MovieChat Forums > Soredemo boku wa yattenai (2007) Discussion > U.S. Justice System Is Even Worse

U.S. Justice System Is Even Worse

posted 17 years ago by thommickel
11 replies | jump to latest

This film takes aim at the Japanese justice system, which admittedly has its flaws. But the fact is, the American "justice" system is infinitely worse.
I worked as a journalist for many years, covering court trials in the U.S., and I was shocked at how grossly unfair and poorly run our justice system is.
I saw countless low-income defendants sentenced to lengthy prison terms (and even handed down death sentences) in trials that mocked the very idea of "justice." One defendant, who received the death penalty, had a sham trial, in which his attorney slept during the proceedings, here in Texas.
One thing I found over the years is that if you have a lot of money, you can literally buy your way out of a murder rap here in the States.
I'm sure the Japanese justice has its flaws, but let's be clear on one thing: there may be "innocent" people going to jail in Japan---but Japan's crime rate is virtually non-existent, compared to America's shockingly high crime rates, particularly for violent crime.
One commentator I read said this movie takes aim at Japan's "suspiciously high" conviction rate of 99 percent. But the fact is, Japan has so little crime, that authorities aren't overwhelmed with cases (as is the case here in America). When there is little crime, you have a much better chance of actually catching and convicting criminals.
I think most Americans would be stunned at how little crime there is in Japan. After all, this is a nation where parents think nothing of letting 9-year-olds ride on the train, unaccompanied.
What's more, Japan's prison system is tiny, compared to the massive U.S. prison system. Although Japan has almost half of America's population, its prison system only has around 70,000 inmates. Compare that to the staggeringly high incarceration rate here in America (home of the biggest prison population on Earth), where over 2.2 million people are behind bars.
Given that the vast majority of people in our prison system (and Death Row) are poor, it's obvious that you can buy your way out of trouble in our corrupt, crooked justice system, if you have the bucks.

[–] duax 17 years ago

I'm not sure if I can agree that the US system is worse. No system is perfect, but a 99% conviction rate? If true, why would they even bother?

Another thing not to be overlooked, is that Japan is still a very homogenous society, with only about 3% of the population being non-Japanese. Without the race card, there's alot less to argue about and alot less "misunderstandings" to fight over.

A high productivity rate coupled with a national health care system also doesn't hurt. So, yes, there is alot less crime in Japan...but that doesn't sufficiently explain why virtually everyone who is accused gets convicted.

And lastly, the fact that most people in US jails are poor shouldn't automatically lead you to think that ALL the rich people bought themselves out. Don't forget that being poor was probably a factor in what got them there in the first place.

[–] Nephilim-6 17 years ago

Dunno which is worse but as a European observer I tend to agree that the US Justice system is seriously flawed. My major point of criticism is the whole jury thing. So we let a bunch of random people with virtually no knowledge of the law(compared to judges and lawyers) decide who is guilty or not based on subjective propaganda by either the prosecution or the defense?
Sorry but I'd rather trust a judge's decision that's based on facts than a bunch of random people who are being swayed by gut-feeling.

Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved? - Bill Hicks

[–] gregbarnes 17 years ago

Why are we even comparing the US justice system vs. the Japanese justice system anyway? Our justice system (the US, that is) has major flaws and that is no secret. I'm just not sure I understand how a film written about Japan's legal system leads to an indictment of ours.

[–] ethSin 16 years ago

99.9% conviction rate was a half-lie by the prosecutor to scare the defendant.
That number includes those who plead guilty, and as they discussed in the movie, they can just get away from it by paying a 50000 yen (US$500) fine.

According to the main lawyer in the movie, 3% of the cases are acquitted in court. 97% conviction rate still sounds bad, but nowhere as bad as 99.9%

[–] cooleon 16 years ago

fines are also punishments for the guilty.
only lighter than doing hard time.

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

[–] JapanGuy 16 years ago

Sorry, thommickel, but you've missed the key points in what makes the Japanese criminal justice system (don't even get me started on family court) miles behind the U.S. in fairness. Some highlights of the Japanese system in contrast to the U.S.:

* The presumption of guilt. If you have been formally arrested, you are assumed to be guilty: by the police, the prosecutor and the public. Because you are assumed guilty even before trial, those who fight and protest their innocence are branded as someone who is refusing to atone for their crime and isn't showing remorse, which always leads to heavier sentencing. Exercising your right to be silent amounts to tacit assumption of your own guilt.

