MovieChat Forums > Linkeroever (2008) Discussion > Very confused?!? Spoilers(of course)

Very confused?!? Spoilers(of course)


Not really sure of a few things:

1) We see Hella, the former tenant of the flat, disappear in the beginning and then we see her giving birth(or rebirth) to Marie at the end. What does that mean? Was Hella just living in another apartment at the Left Bank? Who was that guy with her? That was not her boyfriend, that had been looking for her, so who was it?

2)What did Marie's hairy knee signify? A mouse(Hella saw one near that room at the start of the picture) ended up coming out of it. I have heard of water on the knee but never mouse.

3) We were bombarded with the general message of rebirth and the such but obviously Bob had either been reborn many times or was immortal(reborn to whom? Random woman or was he in fact a part of Samhaim).

It seemed the Guild members(I only counted 4 or 5 including Bob's "Grandmother") the only people living in the three towers that knew anything was going on. Not the kind of place I would want to stay since throwing up seems the norm, lol.

4)Was Marie really pregnant? A couple of her dreams suggest that. But was she pregnant only with the mouse?

Not a bad flick but not exactly terrifying either. I thought Marie(played by Eline Kuppens) was outstanding and hopefully I will see her in many more movies.

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1) That woman wasn't a tenant nor Hella. She was working on the buildings' plant and just find out a secret lodge and then the movie starts. Marie's boyfriend gave her a chance to start all over again - the rebirth - with happy and lovely parents, the opposite of the chaotic environment of her original family.

2) Its just something to confuse the audience, to make it looks complex without any further explanation or insight.

3) I think he reborn many times. Maybe that woman with the little kid is his mother, but either way, I don't think he's immortal. He have some scars all over his body (sacrifice), so if he is immortal, it wouldn't be just 'some scars' at all.

4) LOL. It would be a great touch to the movie if she was pregnant with the mouse (really, because maybe it would make the movie funny, at least). I don't think she was pregnant only because she puke all the time. Her doctor was skeptic about this idea and state that more than once in the movie. I think she wanted so hard to have a baby (since she most likely wouldn't be able to run again), so maybe it's explain the dreams. But at the end the doctor asked for blood sample, but the movie ended before his analisis. So I think that we can't be 100% sure about that.

It's a bad movie, a really bad one. Maybe Dirk and Bobby did a good job, but Marie didn't at all. Eline Kuppens may be a great actress, but she wasn't good on this movie.

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1) That woman wasn't a tenant nor Hella. She was working on the buildings' plant and just find out a secret lodge and then the movie starts. Marie's boyfriend gave her a chance to start all over again - the rebirth - with happy and lovely parents, the opposite of the chaotic environment of her original family.


But the midwife called her Hella. "What are you going to name her, Hella?" Surely that is not a coincidence.

Who put acid in my spam?

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Of course it's not a coincidence that's the same character ! And here we go again : someone saying a movie is bad without understanding it properly. Good Heaven !

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Then Please explain what the original poster asked; I`m still REALLY confused

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A few things I noticed in the movie concerning your questions:

First, I don't know what the deal with the mouse was. That was weird, and was probably intended to be ambiguous, although there was a mouse with Hella when she went through that cloth barrier.

As for Bobby, he was the same age in all the photographs in those clubhouse files, so I think we can rule out that he was being reborn, but instead is either immortal or gets rejuvenated through the Samhain feast. It's also unclear to me whether the form Bobby was in at the end was a costume or a transformation.

The question about Hella is more cut and dry. When Dirk had dinner with Marie, he mentioned that Hella had been missing for *8* months. Also, Dirk was extremely surprised at the Pregnancy for Dummies book that Hella had been reading at the library, and obviously Dirk was not present at the delivery of the reborn Marie at the end. What ISN'T clear to me is where Hella was during those 8 months; either she was with the guy at the delivery (who looked an awful lot like Marie's coach, which would be a weird coincidence), or the same thing happened to her that happened to Marie. Because as you may recall, Dirk said to Marie that the feast of Samhain was thought to open "cracks in time", accessed through a cave or a pit. A lot would have been clearer if we saw whether Hella actually went into the pit itself after she broke into the cellar, or if she left. However, after Hella went through that cloth barrier we saw the same vibrating visual effect that we saw when Marie was going through that cave tunnel/Hella's womb.

