ric flair

the thing with foley is that he will never be the same as he was in his prime - he doesn't need to be and the wwe (and wrestling in general) is not the same as it was 10 - 15 years ago. besides i don't need to see him again and again i would rather watch the dvd of his highlights - or even read his books!
so yeah you are right another hell in a cell would have a high expectation that i doubt it would delievr (completely the opposite of the original)

ditto on that with roberts too - my thoughts are with him and hope he gets and stays sober.

cheers for the savio vega info - he was great back in the day!!

with regards to steph taking over - i think that would make a lot o sense and with HHH's experience and passion he would have to have an active role somewhere (imagine him and HBK as steph's stooges!!! like brisco and patterson!!)

i have also found a trend with your wrestling chats - your knowledge of brian pillman!! its refreshing - pillman couldhave been an intercontinental star given the time. obviously you don't feel the same way about my appriciation of lesner!! i am not embarrassed though, i know a lot of fans don't like him but i do - i enjoyed his matches!

have you seen the line up for this years money in the bank? pretty mush every wrestler we have spoke about as being the companies best talent is in.
could be a great great match - but ladder matches usually are

Foley is a legend, and as entertaining as some of his matches have been since his semi-retirement. I believe He and Edge stole the show when they had their hardcore match at Wrestlemania. He either needs to walk away completely or come back full time. I would not even mind Foley as an announcer. Some people gave him alot of stick for his announcing at the original One Night Stand but I actually thought he did ok.

The only problem I see with Steph taking over is her ideas for storylines, I think she is one of the main reasons ratings and attendance figures have fell the last few years. But put HHH and HBK in a position of authority and that might change. As mentioned they are rumored to be taking over develpmental and talent relations at some point so we will see.

My knowledge of Pillman is something that I am proud of and something I try to learn more on every single day, as stated previously Brian was my personal hero growing up. Pillman would have been more than just IC champ if he was healthy and still alive. I have no doubt that he would have been WWE Champ on several occasions. But unfortunately that was not to be. The same goes for Owen Hart, Davey Boy, Perfect, and others. Don't get me wrong I think Lesnar was a good athelete, that can not be doubted but he just did not have the passion, you could see in his eyes that he was not fully into the business.

As for MITB match at Wrestlemania, thanks to Jeff throwing his career down the crapper, the match is now wide open, it is now very tough to pick a winner, but I am now going to have to go with MVP. And it is safe to say that Jeff Hardy wont ever get back to the level he was at, I dont see Vince having faith in him again and I believe that HHH may now turn his back on him. I honestly dont see Jeff lasting till the end of the year with WWE. I just hope his rehab gets him straightened out.

sorry i have not heard about what jeff has done please let me know. so he ould be back in TNA again then. idiot! he really was on a role and just blew it - like rvd!

and if that s the case the MITB is now wide open between kennedy,mvp and cm punk. should be the best match of the night.

as fo foley he did do a great match at mania - and again at one night stand bt he is no terry funk - and i think he should call it a day, although i am not convinced with him as announcer - i prefer coach! and that is saying something!

good on you with your loyalty to pillman - he doesn't get a lot of credit and you are right to champion the cause! but i doubt he would have ever been champ although i did like his nutter/loose cannon gimic

and i also disagree that bulldog and perfect would have been champs i think they had their best runs long before they passed away.

and as for steph you are right she can't see a good a good storyline when its right in front of her! vince does h ave this problem to at times!!

but if she surrounds herself with the right people she will be ok

Basically Jeff has been suspended for 60 days for failing a drug test, this marks his second violation of the wellness policy, one more and he is fired. Basically WWE have pulled him from all shows and appearances, because Vince wants Jeff to go to rehab, just like back in 2002. If Jeff is accepting that and going to rehab is not known, but it has been reported that Jeff does not think he has a problem. If that is so, then after his suspension is up look for an immediate release. I doubt he will be back in TNA, he does not get along with Jeff Jarrett, and with them now implementing their own wellness policy doubt he would last long if he did end up in TNA.

Kennedy, right now is my third choice to win MITB, I dont think WWE has complete confidence in him again yet, I can't see it being Punk because I can't see them putting ECW in to a huge position like that. I believe it will be MVP, or second choice is Jericho.

I hate Coach, sorry but the guy just annoys me, no talent as an announcer what so ever, Michael Cole is better than Coach. I would rather have Todd Pettengill back, than listen to Coach.

See the reason I think Pillman could have been Champion is because of his character, the most creative and original character in the business, that since then pretty much everybody and their mothers have ripped off in some way or another. Austin becomes arguably the biggest name in the business by using a watered down version of the character, I say watered down because Austin never said *beep* on live TV and never lived the character outside of the ring like Pillman did. Imagine Pillman at his very best with his Loose Cannon character against Austin at his very best, are you telling me you would not pay to see that match as a Wrestlemania Main Event?

As for Perfect and Bulldog, I did not mean they would of been champion as such but more along the lines of they should have been. Both are two of the most under rated guys in the history of the business. Why Perfect was not given the Championship back in his prime in the late 80's and early 90's is beyond me. Why Bulldog was not given the Championship in 96 when he was fueding with HBK was beyond me. There are some guys that thoroughly deserved to be given the chance to be the top guy, as mentioned before Owen deserved it, definately one of the best technical wrestlers of all time, and I think the only thing other than his death that stopped him from getting the Championship was who is brother is.

