Gale Harold = Good Ratings. The truth about what happened... - Vanished (2006) Discussion

[–] Ms_Christina 17 years ago

Why didn't they audience test the pilot before inking the deal to air 13 episodes? It seems odd to put a show in their line-up without knowing if it appealed to the demographic they were seeking. Then deciding to kill the lead actor the day the show aired. If that was the true reason they let Gale go it seems like the whole project was mismanaged from day one.

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[–] dap_125 17 years ago

I think there was a group assigned to be the pilot audience and the feedback was not good even before the official airing of the show.

There were several comments posted to this board.

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Yes, indeed, rumors have been energetically spread on this board and elsewhere that are meant to exonerate Fox, and this one is believable insofar as it only consists of the suggestion that Gale didn't test well among young males. The unspoken corollary is that he tested satisfactorily among every other demographic group.

However, instead of tweaking the character, what they decided to do was the preposterous expedient of replacing the lead actor 7 episodes into the broadcast season, letting the news get out right after the premiere, covering the show with flop sweat and shooting themselves in the foot. The audience started peeling away as soon as the rumor came out, and the audience segments that Gale did NOT test badly with voted with their feet as soon as Gale became a corpse.

They never promoted their lead by name, de-emphasized him in all the publicity, gave him lousy direction, gave him flat writing, costumed him badly, did nothing to enhance him, and he was STILL popular with the show's audience, to the extent that half of 6 million wouldn't even watch it without him.

And Cibrian seems to have attracted no young males to speak of whatsoever. The entire share of the 18-49 demo on the last ep was 0.9%, and that's every part of the age group and BOTH sexes.

Sophia Loren would have had no career in American films at all if she'd been under contract with Fox. Her first Hollywood movies flopped, because although men found her sexy, women hated her. Instead of just firing her, they put her in "Houseboat" and let her interact with children onscreen. They tweaked her image. Had Fox given Kelton a better look, had we seen him punch somebody in the snoot, had we seen women ogle him and other men envy him, 18-23 year old males might have warmed to him, and the audience that liked him would have stuck too.

Fox did none of that. Look, they were STUPID. And if you don't believe me, tell me what's on at 8 p.m. on Friday. They had a solid show before news leaked out that Gale had been written out, and they didn't have a failure till he left. Then the show INSTANTLY failed. It didn't even go into a tailspin. It just blew up and fell out of the sky, raining burning wreckage onto Berman, Leder and Liguori. They should all be fired. This is worse than failure. It's self-destructive and wanton caprice.

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[–] luckyfourleafclover 17 years ago

'didn't even go into a tailspin. It just blew up and fell out of the sky, raining burning wreckage onto Berman, Leder and Liguori. They should all be fired. This is worse than failure. It's self-destructive and wanton caprice.'

Hi, I have followed your posts all around Vanished, because I, like you, were following a character. I have recently found out that the for mentioned people, even tried to blame him for the demise of the show. You were right the whole time, I couldn't believe, so called professionals would behave in such a manner. What a bunch of creeps

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Thank you. And thank you for bumping this thread.

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***You must be old and wrinkled to have that type of reaction. - Liana***

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[–] dap_125 17 years ago

I would be very interested in reading that article. I must have missed that one where the shows failure was blamed on Gale. Please provide a link or url.

thanks

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[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] StellaDallas 17 years ago

"Professionals only behave unprofessionally to the unprofessional."

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[–] QAFNikitafan 17 years ago

I have to admit, I am confused by that one...

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Just a quick note: Professionals only behave unprofessionally to the unprofessional.

As another great thinker once said, my friend, you live in a pretty, sparkly world.

But as for "plenty of years," Berman has been a show-runner exactly as long as Gale Harold has been a TV star, and worked on fewer sets. He started with "CSI" in 2000, went on to "Vanished," and is now in the boneyard that is "Bones." He and Gale are about the same age. Mimi Leder's career is a lot longer, but her work on "Vanished" wasn't that impressive, despite her experience.