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I am just gonna ramble a bit here....

>The Blonde giving birth to Marie at the end DID look like the Hella from the beginning, but older. No way that's a coincidence.

>The man with Hella at the end, I believe, WAS Dirk. Older looking (Like Hella) with cosmetic or CGI hair loss, and some make up. Definitely HIS face.

>Hella disappeared 8 months before these proceedings, and the story time was roughly a month in duration it seemed, which would bring about a 9 month term. This lends to the Guilds timetable, or countdown.

>At the end when Marie emerges from the water, then climbs through the caverns (shakey cam effect, from the opening) it cuts directly away to the actual birth.

>As was pointed out, the well can create cracks in time. In the deleted scenes of the DVD there are at least two scenes I recall dealing even more with a crack being present, then filled...only for Marie to plunge her hand deep into it.

All these points seem to indicate, to me, the following:

1. Hella fell through the muck, and was reborn somewhere, somewhen else.

2. Marie established a bond with Dirk, which was more innocent than anything else. Dirk supplied info about the building to both Marie, and her MOTHER. When Marie wore Hellas skirt, she chose a special one to Dirk, but he insisted she keep it. Then they innocently kissed, and though he apologized, she acted as if it were normal behavior. At the funeral, when Marie broke down, she embraced Dirk first. Then, perhaps most importantly, Dirk defended Bobby's advances on Marie...at her MOTHER'S funeral. Theme's and links of a Father figure.

3. Then, after Marie's re-emergence through the muck (9 months later) she is being born to Hella and Dirk (again, aged either through cosmetics or CGI).


If I am correct in that assessment (and I don't know that I am, but that's how I see it), then the Guild really weren't as evil as we may have previously thought. Maybe when Bobby said he was trying to give her a chance to be reborn and start over, start fresh....maybe he sincerely meant it. He DID, after-all, comment that even when she was running (her passion), she seemed unhappy.

As for the mouse, or the knee, or being preggers with the mouse IN the knee, I have NO idea. Maybe it was some regional or religious idea that outsiders won't understand. Or, it was probably just chemical induced story-telling by the screen-writers. Are mice symbolically linked to reincarnation, or procreation somewhere in religious or philosophical contexts? Probably not....but I really don't know.

Not as good as I hoped...the performances were strong, cinematography as well. In the end, though, just sort of...Meh.

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The woman at the beginning of the movie is Hella who also gave birth at the end of the movie. My guess is that she ran away from that place after she found the black hole. She knew the meaning of it after all the research she did. She was not a sacrifice because they only needed a sacrifice once in 7 years. She was pregnant and scared, so she run leaving a box with her research behind to warn others. The father at the end was Maries trainer.
A lot of loose ends in the movie though...
Why would Dirk call Marie over to the clubhouse to see some old newspapers if he could just take them with him instead of waiting in the lair of the enemy (and bringing Marie there also)?
Why would Bobby keep those newspapers around waiting to be found bij anyone?
How could 'the gild' kill two cops and another man outside such a large building without being seen?
there are a lot more of those questions...

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But the midwife called her Hella. "What are you going to name her, Hella?" Surely that is not a coincidence.

That woman at the start IS Hella. She is wearing the dress that Dirk gave Marie and said was Hella's, though how it ended up back at Dirk's place nice and clean, I'm not sure. And as you say, she is seen at the end of the film giving birth and is referred to as Hella. I have no idea what she is doing with the coach though, which I found bizarre.

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I am only going to comment on the Mousy Symbolism. Could it be that the mouse was symbolic of all the bad things, sadness, etc that had accumulated in Marie....rather like a poison that had to come out.....so that she would be born clean & pure with no baggage? This was how I took it to mean.

