MovieChat Forums > Black Death (2010) Discussion > Atheists ARE Pagans

Atheists ARE Pagans

posted 12 years ago by AriaOfTelengard
32 replies | jump to latest

Just to make it clear...

Even if the "witch" was Atheist, by the prevailing lexicon of the time, she would have been labeled a Pagan.

The term "Pagan" was nothing more than a racist slur to call backwards people. It's like calling people "Hicks." Hicks can be Christian, Jewish, Atheist, it doesn't matter. If they are backwards people who still drink moonshine and are pissed off about losing the Civil War, they are Hicks.

And yes, even in modern times, Atheists ARE Pagans, but not all Pagans are Atheists.

Take this for example: Most Atheists in the United States celebrate traditionally Pagan holidays like Easter, Halloween, and the Winter Solstice. Also, most Atheists even have a "Tree of Life" in their living rooms during the Winter Solstice in which gifts are placed under.

Atheists go out of their way to celebrate Pagan holidays. Technically, I guess the true term would be Atheist/Pagan. They are not fully Atheist, but yet, they don't believe in any of the Pagan gods but still partake in Pagan celebrations.

[–] barlowe2003 12 years ago

Christians were pagans before they were in the majority.

[–] wranger_243 12 years ago

I think you're confusing pagans with heathens.

[–] douces 12 years ago

They are not fully Atheist, but yet, they don't believe in any of the Pagan gods but still partake in Pagan celebrations.

This is ridiculous. Why are you defining atheists by the secular holidays/celebrations they observe? Are Christians who dress up for Halloween also Pagans?

How can someone not be "fully" atheist? This is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Atheism is just a single position on a single issue (belief in a god/gods). Observing a secular holiday or even a Christian holiday has no bearing on the position one takes in this situation. I can go to church every day of the week and take communion and still be "fully" atheist.

If one is not "fully" atheist, one is a theist (some may argue that one can also take no position at all, but to me, that is still atheism).

You are just playing stupid semantics games.

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] HeatherAgain 12 years ago

The atheists and agnostics I know are all rationals who think Christianity and Paganism are both crocks and wouldn't be caught dead with a living tree.

[–] chas437 12 years ago

Yeah, dead trees are so much easier.

Atheists and the like celebrate Christmas, Easter, etc not for religious reasons but for cultural reasons. Christian mythology is an anchor of European Culture.

[–] HeatherAgain 12 years ago

-- for cultural reasons and presents too!

[–] PianoWired-688-539232 12 years ago

Exactly, "tis the season to receive". And those easter bunnies had better be SOLID CHOCOLATE!

recovering catholic

Knot2nite

[–] Indifferent_Observer 12 years ago

Athiests arent pagans, but the village in the Movie were pagans, NOT athiests. I am not sure why people are saying otherwise. She just hates the Christian God because she believes God sent the plague.

She believes the Christian God sent the plague to punish the Christians. She also believes that by killing the Christians it will keep the town clean. This is pagan beliefs. Though there are comments like Heaven isn't real and there is no God, I believe this is more along the reasoning that the Woman WAS real and alive. They follow her as their God because they believe she can perform miracles like bring people back from the dead. Again, Pagan.

I am watching it again right(I own the film) now because I knew it wasn't true, but wanted to be sure. She is a witch and they're all pagans following her. Even Sean Bean's character calls her a pagan witch and warns the town that she cannot save them.

Pagan != Athiest

Pagan is a belief system, athiesm is a lack of.

[–] AriaOfTelengard 12 years ago

In the ancient, racist, and bigot definition of Paganism, then yes: Atheists ARE Pagans.

The term "Pagan" was originally nothing more than a term invented by Christians to damn anyone who wasn't Christian. It didn't matter how many gods you worshipped, it didn't matter the color of your skin... The only thing that mattered was that you were NOT Christian. If you were not Christian, you are automatically Pagan, no matter what your beliefs are.

Yes, classical Roman Christians would have labelled "Atheists" as "Pagans."

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] AriaOfTelengard 12 years ago

You are missing the point. Roman Christians would have labelled Atheists as Pagans.

[–] matt-1215 11 years ago

Not resurrect an old thread, but it should be noted that the etymology of the word Pagan predates the rise of Christianity. It is not wholly accurate to say that Roman Christians viewed/decried atheists as pagans, as their understanding of the word and its initial use reflected something else. "Paganus" originally denoted that one resided in the countryside or that something was of the countryside. The well-supported history behind its gradual change in meaning suggests that urban Romans who adopted Christianity before rural dwellers were taken to associate those who lived in the countryside as less likely to practice Christianity because evangelist proselytized in the Roman cities first, where the population was denser, and therefore a more productive object of their energy. Rural worship of a Christian god came much later in the regional development. At first, Christian Romans only used to word to describe rural folk who incidentally were less likely to have changed religion. Later, once this trend became settled and the association manifest, did it become an epithet to describe those country dwellers who did not worship the Christian god.