Gale's professionalism has never been questioned by anybody who wasn't trying to scapegoat him for their own dumb mistakes, and those very few people happen to have been associated with one particular Fox series. I've met plenty of unprofessional people in my life, and watched them behave unprofessionally toward people who were far more professional and talented than they were. As a matter of fact, those are the people towards whom they're likely to behave the most unprofessionally.

In any case, your argument goes two ways: if unprofessionalism toward Gale could only be motivated by his own unprofessionalism, then couldn't one say equally well that Gale's alleged unprofessionalism could only be motivated by the unprofessionalism of his bosses? Circular arguments roll downhill.

I don't think Gale's firing was necessarily "unprofessional." Stupid, yes. Colossally stupid, uh huh. Bordering on moronic, oh yes indeed. But the whispering campaign since that time, and the shady little press plants, and the invasion of the Fox shills -- that's as unprofessional as it gets. Meanwhile, the "unprofessional" Gale Harold isn't throwing shade on his former employers in interviews or on red carpets. He's not telling anybody that he's heard Josh Berman is unprofessional but has never personally seen it. I think his professionalism (and his gentlemanliness) have been above reproach.

And if you think an "unprofessional" actor does 8 performances a week for months in the legitimate theatre and never misses a performance or delays a curtain, you are very much mistaken.

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***You must be old and wrinkled to have that type of reaction. - Liana***

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[–] LordoftheGeeks 17 years ago

I agree with everything Morgaine said. This character could have come off as being a one dimensional suited stiff, like half the detectives on TV, but Gale made this guy intruiging. I wanted to see him go to work each week.

I don't understand why those in charge had no faith in this show, especially with all of the terrible crap on TV now that gets pushed on us all.

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[–] mbs 17 years ago

the show flopped post gale because the only two times the show aired post gale...the show was on friday nights where fox hasn't been able to get out of last place in years. if the show had continued on monday nights it prob would have gotten similar ratings to what it had been getting the last time or two it was there.

and yes gale was good, at least they tried to develop a character for him with a tortured backround and a loving kid and an ex wife and that whole backstory about the kidnapping ransom gone bad that haunted him they havn't even bothered to give eddie a backround story...but the main problem with the show wasn't its acting...it was the main storyline with the missing senator's wife and all the mystery surrounding her life, backround, and current family was mehhhh. every week with a new twist that didn't really advance the show at all so much as create one more problem for them to come up with a ridiculous soulution for before the next ridicuolous twist that was supposed to move the show foward. that's why the show was falling down every week....there was no momentum on it, no compelling reason to stick with it no promise or guarantee that there would be a resolution to the storyline like with 24 or even with prison break where they eventually got out of prison...just the possibility that they would find her.

am looking foward to next week's online ep though...crossing my fingers that they give her a proper send-off and not some new radical twist that would have sent the show veering into another mystery!

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

I don't know why the people who insist upon the shift to Friday (and the baseball hiatus) as the reasons for the show's loss of half its audience insist upon those two factors as the only factors. The show comes to a natural stopping place (the very opposite of a "cliffhanger") with Kelton's death. To negate that death (and the loss of Gale Harold) as a factor is so wrong that I can’t fathom why anybody does it.

"Justice" also switched nights, and also had to come back after a baseball hiatus, and yep, it also lost audience. But it didn't lose fifty percent of that audience. And it isn't just a question of 3 million "Vanished" viewers taking a hike. Look at the rankings. The show moved to dead last on Friday night, despite extremely unimpressive competition. The CW beat it with the "Friday Night Smackdown."

So even though there's a smaller pie to divvy up on Friday night, that shouldn't effect the ability of "Vanished" to get some of it. In fact, the show did so poorly that Fox didn't dare run it anymore. Anything they put in its place was a better idea. On Friday, November 24th, they ran "Bruce Almighty." How did it do? Better. Its share of the 18-49 demo was 2.1. The last night "Vanished" aired, it got a 0.9. And Fox beat the CW too ... with a 3 year old Jim Carrey movie (!!!) ... when it couldn't do so with a new airing of a new series episode with a supposedly hot new leading man.

