MovieChat Forums > Blue Valentine (2011) Discussion > Cindy's 25 partners since she was 13

Cindy's 25 partners since she was 13

posted 7 years ago by Sundance-A-Kid
3 replies | jump to latest

Having been so moved by this film I wanted to write something here and was saddened by the endless, extraordinarily venomous outpourings of scorn directed at Cindy for her sexual past. So many people feeling like they have the right to judge someone's sexual history and use that judgement to label someone with hateful derogatory terms. Someone's sexual history may tell you something about them, can inform upon behaviour and certain characteristics but how that can lead to so many people reacting with disdain and a kind of religious anger is very revealing. Sex is still so very threatening to so many. If they themselves have not indulged in multiple partners they usually look upon those who have with cold disapproval. Which, in simple psychological terms, points very directly at a sort of jealousy.

Men tend to attack women for such behaviour because they often feel as if that woman is no longer theirs, or no longer potentially theirs, or if theirs then forever tainted by not being only theirs. Men, regardless of how relaxed they are about sexuality - a woman's that is - mostly retain some form of desire for innocence and needing some kind of ownership of her sexuality. So when they encounter a woman whom they have no sexual control over they resort to derisory name calling as a sort of mechanism to hide their intimidation by her sexual power and willingness to use it. She may have emotional attachment issues and she may be doing it to hide weaknesses, frailties. But a man will often judge her as being simply a 'slut'. It's easier that way.

Women who attack other women with these tendencies tend to be jealous. Not that they necessarily want that woman's life, but that she can be that free with her sexuality is something many women wish they could do. Generally speaking it would be odd to suggest that there is anyone who wouldn't want to be able to access a lot more sex, a lot more experiences and ways to explore. But most don't have the access, or don't want it as it goes against their emotional core. But in the realms of fantasy very few would say they indulge in imagining just the one person as their sexual desire.

Men, very unfairly, mostly get away with this sort of behaviour. Which makes sense in an animal kingdom kind of way, but not in a human way. Men have over centuries given themselves the right to pluck as many partners as they choose and having dictated the contents of our religious morals and ethics have ensured that most women are fairly lenient with this kind of behaviour. It's part of our construct of 'manly' behaviour.

This is one of the things this film conveys very well by making the man very unstereotypical. He is the one who wants only the one woman and she is the one with the multiple partners. This gender role reversal is surely intentional. The sex scene shows this very clearly where she is the one initiating the baseness and he refusing as he seeks her soul, not her sex. He ridicules her need for him to be more typically male, she ridicules him for not understanding that she needs him to do just that. She is silent. He talks. She wants less romance and more practicality. He is the exact opposite. It feels like what is being said is that opposites attract but perhaps they find it difficult to last and that whether it is the man or the woman who is the idealist or the cynic is irrelevant.

A long way of saying that it is misguided to resort to name calling based on sexual behaviour. Why judge someone so negatively for something that presumably the vast majority of the people so angry with her here have never experienced? It serves no purpose except for elevating oneself as some kind of moral purveyor. An unempathetic, uninformed self entitlement that is quick to disapprove of what they don't understand and probably, whether deep down or not, quite simply would like to be able to explore themselves.

[–] schall1991 7 years ago

Listen, I have more empathy than most but you are not being realistic here. For the record, let me preface this by saying I am a male (so please, no "if a guy slept with that many people you would say he was a god!" crap). I do not care if you are male or female, having that many partners in that length of time and starting that early can only be detrimental to a persons wellbeing. If you are truly one of those people that can separate sex and emotions, then I envy you and wish you nothing but happiness. With that being said, no 13 year old (male or female) can be ready for the emotional baggage that comes along with something like sex. Even those of you who could later learn to compartmentalize were not capable of doing so at the tender age of thirteen. Now maybe Cindy was raped at a very young age. We will never know, but psychologically, it sure would explain a lot about her character (and it would also redeem her character in my eyes, because otherwise, she is just a selfish and unlikable person). My point is this - there is nothing "wrong" with someone who sleeps with a lot of people, but unless you are part of a rare minority, odds are you have some serious psychological issues that need to be addressed and it's okay! It's just like Dean's drinking - he does it WAY more than necessary and it would be unwise to think that this doesn't ultimately come from a place frustration and unhappiness.

[–] Sundance-A-Kid 7 years ago

Exactly. All you are pointing out is that her sexual behaviour gives us insights into who she is, and you don't resort to name calling - which was the thing I reacted to in so many of the posts on this board. And that vitriol was mainly directed at the number of partners - not the more serious issue that she started at 13 - which I agree is a very early age. But that multiple partners always points to serious psychological issues is not necessarily the case. It can point to certain negative characteristics, sure - commitment issues, emotional coldness and so on. But it can also point to things like sexual exploration, high libido, curiosity, physical need for intimacy etc.. People never consider that the psychology of multiple partners is not only indicative of detrimental effects on the psyche but that there can be an element of freedom and fascination with encountering many different experiences. My point was mainly that people are too quick to denigrate someone for doing something they don't dare to do - for moral or emotional reasons, or perhaps for fear of the unknown. Being sexually free can of course lead to emotional complications - as Cindy's character reflects. But don't assume that is always the case. I know many people who have indulged in multiple partners and show none of her 'symptoms'. So don't get on a pedestal and look down upon those people like a judge - which you didn't really do, so well done.

[–] Fandango137 7 years ago

It is interesting how a lot of people look down on Cindy for her sexual escapades. I'm of the opinion that people should be free to do whatever they want, but given that, should also be held accountable for their actions. The fact she was with so many men meant she carried emotional baggage with her. This is a byproduct of having so many partners. Most people, on an instinctual level, understand that having sex is a psychological act as much as it is physical, and that having casual sex is dangerous unless you're able to disconnect yourself from the person and see them only as someone there for pleasure.

I believe that although most people understand that women are just as free to have as much casual sex as they like, they feel like by doing so they're hurting themselves in the long run.

Men, very unfairly, mostly get away with this sort of behaviour. Which makes sense in an animal kingdom kind of way, but not in a human way. Men have over centuries given themselves the right to pluck as many partners as they choose and having dictated the contents of our religious morals and ethics have ensured that most women are fairly lenient with this kind of behaviour. It's part of our construct of 'manly' behaviour.

To be fair, men often have to do the lion's share of work to get to the point of sleeping with a woman. Rarely do you see women initiate encounters or approach someone they fancy and ask them for a date. Yes, it happens, but again, it's rare, and still not considered the norm. The reason men are lauded when they talk about their conquests is because other men understand that they most likely achieved them through either, A). Effort, or B) By virtue of good looks.

Access to sex, for both sexes, is mostly limited by attraction. Cindy liked Dean because he was good looking, and because he was good looking, she forgave his lack of ambition or practicality. I'm not judging whether this is right or wrong. It just is.