MovieChat Forums > Californication (2007) Discussion > The women on this show...

The women on this show...

posted 8 years ago by pressplay310
16 replies | jump to latest

Infuriate me. Namely, Karen and Becca. At any point during all of the finger pointing and blaming directed at Hank, I was hoping that just once Hank would say, "Karen, YOU cheated on ME. YOU left ME. Becca, your mom cheated on me. Your mom left me." And then Karen is always showing up places where she knows Hank will be to shame him about the way he lives his life as a single man. She is the one who broke up the family. He can't win when he is with her, and he can't win when they are apart. She is horrible person. Example: The moment Bates falls off the wagon, she decides that her vows to him don't matter and she runs crying to Hank saying she made a terrible mistake? The character sets a horrible example to girls everywhere, including the annoying little robot daughter who is played by an actress who wouldn't be able to act her way out of an imaginary air bubble.

[–] clockwatcher 8 years ago

This is the point I made in my post. That the female characters in this show are horrible role models.

What really bothered me was that Hank let his own daughter walk all over him. I'm only on Season 6 but I count only one time where Hank put her in her place. Every other time it was Becca telling him how he let her down as a father or her displaying her entitled, self-centered attitude in front of him.

What father would put up with that?

[–] Martha_Samara_Saxon 8 years ago

I wish these characters were real so I could go take Hank as a father. I'd love to have a dad like that that fought to have me in his life. He obviously really loves her and cares about and would protect her from anything and yet she doesn't appreciate any of that. I'm still at a loss trying to figure out what the hell Karen's and Beccas problem is. So it's not something I missed then right? They seem to hold it against him for being human. Like even breathing is a crime. So what if Hank drinks and smokes? So does Karen. I'm not getting what Karen and Becca have against Hank. Karen is the bad one as she's the one who cheated and broke up the family. Becca is the one always getting into trouble and then it's somehow Hank's fault for their mistakes? I'm not following this so called logic.

I'm a Timelord.
Right, not pompous at all then.

[–] cmun 7 years ago

Martha You are completely right. I'm so glad that people in this thread are thinking clearly, like you (especially)....I just read another thread on this board bashing Hank....Seems that many of the posts HAD to be written by people who missed an episode or two, namely, the one where Hank is working long hours and finds out that Karen has cheated on him....then, while apart, verbally crucifying this man for having sexual desires (how DARE he???). He is treated like dirt over things that were either innocent mistakes (finding the wrong room in the house and "mouth-raping" a woman, whom he IMMEDIATELY realized wasn't Karen and stopped), or things he did when they were apart. It just made me sick.....he gave up two of his biggest dreams for his daughter as well, moving back to New York, and doing so with Karen. If that's not a self sacrificing father, then show me anyone else who would do that. Even loving parents would just move on with their daughter, believing that she would eventually get accustomed to the move. He stayed in a town he despised for her sake....letting Karen go on without him, and almost instantly, Becca's love for her father disappears. And what a flake Karen was....choosing her wedding day to leave Bill....

So I'm another woman on Hank's side. And completely at a loss as to why these two treat him so badly.

[–] writetopcat 8 years ago

What really bothered me was that Hank let his own daughter walk all over him.

Yeah I hate that kind of stuff. I think the writers have it play out this way for a couple of reasons.

First, they probably think it makes Hank a more sympathetic character, more likable.

Second, I think it is part of the neoliberal doctrine so prevalent in Hollywood that parents are never supposed to say anything critical of their children as it might somehow damage their fragile pysches.

I think it sets an awful example. It would be better by far to have Hank tell Becca firmly that while he recognizes and admits to his own shortcomings and the affect they may have had upon her, she needs to understand something; life is not fair. And there will always be people and circumstances which challenge you. People will let you down. You will get bad breaks. Things will happen which bring you down.
But blaming other people and circumstances, using them as excuses, abusing others because life didn't turn out the way you wanted it to is a deadly attitude. And she needs to develop the skill of always taking responsibility for her own attitude, never copping out and blaming other people or circumstances to excuse her bad attitude or behavior.

