk" scene, and it's one of my favourites too.

I don't want to make this too big a post, as there's a danger I'm going to end up commenting on virtually every line of your OP, but a few comments on the last paragraph:

A final comment or two on the opening act that most people seem to downplay for its banality. Beyond the simple introduction of our characters, there’s a good deal of second degree foreboding that isn’t readily apparent on a first viewing. As they take to sea, an aerial shot depicts growing swells alongside an ambiguous musical phrase that already looks to the coming disaster (especially since the digital waves appear to run nearly perpendicular to the natural surge).

And let's not forget that seagull still hanging around...


There’s the deeper meanings of Heather’s “Bad dreams cure you of real life stress” or Jess’ “You did (come to the restaurant just to invite me)?

The conversation between Jess and Greg is full of hidden meanings that only become clear on repeat viewings:
"Every day's the same."
"Tommy likes things to be a certain way. If I do one thing differently I lose him."
"I just feel guilty when I'm not with Tommy."

In the past, I've only really transcribed the Director's Commentary, but you've now got me thinking that I need to add transcribing this exchange for the "Quotes" section to my "To do" list...


I especially liked Greg’s fitting slip of grammar: “You can’t be everywhere all of the times”.

You've got me rethinking this now. In the subtitles it says "...all of the time.", and I've always assumed it was just a slip by the actor, but on listening to it again it does sound over-emphasised. Perhaps it really was deliberate?


What I found slightly odd was the repeated reference to Victor as the ‘boy’ when he’s barely 8-9 years the junior of the others.

I didn't have a problem with this. Liam Hemsworth would have only been about 18 when this was filmed - now of course an actor's age cannot be taken as representing his character's age, but let's just run with this for the sake of argument. From my own and friends' experiences, age gaps become less significant as you get older: for a 27-year-old, a 9 year difference can be a much bigger deal than it would be for a 37-year-old. And that's before we consider that he's still a teenager: an adult, yes, but still a teenager, and that would affect how people look at him.


Downey seems to insinuate an even homo-erotic affair with his odd, “Do you guys sunbathe together? “ query.

Yeah: this struck me as a little odd too, but I've tended to put it down as another example of Downey's particular sense of humour...


And Sally clearly hasn’t forgotten Greg since their ‘high school’ affair. Curiously, the 8th grade is in fact part of junior high. An innocent slip or sly allusion to the notion of time going haywire that is to come? Or I’m only reading too much into this soon-to-be red herring material.

As a Brit, I always get confused by US school "grades", so I didn't pick up on this. Christopher Smith is of course a Brit too, and despite his best efforts the film didn't get made in the States, so perhaps it was a genuine slip and none of the Australian cast and crew picked up on it either?
You're quite right to be concerned about reading too much into this, though, and it's something that I've noticed this film has a particular problem with. A classic example is the notorious "hairy hand" shot (where one of the masked Jesses is clearly played by a male stunt actor). In any other film, that shot would be dismissed as a goof, resulting from a low budget: only in Triangle is it seized on as a possible clue...

As an aside: I've mentioned this repeatedly in the past so I won't go into it all again here, but the original script went into much more detail regarding Sally's feelings for Greg. This was filmed, but then deleted in the edit...


Anyone in favor of a sequel?

You may already know this, but Smith has joked about a sequel in the past:
"I said to the financiers that if the film is a runaway success then we'll just release the same film and call it Triangle 2. Let's see if we get away with it!"

--
"So I've got bullets, but no gun. That's quite Zen."

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Nice hearing from you spielburger. In regards to the 'boy' business I'd initially thought this might be Australian jargon. Both Heather and Downey use it. I'm American, and even in my twenties I'm sure such a word would never have come across my lips to refer to an 18-year old. The youth would have to be at the pre-teen stage maximum. Why is this even of interest? Because of a far-flung possibility that Chris Smith might be throwing us yet another fish and...are you ready...Viktor is only Tommy, a decade of a loop later. Nothing else supports this however, so maybe...ciao bello.

As far as reading too much meaning into production slips, I'm reminded of Kubrick's The Shining. One of the main rebuttals to the accusations of naysayers who thought that film was only full of continuity errors was the established fact that the director was notoriously a perfectionist. A legitimate argument in my opinion. Is it unreasonable to suppose that Smith who took four years to put this movie together, wasn't also a hard-nosed stickler for detail? On the other hand such input goes against my view regarding the analysis of films via extraneous material so maybe I'm being a bit disingenuous here.

I would still like to be corrected as to my suspicion that no matter where you turn there seems to be no comfortable solution with respect to the circumstances of Jess' true death. The car, the boat, neither or both. It's the one hard-core loose end that needs to be addressed and I blindly am neither able to do it nor find it. It's less the when than it is the what (even if one may explain the other).

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I noticed several instances of "Australia for Miami," though I'm not sure about the "boy" usage.

How Jess says certain words, such as "Father," show some Oz accent.

Street signs and house styles.

...and I think they all, including Jess, died on the sailboat. The God, or "a god" Aeolus, sent the punishment.

All but Heather are being punished for something, perhaps sexual misconduct or disloyalty, in addition to Jess' Sisyphean punishment for not paying Charon the "Driver," as she promised.

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Thank you for your post! It sent me on an amazing (and likely unrelated) rabbit trail that was a huge blessing. I googled the term "pilot loop". :D

After I came to my senses I returned to enjoy the rest of your post/analysis of the film, which I also enjoyed.

As to the question of death, I do agree it is the one major gap that is hard to reconcile. For me the thing that bothered me most (and I'm sure I'm not thinking as deeply as you) is where does she get her new outfit? The "boat loop" version of Jess is wearing some combination of shorts/tanktop/coverup while the "house loop" version of Jess was wearing the dress. (BTW, wouldn't there be 'Jess bodies' stacking up at the morgue just like the birds on the beach?) So where did the "original" Jess get the wardrobe? It seems the rest of the film is quite meticulous about showing her various states of dress while looping.

For me this one irreconcilable fact caused me to enjoy the film far less...sad too because otherwise it was brilliant!

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No idea if you'll ever see this, what with the boards being shut down soon for no sane reason, but eighth grade is only part of junior high if your district actually has junior high. When/where I grew up, we went straight from elementary school to high school, which began with the eighth grade.

-There is no such word as "alot."

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It's definitely different in various regions. Where I grew up grade school was 1 through 6, middle school was 7 and 8, and high school was 9 through 12. 6 days and counting for the message boards!
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I'm something new entirely. With my own set of rules. I'm Dexter. Boo.

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