Marie did indeed state that she had a lot of baggage. Maybe this was the Guild's way of having her leave her old baggage at the door & her old world & her old negative habits....and enter the new world, born pure, innocent, clean & happy.
Otherwise Marie's history would continue to repeat itself again & again OR she would be an unhappy girl no matter what changed during her rebirth (whether it be new parents or new circumstances).
She was very negative, which she had learned a lot of that from her mother. She was also very sad, which she'd gotten (I gathered) from her father's absences & the parent's divorce.
Even Marie's coach mentioned (the beginning - just after she placed second in the race) that she couldn't be happy about anything....even if something good happened to her.
Then Bob basically made comments of a similar nature, like when he first met her in the locker room....about her being stand-offish. Bob mentioned her gloominess a second time, about the fact that when she ran (which seemed to be her passion) she didn't seem happy.
Maybe Bob & the Guild gathered she was too polluted with baggage to be reborn & she needed to be cleansed of her old life. Since getting rid of this mouse was painful & so was her birth...since she screamed at both.....this seemed to me to be symbolic of purging out the old baggage & thought processes. Out with the old & in with the new - Similar to Bob's description of the symbolism of the Dragon eating it's tail.

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I think you hit the nail on the head. It seems like more people would have gotten that since her knee turned black, hairy and ugly then a mouse poped out but I didnt eather till you explaiined it. It makes so much sense that her knee turning that way and the mouse represented all her negative stuff. Thanks for explaining!
I thought the movie was good but not great. It was def interesting enough to have made it worth watching though.

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Thanks for your comments,

I just re-watched it again, since it came back on cable late last night & nothing else was on....heheheh & I started to think about the purifying thing again. I think the Purifying Process started even sooner than I thought. The things that clued me into that were......(when I said out with the old & in with the new):

1)The Bleeding - They called it a Virus, I call it Purification. (Marie had just met Bob & was going on a date with him. He could have started the purification process with Marie the day they met on the archery range & then when he came in naked in the shower. His mere very near presence to her/ just by being close to Marie, started things changing inside her)

2)The Vomiting - She is still a very negative person, but notice how her attitude changes after being with Bob. She smiles more, and is even giddy at times. That is of course when she is not driving herself crazy with conspiracy plots about missing people.
(Regarding the vomiting.....By then Marie had had moved in with Bob and had begun having intercourse with him. He is closer to her that just his mere presence.....causing even more of a purification effect....a volatile purification in the form of vomiting)

3)The Mousie Furry Knee Injury - This would be the final assault on her system & the final end stage cleansing of her system...maybe her mind & memories? (Marie was having round the clock sex with Bob & it was pretty intense to say the least if not a little volatile at times. Unfortunantly, she was also in the process of leaving Bob, to go back to Momma's. Bob was losing his chance to help her & his hold over her...... so this was it... Time to move it or lose it with Marie!)

Also a lot of people are asking who the guy is that is with the "New Mother" at the end of the movie...since it isn't her boyfriend who was looking for her & it wasn't Marie's Coach, either.
I think Bob saw that Marie looked to her Coach as a Father Figure. The Coach was very loving & caring toward Marie & I noticed that when Marie fainted after the "bleeding" episode, the Coach was there with the Mother, which I found to be odd....where was her Dad? (I guess he was too busy recording music, to be bothered with Marie's health issues?) One would think that a father would be a little more concerned about his daughter when they're are a primed athlete, in top physical condition....Then suddenly suffer from a bleeding episode, followed by passing out episode, which is completely out of character for them. I sure as hell would be at the hospital trying to find out why that happened & nothing would stop me or take precidence over that!
My guess was that maybe Bob had some control over who ended up as Marie's Father too....& since it really wasn't feasable to have her Coach jump through the hole, also.... Bob ensured that the "New Mom" hooked up romantically with someone similar to the Coach, who would eventually become Marie's new biological Father in her new life.