I probably did not say that very well, but it would be nice if Hank could say something of that sort to Becca.
In a way, he is enabling her nasty attitude by wallowing in guilt over not being the best father.

[–] Pippy-4 8 years ago

Have you watched the whole series writetopcat? Because in the later seasons he does tell her off.

[–] writetopcat 8 years ago

No, not through yet

[–] Martha_Samara_Saxon 8 years ago

Thank you, god, there is intelligence left in the world. I came on this board expecting people to sympathize with Becca and Karen but hoping for the sake of humanity that this wouldn't be the case. I'm glad I'm not alone here. I'm only on season 5, but since the first season, I keep asking myself are we actually supposed to be sympathizing with Karen and Becca here? I'm on the episode Here I go Again in season 5 where Hank is trying to cover up Karen's guy's mistake so Karen doesn't get hurt any farther than she has to. Karen's husband is the one that cheated on her with a stripper and Hank is trying to cover this up so Karen doesn't get hurt by it. Once again, Karen and Becca turn it around on him and say that it's his fault when he was just trying to keep what's his face and Karen together because he wants to see Karen happy. Yet, Becca and Karen both tell him off and make him feel like *beep* [yet again].

I'm not understanding it. I don't comprehend why he tries so hard to be a part of these womens lives and make them happy. If he would just stay away from Karen and Becca, he wouldn't have as many problems as he does, yet I can't hate him for it because he really loves them, but they don't seem to feel the same about him and I'm still trying to sort out why they think he's so horrible of a person. What is it? Because he drinks? Because he has sex with women when he's not together with Karen? Because he mostly always tries to do the right thing? 98 percent of the time he gets into trouble is because he's trying to help someone else out.

Hank isn't a bad guy. I think he's such a sweetheart. Sure he drinks and he has sex. So what? Welcome to the human race. We all do something for stress relief. I think Hank's only real crime is being so naïve and open to people when he shouldn't be, especially trying to be part of Karen's and Becca's life all the time. They are *beep* and yet he thinks the world of them and yet that just makes me love him more. He sees the best in people, even them.

I am totally on board with you. I don't know if the writers intend for us to sympathise with Becca and Karen but I am a woman and I sure as hell don't. I think they both are horrible people who always are quick to blame Hank for everything that goes wrong, even when they are the culprits. Poor Hank. That's all I can say. I hope before the show is over that Hank finds a woman who loves him for who he is and doesn't treat him like garbage like these women do.

Also, I agree with the robot daughter. Becca is a very horrible actress. I've seen some *beep* in my time, but this is just ridiculous, but I don't really want to get into that, since it's not the acting that really grinds my gears, it is the characters. I think the actress who plays Karen is great, but the character is just obnoxious. Hank is such a sweet guy to her. She doesn't deserve him. Any other guy would have said bye to her a long time ago. Most guys don't fight to see their daughters and fight to be back together with the woman who loved them, they run off and enjoy their life of freedom like their daughter and ex were some weight that's been lifted off them, but Hank fights to win them back at every turn and neither of them deserve it.

I'm a Timelord.
Right, not pompous at all then.

[–] aislingburchael 8 years ago

So with you. hank was faithful while with Karen. his spiral started with her cheating and leaving. she acts as if she is doing him a favour by even spending time with him.

[–] Pippy-4 8 years ago

I have to agree with you about Karen. I wanted it to work out between Hank and Karen because he loved her so much. But she most definitely was the one to cheat on him and not the other way around. Edited to add this about Becca. I use to love the interaction between Hank and Becca in the first few seasons. Towards the end it wasn't as good. I thought Marilyn M played the character just right.

