MovieChat Forums > Forbrydelsen (2021) Discussion > Oh So Many Questions

Oh So Many Questions

posted 13 years ago by DonVitoCorleone
31 replies | jump to latest

1. Why does Leon run? Is it because he was a bit of a wierdo with all the newspaper clippings up on the wall. Does Leon know it was Vagn? I'm sure there is dialogue when one of them mentions something like "you better not have said anything" Also Leon tells Lund on the phone "you have no idea"

2. Why does Holke feel the need to run over the young civil servant Olav when he is going to get caught for bribing him to use the flat. Also why is he then tying up Lund? Is that not a bit mental and rather drastic measures. Was he actually for killing Lund because he had wrongly been using a flat for an affair!

3. Nannas boyfriend, Emil, that she plans to leave with, waits until the police come looking for him to inform them that she was planning on meeting him at the train station to leave that night. Never once thinking that was maybe quite important to the police?

4. Why if Nannas blood is all over the flat, does Vagn not try and clean it, when he goes to the bother of covering up what he did at the house. Doesn't fit the profile of him cleaning the body etc And surely there are traces of Vagn in the flat. He went there to talk to her, he didn't plan on killing or attacking her at the time. So if he has left her blood there, it's likely his prints etc are there.

5. In the one of the early episodes it looks like Theis is telling Vagn about the new house for the first time?

6. How does Vagn know to go to the storage place where he shoots Meyer, I can't remember how they got round to that bit.

7. What car does Hartmann get to his summer house, or how did he get there again?

Enjoyable series, but there are so many unfortunate coincidences that make it a tad unbelievable.

Nearly everyone they question, lies to them at some point or has some unfortunate circumstancial evidence making them look guilty.

2 things I noticed. Firstly the plaster on Vagns neck had alarm bells ringing for me from the beginning, and also when Meyer gets shot Vagns wearing black gloves and then at the hospital you see Brix holding black gloves. Nice touches.

[–] bendipa 13 years ago

You don't appear to have been watching this properly. I'll answer the first 3 of your questions. Others can fill in the rest if they feel so inclined.

1. Leon ran because he thought that the police suspected him for the killing of Nanna.and of Detective Meyer He hadn't told Lund earlier when questioned twice that he knew Nanna and had worked for the Birk Larsens. He was spotted outside Vagn's flat by Lund. Until then she had no idea that he was connected to Vagn, and when she tried to stop him he panicked and took off.

2. Holke didn't know when or if Olav would expose him. He decided Olav would have ti be silenced to stop him blackmailing him and ruining his career. If he admitted to dating Nanna and using Troels's flat he would have become a prime suspect as her killer. He was happy to let Troels take the rap for it. We don't know whether Holke would have killed Lund. He was panicking by this point, when he saw she had discovered the estate car. He may have just intended to tie her up and put her in the boot to delay his capture while he fled.

3. Nanna's boyfriend was called Amir. We have the impression that his father was some unscrupulous, businessman, whom Theis rented his flat from and had some history with.. We don't know why Amir didn't tell the police straight off, but then again he didn't know himself who killed Nanna, so what could he have told the police? One can only guess that his father might have had some sway over that. It might have been that he didn't want the Birk Larsens to know about the plan his son had to elope with Nanna thus causing further tension between the families.In the end Amir defies his father and tellsTheis the whole story.

[–] DonVitoCorleone 13 years ago

You don't need the insults about me not "watching it properly"

But thanks for the replies. After all it's just a TV show, and there are so many convenient things that go against the investigation simply to make it exciting.

As to the first point why did Leon not just tell Lund that he drove Nanna to the flat. He hadn't done anything wrong. Almost everyone they interviewed as part of their investigation held something back or lied to them.

[–] bendipa 13 years ago

As to the first point why did Leon not just tell Lund that he drove Nanna to the flat. He hadn't done anything wrong.

He did tell Lund that or rather told Lund that he gave her a lift. He didn't know about the flat originally when questioned. He dropped her off nearby. It's what he didn't tell Lund that put him in the frame.

[–] Jonathan Dore 13 years ago

I'll have a go at a couple of your questions:
6. Vagn knew about the warehouse because he too had worked for Merkur, so knew Mette's stuff was stored there, including the photo that showed she had known him from school.
7. When he finally explains to Brix where he was on the crucial weekend Hartmann says he got a taxi out to his wife's cottage.

[–] freddythreepwood 12 years ago

Still unconvincing...

6. Vagn knew about the warehouse because he too had worked for Merkur, so knew Mette's stuff was stored there, including the photo that showed she had known him from school.

