or someone like him?
The people who handled the Silent Hill franchise were not smart. They could have had an almost halfway decent horror trilogy going if they had hired someone who knew what they were doing. This was heartbreaking.
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Agreed. I think a good screen writer could have found a way to conclude the first story without rebooting or just made it a standalone.
The second one bothers me because it tried to put its own creative spin on the story of the game while still trying to follow the story of the game and connect it with the crap story that was the first film. It ends up being an incoherent mess where no one but people who have played the series are able to follow.
Rose in the first movie was pretty dumb and was guaranteed a bad ending the moment she accepted the Alessa/demon/witch/thing's offer to get her into the cult's church. It was idiotic and Sean Bean's character was a waste of film. His character continued to be useless into the sequel.
The theme they were trying to shoehorn into the first film that 'mother was god in the eyes of a child' I couldn't buy because both Dahlia and Rose were stupid parents and it was hard to empathize with either.
What I liked about the first game was the contrast in parenting between Harry Mason and Dahlia. The opportunity was sorely missed in these films.
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I don't think James Wan would be a good fit for the series, because his particular type of horror isn't really the same as Silent Hill's brand (that's not to say that the second movie had anything to do with the Silent Hill horror brand). Don't get me wrong, I love Insidious and The Conjuring, I just think they're less psychological in nature than Silent Hill is.
Rose in the first movie was pretty dumb and was guaranteed a bad ending the moment she accepted the Alessa/demon/witch/thing's offer to get her into the cult's church.
Sean Bean's character was a waste of film.
The theme they were trying to shoehorn into the first film that 'mother was god in the eyes of a child' I couldn't buy because both Dahlia and Rose were stupid parents and it was hard to empathize with either.
What I liked about the first game was the contrast in parenting between Harry Mason and Dahlia. The opportunity was sorely missed in these films.
Dahlia' brainwashing wore off the minute the door closed for a ritual that Dahlia had to know was going to happen. They fumbled the backstory.
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I don't think James Wan would be a good fit for the series, because his particular type of horror isn't really the same as Silent Hill's brand (that's not to say that the second movie had anything to do with the Silent Hill horror brand). Don't get me wrong, I love Insidious and The Conjuring, I just think they're less psychological in nature than Silent Hill is.
I'm unsure how [Rose]'s deal with Alessa could be viewed as being "dumb"
There's actually a whole plethora of different types of mothers in the film: Rose as a mother to Sharon, Dahlia to Alessa, Dark Alessa to Alessa, Cybil to children in general, and Christabella to her flock.
I love the Silent Hill games. There's nothing about the films that are psychological or smart however. The first movie treats the audience as if they're stupid ("Good job, Rose! Now you get to learn the truth about Alessa! She used to be a good little girl!)
The visuals in the film were great but there was nothing really scary or tense about it. The films would have benefited immensely with a director who knew how to set up scares or make the atmosphere tense. You go in thinking you're going to see a horror movie. Not a disjointed action adventure. The original three games to this day still have pretty intense, sometimes scary moments. The films did not.
si
Yes it's obvious that Rose won't die, but Silent Hill isn't a Who dies next type of film. Watching Rose get attacked is not so much the suspense as the pain. We can feel her thrown into the horrorlopolis town and think about her suffering even while we wait for a resolution.
There's nothing about the films that are psychological or smart however
You go in thinking you're going to see a horror movie. Not a disjointed action adventure.
The original three games to this day still have pretty intense, sometimes scary moments. The films did not.
They were both lead around by the cult or Alessa yet, unlike the character in the first game, didn't stop to think for a minute and do things their own way.
I didn't find Rose to be a smart character. She didn't have that 'ah hah' moment where she decided she was done being the pawn of Alessa and [the cult]. She didn't seem like a heroine at all. Just a sheep being lead out to slaughter.
And none of it had to actually do with the original story of the game.
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I agree to disagree.
That summary you gave me would indeed indicate a psychological horror but the execution of the film, in my opinion, did not accomplish this well. It was more gore and action and eye candy pyramid head for the fans more than anything else. Psychological horrors start off quiet and subtle and then builds.
Films like: Jacob's Ladder, Session 9 (maybe), Rosemary's Baby, The Shining, and Mulholland Drive are perfect examples of smart, psychological horror.
