Why didn't Hector 3 simply kill Hector 1 and Hector 2? - Los cronocrímenes (2008) Discussion

[–] prop_fan 10 years ago

It is logical. He would NOT exist.

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Yeah time travel has been totally explored and studied scientifically.

Killing your grandfather will create a new time line, but the line with you existing will still be there.

Parallel universes have been studied thoroughly too.

Not paid attention in 5th grade in physics?

Oh wait... what time is it? ^^

---
Lincoln Lee: I lost a partner.
Peter Bishop: I lost a universe!

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[–] Darthnixa 10 years ago

That's not how it happens. This is the answer to your question, however strange it may sound.

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[–] jackluminous1965 10 years ago

in terms of causality that would mean that Hector 3 would not exist...BUT you have time paradoxes so IMHO its theoretically possible...Its sad but I think the only time travel/looping story I have seen the character attempt to break the loop is Groundhog Day when he commits suicide

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[–] halonone 10 years ago

Funny how many times this comment is showing up. If you went back in time and killed yourself right after you were born, you would never have grown up to be able to go back to kill yourself. Simple as that. It's basically the grandfather paradox without going as far back as your grandfather. It's pretty much an unsolvable riddle.

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[–] ibrarules 10 years ago

It's basically the grandfather paradox

Which is a type of timetravel paradox that does not apply in the type of time-travel logic present in this particular film. In fact, it's pretty much the point of the movie. This is not Back to the Future.

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[–] Orion775 10 years ago

No, it's mentioned numerous times in the movie that if Hector 1, 2 or 3 doesn't continue his path then they wont exist. E.G. if Hector 3 didn't orchestrate the killing of the young girl, he would of ceased to exist because Hector 2 would never have a reason to get back in the time machine, thus Hector 3 would never be created. The line would end with Hector 2, like it did with Hector 3 in the movie.

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[–] Dejay 9 years ago

If that theory is true then it would be enough to break Hectors 1 his leg to stop him from going back in time in the first place. Or stop Hector 2 from scaring Hector 1. Then Hector 2+3 would cease to exist which is the same as committing murder-suicide. In that case "nobody" dies that was supposed to be there in the first place.

But it's far more likely that paradoxes aren't solved by divine intervention but just through new alternative timelines. Time travel violates causality in any case (objects from thin air). So he wouldn't "disappear" if he doesn't go back in time.

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[–] tobisama 9 years ago

But Hector 3 could simply convince Hector 2 (talking to him) to go back to the machine (instead of hitting himself with that table in the house), and to repeat the crash with the van.

There was no need to kill the girl.. but Hector was not so brilliant.

Plus Hector 2 and 3 already knew about time travel so they could figured that solution.

A different case would be trying to convince Hector 1.

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[–] runefrog-960-37728 10 years ago

The whole point of the film is no matter what changes you try to make it will inevitably lead to the eventuality you're trying to change.

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[–] rainofwalrus 10 years ago

The whole point of the film is no matter what changes you try to make it will inevitably lead to the eventuality you're trying to change.

This.

AKA The self-consistency principle.

1. Fold space-time and kill your infant mother... Didn't vanish? You were actually adopted.

2. Fold space-time and kill your infant birth-mother... Still didn't vanish? She isn't your actual birth-mother.

And so on. Strangely, self-consistency theory is precisely the type of science that led to "run flat tires." They self-correct for displaced air. You could say that run flat tires are intelligent, and you would not be entirely wrong.

Enjoy these words, for one day they'll be gone... All of them.

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[–] rainofwalrus 10 years ago

The whole point of the film is no matter what changes you try to make it will inevitably lead to the eventuality you're trying to change.

This.

AKA The self-consistency principle.

1. Fold space-time and kill your infant mother... Didn't vanish? You were actually adopted.

2. Fold space-time and kill your infant birth-mother... Still didn't vanish? She isn't your actual birth-mother.

And so on. Strangely, self-consistency theory is precisely the type of theory that led to "run flat tires." They self-correct for displaced air. You could say that run flat tires are intelligent, and you would not be entirely wrong.

Enjoy these words, for one day they'll be gone... All of them.

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[–] Blonde2291 10 years ago

Hector 1, 2 and 3 are the same person - only in different time frames. Killing any one of them will kill all of them as they cross the time when one of them was killed.

I only ask to be free. The butterflies are free. - Charles Dickens

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[–] myownopinion 10 years ago

I think Blonde2291 is right - at least that explanation makes the most sense to me.

I think the movie remains confusing. At the end, Hector 3 is sitting with his wife waiting "for the storm" both figuratively and literally. One of the Hectors (presumably) is driving away. And what happened to the 3rd Hector? - that's a loose end that isn't covered.

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[–] Symarip 9 years ago

The Hector sitting with his wife waiting IS the third Hector. The second one goes back in time after thinking he killed his wife, becoming Hector 3 in that timeline.

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[–] alveolate 9 years ago

i think that's exactly what hector 3 had in mind when he decided to go back in time again. he wanted to kill hector 2, but unfortunately (or inevitably) he ended up driving his van into another ditch and passing out for a bit.

thereafter, he ended up following the bike girl back to the house, and met his wife, whereupon he hatched a plan to let the girl die in clara's place. at that moment, he could actually try to kill hector 2 in the house; but he had become fatalistic after the van crash -- found the radio and told scientist it did not work. so he thought his only chance was to make things "fit" the previous iterations by getting the girl to take the fall.

in a sense, it kind of seemed like the "run-flat tires" thing which another poster said; but imo, that was just hector 3's belief. in fact, hector 2 behaved the exact same way -- trying to recreate the scenario his previous iteration saw. he never actually tried to kill his previous iteration (he tried to run hector 2 off the road, but he knows 2 survives it) or flub causality in any way. the film was scripted based on this key assumption: that there is a single timeline and it cannot (seem to) be altered by time travel.

there is however, no certainty as to whether killing an earlier hector would i) kill all hectors, or ii) cause the "uncaused" subsequent hectors to cease existing. it could turn out that the parallel universes theory was correct after all, and negating causality simply causes you to split off into a new parallel universe. or, it could implode all physics and negate the entirety of existence. there's just no way to know which would happen.

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[–] Dr_Julius_Strangepork 9 years ago

"there is however, no certainty as to whether killing an earlier hector would i) kill all hectors, or ii) cause the "uncaused" subsequent hectors to cease existing. it could turn out that the parallel universes theory was correct after all, and negating causality simply causes you to split off into a new parallel universe. or, it could implode all physics and negate the entirety of existence. there's just no way to know which would happen."

^^THIS.

neither the scientist nor hector 2 or 3 know what would happen if he doesn't preserve the timeflow. so is it worth the risk?

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[–] karlweb2002 9 years ago

He does not have to kill 1 and 2. In the end, he realizes as long as he does not interfere and just sits there with his wife, he can go on his life without the other two, who are left behind in the past, perhaps forever trapped in the time loop busily chasing each other.

From Taiwan, Ming Dynasty

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[–] Mellow-Fellow 9 years ago

Yeah... chasing himself, like the new movie "Predestination", only not as cool.

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[–] 9 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Kent_Kainer 9 years ago

He could kill H2 and overtake his part. Spares the creation of a new H3 and saves the bike girl.
All important things H3 does anyway is bump H2 into the bushes to get the bike girls attention. He could dump himself to cause this. Or use force right from the beginning.

---
Lincoln Lee: I lost a partner.
Peter Bishop: I lost a universe!

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