I seriously think that WWE need to fire pretty much everybody on the creative team, get Stephanie away from it aswell. Fire all the stupid "I used to write for such and such on NBC" sitcom guys, why hire people who know nothing about wrestling? Did Jim Herd not *beep* up the business enough back in the early WCW days, when he tried to turn Flair in to a gay guy? Bring in more legends, not current talent but legends and let them write the storylines.

Yes Vince does sometimes come up with the worst possible storylines but he has also came up with the greatest storylines of all time, and without doubt is the greatest heel of all time, like Austin said who doesn't want to beat the crap out of their boss.

there is one more entry in mitb either the miz or john morrison. money is on morrison for me - as i think he too is an awesome talent - reminds me of a young HBK

and by the way y comment on coach was meant to be taken with a massive pinch of salt! yes he sucks and blows at the same time. i would do a better job as a commentator! ~(actually i believe i would in all seriousness i would be awesome!)

i get your point now on bulldog and perfect with the titles - god damn hey were good - it is crazy looking back at the difference in talent from the early 1990s hayday to today - is that rose tinted glasses? i am not sure - maybe its because t was al new back then and after 25 years history does repeat itself and it is harder to be fresh and creative.

speaking f creative yes vince does have brilliant storylines in his back catalogue and is a great heel - h does the best facial expressions that i have ever seen! (expect to quote mick foley 'the big gulp of fear!")

as for pillman and austin yes austin did not live is character in the way pillman did (have you read bishoffs book?) but i am not convinced yet - but you are right what a visionary - maybe he would have been a great writer for the future.
and as for pilman and austin at there peak - you asked would i py to watch that - give me a hell yeah!! might go out and buy the dvd - or is there any thing i should get instead? i will have a go i might be educated!

oh my i don't remember flair being touted as gay? how much of a bad idea was that! he is a wheeling dealing limosine riding kiss stealing son of a gun! not billy and chuck! again i would bemuch better as a writer! and again you know i believe that!

Morrison is good, but I think he lacks on charisma, dont get me wrong I think the guy is a great talent but he needs to work on his mic skills alot, and why in the hell did they give him this god awful character when Johnny Nitro was far better. I also think Matt Hardy will be added to MITB.

I know your comments about Coach were only joking I just had to get in my penny's worth. You remember how WWE used to have the commentary booth at things like Fan Axxess leading upto Wrestlemania? Well me and a friend who is not involved in the business at all but is a huge fan and has been for over 15 years decided to record ourselves one time doing commentary on an old PPV, I believe it was Royal Rumble 99. Basically we decided to do it because Michael Cole sucks, we did it and my friend has a nack for video and audio editing, so we merged our commentary into the visual feed. We showed it to some friends I have in the business one of whom is a promoter, who basically told us if he could get a TV deal he would hire us as commentators because of the insight and passion shown in our commentary. Me being a wrestler I said thanks but no thanks, but it is something to do in retirement or as a fall back option.

Wrestling 10 and 20 years ago was far better than today, so much talent around, where even the jobbers were better than some of the main eventers of today. You used to get so much enjoyment and entertainment out of watching a match no matter who was in it, You could watch a match between Dino Bravo and Hogan and still think "what a great match". Now very few matches get my excitement levels up.

Pillman is what a wrestler should be, he was more like the guys back in the 50's and 60's where they would stay in character at all times unless they were in their own homes, Pillman understood that for people to believe in his character he had to be that character, even in hotel bars, and at television conventions. If Pillman were alive today and retired from competition he would of been great as a writer or a booker, he knew how to get the best out of everyone. I have read Bischoff's book once I borrowed it from the friend mentioned above, and I enjoyed it in almost all aspects. If you want to know more about Pillman definately get the Loose Cannon dvd, my girlfriend got it for me and she is not a huge wrestling fan, she knows guys like Rock and Austin and watched for a few years back in the late 90's and early 00's, she watches from time to time now to try and keep up to date so she can talk to me about my passion. But I will say since the day she got it for me over a year ago I have watched it atleast 200 times and half of those times she has sat next to me and enjoyed it. She was asked at a show that I did several months ago now, after watching the dvd for about the 40th time "who is your favorite wrestler of all time" first name out of her mouth which shocked me was "Brian *beep* Pillman". Also look around for stuff on youtube, his ECW promo's were great, try and get some old WCW PPV's and Nitro's from 95 and 96 to see the birth of the Loose Cannon, but also get stuff from before that to see Pillman at his best physically, get as much Hollywood Blondes stuff as you can, because Pillman and Austin as a team were phenomenal, if they were not seperated so soon, in my opinion they could have gone on to be the best tag team of all time. Also check out his stampede days too, when he was teaming with Bruce Hart to make the team of Bad Company.

The Flair gay angle was not exactly a gay angle, atleast it was not recognized as such, but Jim Herd who at the time Ted Turner and taken from being a senior vice president at pizza hut and put him in charge of day to day running of WCW, he was not a wrestling fan, he knew nothing about the business, but he got it into his head that Flair needed to wear diamond ear rings and a little make up, this is pretty much what caused Flair to leave WCW back in 91 he only came back when his contract was up in WWE and Jim Herd had been fired and replaced by Bischoff.

thats brilliant that you and your mate did a commentry reel! haha i never thoght of doing that - sure i listen to JR and king and think that i could do it myself - i alway prefered bobby heenan and mean gene though. but i never considered making a show reel (i have a hnd and degree in media and am prtty hot on editing and the like - also have been a radio preseter for 8 years so i am confident in my ability - especially as a mark!)