What's more, if the problem with "Vanished" was simply Friday night's slot, it would have held onto the audience it did get on the first Friday night it aired. It didn't even do that. Cibrian's second night as the show's lead did even worse than his first. Bad enough that those 3 million people didn't come back to see Gale for ten seconds on a slab right after the baseball hiatus, but it's even worse that those who did do so started peeling away as soon as they made sure he was dead. Cibrian didn't even hold the audience he did get.

Here’s what the Washington Post said: “Turns out killing the star in the seventh episode wasn't such a good idea after all. Fox has pulled "Vanished," which briefly starred Gale Harold, out of its lineup and will run the remaining episodes on the Internet.”

Look, Somebody had to win Friday night, and as far as I'm concerned, if CBS can win it with that awful "Ghost Whisperer" (and it does), Fox can hardly pretend that Friday night is an impossible night for it to win with anything. What's more, where do you get the idea that 6-7 million people is somehow the show's natural audience -- that it's some kind of level it would inevitably have risen to on Friday, even in the absence of the man who starred in the show for every single episode that did attain that size audience?

Actors do matter. The personalities in the show do matter. Are you somehow saying that 6 million people would watch a show about a Masonic conspiracy no matter who was in it? What if it were done in claymation? In anime? What if it were just read cold by midgets sitting on stools? You not only don't have a crystal ball, but you really need to consistent in your arguments and not transgress the bounds of common sense. What happened happened. The disaster may have had several causes, but the bizarre decision to ditch the leading man abruptly at the end of the 7th episode was surely one of them. There's no way it could not be.

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[–] bluehex 13 years ago

I know I'm responding to an old post, but - I only discovered "Vanished" now, and I must agree with you - killing Gale off was definitely the dumbest decision ever made for the show. The concept/plot was the tiredest ever; also, somewhat absurd. But Gale sold it flawlessly and made it intriguing. After he was gone, it all just sort of fizzed out.

But then, Fox isn't ecxactly famous for good decisions, are they? Same guys canceled Firefly after half a season...

Don't patronize me, I'm not totally defective.

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[–] kam1975 17 years ago

i had recorded every episode on my dvd recorder
where can i see the rest of the epsiodes
will it come to dvd
also what happened to sara collins

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[–] dap_125 17 years ago

I can't wait to see how this will end, but it looks like the plot is going in another direction.

Sara Collins warrior princess. LOL.

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[–] shayneferry 17 years ago

OMG are you kidding me! I was SO excited bout this show and then when i heard it was airing in Aus i was even more excited! But now this just SUX! I will, without a doubt, stop watching the MINUTE Gale is gone! What a truly terrible decision to make! Stupid idiots! I was so excited cos i was under the impression that he sorta had like his own new show where he was the main character and gonna stick around, this is SH()T!

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[–] dap_125 17 years ago

If you were just watching because of Gale, then there is no point in watching.
What a shame the show itself was pretty good.

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[–] jaded66 17 years ago

The ONLY point in watching was Gale. I actually liked the show at first but then I realized that I only liked it because of Gale. There is no point in watching it now, it couldn't hold my interest after he left.

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[–] shayneferry 17 years ago

Im with Jaded66!

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[–] dap_125 17 years ago

It's your choice.

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[–] michigan_jim 17 years ago

Honestly, I never heard of Gale Harold before I watched this show. The only ones I knew were the beautiful Ming-Na, and the guy who played Jeffrey Collins. I watched the show because of the CONCEPT. I have watched exactly ONE show in my life becuase of an actor ("Heroes", but I also like the concept). If the concept isn't good, the best actor in the world can't save it. On the other hand, with a good concept, the actors can be so-so, and the show can still be acceptable.