He remembered (after 15 years) that one of the things she packed into one of her boxes was a photo album with one photo of him together with her in it?? Geez! And he just took just that one photo? why not take the entire album? Wouldn't it be drawing more attention to remove one photo in the album thereby leaving a glaring empty spot where it had been pasted, than to make the whole thing disappear? Why didn't he remove it 15 years earlier when there was an investigation right after Mette had disappeared? The trail would have been much hotter and he would have been more vulnerable then (especially since he was working for Merkur at that time)!

[–] freddythreepwood 12 years ago

I don't get it..

Did Leon know that vagn had done it or not? If he did, why not come clean to the cops, especially when he knew he was their prime suspect? If he did not - then what was the hubub all about with the "You have no idea?" etc?

Why would he hang himself? Or was he killed? by whom? Why? Vagn knew that Leon didn't know what he (Vagn) had done. And he already knew that Leon had told the cops about dropping her off at the flat. So... ??

[–] GoldEagle 12 years ago

Leon teeth were broken by a gun, Vagn put a gun in his mouth and made him write the note and killed him. Leon called Vagn and told him about Nanna, so when he was told that he was the last one to see her alive he figured out who killed her.

[–] freddythreepwood 12 years ago

that doesn't seem to add up.. all Leon had to do was tell Vagn that he had already told the cops that he (Leon) had told Vagn where Nanna was the night she got killed. Obviously if Leon got bumped off after that - Vagn would be the prime suspect not only in Leon's killing, but Nanna's as well.

[–] freddythreepwood 12 years ago

I have one more question -

8. Why was there no video of Vagn in the parking lot from where the car was taken, or at the party's flat? There was footage of Holcek and Nanna at the flat entrance, there was footage of Troels driving the car off the lot, etc, but absolutely no footage of Vagn either entering the party flat or taking the car from the lot, even though they were exactly the same places where the others had been filmed?
Moreover - how did he get the keys to the car? The lot attendant said he picked it up from the school basement and brought it back. Mortem brought Troels back from the summer cottage (and presumably) left the keys with the lot attendant (why would he leave them in the flat?) - So, how did Vagn get them?

[–] GoldEagle 12 years ago

There was no footage of Holck and Nanna at the flat entrance. Hartmann left the car keys in the flat, Vagn took the car from the flat. There were no camera's or footage from the flat. The real question is how Vagn got to the flat and how he left the woods after driving the car into the water.

[–] freddythreepwood 12 years ago

i'm pretty sure there was. I remember quite clearly cctv footage of holcek and nanna in front of the flat where she gets the keys to the flat from him. If I remember right - they even had that footage analyzed by a girl who knew to read lips - and they were able to decipher that Nanna was turning down Holcek and asking him for the keys to the party flat.

I don't know if it makes a huge diference HOW Vagn left the woods.. He could've walked, run, hitched ...

[–] manfromdeltrotter 11 years ago

Obviously this is late, but I've only just finished the series. Vagn didn't take the car from the lot, Troels left it at the flat with the keys on the coffee table. He left it there because he was very drunk and planned on walking to Rie's. The video of Holcek and Nanna was from city hall not the flat. So it goes; the attendant took it from the school to the lot at city hall, Troels took it to the flat and Vagn took it from there. As for him knowing which car the keys fitted if it was part of a fleet it may have had the reg. number on them.

[–] rancid51 11 years ago

But what car did Troels take to the cabin then?

[–] GoldEagle 12 years ago

5. In the one of the early episodes it looks like Theis is telling Vagn about the new house for the first time?

Thies was starting work on the house and telling Vagn about the work, Vagn knew about the house beforehand.

4. Why if Nannas blood is all over the flat, does Vagn not try and clean it, when he goes to the bother of covering up what he did at the house. Doesn't fit the profile of him cleaning the body etc And surely there are traces of Vagn in the flat. He went there to talk to her, he didn't plan on killing or attacking her at the time. So if he has left her blood there, it's likely his prints etc are there.

Vagn didn't clean the flat, he took Nanna and left that same night. He had to clean the house because that crime scene connected him to the crime. He didn't know if someone would come to the flat, so he got out of there quickly.

[–] jon-1486 12 years ago

I have some questions too.

1. About the toilet situation. Morten admits to having thrown stuff into the toilet on the Saturday morning which subsequently blocked the toilet. However the plumber had already been called to supply a new toilet on the Saturday and thought Morten was the cleaner who wouldn't let him in. It seems odd that a plumber had been called well in advance to replace a toilet which was blocked up with a dead girl's items only the night before he's due to arrive with the replacement lavatory. Surely the order for the new toilet was placed weeks before when it hadn't been blocked yet. Why call a plumber for an unblocked toilet?

