MovieChat Forums > Capturing Mary (2007) Discussion > I Need A Little Help Please (Spoilers)

I Need A Little Help Please (Spoilers)

posted 16 years ago by Wonderfulgal4378
10 replies | jump to latest

This story absolutely had me gripped from start to finish, but I didn’t really understand most of it. I understand that she was disturbed by what she was told in the cellar and I understand that he was hurt by her rejecting his key and thus ruined her career; however that’s about all that I do understand. I cannot understand why he gave her the key, what connection he had to the young girl/what hold he had over her, why did he need her help, why he appeared in the park and why couldn’t she move on sooner. Unfortunately I have a lot more questions than answers and perhaps that was the point of the story line, but any answers or theories anyone could give would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks =D

[–] austendw 16 years ago

Well I think all your questions are good ones, but frankly I'm not sure if you'll get satisfying answers. I simply don't think it made a lot of sense, to be honest. It was all too self-consciously vague for my taste. The mysteries seemed manufactured and the shocking stories seemed flimsy. Nothing convincingly explained why Mary didn't or couldn't get over his malign influence, or what, precisely, that power was. She comments that she might have been immune to his power if she'd been older when she encountered him, or born later, part of the new generation that wasn't intimidated by him or what he stood for. But while this was stated, there was nothing that embodied or dramatised the force (social? psychological? mataphysical?) that knit her to him. But since that was, after all, the central relationship of the story, I found the piece deeply unsatisfying.

His ageless reappearance in the park only muddied matters further.

Call me Ishmael...

[–] Wonderfulgal4378 16 years ago

I agree with you 100% that it was all very vague. I do not mind stories that leave certian things unanswered, however, most of the time you are able to speculate and put things together from within the story that perhaps would answer the unanswered. The more I think about this story the less I am able to answer my questions as I found there was little sbustance to speculate about and perhaps fill in the gaps.

[–] Dirty_Dalek 16 years ago

Forgive me if mine is a bit of a simplistic and/or obvious answer, but I like to believe that Greville was in fact a figment of Mary's imagination, induced and compounded by her increasing dependence on alcohol. Mary's first creepy encounter with Greville did take place at a young age in the surrounding of a wine cellar after all, then throughout various social gatherings over the years where alcohol was undoubtedly present. Could her relationship with Greville in fact have been a ruse for her relationship with alcohol? After all, she was convinced that Greville was responsible for every ruined career opportunity that was bestowed upon her since the day she refused the key to his house (not to mention her writers block). And what of that key? Could Mary's refusal towards accepting his key have been her first point of denial to an increasing dependence on alcohol (not wishing to become like one of Greville's other women).

Although none of this connection with alcoholism was clearly evident in the story, this certainly was the type of screenplay that left one hell of a lot to the imagination.

I think the scene towards the end when Mary finally broke down in the park having just seen Greville still as young man, was her eventual realisation that he was not real, but of her own creation - her denial of her addiction to alcohol. Remember the little girl that suddenly appears standing in front of Mary on the bench, staring at her. Her mother arrives and quickly whisks her away. Think to yourself, why would the mother have done that? Only then do you observe Mary as she truly is, a drunken wreck with an empty hip flask in hand, lying on the park bench, "as others see her"...

[–] Wonderfulgal4378 16 years ago

Thats not a simplistic and/or obvious answer at all! I never thought of that but when you think it through it makes quite a bit of sense and at least with this theory there is evidence to support it. Thanks for everyones imput and opinions =D

[–] patrickrandell 16 years ago

I thought as the film went on that Greville (especially a young looking one later in the story) and Liza too, were figments of Mary's imagination - hallucinations of sorts who she saw at certain points of an ongoing mental breakdown.

Like Churchill, who had a name for his depression - his "Black Dog", Greville would appear at her lowest times, and throw her into turmoil. I think the drinking was a symptom of her ilness, not a direct cause.

