MovieChat Forums > The Book of Eli (2010) Discussion > religions have been created without a bo...

religions have been created without a book


I don't quite understand the importance attributed to the Bible? Plenty of cult movements and would be religions have been created without a book. If the apocalypse wiped out everything and all bibles were burned, surely it would be easier to just invent a new faith than cling to an old one that had bearing in a previous civilisation. Firstly no one remembers Christianity in this new world and secondly it really doesn't matter that much about the content of this bible/book.. If other religions are just as powerful in terms of control right now, why Christianity?

reply

Except, and I don't expect you to understand this as you obviously have your mind made up the Bible is the TRUE word of God. It isn't made up. This movie is based on a Biblical prophecy that no matter what the Word of God would ALWAYS exist.

That is what makes Christianity different, it is based on the teachings of the one true and living God.

reply

The idea that in 30 years that the basis of the Abrahamic religions (Jewish, Muslim, Christian) would be totally wiped out is ludicrous. As before there were written Bibles, the Faith would be passed down in families or groups through oral tradition. It's not like nuclear war happened and everyone who survived had all memories of their faith erased.

reply

as you obviously have your mind made up the Bible is the TRUE word of God...


Based on the context of your entire post (and the position of the original poster you were responding to), I think you meant to say "the Bible is NOT the TRUE word of God," correct? 

"There are two principles of atheism: one - there is no God, and two - I hate Him."-Anonymous

reply

I really can't abide religious nut-jobs. The one true and living God? Yeah, show me that one. Hey God ! Got any good blow? I'm one hurtin' son of a bee. I'll make it up to ya later. Say hi to Hay Zeus for me, will ya? Hahaha.

reply

LoneWolfArcher I have absolutely no idea what you are going on about. Can you translate for us non-religious people?

reply

The Bible IS the Word of God. Man makes up religions, but God created Christianity.

reply

A faith which happens to contradict one of the MAIN commandment of God, how much ever the likes of you try and spin it otherwise. Go figure that one out.

And, pray tell us why Christianity was not handed down to His first creations? All the souls who preceded Christ are not worthy of salvation?

Even a sponge has fewer holes.

reply

Christianity came after Christ, that's why it is called Christianity.

Why would Jehova give them Christianity, when there hadn't even been a Christ?

Cmon make sense dammit man.

reply

Yeah I think you'll find that's a SUBJECTIVE OPINION and not SCIENTIFIC FACT

reply

Yeah I think you'll find that's a SUBJECTIVE OPINION and not SCIENTIFIC FACT

As far as I'm concerned unless you have a time machine and can go back in time to 6billion years ago, you can't disprove the existence of God. Anything about the creation of the world is just a theory. Because no people were around when it was done. Frankly I think it takes more faith to believe the whole universe came from nothing than to say God created it. Frankly God creating it makes more sense to me. But whatever.

1, 2 Freddy's coming for you. 3, 4 better lock your door.

reply

I think the reason the bible is so important, is the lack of an educational system.

Carnegie might not possess the intelligence and sociopathic tendencies that is necessary to create a religion that can control a population that is desperate for guidance.

Christianity has already proven in the past to be very effective in neutering a weak populas.

Why design a new gun from scratch when you have one that has been designed and perfected over centuries to do the job?


As for the troglodyte that said that the bible isn't made up, and is the word of god.... Are you saying that your god came down and sat at a table with a quill and squid ink for weeks writing multiple copies of his book?
Then went around handing out copies to everyone, "Oi, I'm god, this is my word!"

Cuz I'm pretty sure I've seen that guy downtown selling pencils on the street corner.

reply

As for the troglodyte that said...


That's right: When you don't have a coherent, valid, non-disingenuous argument, resort to name-calling.


"There are two principles of atheism: one - there is no God, and two - I hate Him."-Anonymous

reply

I'm pretty sure I used the word troglodyte only to direct my coherent, valid, non-disingenuous argument, to the right people. I was speaking to a specific person who happened to be a troglodyte.
I wasn't name calling any more than, "I love your Mother" is name calling.

You *beep* Dumbass. <--- name calling.

reply

LoneWolfArcher said:

The Bible IS the Word of God. Man makes up religions, but God created Christianity.



Then you [Thee-Justin_Sane] replied:
As for the troglodyte that said that the bible isn't made up, and is the word of god....


I was speaking to a specific person who happened to be a troglodyte....


Definition: troglodyte:

1. A person considered to be reclusive, reactionary, out of date, or brutish.
2. a person of degraded, primitive, or brutal character.
3. an extremely old-fashioned or conservative person; a reactionary.
4. informal a person who lives alone and appears eccentric.