* The legal detention of suspects for 3 days with 8-hour interrogation sessions for police to investigate the crime, which can be extended by an extra two 10-day sessions at the prosecutor's discretion: all of which are are held without the presence of your lawyer. To reiterate, 23 days detention with 8-hour interrogations without a lawyer present. It wasn't even until THIS year that public and government pressure forced the police to start videotaping the interrogations. In addition, the majority of convictions from the 97% conviction rate historically have come from signed confessions from these three-week, non-recorded interrogations. This, despite Japan's constitution clearly stating that signed confessions while under duress cannot be used in court.

* Non disclosure of prosecutor's evidence. The prosecutor is under no obligation to disclose their amassed evidence; whether it be a witness, forensic evidence or otherwise. Any evidence that doesn't help THEIR case is not used by them and is not handed over to your defense lawyer.

Sorry, but in terms of fairness, it's not even close.

[–] thommickel 15 years ago

You have an idealized, rosy, naive view of the U.S. judicial system.

I never claimed that the Japanese system is perfect.

But let's look at a couple of numbers:

People locked up in prison:

1. America: 2.2 million
2. Japan: 70 thousand

I'll take my chances with a Japanese court. I mean, the odds that one will wind
up in prison in Japan are pretty remote---whereas here in the U.S., it's a very real possibility. Not only does the U.S. have the world's biggest prison system, but we have the highest incarceration rate, as well. Bizarrely, our nation's media pretty much ignores our soaring prison rate and much of the public isn't even aware of it.

I read somewhere that, if the current increase in the prison population continues, that by the year 2145, everyone in America will either be in prison, or working for a prison. It's an astonishing fact---and it goes to show how completely and utterly clueless Americans are about what goes on in our own country. (Although we seem to be really informed about such urgent matters as who won "American Idol.").

Incidentally, the "fair" U.S. rules that you cite are complete and utter bullsh*t. Those rules are window dressing only. They are only adhered to in high-profile cases (usually involving the rich and powerful) in trials under the glare of the media spotlight.

In ordinary cases, these precious rules that you cite are simply non-existent.
I worked the crime beat for many years. I saw many defendants who had the sh*t beaten out of them by crooked cops. I saw innocent people go to prison on trumped-up charges. Oh, and a lot of people who go into prison in the U.S. never make it out alive.

As always, people such as yourself compare America's ideals to other nations' realities.

The Constitution doesn't mean a god damn thing if it's not adhered to. And much of the time, here in the U.S. it's completely and utterly ignored.

I hate to burst your bubble, but the U.S. judicial system is not fair or just. Justice is for sale to the highest bidder.

Oh, and Santa doesn't exist, either.

[–] sanjuniban 15 years ago

Nevermind the fact that if one actually is acquitted in Japan, the prosecutor retains the right to appeal the innocent verdict--which he always does. An aqcuittal at the appeals level is virtually non-existent. Thus, the system does maintain a 99.9+% conviction rate.

To those who feel that the U.S. system of justice is problematic, you are correct. However, I have yet, in more than 10 years of research into a variety of legal systems(including a graduate school thesis on Japan's criminal conviction rate), encountered one which is flawless.

As for the question "which country has a more corrupt system of justice, the U.S. or Japan?" I believe, from the accused's standpoint, the answer is in the details. That is, if I'm the defendant, and I've been accused of a lesser crime--and I have a choice between being tried in an American court or its Japanese equivalent--I'll choose the former. At least in the American system, one stands a chance at being acquitted of the accusations that he/she faces. Not so in Japan. If I'm facing a serious charge like rape, murder, etc., however, then I'd rather be tried in Japan where the courts are surprisingly lenient in the sentencing phase(this is changing a bit these days, however, with the current wave of "genbatsuka"..).

Now, with regards to the comment by the European observer that one stands a greater chance at receiving justice through a verdict which is rendered by a professional judge rather than a body of lay jury members, I must disagree with you--especially in the case of Japan. The Japanese Ministry of Justice is a bureaucracy. In this bureaucracy, the careers of prosecutors and judges are significantly affected by the number of cases that end up in an acquittal--the number of cases that they "lose". This, of course, could make sense with regards to the procuracy, since, after all, the whole point of their existence is to prosecute. For judges, men and women who are charged with bringing out the truth in a given case and (in some cases) rendering a fair and impartial verdict, this is clearly worrisome. And this is the case in Japan where judges are promoted for overseeing an acquittal-less courtroom and conversely punished (demotion, ostracism, etc.)for incurring the defeat of an acquittal. If you are ever tried for a crime in Japan, you better pray that a jury, rather than a panel of judges, will be handing down your verdict.

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