MovieChat Forums > Toki o kakeru shôjo (2006) Discussion > Is the painting really from the future??

Is the painting really from the future??

posted 14 years ago by amzamz2000
12 replies | jump to latest

Aunty witch mentioned that the painting was made during a period of famine and war, and there was no clues as to its whereabouts prior to the present era. So I thought since Chiaki made it quite clear that he came from a time where clearly the country had been destroyed and that there was no baseball and he had forgotten what the sky looked like. He also mentioned that he had never seen so many people before. So perhaps the painting was created during the future, when this disaster happened (hence why it was destroyed) Maybe the reason it was brought back to the past was so that it could be restored again and taken back to the people of Chiakis time to give them hope.

[–] Abbykat 14 years ago

No, the painting isn't from the future. It was from a period of famine and war in Japan's history, which is why Chiaki had to come to the past to see it - he came back to a time during which its whereabouts were known.

"You always know where the X-Men have been, because it's always on fire."
- Pete Wisdom

[–] StrongKanegou 14 years ago

There is actually a lot that points to the picture being from the future. I have not seen the movie this one is loosely connected to, neither have I read the novel - so mayhaps some of the points I am trying to raise are answered in either the book or said movie.

What's striking is that at some point Aunt Mahou (witch) gets hold of the picture, she cannot seem to place in terms of its origins (remember, she is a professional art restorer). The only thing she comments about is its soothing effect and that it must have been painted during a time of famine and war (not necessarily in the past).

My guess: The picture was brought to the aunt by someone from the future (bringing objects from the future is obviously possible, as is the case with the walnut-shaped recharger thingy Makoto falls on); at one point we can vaguely see this guy in a picture in Aunt Mahou's house - he does not seem to be the same person as Chiaki, but it might be him (his hair is different). It most likely has been painted during the catastrophe that plunged the world into chaos. In the turmoil of the ongoing war/famine/general end of the world, the picture has been destroyed (at least to the extent that it needed restoration). Lacking the means and/or expertise to restore this picture, someone from the future brought the painting to a place in time where it could be restored.

If the picture had been from the 'past' (even by Makoto's standards), it would mean that the picture was destroyed twice (once before it has been restored by Aunt Mahou, and then at some later point in time, since Chiaki cannot admire it in his present). Alongside other plot holes in this otherwise great movie, Chiaki could easily have travelled to a time before the picture’s first destruction to see it.

[–] Abbykat 14 years ago

The picture in Aunt Mahou's house is a reference back to the events of the first novel, when she was a schoolgirl and had her own encounter with time travel. The painting isn't a plot point in the book, and as far as I can tell, Chiaki isn't meant to be the time traveler from the original book either.

It's also important to note that just because the painting needed restoration doesn't mean it was "destroyed." Paintings accumulate dust and gunk; the paint fades or degrades and becomes discolored. The materials age. All that's indicated by the fact that it needed restoration is that it's probably quite old, which also accounts for why Aunt Mahou doesn't know its origins.

As for why Chiaki came to the time he did to see it, that's explained in the movie: he knew its whereabouts at that point in time. He didn't know where it would be earlier in time, so he went to a time where he knew he'd be able to find it.

Anyway, why would it need to be taken back in time for restoration? I can't think of anything that would be needed for the restoration that wouldn't still exist in the future, even after the undescribed catastrophe. The whole reason Chiaki had to come back in time to see it was because it was destroyed - not just damaged, but destroyed past restoration - and no longer existed in his time. If it was simply taken back for restoration, then when the restoration was complete it would be taken to the future again, probably with minimal time delay, so he'd be able to see it without time travel.

"You always know where the X-Men have been, because it's always on fire."
- Pete Wisdom

[–] StrongKanegou 14 years ago

Thanks for clearing up the issue with Aunt Mahou and the time traveler she met when she was Makoto's age.

I can definitely see how your theory makes sense (the picture being totally destroyed in the future/Chiaki's present, and this being the reason for his leap to the past). Also, I might have used the word "destroyed" to liberally when talking about the picture. I of course wasn't referring to its complete destruction (although I had this image of a somewhat charred painting in mind).

However, the fact the picture and its origins are so obscure that, even though an alleged masterpiece, not even a professional art restorer is able to give closer information pertaining its style, school of painters, etc. I think it's safe to assume that a picture of such immense impact would have been widely acclaimed (by critics at least) at some point in time. And how would Chiaki even know of the existence of such a masterpiece when Aunt Mahou didn’t until she first saw it, even more so when it doesn't exist anymore in his present? It can only be through some sources (catalogs, encyclopedias, etc.) that are for some reason unknown to the aunt. The only explanation that appears logical to me is that the picture has been created at some point in the future. Even if the picture was painted in the past and had been unearthed shortly before Aunt Mahou’s restoration work began (or at some other time in the future and then brought back in time to Aunt Mahou), art historians would at least have come up with a rough estimate on time when painted and/or possible painters.