2. Vagn was at his uncle's rest home and slipped his uncle some drugs to put him to sleep. He pretended to be asleep in a chair and slipped out later using the emergency exit so that no one would see him. But why would he do that if he was only going to have a chat with Nanna to try to convince her not to leave with Amir? Surely he would just tell the nurses that he had to leave and walk out the main door as any normal person would.

3. On the night that he abducts Treis, Vagn has already delivered the puppy and kennel and lied to Treis about having to go out later together and collect a dog from a Pole, when he hears the voicemail message from the disgruntled client. Yet, although he has already planned a trip to the woods to get Treis to kill him (otherwise why mention going out later to collect a dog that you have already delivered?), he thinks it necessary to steal the incriminating voicemail tape. Why would he care if they heard the tape? He would be dead in the woods anyway.

4. How did Vagn get from the 6th floor of the warehouse (with his flashlight) to the ground floor in a matter of seconds, beating the lift and without making a sound as he ran down the stairwell that Lund had entered? If he had already got to the ground floor before Meyer got in, why bother killing Meyer? Why not just sneak out with your evidence? Why risk getting caught by going to the lift and calling it?

5. If Vagn attacked her in the Liberal's flat, how did he get there from the Hospital where his uncle was? Surely he must have had a van or car waiting at the hospital. In which case why then take keys belonging to a high profile candidate in a mayoral election, steal his car (presumably leaving his own vehicle at the Liberal's flat) and then drive her (after beating her up in the flat) in the politician's car to Theils house before attacking her again and then driving her to the woods? It's so far fetched that she would get in a stolen car at the flat, having already been beaten up. Why did he not just put her in his own transport rather than risk stealing another high profile vehicle?

Just a bit disappointed with some odd behaviour and circumstances esp the taxi driver being scared of Vagn as if he knew he was a murderer ("you have no idea") and yet not bothering to tell the police the reasons why he thinks it is Vagn.

It seems that the writers simply wanted to throw as many red herrings in as possible, regardless of their realism. So many plot holes as to ultimately spoil a well acted drama.

[–] dalek69 10 years ago

Just a bit disappointed with some odd behaviour and circumstances esp the taxi driver being scared of Vagn as if he knew he was a murderer ("you have no idea") and yet not bothering to tell the police the reasons why he thinks it is Vagn.

I think it was suggested somewhere in the later episodes that Vagn did Leon some favors and that Leon was scared to rap on the man that did him favors and was also dangerous. Leon was scared of Vagn maybe, scared for his own hide!
---Just guessing here---

[–] olegunnar25 11 years ago

1. Could have walked back or somebody offered him a ride back. Airport was nearby so public transport was also a possibility.

2. So was going abroad with Amir and wanted to return some books from school to hartman's flat before she left.

[–] DepecheArsenal 11 years ago

Having read through this entire thread, few of the OP's original questions have been answered satisfactorily.

Personally, I think Season 1 was superb for 19 episodes. Episode 20 was a huge disappointment and the identity of the killer (who I had hitherto imagined to be some mastermind capable of staying one step ahead of the police and who had "done this kind of thing before") as an everyday removal man was a big let-down. Having not yet seen seasons 2 and 3, I am now desperately hoping that we will learn there was more behind the crimes of season 1 than we are being led to believe (in much the same way as the Stieg Larsson trilogy reveals different stories in each of its three parts)

Oh and one mustn't forget the bad lighting!...;)

[–] AnneOnymous 10 years ago

Well, Vagn had done this kind of thing before, possibly several times. Also, he was a lot cleverer than he let on - one or both of his parents were doctors or something equally intellectually demanding. Not that highly intelligent parents always produce similarly intelligent offspring, but he wasn't any old removal man.

[–] JohnnyIgaloo 11 years ago

2. She went to the flat to get her passport I believe.

[–] lovedtohate 11 years ago

Maybe it's stupid but I think Leon ran away also because he was scared of what Theis would have done if he knew that he was aware of Vagn being the killer all the time, I mean, he killed Vagn in the end and we all know he wasn't exactly "mr. nice guy" in his past, plus they beat up the teacher when they thought he was the killer. He could have felt a little responsible for the murder too, because Vagn wouldn't have known of Nanna's plans if it wasn't for him telling that.

Anyway, I have some questions as well.