That said, I think Gale Harold did a decent job as Agent Kelton. That's no reason to rag on Eddie Cibrian, he's also a good actor (and in fact, I think I liked his work here even more than on "Invasion"). It seems like they killed off Kelton for shock value (which they accomplished), and to let the audience know how serious the bad guys were.

I think it's delusional to act like this show was some big Gale Harold starring vehicle. The star was supposed to be the concept. Sadly, it just didn't take with enough of an audience, and we are left with an incomplete story. Not the first time it's happened in TV, and it won't be the last, either.

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

He did have top billing, and half the audience departed when he did. If they'd hated the concept, they could have left after the first episode. If they'd loved the concept, they could have stayed after the lead died. It's "delusional" to suggest that actors don't matter, that characters don't matter. Characters are hooks, even in a plot-driven show, and actors have followings. Beyond the people who already knew Gale Harold from Queer as Folk, a lot of the audience for Vanished obviously embraced him on the show. Even if nobody on earth had heard of Gale Harold before this series, everybody watching it knew who Graham Kelton was by the time it ended. How many people had heard of him prior to the show is immaterial.

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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] Avidog 17 years ago

Gale was terrible! With him in the show, it became agenda-driven drivel. It's obvious by some of your comments. You only watched the show because of him; Puh-leaze!! I was delighted when he was shot and replaced, more or less, by the much more capable Eddie Cibrian. This show might have worked if this was the choice from the beginning. Apologies Gale-o-philes.

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[–] mchellie 17 years ago

Pretty much irrelevent now! OH YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!

mmmexperimental
nothing unreal exists

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

More capable of putting it in the toilet, you mean. Yeah, and it might have worked from the beginning if they'd paid us all to watch it. Or maybe not. If they'd given Gale more to act, a little more character conflict, that would have worked from the beginning. The only mistake they never made was that they never required any acting from "capable" Eddie Cibrian.

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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] sjm111455 17 years ago

and the only thing they right was to let gale out of contract so he could go one to better things.

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Amen.

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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] galebud 17 years ago

Avidog,

Which one of Edie's two expressions do you like best? And which one of his cancelled shows did you like the best? He's a real show stopper.

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[–] Avidog 17 years ago

Touche! But what's Gale up to now? Not taking more "butch" lessons I hope. God knows, he's taken enough, at least for me.

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[–] itsthesled 17 years ago

Gale Harold was terrible in this show.

I had never heard of him before this show and now I know why.

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[–] ccbw16-1 17 years ago

man i read stuff about something big happening in ep 7..didnt know it was so controversial..

i watched all 13 eps in 2 days..what a waste of time..the ending sucked..the whole storyline with the decoding ancient stuff which made up the latter half of the season was pointless..

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[–] jcarlile99 17 years ago

I'm with you "itsthesled"..... terrible actor. I enjoyed the show much more with the new actor, Eddie C..

But, all you Gale Harold fans: if you like the concept of the show, why would you leave just because he was killed off? Makes no sense to me!

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

We liked the concept of a show starring Gale Harold. If it had to be this one, we'd have watched it. No way we'd go on watching it after they scapegoated Gale for the writing and direction.

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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] sjm111455 17 years ago

after he was killed off the concept of the show changed. there were what several different story lines that seemed interesting and then boom he gets shot and the story lines disappear. want to tell me why jcarlile99

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Ignorant people always blame their ignorance on the universe. If it were of any significance, it would have bored its way into their thick craniums. They feel that way about Proust and physics and the United States Constitution, so God knows they'll feel that way about an actor. If they haven't heard of him, he must be nobody. Needless to say, their opinions about what constitutes good or bad acting may be safely disregarded.

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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] filmfan86 17 years ago

Hey - I'm from Australia - I just came online to check if his character actually died - or if he somehow survived - man, i'm so disappointed! he was the reason i started watching the show! I will probably watch the rest - cause i want to know what's happening - but i think it was a major mistake to have your spunky lead character die 7 eps in! its so ...permanant! Surely if they wern't sure - they could have had his character leave temporarily instead - thus leaving options - ie - if people complain once he's gone etc.
Aww, i'm sad. All that time invested in background - only to shoot him. geez!

