Did anyone else start wondering about Red when that professor mentioned that the final circle of the Inferno is reserved for the treacherous? We know Red betrayed his brother, and not only is part of that circle reserved for those who betrayed their kindred, but the head of Judas Iscariot is also found there - Red was "Judas" to the Apostle killer in the first Messiah.
shareI did wonder, but then surely they wouldn't mirror the first Messiah so blatantly?
Duncan was quite treacherous in the first one, too. Remember when he sold the case out to that journalist for £20,000? Maybe he hasn't paid for that, yet......
Yeah, that's what I thought - I can't see them re-doing the ending of the first series. Plus, a lot of casual viewers have probably forgotten what happened between Red and Eric.
shareYou're right, and Eric wasn't even mentioned in the third one.
I don't thnk they refer that much to the first one, as by rights Red should be in jail for the hit and run, and Duncan should be off the force for taking the journalists money. The whole Dante thing is a wee bit like the film 7seven, only it's circles of Hell instead of deadly sins. Maybe Kevin Spacey has a role in tonights episode!
I wondered about that, Red being in prison. In the third series he talked about "the madness", about his reaction to being in prison, but he talked about it as though it was about 10 years ago - are we to assume that there was 10 years between Messiah 1 and 2? I wonder how long his prison sentence would have been - Jez wasn't killed in the hit-and-run, after all.
shareNo, I think the whole reference to Pace Tierney holding him hostage was completely seperate. I think Red was supposed to have been in a similar 'prison riot' situation 11 years previously, while Red was a cop, not a prisoner. Timeline wise, I think it's about real. If you remember in the first one, Duncan's son Sam was about 11/12, and in Messiah 2, he's about 13/14.
I've just remembered something from Sunday night that could be relevant, the new DC (Twinkle from Dinnerladies) said to the grieving mother "It's OK, she's not suffering, she's in Heaven now" , so she has some religious leanings. Hmmm.
She cant be the killer (Twinkle) cause the whole point of the murders is to show them hell not heaven.
(there is alight that never goes out)
The ninth circle is for those who betray personal benefactors, not necessarily family members. Dante viewed Judas, Brutus, and Cassius as sort of twice damned in that they betrayed their respective masters (Brutus and Cassius conspired to kill Julius Caesar) and they betrayed religious and historical progress, with the Roman Empire conceived of as the forerunner of God's kingdom on earth. In the context of Dante's scheme, Red would be viewed as sinful for not turning Eric in; in that case, his betrayal would have been against the social order.
I think maybe I spend far too much time teaching Dante; the professor's interpretation of the Inferno kind of ticked me off.
All in all, the ending was a big disappointment. Unlike some who have commented, I did not suspect. When looking for a likely perpetrator, you look for motive, opportunity and _wherewithal_. I don't accept that this revealed killer actually could have been capable of performing all of the crimes, and I expect that that's why I couldn't / didn't suspect who it was.
I like the way Ken Stott does that sub-volcanic rage thing and I hope there are more stories under this rubric. But except for the first Messiah, I think most people agree that the writing has been weak.
henry, it was impossible for anyone to carry out those murders, not just the killer, so it doesn't really matter, programmes don't always have to be overly realistic for it to be good. And I thought messiah 3 and 4 weren't as good as the others, but messiah 2 was much better than messiah 1!!
share"All in all, the ending was a big disappointment. Unlike some who have commented, I did not suspect. When looking for a likely perpetrator, you look for motive, opportunity and _wherewithal_. I don't accept that this revealed killer actually could have been capable of performing all of the crimes, and I expect that that's why I couldn't / didn't suspect who it was. "
Why not? I think going mad because your daughter has commited suicide and left a creepy book and then hearing the words "save me" in your own head is enough to push someone into murder...
no but i actually thought Jack would be. all the killings were linked to Isabel's suicide and when Jack did not answer her call, or her cry for help rather, i thought the mother would accuse him of her death and thus see him as the worst of all; a traitor.
(how she'd find out about the call i do not know)
either way, that would have resulted in a quite interesting ending ^^