As I have written before, someone had to take the picture back, because people were not able to restore it in the future. Given the fact that they even have forgotten about baseball, this does not seem to be too far fetched to me (maybe art restorers did not posses the skills necessary to survive in the future's hostile environment - a world similar to the one in 12 Monkeys). Chiaki then returned to a point in the past where he deemed the picture restored (to either see it or take it back to the future - he would in this case also the first one from the future to do so). He later tells Makoto to keep the picture safe (maybe knowing that it will be damaged in the future). This damaging could be inevitable, much like the bicycle accident first Makoto and later Kousuke have (this is very speculative, though), if not deliberately prevented.

I think the nature of the painting is highly debatable, just because we are not provided with sufficient information regarding its origins. The same is true for everything that can be inferred from the characters' actions - a lot of their decisions seem illogical, given the number of possibilities to alter history they wield because of their ability to leap through time (I wrote somewhere else that hopefully in the future it will cross someone's mind to jump back in time and prevent the huge catastrophe from happening - it just might be worth a shot). This is the best I could come up with though.

[–] amzamz2000 14 years ago

Yes I completely agree. I really think that the painting is from the future. Aunty Witch said something about the painting giving hope during a period of famine, or something like that, so I can only assume this was Chiaki's reasons for coming back for it.

[–] agaettis 13 years ago

I took it as more that by getting Makoto to promise she'll protect the painting, they're messing with the timeline so that the war in Chiaki's time won't happen. Like a butterfly effect

"Maybe there's hope..." - Mulder

[–] Vehrlah 13 years ago

Yes! That's it! Painting not getting destroyed-> butterfly effect-> no war+world destruction. This fact is known by some in the future, hence the fact that thi spainting gives hope. *facepalm* of course. And i can still fit in my own little theory:
I think that the painting holds a secret about time and time travelling (as makoto already mentions at some point)
Also the vortexes and universe-like pictures included on the painting could point to this.
So i think once Chiaki has seen this painting, rules about time-travelling or time-travelling itself may change and/or it will give him power/knowledge so that it will become possible again to see Makoto.

The painting and the witch-aunt may also help Makoto herself to start time travelling, who knows?

But no way he was just using her or anything, it was clearly meant that they genuinely like eachother.

He is simply sure that they might somehow, someday find a way to meet again, and so is Makoto, by joking about the running, she makes clear she'll do whatever she can to make a reunion possible, even if at that point neither one exactly knows how and when yet.
Yay for timeless love.

[–] Super_Movie_Expert 13 years ago

I don't understand why people keep calling Makoto's aunt Mahou? i thought her name was Kazuko , and she's not a witch lol , like Makoto she did leap through time back in 1972 , if you watch the live action movie Time Traveller:The Girl Who leapt Through Time , you'll get to know what happened to her and her Daughter Akari(Makoto's cousin).

[–] Abbykat 13 years ago

It's a play on words which mostly gets lost in translation. "Majo," the word for "witch," also works as a pun on her name, and Makoto's mother calls her "Aunt Witch."

"You always know where the X-Men have been, because it's always on fire."
- Pete Wisdom

[–] mark_g_1 13 years ago

i think the painting is of the aunt...it disapears from history because the aunt keeps it for herself...

[–] barniac68 10 years ago

Er...no. You`re all over-thinking this, folks. But what wonderfully inventive minds!
The painting is a historical 1 that probably became quite well known after it`s restoration & possibly was eventually bought for a private collection, hence Chiaki coming back to this period in time to view it.
As a rough example, I have a friend who`s about as cultured as a breeze-block, but is fascinated by Da Vinci`s Mona Lisa & fulfilled his ambition several years back of actually viewing the painting with his own eyes on a 5-day holiday to France after winning £4,500 on the National Lottery (technically, a mid-week romantic trip with his wife, but she wasn`t fooled 1 bit lol!).
Incidentally, 'Makoto eventually going to the future with Chiaki' - again, very doubtful as that would be as big a no-no as leaving time-leap/future tech in the past.

[–] MadSimian 8 years ago

I don't think it's from the future but could it have been painted by someone from the future who travelled to the period in which it was painted?

This would explain why the painting is so hard to track down historically by Auntie as, going by Chiaki's example, time travelers basically create a fake identity to interact with another time period and disappear as mysteriously as they appeared. Think about it, he was enrolled in high school and you'd need identification and various other paperwork to do that in OUR modern era so why would other time travelers in other periods be much different? In fact, it would be easier to falsify an identity the further back you go in history as the technology and attendant infrastructure to track such records would be more "primitive" and susceptible to tampering.

**edit**tl;dr Time traveler creates one-off painting in past then disappears back to the future therefore the painting doesn't have any historical backing pertaining to its authenticity/origin and creator.

Rudy, question.
Yeah?
...Know any virgins?**cue spit take**