SPOILERS ARE AHEAD. PLEASE BE FOREWARNED. SPOILERS ARE AHEAD. PLEASE BE FOREWARNED.
THANKS!
I am still not completely sure why Abraham Laing disowned his daughter in this film. What exactly did she do that was so repellent to him? So, she dated a Black man ... so what? I thought Abraham Lang was more tolerant than this
it was apartheid south africa babe...
dating a black guy was such a no no
"I dont chase anyone who wont chase me back....BB"
beneragazza:
I understand that it was very separatist time in that part of Africa, but here is what I don't understand: Why, when Sandra's dad was so enlightened and didn't mind having such a dark daughter, did he suddenly balk at her wanting to date her own kind?
Remember, that earlier in the film, he had defied the cops by sending his daughter to a school where she wasn't welcomed, and also had wanted her classified as being White, so there again ... he was willing to "buck the system", when it suited him.
Would have made sense for him to have bucked the system yet again, in letting his (BELOVED! He loved Sandra and protected her) daughter date who she pleased.
In other words, the dad seemed NOT to care about the impositions of Apartheid, didn't he? Well, he did to me.
Well, that's why the character's so interesting. He fought to get his daughter classified as white because, really, he's just as racist as everyone else around him. He loved his daughter, yes, but that was because of the blood bond - he never thought of her as black, and hated the thought of her being treated as such. It's why he fought so hard for a scrap of classification that doesn't help her at all, and why he reacted so explosively when it turned out she thought of herself as black all along.
Very compelling character. Very good acting by Sam Neill.
Interesting observation, Jimi O.
I was shocked at Abraham's ejection of his daughter, for it surely didn't fit with how very loving he was towards her, before.
I couldn't get over how he punished her by barricading her in her room (She was grown, for Lord's sake) and that the mother was so namby-pamby about it all.
Talk about an Enabler!
"and that the mother was so namby-pamby about it all."
The mother was not namby-pamby. She has similar concerns to her husband. When Sandra says that she is in love with the black man, her mother has no qualms with slapping her face in response. Sandra's mother agrees with her husband's basic sentiment, but believes his reaction is too extreme.
Namby-pamby, meaning that she supported her husband and didn't stand up to him, is all.
RIP: ANY Celebrity that dies too soon. Many are perishing, or, close to dying.
by - DogtownGirl on Sat Nov 14 2009 15:25:53
Interesting observation, Jimi O.
I was shocked at Abraham's ejection of his daughter, for it surely didn't fit with how very loving he was towards her, before.
I couldn't get over how he punished her by barricading her in her room (She was grown, for Lord's sake) and that the mother was so namby-pamby about it all.
Talk about an Enabler! []
The real Sandra was just 15, a child when she ran off and got married.
"Well, that's why the character's so interesting. He fought to get his daughter classified as white because, really, he's just as racist as everyone else around him. He loved his daughter, yes, but that was because of the blood bond - he never thought of her as black, and hated the thought of her being treated as such. It's why he fought so hard for a scrap of classification that doesn't help her at all, and why he reacted so explosively when it turned out she thought of herself as black all along."
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exactly...
the father was not very enlightened. he didn't want the mother to talk to the black african customers, especially in their language. he also seemed to be suspicious of his wife, almost questioning if she had always been faithful to him. he was very stand offish toward his workers and toward the farmers. if you remember, the mother was the first to suggest that they both had "black blood" in their lineage, yet the father never voiced this possibility. he truly saw himself, his wife, and children as "white." he was trying to protect his daughter, but he was also going along with the racist status quo in his country. a part of me was rooting for him because he was trying to stand up for his daughter.
"and why he reacted so explosively when it turned out she thought of herself as black all along."
I wouldn't say all along... about 6 or 7 years earlier she didn't seem to think in terms of being "black" or "white", at least not until it was pointed out to her by others that she looked different.
And she was grown perhaps when her room was barricaded, but as far as I could make out of the story she was still underage! She was still a teenager, and we all know teenagers think they know best, even if they don't.
Running off with Petrus turned out to be a big disappointment, not because he is black, but because he was a drunkard and beat her. It seemed as if she jumped into this relationship rather hastily. Was this just a teenage infatuation?
Running off with Petrus turned out to be a big disappointment, not because he is black, but because he was a drunkard and beat her. It seemed as if she jumped into this relationship rather hastily. Was this just a teenage infatuation?