The way I saw it as the story unfolded was that Mary, suffering from a mental illness, would conjour up this demonic character (maybe he did initially exist, but all of the conversations were completely delusional), and thenm went on to blame him for her work & relationships suffering without her realising it was her that was the problem. Not surprising if she was seen to be behaving more & more erratically in front of the great & good at these parties, and at work, that her job was taken away from her and she found it hard to find a new one.

I was expecting a flashback/denouement at the end of the film to the Greville moments of her being seen talking to herself (like in the kitchen, making a salad by herself, or running around the house, following "him") with the servants and other guests observing, but not getting involved.

[–] timberbutte 16 years ago

If Mary's suffering from mental illness, there are a whole generation of men and women who need help right away. I think Mary is psychologically caught up in her own thoughts, obsessing about the past, in ways not unexpected for someone at her age. This is the mind of someone who still suffers from an emotional trauma that she's never come to grips with, and she's giving it one last chance to rid herself of her anxiety. Sure, she's anesthetizing herself regularly with her flask of vodka. Again if we're institutionalizing people for this, the homes will be bulging.

At the risk of sounding ageist, and I mean no offence, when you reach a certain age in life, even the most well adjusted may look back on their careers and say "I wonder what if..." Or "I should have told old so and so thus and such and life might be different today." Such imaginings are not outside normal behavior, certainly not delusional or hallucinatory, especially if we let those thoughts go in the light of day. Unfortunately Mary is quite deeply scarred by what happened to her so shaking off the past is not something that comes easily.

Greville is not a ghost or a delusion but his presence in Mary's life was sufficiently haunting that he doesn't go away in her mind.

[–] Imdb11168 13 years ago

SPOILERS !!

No, Greville is what he is shown to be, he has contacts, but those contacts are aging, and he knows that his influence will go one day as well, unless he does not reinvent himself. He shows no real lust for Mary, in fact he even tells her that they can help each other proffesionally. I think Greville needs Mary as he thinks she could be the 'key' to his future. Greville is sure that he can help Mary in return and make her more famous. Maybe Greville was right all along.

The problem is that Greville is not a very pleasant person, and he tries to impress Mary about his power and influence with those stories, which have a disastrous effect on Mary's mind, and subsequently, on their relationship.

I would like to think that Mary realizes all this in time, and regrets that she did not help herself, and slowly turns into an alcoholic, regretting her lost opportunities in life. I'm sure she even liked Greville in many ways, its her confession, and the fact that she keeps wondering about Grevilles young female friends. She imagines Greville in the penultimate scene.

I also wonder if something more happened in the cellar, which is left to our imagination ? Just the horrible stories could not have a disturbing life long effect. This is one defect in the movie, or maybe its an artistic movie which tries to involve the viewer. Anyway, Mary is captured for life, and she comes back to the house to rid herself of her lifelong Demons. She needs out, and someone to vent to. Thats why she ends with Thank You Joe.

I wish the ening was more like what you said ..." I was expecting a flashback/denouement at the end of the film to the Greville moments of her being seen talking to herself (like in the kitchen, making a salad by herself, or running around the house, following "him") with the servants and other guests observing, but not getting involved. "

I'm not really intelligent and i like emotion over logic. I was hoping for a more bizarre ending after the tension and buildup.

even monkeys fall from trees

[–] mike-1828 16 years ago

I agree that Greville most probably did not actually exist. I think the whole thing was an allegory of her passage through life. She was offered the chance fully to participate in the society of the time, but she lacked the courage to ake the rough parts with the smooth and rejected it. It therefore rejected her and she has spent most of her life regretting this, but noting that society itself has moved on, for better or worse, from the Greville era. She has not.

I've only just seen this I'm afraid, had it on my disk since November. An extremely fine production. Missed the others in the trilogy too, but I'll be looking out for them.

[–] timberbutte 16 years ago

See if you can find Real Summer which gives more insight into Mary's background. I don't know that the piece necessarily will help you understand Capturing Mary but you do get a better feel for the time period, the late 50's, which is especially helpful if you didn't live through them yourself.

[–] [email protected] (1288) 6 years ago

well said.