The Silent Hill films were great to look at but there was not much else going for them. The story execution screamed 'BASED OFF THE HIT VIDEO GAME' and there is really no heaviness to them or the characters. The first film actually tries and is only a little bit better than the second one. But it's not saying much.
No offense, but did we watch the same movie? Regardless of whether it scared you, it is very obviously a horror film, and there is nothing even sort of action genre-like about it. How can a movie without only one 10 second fight scene be classed as action?
Dahlia broke from the cult after Alessa's burning and refused to have any part of her revenge. I'd call that doing her own thinking.
And what would that have accomplished? If she tried to save Sharon alone, she would simply have been overpowered by the dozens of cultists. The only thing Rose would gain from not making the deal with Alessa is her own death and that of her child. She wasn't being dumb in the least by doing what Alessa wanted her to; she was merely doing what was necessary to ensure the survival of her child.
The film exists within its own canon and should be judged on that.
I agree to disagree as well. I found the first movie to be beautiful, deep, disturbing and full of psychological horror. It's one of the few movies I've ever seen that has so many layers that you can think about it for hours and still not have uncovered every part of it. The only problem I ever saw was some of the dialogue was poor, but that was offset by everything else being so well done.
I believe I watched the same film as you. I own the first one. I also really wanted them to be great films but they are all style and no substance. Great soundtrack though.
She didn't really break free. A person who was reasonable would have went in to stop the cult from harming their kid or die trying. She just goes "what have I done??" and walks away. What? There was no reason for Alessa to spare her like she did.
Well I don't know. None of the characters from the Silent Hill games had to merge with Alessa in order to reach a conclusion in their story? They all pretty much had all the supernatural odds stacked against them fighting against the town (or Alessa) and were alone yet managed just fine.
Even Heather in the game didn't have to merge with her former self. She put the memory to rest. Merging with Alessa is a completely new concept made up just for the films.
There were other ways but the screenwriter kind of boxed the character into it.
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I don't want to put words in another posters mouth, but what I think he was referring to was not "action film", but "Survival Horror" which is what category the Resident Evil, and Silent Hill games fall under.
The movie goes into a lull when Rose is running around evading monsters and trying solves pieces of the puzzle in Dark Alessa's test. It felt like watching a clip on You Tube of someone playing one of the games.
"One of the movie's themes is moral ambiguity,"(Yes It Is) "which is tied into nicely by Rose being forced to chose between two evils. That doesn't make her dumb."
Yes it does. Rose wouldn't have faced theme(s) of "moral ambiguity" if she hadn't made a rash, and stupid decision to take Sharon to Silent Hill in the first place thinking that somehow it would miraculously heal her mental condition. She even says so in her phone call to Chris "That it was a mistake", but according
to Gans and you, "Chris is the Bastard" for wanting to seek mental health
counseling for Sharon, and the reason "Sharon 2.0" doesn't allow herself and
Rose to return home.
I didn't care for Alessa's test either since the character ended up doing things Alessa's way anyway so there was no point in 'testing' Rose.
The whole time I felt I wasn't watching a REAL film but a movie that wasn't good at explaining itself to the general audience that wasn't familiar with the game. It wasn't even in a good way either where it's just 'too smart' for some people. It wasn't.
I've shown the film to several friends and family members and they didn't find it scary or psychological.
The whole idea that Sharon might be healed if she went to Silent Hill is nonsensical. What gave Rose that incentive in the first place? Nothing she googled said there was anything there to HEAL people. Her search results didn't show any healing springs or healing witch doctors. I understand it's not the same story from the game but it's completely contrived to have Sharon have nightmares about Silent Hill, wake up screaming its name (coupled with the bad acting), and have Rose think it's a great solution to take her daughter to a town that she screams in her sleep.
Just because Rose passed the test, doesn't mean there was no point to it. Alessa was testing Rose to see if she had the strength necessary to stand up to the cult and to become Alessa's new mother. If Rose had failed these tests, she would have been either sent back out into the real world without Sharon or killed.
So Rose would be dead in Silent Hill and Sharon would still be in Dahlia's apartment. Dark Alessa's entire scheme went for naught because Rose gets stabbed.
IT's a pure plot hole to say that D Alessa was driving the monsters to attack Rose AND that Dark Alessa intended to use Rose to get inside the church. There is no way to scheme around it with a "test."