Agree 100% with you there Nikkiten1979. Sometimes people resort to alcohol and other drugs as a way or dealing with difficult situations thsy have no control over. Big mistake!
shareNo, it was not teenage infatuation. It was a need and desire to belong, to feel loved. Two scenes before her running off with Petrus, she asked her dad at the dinner table if he loved her and asked him to look at her. Then she was matched up with this white guy, he takes her to a place where people are looking at her as if she's a circus freak. She asks him if they can leave and does not want to, pushing her to climb out of a bathroom window.
She was far from infatuated, she needed to belong and it was extremely sad. This movie angered me and deeply saddening me at the same time. I just wish the world was not like this...it is beyond ridiculous.
She did jump into it hastily. That's what happens when parents are too controlling, they force the child to rebel against them. If her parents had been more tolerant and allowed her to date Petrus openly and get to know one him better, maybe she wouldn't have made the rash decision to run off with the first black man she ever fell in love with. She had to run off with Petrus, because her parents refused to accept her relationship with him. Not because they were wise enough to know he'd turn out to be abusive, they didn't know him at all, they simply disliked him he was black, and her father in particular was a racist that didn't want to see his daughter with a black man. Her parents also understood that in order to be able to live with and have children with a black man, she would have to be re-classified as colored, which they didn't want, especially not after all the trouble they had gone through to make her legally white.
Her father was living in a fantasy world where he expected everyone to view his daughter as a white person, just like he did. He expected it to be easy for her to find a nice white guy who would accept to date her (and whose family would approve of it) and that it would be possible for the to of them to go out in public on dates when in Apartheid South-Africa it wasn't even possible to go to the same restaurants if you were of different colors.
She clearly did not feel like she belonged with a white man because of the society she lived in.
Good analysis Propast... call it double standard!
I have to say this is a powerful movie. Not only is the story so powerful and almost sounds like fiction, but also the acting and directing are superb. Great job but as usual real-life great movies don't do well in this main stream commercial world. If only people can be exposed to these kinds of story telling, I reckon the world would become a better place because surely even 'evil' hearted people would be compelled to re-examining their conscience. Great stuff!
>>>Why, when Sandra's dad was so enlightened and didn't mind having such a dark daughter, did he suddenly balk at her wanting to date her own kind?
>>>
He said why in the movie. "I don't want her to be a second class citizen." He wanted her to be a white women married to a white man, so she could live in privilege, instead of squalor.
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Because God created it, the human body
can be uncovered and preserve His splendor. -Pope John Paul
electrictroy:
Just that his actions seemed far too severe to me. If he were my father, regardless of feelings, he would have supported me, in some way or another.
One moment he was all supportive and cuddling to his beloved daugher, then ... the next? He totally slagged her off! Was too jarring to my mind, is all.
RIP: ANY Celebrity that dies too soon. Many are perishing, or, close to dying.
He didn't slag her off. You've got to recognise that he doesn't think of her as black. He isn't in opposition to apartheid. The thing he is upset with her for is having a relationship with a black man. Remember that he insists on not touching hands with black people when he takes money from them in the shop.
His daughter's decision to have a relationship with a black man is seen as bringing disgrace on the family. He considers it as a betrayal. He loves her and he is actually prepared to forgive her if it means she'll leave her black man and come back to them. However, when she insists on staying with her black lover this is more than her father is willing to accept. It doesn't conflict with his attitude to her skin colour, because in his eyes she is white and so the real source of the conflict is that her boyfriend is black, not anything to do with her own darker (is that the right term?) features.
fatpie,
Wow, what can I tell you? Just that I read the dad differently than you did, obviously. I thought that he was NOT as prejudiced, as you did. I thought he liked Black People ! I thought he thought of his kid as being part Black. I mean, she so obviously WAS, right?
RIP: ANY Celebrity that dies too soon. Many are perishing, or, close to dying.
I just saw this movie last night and I think you should watch it again. There is NO point where the father seems to LIKE Blacks. As someone mentioned above, he won't touch them when they buy things at his store, and he scolds the mother for being too friendly. He sees them as a necessary evil almost; they are paying customers, but still inferior. Did you watch this movie with subtitles perhaps? There could have been some mistranslations.
share
I appreciate your opinion. Amazing that you think what you do about what you saw in the film, but I am not going to argue with your perception, either.
Try not to gossip about who / what you don't know. Words are just cruelly speculative.