[–] greyhound1218 9 years ago

Petey, you're spot on in all of your posts.

I'm pagan and it astounds me how many continued misconceptions there are!

[–] cokoholicar 12 years ago

Until I read it on the internet I thought Christians were pagans because in Rome there existed this great religion with many gods and then this pagan religion called Christianity came in and ruined everything. Anyway I know what you're saying but atheists are not pagans, it's just what christians like yourself like to call them to try to piss them off. Well sorry dude no luck this time. =)

[–] AriaOfTelengard 12 years ago

I'm not Christian, I'm Atheist/Pagan.
As you would say "sorry dude, no luck this time =)"

[–] jobs-660-954141 11 years ago

No one is atheist!!!

You are agnostic!!!

You can never prove or find an atheist..

If you've "hoped" for anything, you are not an atheist... The entire concept of hope is a religious idea!!!?

[–] AssetsonFire 11 years ago

If you've "hoped" for anything, you are not an atheist... The entire concept of hope is a religious idea!!!?

No. Hope doesn't presume supernatural involvement. Is a dog who salivates at the sound of a bell also a theist?

He put his disease in me http://www.imdb.com/list/ze4EduNaQ-s/

[–] senua 11 years ago

That's not hope, that's expectation based on previous experience.

[–] ecuelles 11 years ago

From Urban Dictionary....

Pagan:
"A somewhat vague term derived from from the Latin word paganus. Pagan is a term which refers to a variety of different religions ranging from Wicca, to that of ancient Egypt and even Hinduism, among many others. Some Pagans are of no specific religion, but rather are eclectic. In general Pagan religions have more than one deity, or many gods which are aspects of one (an idea similar to that of the Christian trinity). Another quite common feature of Pagan religions are that they tend to be nature oriented. Pagan can also be used as a derogatory word for any non-Judeo/Christian/Islamic religion."

So obviously an Atheist is the opposite of a Pagan and a Christian.

Atheist are not Pagans period...

Heathens according to Merriam-webster:

"Definition of HEATHEN

1
: an unconverted member of a people or nation that does not acknowledge the God of the Bible"

So a Pagan is usually a Heathen as long as he/she is "uncivilized"!!I wonder what we would call an uncivilized Christian.....a prick maybe??

[–] castanz 11 years ago

I thought you were proving Atheists are pagans. Didn't you quote: "Pagan can also be used as a derogatory word for any non-Judeo/Christian/Islamic religion?" even though the Urban dictionary is not a totally valid source of information. I agree an atheist back then would be lumped in with the rest of the pagans.

For those who are saying Atheism is not a believe system. An atheist believes there is not a God. They can not know it for a fact. So they believe everything was created without any divine intervention.

[–] miffo 11 years ago

For those who are saying Atheism is not a believe system. An atheist believes there is not a God. They can not know it for a fact. So they believe everything was created without any divine intervention.

Not believing in a god is not a belief system, its a non existent belief system.
Just like Off is not a TV station, or abstinence is not a sex position and so on and so forth.
You don't have to know for certain not to believe in a crazy idea, just like the flying teapot between Mars and Saturn.
These arguments have been so rehashed, you'd think it would have reached everyone by now, but apparently not.

By the way, just for semantics. An atheist doesn't believe there is no god. They do not believe in any god. Subtle difference, but there is a difference.

Being atheist says nothing at all about what you believe regarding the beginning of the universe. It only says that you don't believe in any god.

Some might find me morally challenged or morally ambiguous. I prefer morally creative.

[–] ClintJCL 11 years ago

Yes, not believing in something is a belief system.

You do not believe monsters are under your bed. Your child may, though. Those are both belief systems. The system of whether you believe monsters are in the bed.

This isn't the same as calling atheism a religion. It's a religion in the same way that "not collecting stamps" is a hobby. That is, it isn't.

Systems of belief and religions are not mutually exclusive. You have severe logic problems.

-ClintJCL
http://clintjcl.wordpress.com/category/reviews/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/clintjcl

[–] greyhound1218 9 years ago

As a pagan, I have to call you out on your glaring errors. Pagans are deeply spiritual individuals.... Nothing at all like atheists.

[–] avia2 8 years ago

Pagans can believe in God, but in addition to other beings. Atheists are totally different.

You could even argue that many medieval Christians were essentially pagans imitating the new Christian priests, eventually leading to Protestant attacks on Catholics during the Reformation.