[–] Ryojin20 8 years ago

Once again, Martha nails it on point. I've already put in my two cents about Karen on another post, but now onto Becca. She is without a doubt, the biggest piece of *beep* on this show next to Karen. In the first season, she was a sweet but sullen, goth teenager going through a phase, and the robot-esque voice kinda suited her. As the show went on, she became more and more of a self-absorbed, whiny, first world problems having *beep* Hank, despite his flaws and mistakes, busts his ass to redeem himself and devotes his life to be a good father to Becca, but she keeps giving him *beep* and for what? She says that he's put her and Karen through a lot of drama, yet they are never in the line of fire or even in the blast radius of Hank's drama. They just look from the outside. After season 2, Becca's negative character development began: she became friends with Chelsea who's another piece of *beep* character and like most low self esteem girls, starts to emulate the *beep* behavior of her new friend. She begins a toxic relationship with Tyler which is encouraged by Karen cause like a typical *beep* falls for Tyler's douchbaggery. Becca then has another relationship with Ross who is without a doubt the most disgusting looking troll on the show and a druggo to boot. And she wants to put college on hold just to "find herself" on a world trip because she has a distorted over romantic view on what makes a great writer and of course, Karen encourages it while Hank acts as the voice of reason and reality by telling Becca to finish school first. As Martha said, Karen and Becca are horrible people. Hank may be a screw up, but at least he takes responsibility while Karen and Becca act self-righteous.

[–] onomaz 8 years ago

I Gave up on this otherwise great show, because of those two annoying *beep* - his wife and his daughter.

[–] onomaz 8 years ago

I Gave up on this otherwise great show, because of those two annoying *beep* - his wife and his daughter.

IMDB, the word is f*u*c*k*s not beep, thank you.

[–] imadbasayev 8 years ago

I'm gonna go get the papers, get the papers.

[–] cheerio_xo 8 years ago

Thank GOD.. I thought I was the only one disgusted with the women on this show. They are all so unlikable.. you can tell they are not actually written by women. I hate how Karen is portrayed as having some special magic in her vag that Hank just can't keep away from her... she is irritating beyond belief. She is the cheater who broke up their relationship in the beginning and then spent forever leading Hank on, sleeping with him and cheating on Bill (not even telling him about it) and finally deciding on her and Bill's WEDDING NIGHT that she wants to be with Hank after all and running off for her happily ever after. Only to then dump Hank for *beep* he had done prior to them even being together. Then back to him at the end of the season and CYCLE REPEATS.

One of the things I love about Hank is that he is never judgemental of people but he needs to see this bug-eyed woman for who she is!!!

Also sometimes they give Becca too much screen time. I understand that it's hard to find a talented child actor for a t.v. series but you are so spot-on about her not being able to act her way out of an imaginary air bubble. I have to cringe at her scenes and sometimes there are just too many of them.

I also hate several of the guest stars like that stripper student that Hank starts dating... she is hideous and thinks she's all that.

[–] jaybond007 8 years ago

I so agree, the Becca character drove me nuts. Acting lessons from Lisa Simpson- a cartoon character.

Find what you love and let it kill you.

[–] frankstallone1 7 years ago

I was not able to understand throughout the whole series how we are supposed to believe anyone would be that head over heels, never getting over you in love, with a character like Karen.
Other than having a child together, any man in their right mind, even on a fictional show would have ran far, far away from her. She was the one who destroyed their relationship. She cheated on him, he loved her beyong reason, passed on screwing the producer woman to progress his career as to not be unfaithful, and would have done anythign for her.
She was self destructive, naive when there is no way she should have been, and not very bright at all..in fact she was as much a bitch as Marcy just not as abrasive about it. She flashed her doe eyes and we were supposed to feel like it was all his fault.
As far as Becca goes, she was a whiny, spoiled a-hole that used her father's mistakes as an excuse to be brooding and annoying, while ignoring the fact that the reason for his actions are always her nutbag mother, even though she is supposedly supposed to be highly intelligent, wise beyond her years, blah blah blah
I enjoyed everyone else in the show. The guest stars like Rob Lowe, Stephen Tobolowsky, Callum Keith Rennie, RZA, Tim Minchin, especially Kathleen Turner, were usually great. but Becca and Karen constantly threatened to ruin the show for me.
"Pull out.I can't get pregnant now your dad may be floating around looking for a body to reincarnate