ok i will get hold of the loose cannon dvd nd check out youtube - i have agreed with you on most counts so i will ive him a go - but does this mran you will buy a rok lesner dvd? ha ha ha i am actually in dangerof sounding like his bigest fan! i am not by the way l never enjoy watching him smear hulk hogans blood over his chest - yet another attempt at killing hulkamania (it is immortal!)

i was thinking about the talent difference between 10/20 years ago and today - do you think we have nostalgia and impresionable young from back then? i dont know about you buti am 27 and the golden age was a big part of my childhood and it was then when i fell in love with the sport - so am i biased? probably.

and yeah the pillman story about living his character reminds me of the wild samoans in hulk hogans book and even the sandman in original ecw with the blindness angle. he was old schol personified, not saying he wasd a major force but definatly had an impact

Doing commentary reels is how some of the announcers in WWE got hired, it is worth doing even if you end up sucking at it what have you lost except a few hours of your day? But with you having experience on the mic then you should do well, send it off to a nearby promotion or whatever, or just ask some friends to listen to it and give you an honest opinion. I loved Heenan on commentary greatest commentary team of all time was Heenan and Monsoon, take people that are best friends and put them together and it sets up for great chemistry and story telling.

You have more chance of getting me to watch the Iron Shiek shoot interview than getting me to watch "Here comes the pain". Now if you told me to go watch the Roddy Piper dvd I would go bang that bad boy in the dvd player right now.

I think we are somewhat nostalgic towards the old days, but I also know due to being in the business how to spot and rate talent, and alot of the talent today just dont live up to the standards of the 70's, 80's, and 90's (just delete the entire of 1995). I am 26 in 5 weeks and fell in love with the business the first time I watched it, I remember we used to have the old redifusion cable in our house and we used to get wrestling on one of the channels. I was not even supposed to be watching due to the young age I was at the time, but one of my older brothers was watching so I went and sat next to him and watched the show, once it was finished I looked at my brother and said "again" and he just laughed. The main event of that show was Hogan vs The Iron Shiek for the then WWF title, so yeah you know how long ago that was and can work out how old I was at the time.

Very few guys over the last 10 or 15 years have understand what getting a character over means, The Samoans were great at it, but then at that time everyone had to be great at it. The Sandman also great at it, the blinding angle in ECW was brilliantly worked out and all credit to Heyman for coming up with it and to Sandman for living it. The only ones that I believe are any good at this these days are Jericho and Orton, I hate Orton with a passion, but I do believe that alot of his antics are down to him making his heel character believable, I think it might be something his Dad and grandpa drilled into him. Also away from WWE a couple of guys we have mentioned in depth in other posts 3D are great at it, Rhyno also pretty good at it, maybe with those guys it was something that Heyman demanded out of his ECW guys.

maybe you are right about heyman - he was (and is) a creative enius and used a lot of old school techniques in the original ECW - maybe that was one of them, after all ECW was based in realism and the opposite of the cartoony and showy WWF

i never considered orton was living his character - i would like to think he is as he is a complete and utter jerk otherwise - and if anyone would know about the importance of kayfabe it would be a third gen star like orton.
although with the rock whether he was heel or face you always new it was an act. a good one but he was very very showman like whereas orton actually convinces that he is a nasty arogant peie of work - maybe he is but if not its a hell of an act.

oh my god i can only imagine what a shiek shoot would be like - he struggles with scripts yet alone any thing else! (he actually struggles with walking these days)

ts funny but talking about heenan and mean gene the other day i dug out mania 17 and watched the gimmick battle royal! (which is odd that you mention the shiek) but i don't know about you bt i enjoyed the match - well not the match as such but just seeing all the old boys out again - cant blieve that it was seen years ago! must be about time for another one?

I think Paul Heyman is the most creative person in the history of pro wrestling. Sucks as a businessman but when it comes to being creative nobody comes close to Heyman, thats why ECW has been unwatchable since WWE fired Heyman from the head spot as writer of ECW.

I know some people who have met Orton both when he was face and since he has been heel, and they said he was very polite when he was face, but basically told them to get lost but in stronger words as a heel. I dont know about other antics like his poor hygene problems that he has displayed in the past. But I do believe some of it atleast is him trying to remain in character, to make the fans hate him more.

The Shiek struggles with everything these days, and trust me on this avoid his shoot interview.

I did not like the gimmick battle royal, dont get me wrong I enjoyed seeing all the old faces, but what I hated was that they put it out their as just what it was "gimmick". It put me off of the match, because you knew that one of the few guys that had been champion would end up winning because their gimmicks were the most succesful. However I loved the one they did for the Raw 15th Anniversary show, and thought it was great how Dibiase paid off IRS to get the win.

if orton is keeping in character - then good on him but i wonder how he will cope with his eventual face turn - coz as with wwe these days people don't seem to stay heel or face forever and i don't see the writing at the moment being able to pull it off.
maybe i am wrong and he will remain a heel for the rest of his days but i can't see it - however i am still witing for cena to turn heel. it would be the best thing he ever did as he has a lot of heat with the fans. (well the fans over 14 anyway!)

i didn't see the 15th anniversary show (i always miss the big ones as i missed the homecoming and tenth aniversary too) sounds like a laugh with dibiase paying off irs though. we were talking about great heels a few days ago and completely missed dibiase! he was great on the mic and in the ring a lot like jake roberts. about time he got hall of fame. in fact i was talking to my brother about him a few months back and he actually hated dibiase until he realised it was all an act! brilliant! it either says he was a great heel or i am from a family of marks!

actually i was waiting for ted jnr to make his arrival in wwe but it appears he has cocked up to (along with teddy hart and dh smith) its a real shame coz as a life long fan i wanted to see these lads in wwe - looks like its down to nattie niedhart.

fair point on heyman - nothing more to add really - but new ecw might go down as one of vinces mistakes i think. there was talk of it being internet only - that would be its death knell.

final thought - colt cabana has apparently signed with wwe too!

