MovieChat Forums > An Education (2010) Discussion > When David tells Jenny he's a crook and ...

When David tells Jenny he's a crook and she smiles ...


I lost interest in this movie.
How can anyone care about these characters?

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Agreed. I had trouble feeling sympathy for Jenny at the end.

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Oh come on...haven't you seen films before where the girl still likes the guy even though he's doing something underhanded or crooked?

Some girls actually get their kicks out of stuff like that. Though I blame Jenny's naivete on it- she comes from a suburban environment that is safe and boring, and she wanted adventure out of life.

There's plenty of that thinking of wanting adventure away from the boring safety of suburban life even today.

"Thanks, guys." "So long, partner."

- Toy Story 3 (9/10)

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[deleted]

You sure he's a crook? About the map? You think he stole it?

Not quite. Notice that when they leave the place, they say goodbye and so on. I got the impression, and also from his conversation with Jenny afterwards, that he would have bought the map for a small price, that it might have been an estate sale with people who don't know or care the value of what they are selling.

How else do you explain a "For sale" sign in front of the house and the subsequent events?

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I think the point is, frogca, that he deceives vulnerable, elderly people for financial gain, and after a 30-second fit, Jenny acquiesces and thinks all is well again. Not in line with her so-called independent, critical attitude.

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They do urge her to get into the car quickly though! For me it was quite obvious that the map was stolen and they were worried the owner might find out.

For what it's worth, I too felt disappointed by her reaction in that scene.. but then, real life can be like that.

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I was initially unsure about that as well, but wasn't it established that they stole the map later in the film when Jenny confronts Danny & Helen about why they didn't warn her that David was married, to which Danny replies something to the effect that Jenny watched them steal the map and turned a blind eye herself?

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It's quite common for people to steal items from furnished houses that are for sale. People pretend to be interested buyers, and then they lift something of value.

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O come on, she's enamoured with the "dangerous" man. Lots of women and girls love the type. He's a rouge charmer and his babyface and smile lets him get away with it until he is found out. She's a sheltered, inexperienced, young girl bored with the routine of her school, her parents hammering at her to get into Oxford, and the geeky teenage boys her age. The characters are typical for the place and era. There is more character development in this film than any U.S. film that tries to address a similar coming of age storyline. What I loved was no car chase, no explosions, no fart humour.

-- If Ewan McGregor were a lollipop I'd be a diabetic strumpet --

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Totally agree with you - yes she is conflicted about David's criminal behaviour but she reconciles herself to it as many young women do - they don't like what their guys do, but often ignore it or go along with it rather than lose their lover.

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The thing about David's criminality is that it's subtle: he doesn't kill, he doesn't steal, he doesn't sell dangerous things like drugs or weapons or pimp out girls. What he does is legal, its just manipulative. There's nothing wrong about finding a black family an apartment, for instance, but he chooses the apartment and exploit the effect it has on the kind of people he knows already live there. On one hand, some old white family lose their homes and have to move elsewhere, but they relinquish the apartment of their own free will and only because they already have a prejudice against black people. So David's scheme is, on one hand, morally reprehensible, but at the same time somehow...not condemnable. That's what Jenny saw.

*Smile* ~~and stop being so pathetic::..

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The thing about David's criminality is that it's subtle: he doesn't kill, he doesn't steal, he doesn't sell dangerous things like drugs or weapons or pimp out girls. What he does is legal, its just manipulative.

Huh? Did you watch the movie?
THEY STOLE A MAP FROM THAT HOUSE, where they told Jenny to briskly get in the car.
They get into furnished houses, pretending to be prospective buyer, and steal things while the owner is distracted showing them around the house.


It's further confirmed later in her conversation with Danny and Helen in Danny's home:

Danny:
I tried to tell him.
I'm not speaking to him now,
if that's any consolation.

Jenny:
It's a funny world you people live in.
You both watched me
carrying on with a married man
and you didn't think it was worth
saying anything about it.

Danny:
Yes, well,
if you want that conversation...
You watched David and I
help ourselves to a map
and you didn't say much, either.