"Everything in this room is eatable. Even I'm eatable. But that’s called cannibalism."

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Fox fumbled the ball bigtime.

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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] rickisme_99 17 years ago

Hey wait a minute....did someone say somethin' about "FOX'S AWFUL "GHOST WHISPERER"???" you're such a meanie! Meanie, meanie, meanie! I hope you can't poo for a week! I hope you have buggers! Me wuv dat show!
and David Conrad is H-O-T!!!

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

It's on CBS. Hubby's adorable, but I still hate the show.
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***Every troll is not a shill, but every shill is a troll.***

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[–] Vivilp182 17 years ago

Yeah I mean, I only started watching Vanished cause of Gale Harold. In the beggining I actually liked the show, but after some ep they just seem to be losing track of it; the show isn't very good but I'm gonna watch it at least till Graham dies... I'm from Brazil, so they're only passing it right now.

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[–] PhillyJim 17 years ago

I had never heard of Gale before Vanished, but as soon as I watched the 1st episode I was hooked. I loved the whole premise of the show and the characters, especially Gale. Once I heard Gale was getting killed, I was praying the shooter would miss him and kill the reporter instead. But alas, those gunshots left the entire show in a pool of blood. So sad.

I wish I was in that test audience before the show aired. I'm an 18-23 yr old male and I LOVED the show and Gale's character.

Cameron: "You Okay?"
House: "Hurt my shoulder playing fantasy football"

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[–] Ricardo_Aparicio 17 years ago

"Ignorant people always blame their ignorance on the universe. If it were of any significance, it would have bored its way into their thick craniums. They feel that way about Proust and physics and the United States Constitution, so God knows they'll feel that way about an actor. If they haven't heard of him, he must be nobody. Needless to say, their opinions about what constitutes good or bad acting may be safely disregarded."

Wow. I guess you really like Gale Harold.

I liked this show. It was a good concept, and I'm sorry to see it go.

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[–] nnutting-1 17 years ago

Let's just tell the truth.....Fox was worried from the begining that gale harold wouldnt be embraced by the demo it was aiming for.....men....and it was all due to the fact of his portyral as a gay man on queer as folk that ran on showtime for 5 seasons. they hired him for his acting skill then started to sweat when he was noticed as the guy on the gay show...they freaked out and figured he wouldnt play well with the male demos and they made the call to kill him off without even waiting to see if it worked...which it did but it was to late, they had already filmed his death. Fox blew it and thats that. What a bunch of idiots....they didnt realize that most people started watching the show BECAUSE of gale and thier desire to see him after watching him on queer as folk.....they screwed up as far as I'm concerned and i wouldnt watch it again because to be honest outside of gale it was boring and confusing and all over the place......and i found it completly bland. if I want to watch the same old crap i can watch one of the many CSI's.

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[–] Suki_Weeks 17 years ago

His character was killed off in the UK showing last night. Not a lot to stick around for now...all the other characters are D.U.L.L. No wonder it was put to rest after this stupid decision.

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[–] UnprodigalDaughter 17 years ago

Have you seen him around in the last couple of weeks?

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[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] UnprodigalDaughter 17 years ago

No particular reason, I was just wondering.

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[–] rodgersgeoff 17 years ago

I am devastated.

I have been watching this show in Sydney Australia for a couple of months now and was fully into it.

I initially tuned in to see how our little Aussie actor turned Hollywood star (Chris Egan) would handle it.

However i was instantly hooked. Having loved Gale Harolds work in Queer As Folk was very happy to see him again and in something so different.

Needless to say i was in shock and totally devastated last week when he was killed off, i still tuned in this week to see if it was really true and was amazed to note the steep decline in the quality and vibe of the show.

How can i be expected to believe that the silly playboy from Sunset Beach (Eddie Cibrian) is now the leading man.

It's a travesty i tell you.