I can see Orton remaining heel for quite some time, but I think he might be able to pull off being a face, he did not do too badly with his second face run, got a pretty decent crowd reaction. I agree Cena needs to turn heel, Cena the heel was great but Cena the face just sucks, dont get me wrong here I dont think the guy is as bad as alot of people would like to make out, but what bothers me is he was just forced on the fans, too much too soon.

Dibiase is one of the greatest of all time, one of the most believable and hated heels of all time, but nobody can ever doubt the mans talent, carried alot of the top face guys through alot of matches back in the day, you just knew that Dibiase could get a decent match out of anyone. Dibiase deserves hall of fame status for sure, and who knows maybe he will be in this year.

Ted Jr has screwed up quite considerably but he has not been released, I just think they will hold him back for a little while, Teddy Hart whilst a pretty good talent in the ring seriously sucks when it comes to attitude. Harry "D.H" Smith is a great talent also but he screwed up by failing two drug tests, and the thing is he is not even ashamed of it, I read reports that at a house show last weekend during a match with Kendrick a fan shouted at Harry "Nice muscles but I guess thats what steriods do for you" he just smiled and nodded at them and began flexing his muscles. Now that is stupid, and I really dont see him ever getting above a jobber now. Vince is pretty intent on burrying anybody who makes repeated mistakes.

I can't watch Vince's ECW, very rare that they even have one good match on the show, and when they do it aint with ECW guys its with Smackdown guys. I dont see why sci-fi signed on to keep it on their network, very few guys who are on the roster are even talented, Punk, Dreamer, Delanney, Shelton, Thorn and Stevie Richards when he even gets a chance.

Colt signed a development deal last year but soon after asked for his release, and it was granted, so dont expect to see him in WWE for quite some time.

i think vince is right to be harsh on drug abuse and repeated failed tests. i am no mug and realise the history between vince wwe and steriods/other drugs but he is too long in the tooth o activedly promote them by allowing it to go on unpunished (or at least or it to appear so)
for the record i am neither pro or anti - if you know the risks and are an intelligent adult you can do want you want.

yes dibiase will be in the hall of fame soon - he still works for vince and is held in high regard for what i can see. quite rightly too.

as for all the dh smiths, teddy harts and dibiase jnrs - i really wanted to see a new hart foundation. (from what i have seen of them so far they all look pretty good - but would benefit from more exposure. however teddy hart seems to be intent on ruining the good name of hart. (is stu in the hall of fame? i don't think he is - but he bloody should be!)

cena has a heel would work again - he is not a bad wrestler and with all the bad heat he gets from the fans i believe he has tried realy hard to improve his in ring skills and it is to his benefit - but he should turn his street chav good boy image into a real thug (almost like taz from ecw)

which brings me back to ECW - its like watching a training session for new guys and past it superstars. i imaging its what ovw would be like with pyro. you can't have ecw without heyman. although there has been talk of it joining with smackdown and becoming one show.
the problem is it is not extreme any more

I agree that its about time they clamp down on the drug problems in the business, too many people have gotten away with it for so long, but not maybe they will start taking it seriously. Especially knowing they dont have an alternative, now that TNA are drug testing. I am anti drugs in the business, sorry but if you aint good enough without them then you are in the wrong business, there's the door goodbye.

Dibiase actually doesn't work for WWE as a road agent anymore, he quit last year and Mike "IRS" Rutundo took over his position, Dibiase is still on very good terms with WWE and Vince though so they do use him for appearances at times.

I too wanted to see Hart Foundation 2.0, but as we have both said Teddy's attitude ruined that. I also think that the idea they were tossing around with having The Anvil introduce them was not the best, dont get me wrong The Anvil is a legend but surely they could of tried to work something out with Bret, especially now that he is on good terms with Vince and even tapes segments at times for special shows. Also have you seen Bret recently? For a guy who claims to be done with the business he is in great shape, looks like his oldself again now that he has fully recovered from his stroke. I think Stu Hart deserves to be in the hall of fame too, if not for his contribution as a wrestler, then definately for his contributions as a trainer. Just look at the talent that have come out of the dungeon and The Hart Bros Dojo.

Cena was at his best when he was heel and doing his freestyle gimmick, now he is just like everybody else. I agree that he has talent and has shown improvement as far as wrestling skills go. His major problem is that one it was too soon for him to become the golden boy, and two his promos suck, and are aimed entirely at 12 year old boys and under.