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Well I don't know. None of the characters from the Silent Hill games had to merge with Alessa in order to reach a conclusion in their story? They all pretty much had all the supernatural odds stacked against them fighting against the town (or Alessa) and were alone yet managed just fine.The "merging with Alessa" idea was not a new concept made up for the films; that concept was present in the original Silent Hill game. In fact, that concept was really the catalyst for the first game's events. Alessa psychically influenced Cheryl to return to Silent Hill because Alessa wanted to recombine the two halves of her soul and kill herself to prevent the god from being born. Heather is simply a reincarnation of Alessa with her soul intact. share
Even Heather in the game didn't have to merge with her former self. She put the memory to rest. Merging with Alessa is a completely new concept made up just for the films.
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^WRONG! It's just the opposite. Alessa's astral projection appears in the road causing Harry's to swerve and crash the Jeep, thus trying to keep them out of Silent Hill, and out of The Order's hands, who need the "second half of the soul" so they can usher in their "God" by recombining the two halves of the soul. It was the whole point of Alessa splintering off her soul and putting into, or creating Cheryl in the first place. If Alessa needed the second half of the soul to kill herself, then why didn't she do so right after the astral projection of Alessa passed through her in the Jeep? As far as why Harry and Cheryl are going to Silent Hill, it was never explained in the trailer or game. My guess they were either heading there for vacation, or Dahlia managed to locate Cheryl through black magic and called her back similar to how Dark Alessa did in the movie.
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Plus, the Book of Lost Memories states she called to Cheryl so she could commit suicide, and the official guidebook says she merged with Cheryl early in the game.
It is the way of men to make monsters; and it is the nature of monsters to destroy their makers.
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Becareful of "Official" guides and what comes out of Team Silent's mouths.Well that's interesting. I found the original question on Twitter here:
"I remember that I said "Good" was the true ending, because Good+ is a game's game. Probably, Owaku remembered that and he wrote SH3 story as a sequel to "Good". But, now, I change my mind and consider the "Good+" is a true ending."
Keiichiro Toyama - Director of Silent Hill (1999)
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Okay, now that I finally have some time...
I'm assuming this means when the astral projection of Alessa collides with the Jeep it is presumed to have recombined with cheryl. Here lies the problem with that. If Burnt Alessa's astral projection has recombined with Cheryl's half of the soul, Burnt Alessa is in Big Trouble. Alessa in the Fog Realm is just an astral projection. Burnt Alessa is a wheelchair bound invalid in the "Real" world. If the astral projection of Alessa absorbs Cheryl's half of the soul then that means the "complete" soul is now in Burnt Alessa in the "Real" world... right there for Dahlia and the taking. This is why I say that the astral projection of Alessa doesn't recombine with Cheryl in the Jeep collision, it's too dangerous for Alessa to be in possession of both halves of the soul because The Order needs to only go after one target. It would make sense that Alessa was trying to keep Harry and Cheryl away by causing a crash, and keeping them out of Silent Hill. It also makes a lot more sense if Dahlia located Cheryl and called her to Silent Hill. Alessa then senses her in the area and intervenes by causing a crash before getting to Silent Hill.Though it's up in the air as to whether it happened during the crash, we know that Alessa recombines the two halves of her soul very early in the game since we never see Cheryl again after Harry gets attacked in the alley (aside from her appearance on the mall TV screens, which is most likely Alessa's doing). That being the case, the game would've been over in about five minutes if it was as simple as Dahlia waiting beside Alessa's body for the soul's return. But Alessa apparently found ways to evade Dahlia and didn't need to be in her physical body all the time, which is why she popped up in random places (in the road at the beginning, after the first boss fight, at the Green Lion, etc.). As for Alessa making a single target of herself by making herself whole again, "The Order" consisted only of Dahlia during the game. We know there are other cultists because of the flashback we see near the end of the game, but we never see them in person. Therefore, Alessa didn't have much to worry about as far as being overwhelmed by Order members. Actually, she probably had a decent chance of not being caught at all until Dahlia manipulated Harry into helping with her capture.