It isn't my perception alone though...
let me edit and clarify that:
I haven't come across anyone else on this board, or in real life that saw the film and thinks like you do, so I think your perception was closer to 'amazing'. I understand people not thinking he's a racist (for some people, things aren't racist if they aren't blatant, and Mr. Liang never said 'the n word' in the movie). However, the fact that you think he "liked" black people is a bit strange since no one else saw that. Everyone else gave examples- he refused to touch customers, He was for apartheid, he only wanted her to date white guys (even after she had obvious bruising after a date). I guess I'm just confused as to where you got the notion that he 'liked' blacks (can you give an example?)...He was even a member of the nationalist party in the movie and in real life.
So yeah, I wasn't replying to be a jerk or to fight or anything, I just don't see how you came away with the ideas you did and I was curious since you didn't elaborate on why you thought he liked black people.
drakes,
Still, for a father to turn against his own flesh-and-blood as the one in the film did, was to my mind, shocking and remains to be so. I thought the dad even looked part Black, now that I reflect upon having seen the film, to be honest with you.
PROUD member of PETA: People for the Eating of Tasty Animals
What movie were you watching? Her father was clearly white. LOL Sam Neill is the actor and he is clearly white. Although reality is right in front of you, you've built a fantasy of what you wanted this movie to be and it couldn't be further from the truth. He was racist, he did not like black people, he may have loved his daughter, but he didn't like the way she looked. He tried to force her into a system that rejected her. There was no win win situation, all players lost. Very sad and tragic story.
sharekremicoco,
What movie were you watching? Her father was clearly white. LOL Sam Neill is the actor and he is clearly white.
Although reality is right in front of you, you've built a fantasy of what you wanted this movie to be and it couldn't be further from the truth.
He was racist, he did not like black people, he may have loved his daughter, but he didn't like the way she looked.
How can you state that the dad "loved his daughter" yet still was racist? See, those two things just did NOT gell in my mind, sorry. And, to my mind he put skin lightening cream on his kid to make HER LIFE more comfy for her, due to perceptions about the inferiority of Black people at that time, in that place.
Kebrazza,
Pops didn't exactly ACT as though he loved his kid ....
Also, parents who abandon their kids because the kids didn't marry who THEY wanted THEM to, simply are folks to whom I cannot relate.
NOT stating this never happens. Obviously, it does, but I just do NOT understand it nor do I agree with it, sorry.
PROUD member of PETA: People for the Eating of Tasty Animals
The father looked part black? Are you joking? That was Sam Neil, and as far as I know he is caucasian.
Also, you must be incredibly naive if you don't think some parents can disown their daughters like that. There are countless of stories of girl that have been disowned for dating someone of a specific race that her parents didn't approve of, daughters who were pregnant at a young age or without being wed and thus 'bringing shame' on the family, daughters that were disowned for being lesbian or for numerous other reasons. Hell, there are even cases of fathers MURDERING their own daughters because the daughter 'shamed' or 'disappointed' them. It's not right, and I'd personally like to think my father would never disown me, for any reason, but it does happen. I really don't understand how that can seem so implausible to you.
In the film, the actor who played the father looked to me to be part-Black. Now, whether or not this was from expertly applied makeup, or something else, I don't know.
It has never been in my own life experience to see parents treat their own so cruelly as the person played by Mr. Neil in the film did. I am not stating that such cruelty never happens.
Again, in the film, it is my opinion that the viewer could be forgiven for thinking that the father would have stuck more by his own daughter, through thick and thin. His turning his back upon her was awfully sudden to my mind, and did not seem to mesh / jive with what had gone before, to my mind and way of viewing the film.
PROUD member of PETA: People for the Eating of Tasty Animals
I didn't think it was very sudden at all, considering he had made it painfully clear that he did not want his family involved with black people. He was obviously a supporter of the Apartheid government, he even said so himself in one scene. Apartheid is an ideology based on deep-seated racism and hatred for non-whites. People that support apartheid don't just change their values overnight because their daughter decided to date a black man. In fact, interracial dating was the MAIN reason apartheid was inforced, and as he viewed his daughter as white he considered her dating a black man was interracial dating. This was considered detestable and great taboo.
I still think you are naive and that you misunderstood some pretty important key scenes in this movie.
I haven't first-hand experienced parents disowning children either, but I've read enough books and heard enough stories that I definitely don't find it that shocking or hard to believe.
bite me,
For a father that was initially supportive of his daughter, to have rounded upon her in the manner that he did, startled me, and seemed to be not following from what had gone before.