Three sure fire ways to save ECW, bring back Heyman, Bring back alot more original ECW talent, and bring back Extreme, lets face it Eastern Championship Wrestling sucked more ass than Pat Patterson at a gay brothel, but Extreme Championship Wrestling was one of the most innovative and creative and most cultly followed promotions in history.

well said - no heyman no ecw. ecw has shaped modern wrestling. vince was still going down the family entertainment route and heyman showed him that adults liked wrestling too (those adults were actually the children that watched in the 80s) the difference is hese kids grew up and got wise - vince did't see that till ecw and to an extent wcw came along nd shook it up.
the only reason i used to watch wcw was because of the old guys like savage, flair and hogan
the thing is with the correct direction people will follow ecw it has potential to be great - but at the moment it is ruining heymans legacy. is that vinces secret plan? to leave a sour taste in the mouths of the rabid die hard ecw fan by dragging it through the dirt? probably not but i always had my suspisions of vince for example, when he brought in tazz and made him a midcard at best talent. taz was the daddy in ecw but made to look a fool in wwe - i always thought that just as vince bought wcw and ecw he made their talent look infirior to wwe. just a hunch

the last time i saw the hitman was on an episode of byte this - when his dvd came out - and he looked in good nick then. but i doubt he will ever be on wwe tv ever again. if he struggled at the hall of fame (wel the mania apperance any way) a real shame as he was a true legend, definatly an all time top ten.
on a side note who would you put in your all time top ten? i still believe that the hart foundation 2.0 will happen one day - but bret is much more of a draw than the anvil. but do they need either of them? i am not a fan of comebacks and the hart foundation are famous enough. but a fued with shawn micheals would be welcome!

i didn't know about dibiase leaving wwe - lovethe irony of irs talking his job. who next virgil?

I have always felt that way about outside talent coming into WWE, Vince always seems intent on burying anybody who he did not make a star, there are very few exceptions to this. I do believe that it might be the case with ECW, its no secret that Vince does not get along with Heyman, so it is very possible that Vnce wants to kill Heymans baby so to speak.

When it comes to Tazz, I think his injuries held him back quite alot, he even admitted himself he was never 100% durin his WWE in ring run. But I do think he should of atleast been Intercontinental Champ a few times.

Last time I saw Bret was on the Raw special, Vince appreciation and draft last year, and I must say he looked fantastic, great shape, and his speach is back to 100%, in the video he filmed he was lifting weights in the gym, thats why I think he may not entirely be done, dont think he will ever wrestle again, but if he was even to make a one time appearance, it would be huge.

My all time top ten, is very difficult, there really have been some greats, but I will do my best to list them for you.

1. Brian Pillman
2. Ric Flair
3. Owen Hart
4. Bret Hart
5. Steamboat
6. Shawn Michaels
7. Ted Dibiase
8. Hogan (he would have been alot higher if he was better in the ring)
9. Mr Perfect
10. Arn Anderson (probably the most under rated guy of all time)

those are my top ten singles guys of all time tag teams is another story, and mainly consist of 80's and 90's teams, because there just are not any teams around these days.

Tag team wise my top ten is like this.

1. Road Warriors
2. Hollywood Blondes
3. Original Hart Foundation
4. The Rockers
5. Demolition
6. Edge & Christian
7. The Hardyz
8. Dudleyz
9. Midnight Express (Eaton and Lane)
10. Freebirds

As for Dibiase leaving and IRS taking over, I believe it was Dibiase that recommended him for the job. Just shows the pull the man has with Vince.

you only need to look at the career of booker t to see that vince will bury talent. absolutely brilliant in harlem heat and as a singles star in wcw - very poor in wwe (king booker was laughable) - then just as i thought he was past it he turns up in tna with a nerw lease of life and is back to his best. he does however need to leave his wife at home!

i am glad that someone else agrees with me on the point of vince burying talent. i think he is threatened by heyman as he proved to vince that he does not have the complete knowledge on wrestling and that a small company can challenge the behemoth that is wwe.

all time top ten is a hard task as there are so many different aspects to consider but here goes

1. hulk hogan - first true superstar

2. ricky steamboat - hugely underrated, in danger of being forgotton (crap gimmic as a fire breather though

3. dusty rhodes - great on the mic, perfect foil to flair - knew is audience better than hogan ever did

4. ric flair - nuff said, maybe the greatest ever?

5. mick foley - for bringing both hardcare to the masses and comedy back in wrestling

6. shaun micheals - crossed the gap between federation and attitude. DX.

7. Bret hart - technically never bettered (although angle/beniot come close)

8. roddy piper - great heel. pipers pit.

9. undertaker - so graceful for a big man. absolute class act

10. randy savage - in his prime (just for mania 3)

as for tag teams you will have to wait but i can't think of a great tag team since the tlc's of 2001/2002 - although kendrick and london would be brilliant with a little competition

Booker T was great in Harlem Heat, they did not make my top ten teams but they would make top 20 very easily. Most of his singles career in WCW was very good although I like to forget about G.I Bro. I have not liked him in TNA mainly because of his attitude as stated previously he quits a company because they suspend him due to drug use, sorry but that is very unprofesional in my books.

I think Heyman definately proved that you dont need the best arenas, the best talent, but as long as you have guys who love doing what they do and can go out there and entertain they will become stars, and I believe Vince was definately threatened thus he made a working relationship with ECW back in the day so they could essentially use each others talents at times.

As for your top ten you made some good choices, obviously everybody will have different opinions based on what they personally like in a wrestler. The guys you mentioned that I didn't would be the next few guys in my list after number 10.