Here's my argument for Alessa killing herself without recombining with Cheryl and preventing "God" from being born. It's a two for one. Alessa has powers that can generate horrific creatures, and warp the Fog Realm into an alternate reality. Those powers can transcend the Fog Realm and be applied in the "Real" world. She astral projected in front of the Jeep, and dragged Kauffmann's psyche into the Fog realm while he was sleeping. But most of all, she's using her telekinetic powers to keep herself from succumbing to her burns (see Lisa's video tape)But here's the thing: Alessa was physically unable to "just give up." If she could have, we can be sure she would've done so way before the events of SH1. And no, Alessa wasn't using her powers to keep herself from succumbing to her burns. Dahlia cast a "magical spell" on Alessa that forced her body to stay alive and kept her in constant pain (as in the videotape you brought up, Lisa indirectly tells us that Alessa's wounds won't heal). Alessa wanting to end that prolonged pain is what caused her to reach out to Cheryl in the first place. So yes, she wanted to die, but apparently she needed both halves of her soul in order to have enough power to do so.
Why not just give up?
Alessa wants to die. And in doing so, Dahlia and The Order lose one half of the soul which prevents "God" from being born. They now have no use for Cheryl's half of the soul. Cheryl can live happily ever after with Harry. It's a Win/Win for Alessa, a Win for Cheryl, and it's "O and 1" for Dahlia and The Order.
As for the Seal of Metatron, it's nothing more than a protective seal that keeps Dahlia from entering the "Alter" World. It probably negates her use of black magic. That's why she needs and uses Harry to get to Alessa, the seals have no effect on stopping him from entering the Alter World. So if the using The Seal of Metatron is so physically demanding on the user, why die a hard and taxing death using them? Again, all she has to do is stop using her powers to keep herself alive.Going by what the Seal of Metatron/Virun VII memo says, it has protective and dispelling properties. I've also seen it referred to by the creators as "a spell of annihilation." In other words, Alessa believed that the way to destroy the god and finally end her life was to create this seal. The fact that she wasn't able to do this before Cheryl's return means that she needed both halves of her soul in order to have enough power to accomplish these goals.
Now back to canon. I made these arguments before Silent Hill 3 was made. And I think some of them are just as sound, if not more than the back story we got from SH3, that's why I threw out that quote by Keichiro Toyama, about him changing what the canon ending of Silent Hill (1999) was when Silent Hill 3 came out and it didn't jive with the new release. The makers of Silent Hill don't even know which ending is canon, and they created the game.Well, to me (and most other fans from what I can tell), SH3 did jive with the original game. They simply fleshed out the mythology surrounding the cult in SH3. But as I said before, it doesn't matter whether the SH1 ending is officially Good or Good+ since the only real difference - whether Cybil lives or dies - is irrelevant to the continuation of Alessa's story.
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I seem to recall Cybil telling Harry (maybe at the antique shop) that she had seen her, somewhere(?)I haven't played it in a while either, so I just looked it up on YouTube. When Harry asked Cybil if she'd seen Cheryl, she tells him she saw "a girl" and that she tried to follow her, but she vanished. When he asks if the girl she saw was Cheryl, she couldn't say, but mentioned how she was "walking on thin air" in the place where the road was cut off. Since there's no indication that Cheryl had any abilities to do something like what Cybil described, it sounds like the girl she saw was Alessa.
Divining, Gyromancy, etc. You say she's responsible for casting a spell that keeps Alessa from succumbing to her burns. If she can manage that type of black magic, locating Cheryl and calling her back shouldn't be that hard. Also I don't remember the word for word on Lisa's video tape, If I recall call, as a nurse, she doesn't know what's keeping her alive. I can't remember ever hearing that it was one of Dahlia's spell keeping her alive. I remember hearing that Dahlia and, or the Order burned her for submission reasons to control her, knowing her telekinetic powers would keep her being killed.If Dahlia could've located Cheryl by those (or similar) means, then why didn't she do that right after she realized half of Alessa's soul was gone? She could've found baby Cheryl way before Harry and his wife ever saw her on the side of the road. Dahlia obviously did have some knowledge about magic, but she either wasn't powerful enough or didn't have enough magical knowledge to locate Cheryl - or Alessa, for that matter - on her own. Besides, even Claudia, who seemed to be more powerful than Dahlia, ended up having to hire a regular old detective to find Heather, so apparently any powers or magic either of them could've used to locate someone weren't all that great.
I believe what you are a referring to is a memo that came from the Silent Hill 3 game? As far as I'm concerned, that's defining it's purpose by retconning. In the first game, The Seal of Metatron's only definition is that of a protective symbol that keeps Dahlia out of areas that Alessa has marked.Yes, I'm talking about the memo in SH3. However, I've seen a English translation of the official guidebook for SH1 online that features a Q&A with the creators, and from what I remember, when they were asked what the Seal of Metatron is, they said it's a "spell of annihilation." Also, I remember it mentioning the copyright of the guide being 1999, meaning it was released shortly after the first game came out. So, it appears that wasn't a retcon.