That's my interpretation anyway....

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Just saw on a Wicca website that a mouse symbolises rebirth.

Hair growing in usual places was an indication that someone was a witch.

Sunflowers stand for fertility. I wonder if the middle aged Hella was struggling getting pregnant, given all the sunflowers in her apartment?

Chaos reigns

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Still no satisfactory explanation on th coach and Hella at the end and Hella's whereabouts the last 8 months. I've been thinking about it a lot and can't come up with a satisfactory explanation.

....

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Still no satisfactory explanation on th coach and Hella at the end and Hella's whereabouts the last 8 months.
Hella is off gestating somewhere. I gather we are expected to believe she is pregnant to the coach (???). Though how she established a relationship with him without either Marie or Dirk knowing, I have no idea. I also have no idea whether he is involved with the Guild.

Hella gives birth to a reborn Marie, who gave the Guild their septennial female sacrifice.

I have no ideas on the "mouse' (Was it a mouse? It looked rather gross.).

However one conclusion I arrived at, was that this film categorically suggests "Mothers know best" and that Marie was rather foolish to take no notice of her mum who really had all the answers (and was therefore eliminated).

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funny how the whole mouse thing kind of evokes Rosemary's Baby

And now, the news.

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I don't think it was a mouse looked like a worm or parasite that makes it out her knee then moves and falls into the muck.

The guild were portrayed much smarter than they actually were. Bobby seemed like such a loser yet he is meant to belong to this group with centuries of wisdom, it was hard to believe. Marie runs from two of them after escaping the club house yet when she chooses to stop Bobby happens to be sitting at a Bus stop, this someone who apparently was against public transport use shown when he found out dirk didn't drive a car.

It could also be said that Marie killed Bobby before going through the pit as she stabs him in what looked high in the heart region, left him screaming in pain, so she probably killed him.

Also what made no sense in a movie about rebirth was Bobby's statement about how his parents would have already returned to live again, when only girls were sacrificed. A lot of contradictions in this movie.

If that is Marie's coach at the end it would make some sense as she would end up having a coach father to train her if she got into running again.

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Marie runs from two of them after escaping the club house yet when she chooses to stop Bobby happens to be sitting at a Bus stop, this someone who apparently was against public transport use shown when he found out dirk didn't drive a car.

The two fellas must've given Bobby a call after they lost her. His car was parked at the bus stop, so he didn't just 'happen' to be there.
I agree there were holes and inconsistencies, but there generally are in these kind of films. I don't think it was great, but I enjoyed it. Mainly for the performances and atmosphere. Aspects of the storyline seemed a bit half-baked to me.

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I know I'm late to this discussion. I want to add my conclusion and this link to a page I just put up showing Marie is born to Hella and the coach, and that the midwife/nurse is Bobby's Grandmother.

http://imalreadytoobusy4this.blogspot.com/2016/02/left-bank-linkerover-2008.html

I don't like spoon-fed horror. So I've watched this thing 4 or 5 times now.

Bobby definitely loved Marie. That's why he made the ultimate "love sacrifice" and sent her through the hole to the alternate universe where she could start a life at the beginning again, because he believes that she will be happier. We see how much he loves her throughout the film. He tells her she is the first person he has ever given flowers to, he tells her she doesn't look happy even when she is running. He tells her he thinks he knows how to make her happy. The grandmother excitedly tells her how he's talked about her and when he says we're trying to take her mind off running, the grandmother says to her everything will be better soon. And Marie tells Bobby lots of things like how she wants to start again, and life isn't right.

The neighbor lady, when giving Marie the info about Hella, said she didn't want to call Dirk the boyfriend herself because she got a bad feeling from him. He does drag her in further, and even tells her to come to the Guild which is obviously "unsafe" just to show her something. He also drags her mother in, and her mother gets killed. He hits on her when he sees her in Hella's skirt. There's a creepy element to Dirk, which is good because it re-casts Bobby in the good light he's supposed to be in.