Tag team wrestling is dead these days, they proved that last night by splitting up London and Kendrick, I hope that Vince comes to his senses and starts to rebuild the tag division, unify the tag belts and have atleast ten fulltime tag teams.

yeah the top ten was harder thani thought. i tried it with tag teams but got caught up with looking atall the rubbish ones (hurricane and rosey?) and all the great tag teams of the last ten years have not been proper tag teams. like chris jericho and chris benoit or HHH and stone cold and other two wrestlers that vince has nothing else to do with. even the brothers of destruction were never a real tag team as such.

and yeah tag teams are dead and buried - london and kendrick could have been great but without competition they were never going to get any where. and what a crying shame about duece and domino. i actully thought duece (which ever one is snukas son) actually had some talent but lumped with a crap gimmick (how many times has that happened?)

but tag teams wil never die in wrestling - just need to be re invented once and a while (look at the rockers, then the dudleys/hardys/edge+christian - not a lot was going on before them)

as for gi bro - lets leave it at that shall we!!!
but yeah he quit after drugs chargesand it seems that tna is a little more relaxed about these things - but as for in ring talent i think he is as good as ever

this is a horrible sendoff

Hey, dont you ever say anything bad about Shane Helms, I can't wait for the Summer when the guy comes back, he is definately worth atleast a US or Intercontinental push. But I agree teaming him with Rosey was not the best idea or tag team. I actually wished they kept him with Kane, a team of a big guy and a high flying technical guy always seems to work.

I never like the quick fix tag teams they are pointless, especially the ones where they give two people who are fueding the titles, sorry but if the fued can't get over without that added bonus then it aint worth a damn. Except for Matt Hardy and MVP I actuially liked what they did together and thought they showed great chemistry.

Duece and Domino are actually a good team, they just never get put over, and Duece aka Jimmy Snuka Jr as he was known in his early career is the leader of the team yes, but I do believe they are both technically sound and work well together. But I think Cherry needs to Wrestle more, one of the examples that Women with talent wont be seen in a WWE ring but women who break their own or their opponents bones in every match are the top divas. When was the last time Victoria and Mickie James wrestled, wasn't it like thirty years ago now, because it sure seems like it.

I never really thought Booker was the best technically, very good but not great, but I hope he can prove me wrong and have some real great matches in TNA. I hope they bring back Stevie Ray for one match only to face 3D, two of the best tag teams to never face each other.

no don't get me wrong i am not knocking shane helms at all - well not really. i just think the notion of wrestlers as superhero wrestlers should be left alone it really has no place in this decade (to be honest it was old hat in the ninties) and now eric young is doing it in TNA. i actully think shane helms is a talented guy - but the hurricane gimmic just did't do it for me.

as for women in wrestling - the womens divison is a joke. what a waste of talented wrestlers for cheap T and A shots. sex sells and the divas are a fine looking bunch but let them wrestle more!! victoria is a great athlete (all of themn are really - ashley. mickie james, maria, but its just about the sex - what a shame

i wouldn't be surprised if stevie ray does make a comeback in TNA they seem to have a knack for it - after all they manage to get rick stiener back. and yeah and harlem heat vs 3D is a big fantasy match up and i think all four men could still put on a hell of a show.

and i think the reason matt hardy and mvp worked is because both of these guys are peaking with their careers right now. matt has never been better(maybe summerslam 2005) and as we said before mvp is the best prospect for the future for wwe.

I think that no matter what gimmick Shane Helms has had he has made it succesful and entertaining, The Hurricane character was one of the most over characters in the business, and just look at the huge matches that it enabled Shane to be a part of beating guys like The Rock, Triple H, and others. But each to their own.

Don't you even dare mention Ashley in the same sentance as women like Victoria and Mickie, Ashley is the first one they need to fire, sorry but she is just useless, as a manager or valet she would be fine but as for getting in the ring she has proved time and time again that no matter how much time she spends training she just does not improve. This is another reason to watch TNA as their womens division just makes the WWE's womens division look stupid and pointless. Every woman in TNA except for SoCalVal and Christal can wrestle, and SoCalVal and Christal dont even bother trying because they know they either wont be good at it or because they have no real desire too.

I seriously believe that Harlem Heat vs 3D would be a sure fire winner, I know Stevie Ray has not wrestled in a long time but his injuries were not career ending he decided to retire because of injuries and also because he was tired. But if TNA made the right offer it would be on like neck bone as Harlem Heat used to say.

I agree Matt and MVP are both at their best right now, I think both can go so much further than just US title. MVP will likely end up winning the world title later this year or earlier next year. And I think its about time more guys like Matt Hardy and Shane Helms start getting the chance to get the ball and run with it. I am tired of the same old people being at the top all of the time. I do believe that is why Triple H took a huge step back for quite some time he could sense the fans getting tired so he took the step back and now they want him as champion again. And to keep it fresh they need to push some of the younger guys and people who never really got the chance to showcase their skills in main events before.

it did get to the point where HHH got boring - and the stepping back from the title race combined with his injury possibley was his smartest move (which is a massive thing to say as he is very intelligent with the business)

and his comeback now (if you can cal it that) is getting exciting simply because you don't know if he will wn the title or not. (for the record i think cena will do it and remain undefeated - not saying its right but i think it will happen.)

and without a doubt the TNA knockouts could take the divas - in fact ODB could probably do it on her own.

stevie ray would be a massive asset to TNA - apparently booker tried to get him in WWE so chances are he will try again - we can only hope

hopefully we will see some fresh meat on with the title soon. undertaker will win at mania and rumours are that he will start a fued with umaga? but as always taker will be off by july - so who next? edge and batista? probably but with the likes of matt hardy, mvp, rey mysterio and john morrison i think we might see a change of direction.
although they will probably have a draft - or justgive it to batitsa for 18 months

I dont think they will give the WWE title to Cena just yet, he is not going to be working a full schedule till June so I can't see them giving it to him just yet. I actually think HHH will win at Mania.

Yeah the draft is rumored to be happening on April 21, and it is likely that Umaga will be going to Smackdown to fued with Taker over the World Title, which would not be a bad thing in my mind, I actually like Umaga, atheletic, skillful, and does not need to say anything to make you understand what he is all about. I know what you mean about Taker, he does usually suffer injuries not too long after a return these days. But I actually see him holding the World Title till Wrestlemania XXV.