The association with/derivation from the primary, more literal definition, "a prehistoric cave-dweller" is a derogatory one; that is, denoting a person who is primitive, uneducated, unrefined, backwards, etc. Hence, name-calling.


"There are two principles of atheism: one - there is no God, and two - I hate Him."-Anonymous

reply

Are you saying that your god came down and sat at a table with a quill and squid ink for weeks writing multiple copies of his book?
Then went around handing out copies to everyone, "Oi, I'm god, this is my word!"

Cuz I'm pretty sure I've seen that guy downtown selling pencils on the street corner.


Disregarding your insulting, cheeky comparison to the street corner vendor, this represented the "disingenuous" part of your argument. Back in the day (not sure how old you are; but if your avatar is representative, your ears appear a little damp), when a business executive would dictate a letter to their secretary, the secretary typed it up on his or her behalf, based on the dictation. But the executive him or herself was the author of the letter's contents. No one had reasonable cause to doubt that, especially when their signature was added to it.

I propose that if you were really honest with yourself, your "reasonable cause" consists primarily of the changes and requirements that acknowledging the existence of a Supreme Being as the Bible represents Him would impose upon your life. That doesn't have any ability to influence or reverse what is actually fact, however.


"There are two principles of atheism: one - there is no God, and two - I hate Him."-Anonymous

reply

Carnegie might not possess the intelligence and sociopathic tendencies that is necessary to create a religion that can control a population that is desperate for guidance.

Plenty of stoneage dumbasses managed to make up plenty of religions that were good enough to control thousands of other idiots. It would have been way easier to make up his own crap. He even had a blind woman and holy water (aka water), that is pure gold to start your own cult.
He could have also just started his own sect of christianity, the apocalypse adventists or whatever, and pieced it together from what he remembered.

reply

The water itself would be enough to base a religion on, true; but he didn't remember much of the bible himself and it is full of very good stories.

Not everybody is good at writing such fiction, he needed the bible.

reply

Imagine a world without internet... TV, radio, recordings etc.



How do you pass on information and teach others?


Through writing.


Religion had a much stronger influence on people when all those didnt exists during the eras where human struggle was prominent.

reply

Usually orally. The vast majority of human history didn't have any writing. A lot of societies didn't have writing.

reply

You are right that it would be better to invent a new religion that would benefit the inventor more.

reply

[deleted]

Of course the premise of the movie is a bit silly and at parts pretentious. It seems to suggest that a world without christianity would devolve humans to cannibals and scumbags for example. The idea probably that all you need is a bible, read it and boom! instant good guy, spreading the word and healing the world. There are many flaws with this:

1) Let's start with destroying all bibles. This is of course an imposible task, apocalypse or not, since there will be one in every second american home, in most hotel rooms and so on. And this doesn't even touch digital versions that can be copied unlimited times.

2) Okay, let's assume it would somehow be possible. You can wipe out every single holy book of every religion in the world, that doesn't change a damn thing about what people think and believe. ESPECIALLY in times of need! The bible itself was written some hundred years after the fact, so the faith was actually spread via word-of-mouth advertising. Christinity would have survived both the apocalypse and the purge, as well as all the other religions.

3) Now let's pretend all holy books and references to religion have been successfully wiped and for some reason everybody forgot about it and never passed anything to other people using their mouth. Let's pretend there was a point in history without any religion. People would make up new ones the next day! Religions come and go anyway. What doesn't ever go away is lots of people that for some reason need something to believe in. There would be cults, sects and similar all over the place and they would evolve into new religions because that's what humans do: Many just don't want to think for themselves, they want moral codes and spiritual leaders that tell them what to do.

4) SPOILERS! The movie conveniently ends with Eli reciting the bible and someone writing it down. It is implied that christianity is saved and would spawn a new generation of believers that would rebuild society. Well, that's how christians imgaine it anyway.
The thing is, every single word in the bible can be interpreted in a lot of different ways. If the bible was truly forgotten (we had to assume 1) and 2) really happened, right?), then nobody would have any idea what christianity was. Just reading the bible would never ever turn you into a person similar to what christians are today. Most christians don't even know what's written in the bible anyway - as I said, word of mouth is in fact more important. People cut down trees and decorate it with shiny things and make each other presents and dress up as santa because that's a fun thing to do but that's not in the bible.

Actually, THAT is the part that I would like to watch, how the new christianity would be like. It's like a reset. If they really started from scratch with the king james bible as a starting point, would the new christians be homophob? Because, there isn't actually much in the bible adressing this. Would they baptise people using blood of an ox like Moses did? How would they cope with outdated language like “Charity vaunteth not itself”? Would they now believe in unicorns (mentioned no less than 9 times) and satyrs (mentioned 2 times)?

Unfortunately, that's exactly where the movie ends.

reply