Shame on Fox and total shame on whoever made that decision

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[–] SheBear 17 years ago

Jeremy please check your private messages.

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

He's been in NYC doing a play 8 performances a week for the last 4 months. But thanks for sharing all that hostility. Innumerable people who have waited for him after the show speak about how nice he was -- their only complaint being that he won't permit photographs to be taken. They do report that a lot of female fans have been extremely pushy and rude to him, and have gone ahead and used their cameras anyway. Some women are too discourteous to deserve a lot of courtesy in return.

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***You didn't suffer as much as black people so stop acting special.***

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[–] SheBear 17 years ago

"They do report that a lot of female fans have been extremely pushy and rude to him, and have gone ahead and used their cameras anyway."

Alot? Extremely? Pushy? Rude? We've read the same posts but apparently came to different conclusions.

IMO: less than an handful to none out of each bunch does not alot make. And simply taking a pic does not make someone extremely pushy or rude.

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[–] rodgersgeoff 17 years ago

I am devastated.

I have been watching this show in Sydney Australia for a couple of months now and was fully into it.

I initially tuned in to see how our little Aussie actor turned Hollywood star (Chris Egan) would handle it.

However i was instantly hooked. Having loved Gale Harolds work in Queer As Folk was very happy to see him again and in something so different.

Needless to say i was in shock and totally devastated last week when he was killed off, i still tuned in this week to see if it was really true and was amazed to note the steep decline in the quality and vibe of the show.

How can i be expected to believe that the silly playboy from Sunset Beach (Eddie Cibrian) is now the leading man.

It's a travesty i tell you.

Shame on Fox and total shame on whoever made that decision

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

Thanks, rodgersgeoff. You're just going through what we all went through in the States. Outrage.

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***You didn't suffer as much as black people so stop acting special.***

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

I'm not going to fight about this, SheBear. I'm simply going to say that if Gale has ever been rude to any females in California, it's quite possible that the females were rude first.

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***You didn't suffer as much as black people so stop acting special.***

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] rowanderaven 17 years ago

No Gale, no more Vanished for me! And I want Cibrian back to Invasion!!!

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[–] this_fortress_of_tears 17 years ago

Anyone else find it slightly amusing that the show had an excellent title for itself...

Here in Australia the first couple of weeks they aired the show in our primetime 8.30pm slot, a few weeks later it was showing at 11.40pm....vanished completely indeed.

And for me, Gale was the only reason I took remote notice of the show, after having been a fan of his work for the past 7 yrs thanks to QaF. Was also good to see Chris Egan in something else too.

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] StellaDallas 17 years ago

He may be a consistant, predictable performer but his shows have also consistently been axed. Perhaps the U.S. version of "Footballers' Wives" that he's working on will break his losing streak, lest he become the next Ted McGinley.

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[–] ducdebrabant 17 years ago

I love Cibrian, he's always been a consistant performer

Van Buren: Who minds those pop bottles flyin'
Rocky: The hisses and boos
Mickey, Bubba, Ozzie, Smokey: The team has been consistent
Bomber, Sohovik: Yeah we always lose ...

Jerry Ross
"Heart"
(DAMN YANKEES)

Cibrian is extremely consistent. He always does exactly the same thing, exactly the same way. He's not very expressive, and his range is extremely narrow. I do love his eyes, dimples and pecs, and I can hardly blame you for doing the same. But claiming he's a better actor than Gale? MMMM,kay.

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***You must be old and wrinkled to have that type of reaction. - Liana***

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] rapunzzle 17 years ago

Living in the UK, I've been unable to see most episodes, but I did see a few with Gale and --being originally from Canada LOVED him from Queer as Folk and other works-- was instantly hooked. He was the perfect man for such a role. Then, I turn on the tellie and 'no more Gale'. I've been very confused and that's what brought me on here. All things aside, I can't believe the removed --did they really kill the character?-- such a talented actor. Annoyed. Very, very annoyed. And is it is a good show.. only, it's so poorly done :P Yuck.

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