I hope they use some of the younger, and most deserving talent well over the next year instead of pushing Batista all the time, the guy is no more than midcard talent at best, yet another piece of proof of Vince McMahon's muscle fetish.

Most of the younger/fresher talent you named need to be pushed, but I just dont think Morrison is at that level yet, sorry to say it but since his gimmick change and his move to ECW other than the one match he had with Punk, he has pretty much sucked. I also dont get why they put him with "No talent, only here because I was on MTV Road Rules" Mike Mizanin.

i am suprised at the level of quality of umaga - every thing points to him being rubbish but for a big man he is quite athletic (something we touched on before) but he reminds me of bam bam bigelo

i think it would be good to see him against taker but i can't see taker seeing the whole year out. call me a sceptic but i just can't see it - also if umaga does go smackdown i can see him fueding with khali (again khali is rubbish but it would be interesting for umaga NOT to be the biggest man in the ring.

Do you really see HHH taking the title? i can't. i didnt know that cena's schedule didn't go full time til summer - maybe orton will retain? its obvious taker will win maybe both titles won't change hands again this year?
who knows?

morrison and miz - just another example of a quick tag team thrown together as vince has nothing better to do with them. its a shame coz i believe morrison is a talent for the future (i prefer his new gimmick) but as for miz he has no business in the ring

Umaga suprised me also, I have to admit I did not expect a hell of alot, but he has proved to be very good in the ring, I would not say he reminds me of Bam Bam, Bam Bam was a completely different style of wrestler. But Umaga does remind me of his brother back in his earlier days. Rikishi in his early days as part of The Headshrinkers was very good in the ring, but then they kept dumping him in crappy gimmicks when he went single.

I can't see Umaga vs Khali, I think Umaga has to remain as the monster heel, and I know for a fact that nobody who is not high on crack is going to cheer for Khali.

I can see HHH winning the title, he has not had a real reign in a few years now, and the fans would now accept him as champion again. I dont see it being a real long title reign, maybe till SummerSlam. Or who knows me may see a double switch, with the MITB winner cashing in at Wrestlemania?

See the only problem I have with the Morrison character is that it just aint getting over, everytime I have seen him on TV using that character the fans do not react, Johnny Nitro however used to get a reaction from the fans. I agree Miz has no business in the ring, he should go back to what he does best, being fame hungry for MTV, maybe try entering this new Paris Hilton competition.

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maybe you are right HHH is more than worthy of a title reign again (hashe held the spinner belt? (other than the hour and half)

and maybe a fued with cena for a title change at summerslam? who knows?

and as for khali/umaga - is it any different to kane/umaga or kane/big daddy v? vince loves these matches

the morrison character is alright i think - however i have just been reading edges book and when he first started he was offered a jim morrison type gimmick but turned it down - maybe it has been floating around for a while (i can't remember whether vince russo had anything to do with it - if so it must be a bad idea) but he is a very talented wrestler with a bright future.


speaking of good wreslers with cap gimmicks - rikishi. another superstar that i really liked - the samoan lineage is possibly the greatest in wwe history (does that even make sense?) but rikishi and umagao carry on are fine examples of this and continue the legacy.

the miz? wwe gold? i would rather watch coach call his own matches

The last time HHH held the WWE title (other than the virtually non existant reign at No Mercy) it was the old belt that Cena took a huge crap on and replaced with the toy belt they now use.

I think they will likely go with HHH vs Cena at Summerslam, but then who knows anything can happen in the next six months to change that.

I see your point here but I just dont see Umaga being face, and heel vs heel matches very rarely work, and the times they do they have to be two top heels with crap loads of talent. And Khali and talent just dont go together.

Yeah I knew the Morrison gimmick had been around for a while, and I do believe that it was Russo's idea originally, and as you stated all of Russo's ideas sucked and still do. I am not going to take anything away from John Hannigan, I agree he is very talented and has a bright future but I dont see him achieving the greatness we and others see in him with this character.

Yeah I did not like "Making a difference" Fatu, "The Sultan" or Rikishi all that much, I preferred him mainly as the samoan savage type character he was in his early career. And I think that character would of gotten over alot more than the ones that followed, and now his little brother is proving it.

I would rather eat crap and die than watch The Miz, a little extreme I know but I think it is the only way to make sure I never have to see him again.

the belt!! when cena first produced that belt i thoght ok JBL will win this back and turn it into a proper championship belt again - obviously not! and it is the number one title on wwe number one show!!
arguably bth ebiggest title in wrestling and its a spinner belt!! - i was ok with the us championship being a spinner - and it eventually came back to a decent belt. in short th espinner sucks. and the sooner it gets changed again the better.

umaga/khali you are right heel v heel matches don't work (if a heel is that good why would the fans want o watch? you are meant to hate heels right?) and besides khali? yeah he sucks - i can't believe he held the title! he should just be left alone to fued with batista and they can keep each other amused while the real talent gets on with the show!

do yo reckon rikishi is kicking himself over umaga (thinking that could have been me) i remember he got a bit of a push at one point and i thought he could have had a title run. but would he have won it with a stink face? tat would really de face the belt possibly more than making it a spinner!

any way my predictions for mania

undertaker - orton - mayweather - JBL - MVP- HBK - Batista - Kane to win battle royal/chavo to retain - i don't really care about bunny mania

You know the belt sucks when TNA are making fun of it by using it as joke championship. I hope HHH wins at Mania and brings back the old belt or a new one.