Also, I tend not to believe what I hear and read. I tend to believe what I see / eye-witness. Seeing for me, firsthand, is believing.
Beyond this, I don't wish to "get into it" with anyone.
PROUD member of PETA: People for the Eating of Tasty Animals
I definitely have to agree with others that say her father was a bonafide racist. It's subtle at the beginning (putting the skin lightning cream on her could be interpreted as trying to make things more comfortable for her, or maybe for him?) but when she got older, it was apparent that he was uncomfortable with her appearance based on his own prejudices. For example, when she came home from boarding school, he barely even acknowledged her (no hug, no kisses) and at the dinner table, he never even really looked at her, like he couldn't stand the sight of her or something. Yes, some part of him loved her as a daughter, but when she got older, his hatred for blacks outshined his love for her. Also, he used the word kaffir many times which I think is the South African equivalent to the N word.
shareHow could you think he liked black people? Did you not pay any attention to the film whatsoever? It was more than clear that he was a racist, he saw black people as inferior and he agreed with the apartheid system. He is extremely curt with the black people around him, addresses them in a very dismissive or bossy manner. Refuses to touch their hands when exchanging money. he even called Petrus a "Keffer", which is equivalent to the n-word. The ONLY reason treated his daughter well is because it was his DAUGHTER, he loved her and he didn't view her as black, or even part black. To him, she was a white child that just happened to have dark skin.
sharebite me loser,
The first part of your comment / reply to my OP does not jive with the second part of it. Please read your reply carefully. If the first part were true, then it would stand to reason that the white father would have disowned his Black daughter in the film and not when he did.
Also, it can be argued that just because someone appears to accept apartheid, for the sake of perhaps not being cast out of town by one's own compatriots, and thought of as being a complete pariah, does not mean that one condones the practice of it.
PROUD member of PETA: People for the Eating of Tasty Animals
You demonstrate exactly what was wrong-----------you consider that black African guy to "be her own kind" regardless of her family history and appearance, etc. People like you just keep racism going, and going, and going..................
_______________________________________
"ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED??!!"
Maximus Decimus Meridius
He disowned her because accepting her with a black man was to accept her as black and that was something he was unwilling to do. He loved and accepted her as his daughter and fought against all odds to have her classified as white so that she could have all the opportunities afforded to a white child. He fought hard against the system at the time, who could even have had Sandra removed from his home due to her being classified as colored. So clearly he loved her. Many Afrikaaner fathers would not have accepted her at all and may even have left their wives, assuming the wives had been unfaithful.
But what makes Abraham such a conflicted character (and real life personality) is that he left all that love behind the minute Sandra became involved with a black man and as such, acknowledged her own blackness. Abraham could love her and even fight for her rights so long as she identified herself as white and lived what he deemed a white woman's life. He could not accept that although he and his wife were white, their daughter was not and did not see herself as such.
I think his ignorance and prejudice kept him from ever once trying to see life from her point of view. He never considered how difficult it would be for her attending all white schools or trying to marry into a white family at the time. A very trouble twisted soul he was.
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
thepoet26:
I think his ignorance and prejudice kept him from ever once trying to see life from her point of view. He never considered how difficult it would be for her attending all white schools or trying to marry into a white family at the time. A very trouble twisted soul he was.
I'm actually reading the book right now and am dying to see if Abraham truly did want to see her again before he died. There are some major differences in the book than in the movie, though. For instance, they don't show in the film that he also tried to put a halt to Sandra's plans to become reclassified as colored by refusing to turn over her birth certificate. Sandra also says that her older brother, Leon married and adopted children, claiming that his wife was unable to conceive. Sandra believes the true reason he chose to adopt is because he was afraid perhaps his children would come out black like her.
Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
thepoet26,
... and am dying to see if Abraham truly did want to see her again before he died ...
I'm actually reading the book right now and am dying to see if Abraham truly did want to see her again before he died. There are some major differences in the book than in the movie, though. For instance, they don't show in the film that he also tried to put a halt to Sandra's plans to become reclassified as colored by refusing to turn over her birth certificate. Sandra also says that her older brother, Leon married and adopted children, claiming that his wife was unable to conceive. Sandra believes the true reason he chose to adopt is because he was afraid perhaps his children would come out black like her.
The real Sandra Laing never saw her father again after he disowned her
shareHer real life parents supported apartheid
Black people where lesser than white people to them