The boathouse is the Fog Realm at night. It's a common misconception, due to them forgetting to put in the Otherworld transition when Harry turns the corner at the docks. Notice how everything thing is normal (no more expanded steel catwalks, etc.) it's just dark out. The Fog Realm at night happens at least one other time in the game.Ah yes, there's that. As I said, it's been a while since I've played it, so I'd have to go digging through more cutscene videos to see for sure where else Dahlia popped up.
My problem with SH3 is the canon it forces upon the first game...Personally, I didn't see it as them forcing canon on SH1, but merely as them fleshing out the cult's mythos that we were introduced to in the first game.
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"if Dahlia could've located Cheryl by those (or similar) means, then why didn't she do that right after she realized half of Alessa's soul was gone?"This doesn't make much sense and it doesn't answer the question I asked. It seems that you're still following your train of thought that Dahlia located Cheryl somehow, and I've already explained why that doesn't make much sense to me either.
As I said before, Dahlia, along with Alessa, could've sensed Cheryl coming into town.
Also, why did Alessa wait seven years to call back the second half of the soul. That's a long time to be stuck in a wheelchair in agonizing pain. Perhaps Cheryl had to reach a certain maturity level to be psychically linked to either Alessa and/or Dahlia.From what I remember reading in the Q&A I brought up before, they mentioned that Alessa endured her suffering for as long as she could because she didn't want to destroy what little happiness Cheryl had found in her life outside of Silent Hill. Apparently, seven years was the limit of Alessa's endurance.
As far as Q&A's from the creators after fact, they mean nothing to me. Like Gans with the movie, Team Silent has a bad habit of running around trying to explain things, and answer questions that don't make sense. If the source material isn't included in the game, or the movie, then that leaves the story(s) open for interpretation. I just got done posting this on another thread. SH3 fills in the details that were discussed and figured out on Silent Hill forums on-line years before the game was released. What it doesn't do is answer one of the sixty-four thousand dollar questions. What is Cheryl (not the 2nd half of the soul), and when in the game does she merge with Alessa.LOL - okay, so now as far as you're concerned, the collective answers of Team Silent, the creators of the series and the brains behind what fans consider to be the "true" SH games (SH1 - SH4), mean nothing...which is interesting since you recently went out of your way to quote Keiichiro Toyama in an attempt to prove a point. My question is this: Do you really believe that the creators' comments on the series don't matter because you think they were just a confused bunch of game developers who resorted to collecting ideas for their future games from random SH message boards, or are you just saying this because their comments don't coincide with your long-held views on the games?
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This is where your repetition becomes tiresome.I only repeat myself because, as usual, you have a habit of ignoring the answers people give you. Especially when they don't agree with you.
Your problem is you can't answer the questions posed to you, just like "Team Silent" when it comes to interviews.What questions didn't I answer?
"Who could better explain the influences, nuances symbolism, and overall ins and outs of the first four games and the movie than the very people who created them?"Not sure what point you're trying to make here. We've already discussed Keiichiro Toyama's comment. If you're trying to say Toyama changing his mind about what he considers to be the true ending of SH1 = Team Silent's comments "mean nothing," then I'd say I disagree. Toyama's comments don't negate what he and the rest of Team Silent had to say about the nuances, symbolism, themes, etc. in the games.
KEIICHIRO TOYAMA, Director of Silent Hill (1999): "I remember that I said "Good" was the true ending, because Good+ is a game's game. Probably, Owaku remembered that and he wrote SH3 story as a sequel to "Good". But, now I change my mind and consider the "Good+" is a true ending.
Sounds pretty convincing to me.