But if this is not enough proof for you, here is the real story, from the real woman on which this is based, Lynn Barber:
https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2009/jun/07/lynn-barber-virginity-relationships
So I gathered from Danny that the property business in which Simon was involved was not entirely honest. But my first hint of other forms of dishonesty came about 15 months into the relationship when I went to a bookshop on Richmond Green. Simon had taken me there several times to buy me books of Jewish history and the works of Isaac Bashevis Singer - I was glad to have them, though I never read them. But on this occasion, I went alone and the bookdealer, who was normally so friendly, asked: "Where's your friend?"

"What friend?"

"Simon Prewalski."

"I don't know anyone of that name," I said truthfully.

"Well, whatever he calls himself. Tell him I'm fed up with his bouncing cheques - I've reported him to the police."

That evening I said to Simon" "Do you know anyone called Prewalski?"

"Yes - my mother, my grandparents, why?"

I told him what the book dealer had said.

Simon said: "Well don't go in there again. Or if you do, don't tell him you've seen me. Say we've broken up."

"But what did he mean about the bouncing cheques?"

"How should I know? Don't worry about it."

So that was a hint, or more than a hint. But soon there was unmistakable proof. Simon and Danny were buying up a street in Cambridge called Bateman Street, so we often stayed there. One weekend I was moaning - I was always moaning - "I'm bored with Bateman Street", so we drove out towards Newmarket. At a place called Six Mile Bottom, I saw a thatched cottage with a For Sale sign outside. "Look, how pretty," I said. "'Why can't you buy nice places like that, instead of horrible old slums?" "Perhaps we can," said Simon, so we bounced up to the cottage and an old lady showed us round. I was bored within minutes, but Simon seemed unconscionably interested in the bedroom corridor which he kept revisiting. Then I saw him going out to the car, carrying something. Eventually we left and went for lunch at a hotel in Newmarket. We were having a rather lugubrious meal when two men came into the dining room and one pointed the other towards our table. The man introduced himself as a detective. He said: "We've had a complaint from a Mrs so and so of Six Mile Bottom. She says a couple visited her cottage this morning and afterwards she noticed that a valuable antique map by Speed was missing from one of the bedrooms." "Oh, Simon!" I said. He shot me a look. "Perhaps we could have this conversation outside," he suggested. He went outside with the policeman. I waited a few minutes and then went to the Ladies, and out the back door and away down the street. I had just enough money for a train back to London. I hoped Simon would go to prison.

He didn't of course; he bounced round to Clifden Road a few days later and took me out to dinner. "How could you steal from an old lady?"

"I didn't steal. She asked me to have the map valued."

"No she didn't - I was with you."

"All right, she didn't ask me. But I recognised that the map was by Speed and I thought if I got it valued for her, it would be a nice surprise."

I knew he was lying, but I let it go. I said: "If you ever really stole something, I would leave you."

He said: "I know you would, Minn."

But actually I knew he had stolen something and I didn't leave him, so we were both lying.

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I'm sure him saying that since they (him and his buddy) are not as smart as Jenny, they need to find other clever ways to make money. Then, mentioning how "maps don't grow on trees" just after a scene with her father mentioning other items not growing on trees lol im sure that wasnt a random selection of words by the writer.
Either way he was a typical psychopath that was charming and seductive and came at a time when she was bored, craving excitement and something different (like a different view on life).

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I could completely see how a bright, independent-minded and bored young woman who was living a rather suffocating life would be intrigued and attracted by a man who lived just a bit dangerously. David wasn't a hardcore criminal or anything, just an opportunist, petty thief and adulterer. He was charming and treated her pretty well, or at least seemed to until the deception was revealed.

IDK, I sort of felt sorry for him. Jenny was smarter and stronger than he was, and he knew that. During the scene when he proposed to her he seemed desperate to hang onto her, like she was the best he could ever do and he was terrified of losing youth and romance forever.

But in the end he was to scared to file for divorce and give up his "safe" life, the other life to which he retreated. I figure his wife only stayed with him because she needed the financial support.

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I was going to pose the question myself. What do you do when your moral core is challenged at sixteen? She accepted all his gifts. She accepted him because he give her a life of her own, not what her parents, teachers, or friends wanted. I felt sorry for the parents. So trusting of their daughter to do the right thing, however, never talking about the dangers of life with her. That danger is intoxicating. And if you can't tell someone what you are doing, you know it wrong.

Jenny confided her need for living instead of going through the motions with her teacher, but she didn't hear her teacher.

"...as long as people can change, the world can change"

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