This film has a bunch of people being interviewed saying that Michael Moore is a stand up guy, who treated them great, and it has a bunch of people saying the opposite. Now, if this film wants to portray him as a "demon", as you say, why would they include the segments that show he's not?
That's my first point. Here comes my second:
Why are you listing stuff that is only peripherally relevant in the documentary? The movie's main point is about Michael Moore's methods, not whether or not he was born in Flint or not. Do you care about that?
I've seen a lot of Moore defenders say that they didn't dislike the film because of its content but because it was "boring". To me that says a great deal about the audience of Michael Moore. Entertainment first and truth second. I mean, even after this movie shows explicit examples of him manipulating the truth completely (the gun in the bank) you seem to continue to take Moore's exposés at face value and calling his movies great.
Why? Because they have pretty pictures? Shouldn't documentaries strive to present fact, or at least not intentionally produce fiction?
One remark stuck with me from this film, where an old colleague of Michael said that he was more concerned with being quick and witty than being thoughtful.
That just sums it up for me.
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"We're Sonic *beep* Death Monkey!"
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16 years ago
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Daftpfnk
16 years ago
Who cares if they didn't actually hand him the gun in the bank, that situation is ridiculous. Does anyone get the humor in that scene, thats why he carries and holds up the gun, because getting a rifle/shotgun for opening a bank account perfectly sums up the premise of the entire film, the ridiculous way in which this country lets guns float around and are so freely available. Its called dramatic effect and as long as he uses it the way he has in his 'documentaries' (which they were never intended to be) in such a powerful and right on way than more power to him. Piddly complaints like this are all his critics can seem to muster. The real reason so many supposedly hate Moore now is because of the lies and propaganda they themselves have been subjected to by those who just cannot stand to see some things so blatantly rubbed in their faces. They cannot stand the fact that some one like Moore can so powerfully and effectively drive home certain truths about the state of 'our' country, it drives them up the wall. Wheres the great American conservative film maker waiting to awe us all with his stupendous counterpoint presentation? Why is it that all we ever get in response to Moore's work is b*tching and half*ss attempts at discrediting him? The propaganda against him is much more negative and unsubstantiated than anything the man himself has ever done. Are his films as wildly popular as they are because they are so full of lies ? You're telling me morons that will believe anything are lining up for a Michael Moore documentary instead of Transformers? Riiiiiiight.
The Departed - Best Picture 2006
Martin Scorsese - Best Director 2006
There Is A God
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guitar_fun
16 years ago
So what's next Daftpfnk, the "I was only taking orders" or the "End justifies the means" defense. Right wing movies could never get put in uberplexes across the country. They would never get support from the entertainment community. Not paranoia, it is a fact. Some supporters so blindly follow him that they believe Fahrenheit 9/11 AND every 9/11 "Loose Change" conspiracy even though they are mutually exclusive. He calls himself a documentarian, accepts awards in the categories of documentary and made it a point to state "we live in fictitious times, but we are about the truth". All the criticism is accurate he deserves it. I will say he does have a fan base with a cult like loyalty, Jim Jones couldn't get followers to drink this much Kool-Aide. I hope if I am ever put on trial (especially if am guilty) my defense attorney will be half as committed to my defense.
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Daftpfnk
16 years ago
Not sure what anything about your reply has to do with what I had to say but........ as far as Fahrenheit 911 he even wrote a book defending and explaining every point made in the movie. I know it might be painful for you but you should check it out. What is it about the situation that makes you come to such delusional conclusions about the audiences enjoying these films. Like I said before it doesn't make much sense to conclude that as many people that attend his films are drinking Kool-Aid as you so eloquently put. Does it anger you that so many people are interested and angry about the criticisms the films present? Would you rather our 'great' democratic society just not question or criticize things in these especially dark times about 'our' government? I only wish more people were interested in these types of films. Unfortunately the majority would rather stick their heads up their children's asses and watch some middle school talent show.
The Departed - Best Picture 2006
Martin Scorsese - Best Director 2006
There Is A God
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guitar_fun
16 years ago
Well you are either afraid to address the issues or you aren't very bright. You define the typical Moore apologist. He is a documentarian, then he isn't, propaganda is alright as long as his heart is in the right place (i.e. preaching to the choir). You stated, "Does it anger you that so many people are interested and angry about the criticisms the films present?" It sounds like you are assuming I am some Rush Limbaugh right wing neo con instead of the Atheist/Skeptic Libertarian that I am. But I do call *beep* when I see it. Hey man, if it doesn't bother you that he obsfucates issues for things you believe in, thats your choice. But that is still propaganda not documentary film work, no matter what you political views are.
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DaviticusPrime
12 years ago
*obfuscates
Everything else was spot on, though! I especially despise the whole "end justifies the means" bit. As someone else said, if you have to lie to advance a cause, then the cause becomes fiction. If you want to expose the truth, then TELL THE TRUTH.
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TheJesusAndMaryChain
12 years ago
I am a liberal and have seen every one of Moore's film. I whole-heartedly agree with the point he's making in his films but not his tactics. And, does he have to be such a d!ck? He's a self-important narcissistic, hypocritical douchebag. I couldn't believe he had the filmmakers ejected.
This film, to me anyway, started out as being pro-Moore but through learning about his history and deceiptful past, the filmmakers managed to reveal the man behind the mask.
- Jesus died for somebody's sins but not mine
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