"According to canon, JKristine split her soul into the angry woman JK35, and the everything nice-girl". That's the funniest PM I ever got. Now we just have to find the other half of the soul.Okay...good for you. What does this have to do with what we've been discussing? share
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"The point I'm trying to make" is that Keiichiro Toyama's comments show that they had no clue there was going to be a Silent Hill 3 story that involved Cheryl/Heather. You're right, changing the Good/Good+ does nothing to impact the SH3 story. What it does show is these guys had a different idea of what the canon ending was before they decided to write, or re-write the story of Silent Hill (1999) into SH3. So here's another quote, from another member of Team Silent that will help clear up (LoL!) what Keiichiro said.Okay. So? From what I can tell, it doesn't matter whether Team Silent knew if they were going to continue Alessa's story. That doesn't change what we know to be true about the basic aspects of the story as a whole, or the nuances, symbolism, themes, etc. that they've elaborated on for us. The major details of the original story have stayed the same. For some reason, you keep focusing on these inconsequential details - namely the Good vs. Good+ ending and Cybil's fate - which, as I said before, don't really matter in the larger scheme of things.
"Cybil's fate[...] is left to the players' imaginations"
-Hiroyuki Owaku (writer and programmer, SH (1999) - SH 4
Not according to Keiichiro both before, and after Silent Hill 3 was produced.
This is why I can't believe anything Team Silent says about the Silent Hill (1999) game. I think fans give these guys Way too much credit in the first S.H.'s story with it's ambiguity. These guys took the town from "Phantoms", added "The Mist", plus a dash of "Rosemary's Baby", and "Carrie" as the game's protagonist. They dumped it into a blender and out poured they game as we know it. Nobody, and I mean Nobody, understood the game when they played it... including it's creators! It was all the fans that went onto on-line think tanks that filled in the story's holes. That's how Silent Hill (99) theories became lore. After all, what Hiroyuki said applies a lot more to some other unexplained events in the story then to Cybil's fate, In that they are left to the players' imaginations.So now the creators are basically sloppy no-nothings who supposedly didn't understand their own story? That makes no sense. They understood the story just fine for what it was at the time. And the while fans might not have understood every last detail initially, (especially non-Japanese fans, since we weren't really used to that kind of storytelling at the time), I think most of us who paid attention during the game got the general gist of it. When they decided to continue Alessa's story in SH3, they simply took the story they already had and built upon it, fleshing out some of the more interesting details and revealing some of the mysterious aspects of the first game.
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Wow... You are dense. If you were a detective at the scene of a crime interviewing someone who may be a suspect and they can't get their story straight because it keeps changing... are you going to believe them? No, you would not, unless you're a fool. Are you the kind of person that gives money to a bum believing he's going to buy food, and not liquor?And right on cue, here come the uncalled-for insults. I see the point you're trying to make, but your analogy doesn't apply here. Two Team Silent members having differing views on one relatively minor part of a bigger story =/= a story that "keeps changing," nor does it negate or discredit the other background info they've provided for fans of the games.
"Virtually all SH fans consider Team Silent to be the authority on the games. Why? Because they created them. Crazy concept, I know."Yes, I said virtually all fans because after visiting various SH-related message boards, most people in the discussions I've read view Team Silent as the authority on the games...which makes sense because they're the creators of those games. And the very quotes you provided prove that people are still questioning them - about a 15-year-old game, no less.
"Virtually all SH fans..." What was there a poll taken? "consider Team Silent to be the authority on the games. Why?..." Because maybe "Virtually all of the SH fans" have never questioned Team Silent, or seen the quotes I've provided in posts above. "Crazy concept, I know." Not as "Crazy" as the answers that come out of Team Silent mouths.
As far as me being wrong about some things, what about you? You who said Alessa merged with Cheryl at the Jeep or early in the game. I was waiting for this to be brought up on this thread, but instead it was brought up on mine. Explain Dahlia merging the two halves of the soul at the end of the game, since you claim it happened with the Jeep crash or early in the game. Matter of fact, don't bother, I don't want to watch you evade the question, or give me an answer that makes about as much sense as the ones that Team Silent give.What about me? I never said Alessa merged with Cheryl at the Jeep. You can read my exact words for yourself a few posts back, but the short version: It was never clarified whether or not Cheryl and Alessa merged during the crash; all we know is that they merged early in the game.
I don't think I've ever been so happy to have someone on ignore. I guess he's still just as obsessed with me as ever.
It is the way of men to make monsters; and it is the nature of monsters to destroy their makers.
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Yes. I know Cheryl merged with Alessa in the first game. She was also merging to become 'whole' once again. Once she merged with Cheryl, she didn't have to do it again. That's the point.
And, yes, I know the story behind Heather. She was a reincarnation of Alessa. But when Heather goes back to Silent Hill in the third installment she doesn't have to merge with Alessa since she was already whole from the end of the first game. Alessa is now just a memory or imprint from her past life.