The last episode I've seen had the audio messed up exactly when Vagn was confessing the crime to Vagn, so I missed a little part of the speech, did he admit he raped Nanna? Because I'm not sure he did it. Seems like he just wanted to make her disappear, I don't see any reasons for him to rape her.

Got a lot more to ask, this show is a huge mess imo, but I'm gonna start with this and see if someone has some answers. Hope it's all understandable, english isn't my mother tongue.

[–] Altho73 11 years ago

If I remember rightly I think he did admit it.

I agree with you that the story was quite ridiculous and if you piece the events together they don't make sense. Another reason I did not like it was that apart from Hartman none of the characters were likeable.

[–] TuesdayGirl 11 years ago

Glad I read your post and agree about your points. To the person who is bored responding because it's not watched "properly" , I can only say that what s/he suggests doesn't make that much sense either.

First of all, about Leon - I do not recall that he told Meyer he knew Nanna before. What I remember is this: the police broadcasts her photo and he comes forward as a taxi driver who looks at her photo and acts unsure if that was her at all, then tells them where he drove her. They ask "How do you remember?" and he says something like "She asked me to stop and wait for her." What he should have said is, "Of course I remember, I know the girl, bla bla". In fact, he is so interested in her that he calls her home that night to say that she is about to skip town with "some Paki". Apparently, he shares that info with Vagn, but never once mentions it to her family or the police afterwards?
Then being scared of Vagn, but again telling no one?

Next, Holck had an affair with Nanna and bribed Olav...Ok, so being found out and investigated was a reason to kill Olav? Ruined career and becoming a suspect when he is innocent of Nanna's murder is a Good reason to kill Olav?
I understand why he assaulted Lund, she saw his incriminating car. As far as a previous poster's suggestion that it wasn't clear he was going to kill her, No doubt he was. She was the only one that had seen the car.

Finally, the perpetrator was supposedly someone who plans his crimes meticulously and "does not just find keys laying around", as Lund's boyfriend profiles him. Yet, what he does is precisely that - finds keys conveniently laying around and knows EXACTLY which car on the lot they belong to?

As you rightly said, too many twists and turns, too many suspects that lie or withhold info for no apparent reason (e.g. Leon and Nanna's eloping fiancee who cares Oh so much about her, but wont go to the police and tell them what he knows - even if he doesn't think it's relevant), too many "explanations". Another thing I found annoying is that Lund is ALWAYS wearing the same sweater (or 2 color versions of it!), always "right" and treating everyone around her as puppies dancing at her whistle.

[–] Altho73 11 years ago

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Another thing I found annoying is that Lund is ALWAYS wearing the same sweater (or 2 color versions of it!), always "right" and treating everyone around her as puppies dancing at her whistle.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The jumpers were okay and were in fact the only thing I liked about Sarah Lund.

These are just a few reasons that I intensely disliked her -

She constantly ignores procedures and enters dangerous situations without backup, one of which resulted in the needless death of her partner.

She constantly breaks the law herself, passes confidential police files to her boyfriend, steals a bag from a left luggage depot, breaks into private property, gives fake reports to her superiors, pulls a gun on and threatens police officers, carries on interfering in a police case (not once but several times) when she has officially been removed from the case and is no longer in the police force.

She shows total contempt towards her family treating her boyfriend, mother and son like dirt. She shows zero respect towards her superiors and public officials, is totally insensitive towards the families of murder victims.

She has a level of arrogance of cosmic propotion and was incompetent, muddling from one crisis to another. Look at how many innocent people did she accuse and arrest

[–] mivalentini 11 years ago

When I watched it, a year ago, I had so many objections to the finale. I forgot some, but there's one nobody mentioned yet.
So Leon drives Nanna to the flat, calls her father, he's traveling, so the call goes to Vagn. Even though Vagn was only planning to talk to her, he takes the time to drug his uncle, sneak through the emergency exit, walks to the building, finds out which apartment she was in, and stupid Nanna is still there looking for the passport?? That place is not that big.

[–] AnneOnymous 10 years ago

It's a long while since I watched it, so I don't remember all the details. The only explanation I have is for Vagn's drugging of his uncle and sneakiness when he only wants 'to talk.' I'm sure he knows that Nana is not really going to be persuaded by him. Also, he has killed at least once, and possibly several times, before - he realizes that he is going to rape and kill Nana, too.

I agree, Nana should have been long gone by the time Vagn reached the flat. It would have taken her maximum5 minutes to be in and out. Unless Vagn called her and asked her to wait? I really don't remember, though.