Time isn't linear. It's not like Marie was reborn in the future, or on a timeline. Things are layered and parallel sometimes. She went through the hole into an alternate universe to start again.

It's possible there was a subplot that Hella disappeared by Dirk's hand, but that's on the editing room floor. We know it's Hella in the beginning of the film finding the hole in the basement because its her same sticky note that is on the box of Hella's stuff in the apartment. We know it's Hella at the end because the midwife calls her Hella and that's just too coincidental. But we don't really know what happened to her in the first world. Her being pregnant and giving birth in the parallel world doesn't necessarily mean anything. Did she fall into the hole? Or is that another her? We don't know.

I do think the hole passes into another universe, another dimension. I do not think it is just a time portal, because that would be linear and limited to only the same timeline in past present future, and that doesn't work here. I don't think Hella happened to hook up with the coach in the present linear time line and Marie was reborn to them. Although neither the coach or Hella have aged at all, Bobby's grandmother is there too. Also, when the camera pans out the window after you see all the potted sunflowers inside, you see the outside. It's the Left Bank, and it looks different, with fields of sunflowers outside.

I think the Dragon Guild that makes the sacrifice every 7 years, is sending someone to be reborn in the alternate universe, which is right there parallel to theirs. It's the healthier, happier universe. I think that's why the grandmother says to Marie it is a sacrifice of love, because Bobby loves her so much he is sacrificing his own happiness by sending her away. He does it for her happiness, to give her a new start.

I liked the movie. There's a lot of unanswered questions, and there is a lot of symbolism, like the mouse. The silt Marie has inside of her shows she is selected for rebirth. And there are also storylines that don't pan all the way out enough to connect without creative thinking. Like, the absentee father, and the idea that Marie has to get sick so she can't go away to run. When she runs again anyway, she hurts her knee. She is being kept from leaving, so she'll be here for the sacrifice. But what there was of a storyline really worked on a lot of levels.

Someone on another thread remarked at how hot the sex scene was between Bobby and Marie when they first met. That is very true and very intentional. You see his scars, and you see how they connect. She was the right one.

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Yes, it was def an alt universe.

And I don't agree that there were unanswered questions.

Hella discovered the hole, and got busted, they guild members took her out.
They will def kill to protect their secret, we see them do this in open
light. The cops plus Vlad were killed off without hesitation.
Trying to make out that Dirk was somehow a bad guy doesn't make sense.
Bobby was clearly just jealous. They also killed Dirk later on after
catching him at the clubhouse.

The mouse and her sickness was her "baggage" that she needed to expel
before going into the pit.

Bobby was wearing a rotten meat suit, which was pinned to his body, this
is why there is scars of him.

She was set up from the very beginning of the movie, or perhaps Hella was
to be the sacrifice, but they found that she was pregnant and they just
killed her off, and somehow 'programmed' the hole to put her in a happier
life with the coach and a new baby, which is the reincarnated girl.

One thing is clear, the guild doesn't believe they are doing anything wrong
due to they don't actually kill the sacrifice, but reincarnates them.

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EXCELLENT write up DylanSo! Thank you so much for taking the time. I just watched this for the fourth time and yes yes yes to every thing you wrote. When Dirk tells her to come to the Guild which is so dangerous I realized for sure at that moment that all the red flags about him all along were true -he's the bad guy. It is that point for me that opens up the way to see Bobby as the good guy, in balance and also in the story. It's just a well crafted plot point there, and so much fell into order for me afterward. It's as strong as the plot point where the grandmother tells maria it is a sacrifice of love from Bobby, because it really is. He loved her but sent her away, so she could be someplace better.

Her sickness is the reason she doesn't go away and follow her dreams of running. The sickness is important because it keeps her there, like you said, where she needs to be. That's proven when she tries to run anyway and hurts her knee. These physical things -the sickness and the knee - are happening to her to stop her going away, you're right.

I liked this too, despite the questions left unanswered.

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