The film does things differently but the point I'm making is that all the main characters from the games (including Heather herself) did not have to merge with Alessa to get out of the town.
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So why does The Order want just Heather/Sharon? Sharon's half of the soul never contained any power. In the game Heather contained the "full soul" that The Order needed to give birth to "God".
I don't remember Trinity's ramblings on the god birthing, other than that she tried to retconstitute the first film back into the game's plot. But The Order correctly figured out that Alessa's hateful side could be quenched by merging with her goodside. That's why at the end of SHR, it is hinted that Silent HIll is done with Alessa/Heather, they were like an acid/base reaction.
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But that just goes back to picking on the movie for being different than the games. In the story the film presented, merging with Alessa was absolutely necessary to save Rose's child.
It is the way of men to make monsters; and it is the nature of monsters to destroy their makers.
I thought the whole merging thing in the movie was so that Dark Alessa could be with Rose. Why would they have to merge to save Sharon?
"You are tearing me apart, Lisa!"" The Room..a cinematic masterpiece.
Rose agreed to let Dark Alessa temporarily merge with her in the hospital to save Sharon.
It is the way of men to make monsters; and it is the nature of monsters to destroy their makers.
Yes. I know Cheryl merged with Alessa in the first game. She was also merging to become 'whole' once again. Once she merged with Cheryl, she didn't have to do it again. That's the point.Okay, then I'm guessing that instead of "None of the characters from the Silent Hill games had to merge with Alessa in order to reach a conclusion in their story?" you actually meant "None of the characters from the Silent Hill games had to merge with Heather in order to reach a conclusion in their story?" If so, then yes, that makes sense. share
And, yes, I know the story behind Heather. She was a reincarnation of Alessa. But when Heather goes back to Silent Hill in the third installment she doesn't have to merge with Alessa since she was already whole from the end of the first game. Alessa is now just a memory or imprint from her past life.
The film does things differently but the point I'm making is that all the main characters from the games (including Heather herself) did not have to merge with Alessa to get out of the town.
It is the way of men to make monsters; and it is the nature of monsters to destroy their makers.
Dahlia was brainwashed, not stupid. She had been raised by the cult her entire life and told to do what she was told by their leaders, so with so much pressure, it's actually not a huge surprise she would give in. It should also be noted that Christabella is Dahlia's sister, so she would be more likely to believe her sister's lies than anyone else.
There is a huge comparison between Rose and Dahlia: one mother who let her daughter be abused for years, and one who will do absolutely anything necessary to save her child. There's actually a whole plethora of different types of mothers in the film: Rose as a mother to Sharon, Dahlia to Alessa, Dark Alessa to Alessa, Cybil to children in general, and Christabella to her flock. Anna also ties into the motherhood theme, in that she has the mind of a child and attaches herself to anything that fashions itself as a mother.
I don't know about James Wan. He might be a good fit for this sort of material, but I just can't say 100%. (Not to say anything bad about him, in fact, I love most of his film) I do think he could nail the atmosphere wonderfully, but for some reason, it just doesn't seem like a good fit in my mind when I think about it.
And just to give some feedback to some of the other replies I've seen:
In all honesty, there's only two ways this sequel could have worked for me:
1- If it abandoned all pretenses of the storyline being based on the games, and just did its own thing, building off of the first movie's established universe, and only using the games as a rough tonal/style guidebook. (Which is sort-of what the first film did... used the games as tonal and stylistic guidelines while doing it's own thing story-wise.)
or
2- Just been a complete and utter reboot that stuck closer to the game franchise. (Which is what I hope happens after this mess.)
I just watched this film again literally today (I watched the first film with my mom and she then asked to see the sequel, it wasn't really my choice, haha), and I do have to admit, there are some tiny hints of good ideas. But it's just such a fundamental mess, and it's clear that after the first film, going the route of a sort-of straight adaptation of Silent Hill 3 was a mistake.
And FURTHERMORE, this is my signature! SERIOUSLY! Did you think I was still talking about my point?
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Why couldn't they have gotten James Wan to do a Silent Hill film? or someone like him?
The people who handled the Silent Hill franchise were not smart. They could have had an almost halfway decent horror trilogy going if they had hired someone who knew what they were doing. This was heartbreaking.