Khali should just be fired and go back to being a cop in India, he can take Batista with him if he wants, I really dont mind.

I dont know if Rikishi is kicking himself or not because I truly doubt he would of been champion or anywhere close to it with moves like the stink face and the stupid dancing.

My Mania predictions are as follows

World title - Taker
WWE Title - HHH
dumb match - Mayweather (would say Big show but that would defeat the point)
Brawl - Finlay
MITB - MVP
Raw vs Smackdown - No contest (to set up Umaga moving to Smackdown)
ECW - Kane wins battle royal and title
Bunnymania - Maria and Ashley (Ashley will break a bone yet again and will also vomit up the lettuice leaf she had for lunch)
Career match - HBK (I would love to say Flair and something is just making me a little unsure about it but not unsure enough to doubt HBK)

exactly the point on the title - its meant to be the pinnicle of sports entertainment - yet it is a joke and it craps on all the history and past champions. it will change one day - i just hope its soon!

as for khali being fired - again it has to happen soon surely? what is there left for him to do? take over big shows role as the company whipping boy? he is rubbish and only has 2 moves.

and whilst i would love to see Flair win (although not see hbk retire) the stage is set for his retirement - with the hall of fame and career on the line - i really think i am going to cry"!

Khali should go back to making movies, the man was great in star wars.

Yeah I have a house full of friends and family coming over for Wrestlemania this Sunday, everybody has been a fan for atleast 10 years, and I have to say the way things look and pretty much the whole build is saying its Flairs last match. So I think that everybody at my house will be very emotional. I doubt it but I hope they put him in the main event spot, would be a fitting tribute to the greatest of all time.

I think they have to do some Horsemen reunions either at Hall of fame, Mania or at both. I have to say that Flair's last match is the only reason I am even bothering ordering Wrestlemania this year. I had the chance to go watch it at a friends house but turned it down in favor of ordering myself and watching on my 42 inch HDTV. Also means I get to record the show.

I agree in regards to the belt, it has to go!! why WWE decided on a spinner I don't know...it's the tackiest belt they have come up with and looks like plastic lol.

I for one will be emotional during the HBK/Flair matchup, Flair is a true legend in the business and one who is very much respected, and I couldn't imagine a better wrestler for him to wrestle his last match with than Mr Wrestlemania HBK!!!

If Vince is smart he will make this the main event,I couldnt see the locker room having a problem with this, but I doubt it will happen.

All in all I am looking forward to this years WM it's certainly going to be nothing short of spectacular, I'm hoping Taker obtains the belt, HHH to obtain the belt and return on Raw with the classic belt and of course the most important thing for Flair to leave on a high note and have the send off he so deserves!!



Black Label Society SDMF'ER!!

oh yeah maniawil be sweet as in HD and 42 inches! but i can't see flair getting th emain event - its a shame but i always thought he deserved one more shot at the belt.

and as for the horsemen - i genuinly thought they too would be inducted thiS year. after all the horsemen were a big part of flairs career and even wrestling history. it is however only a matter of time before they all are inducted.

you never know they all might show up - vince does like a surprise - but what a shame it would be if flair can't save his career with th ehelp of th efour horsemen. it would sour their legacy - but again do you think vince would care?

I agree Flair deserved to have the title one last time, have him go out on the high note.

I did not think the horsemen would be inducted into the hall of fame this year, but I think it would be great if they were involved somehow. I must say I find it strange that Triple H is doing Flairs induction and not Arn Anderson, surely they should of gave the honor to his best friend of 30 years. Or even have David and Reid do the induction. I know Triple H and Flair are great friends outside of the ring but it just seems so forced.

I think Vince cares very much for Flair, it has been said that Flair is one of the guys that can pretty much say and do as he pleases including let Vince know the truth about his product and get no come backs from it. Vince looks upto Flair a hell of alot, because I truly feel that Vince wanted too and still does want to be like Flair. Everyone knows Vince never wanted to be a commentator, he always wanted to be a wrestler but his dad would not let him.

I hope we atleast get an appearance from Arn Anderson at Mania, even if its just well wishes from Arn to Ric backstage, it would be only fitting for Arn to be there when Flair bows out because Flair was there when Arn bowed out 12 years ago.

oh i was soooo close! and i very nearly went for cm punk ( ilove a bit of hindsight!)

mvp will get his chance at a title this year - he deserves it. i have not yet watched mania but seen the results - was the flair match as good as it reads?

i agree with the HHH point - why not arn anderson? or ricky steamboat? or dusty? hell even hogan - all these people have more history than HHH, but you know him he has to get involved somewhere. (a wrestler with an ego? never!)

i never thought that vince looked up to flair but i can see it - you are right it s no secret he fancies himself as a wrestler (and to be fair he has put on some great matches in his time)

i haven't seen anything of the horsemen. did they show? they are usually there at the HOF

in short - goodbye to one of the greatest of all time

wonder if we will ever see a comeback!! hah ahahah

The HBK vs Flair match was pretty good, one of the best matches on the card. I actually think Taker vs Edge stole the show.

The Horsemen did not show up at all, they did show Arn at the HOF but only briefly.

Ric is taking time off from what I have heard and will be back in a few months but not as an active wrestler. I think they might be pushing Reid to one of the main rosters and Ric will probably be his sons manager.

i heard about reid too - i think he mentions it in his book (as you probably guess i read a lot of wwe books)

i really don't think that flair will evetr wrestle again. what a mark