I thought it pretty much sucked. - Fay Grim (2007) Discussion

[–] 17 years ago

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Yeah, I was going to turn it off too. But I kept watching. Once they were able to level the camera (what was wrong with all those crooked shots!) things turned a little bit better, and even the dialogue improved. It went from a bad parody to a regular spy movie.

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[–] dirty-equation 17 years ago

I had hopes for this when I saw the previews but..... #1 If you are going to have long dialog sequences in a film, at least make them go somewhere and keep a hold on the viewer....[yawn]. #2 Did the (constant)"dutch camera" angles add any bit of tension(or anything at all) to this film?.I didn't think so. I mean come-on ...where was the real "thriller" in FG? Did I miss it somehow? I think not,because there wasn't any. #3 Poor script, #4 poor acting and #5 What comedy? Did I miss that too?. What a let down. ugh

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[–] Aztec_Camera 17 years ago

Yeah I thought it more or less was a yawn fest. Although there were some genuinely amusing moments (They were just that too, moments) it was more or less a complete waste of time. The only reason I didn't turn it off was to see if Fay & Henry would actually come face to face....didn't happen! Guess I shoulda just turned it off!

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[–] xffanatic_4ever 17 years ago

I did turn it off. I tried to watch this film 3 times and fell asleep all three times. Even when I'd try to pick up where I left off (yay, only 40 minutes left), I'd still fall asleep. I finally gave up and returned it today. Ugh. I too thought there were a few funny moments and I highly enjoy Parker Posey and Jeff Goldblume, so that was good, but...mostly just bad. And I really wanted to like this too.

"My drugs are red, white, and blue"

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] explainmyself 17 years ago

i really wanted to like it.
having parker posey and saffron burrows in one movie is like some sort of infinite portal to awesomeness, but nothing about the movie worked. this makes me sad. and it makes my big toe tingle a little, but that last part might be because of the gout. although i don't really know what gout is, though i do know that it rhymes with trout. i once had a trout for dinner, but now i don't because i'm a vegetarian. although there are some fish-eating vegetarians, but what the hell? they're not vegetarians. i wish someone would let them know that their loose morals are decaying our society.

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[–] walsh90210 17 years ago

Just saw it the other day. I was highly disappointed and yes it did suck. I loved Henry Fool. In that one to me he was like a wannabe Jack Kerouac. The fun part about his book was he made it sound so over the top great that you wanted to leave it to your imagination on what was it in.

Now in Fay Grim there is harldy no Henry and we come to find out he was/is this enternal super spy. (Remember they said his birth year was 1591) The book is revealed as world government secerts and not his life as what I thought was an aimless drifter who loved women and to read and write all the time.

What I love about Hartley movies is the way he'd touch on philosophy and the unique dialogue. Outside of "an honest man is always in trouble" (i've been there lol) we didn't get any of that.

I know in some of his early 90's movies he'd touch on old school 70's and 80's Cold War politics but I didn't want to hear about it still in 2006/7. Too much of that along with too many characters and side plots.

In all the other Hartley movies I never wanted them to end. This one, I couldn't wait until it was over. I kept checking my DVD timer to see how much longer I had. It went on forever!

Kudos to Saffron Burrows who seems to be looking even hotter with age!

I think James Urbaniak and Thomas Jay Ryan are very under rated and I wish they were in more movies. Ryan is always watchable with his mannerisms and his wonderful and passionate delievery of lines.

I'd love to see a third Henry Fool movie but I doubt it after this mess. It's a shame too. There could have been so much more done with these characters I think.

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[–] negrinRL 17 years ago

Wow... This year's Era New Horizons festival in Wroclaw, Poland, which has just finished yesteday, had a Hartley retrospective and I saw all of Hal's movies there (save for "Surviving Desire"). And I'm really suprized to see the comments about "Fay Grim" on this board. I loved it and so did all my friends. Sure, it's different from the last couple of deeply philosophical movies he made but come on! "Fay Grim" is just damn fun to watch, the way "Unbeliveable Truth" is fun to watch. Despite the different subject matter and 20 years that separate the two movies, to me they have quite a lot in common. "FG", just as "UT", is a something of a spoof of the genre really, and it features some of Hal's funniest dialogue (which says a lot, considering this is Hal Hartley we're talking about). Sure, it's definitely the most "shallow" HH movie to date but so what? It's just really very entertaining, in that quirky, typically Hartley way. So what's not to like? :)

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[–] noveltyvalue 17 years ago

I don't think it's shallow at all but that's part of its problem. I had high hopes for this and I can even say that I think it's the best thing Hartley's done since HF but that means little when I hated almost everything in between (including most of the shorts). I appreciate FG's ambition and Hartley's evident desire to extend his own boundaries but he over-reaches here or miscalculates or something. The picture starts strong I'll grant you but it wore out my good will well before the second, interminable act. I can see where he's going with this--the absurdly, overcranked espionage plot and dialogue are designed to highlight the incoherent mess of our contemporary situation while also providing a fresh context for Hartley's standard character based fare. However, the emphasis given to the parody plot gets completely out of control (which is probably his point, but still...) and muddles our emotional relationship to the characters and their intentions. Often Hartley seems to just be going for a socially relevant vibe and those moments come off the worst. There are funny things in it, yes, and there are incidents of real emotional depth but their clumsily handled, not well balanced with or within his mind numbing spy plot. Hartley gets in his own way, in other words. I'm sure Hartley does not want to feel as though he's returning too much to his roots--movies like Flirt indicate just how restless and experimental a filmmaker he is--and maybe it's true that I simply don't like what he's trying to do these days, but if I don't it isn't out of spite but because his early films, especially the profoundly moving and very funny Trust and Simple Men, get it all so right. He is certainly free to move on to other forms or narrative conventions but he needs to keep an eye fixed on his strength which is his deeply sensitive examination of characters. The philosophy and the comedy is only there to accentuate that.

And the final shot, effective though it may be, recalls a similar, far more resonant final moment in Simple Men and this does not do his cause here any service.

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[–] negrinRL 17 years ago

I'm sure Hartley does not want to feel as though he's returning too much to his roots--movies like Flirt indicate just how restless and experimental a filmmaker he is--and maybe it's true that I simply don't like what he's trying to do these days

I'm not in love with what he did between "Henry Fool" and this one (not that I didn't like the more recent movies--I simply agree that he was at his best with "Trust" and "Simple Men"), so with "Fay Grim" I did enjoy the fact Hartley kind of got off his high philosophical horse in favor of, well, some of the old flavor, even if delivered differently. And for what it's worth, during one of the Q&As at the Wroclaw festival (I think it was after "The Girl from Monday") he said that he's done with making these quirky genre movies and he plans on making films "about simple people living in their apartments". Sure it needs to be taken with a grain of salt but I take it as an expression of desire to go to his roots. So I for one am looking forward to how well he sticks to his "promise".

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[–] hedricj 17 years ago

I think Hartley makes a risky invite to his audience with "Fay Grim," and that is why I admire the film, because "Henry Fool" is maybe his best work, and I think we know and he knew that he wasn't going to make another picture of that caliber in this sequel. (Although, I have to say, I used to think "Fool" was his best work, but after seeing it pre-"Fay," I would say that it is no better than "Simple Men" or "Trust," agreeably, both outstanding pictures.) What draws me to Hartley, and what pulled me happily through to the final frames of "Fay Grim," is his commitment to technique (even at the risk of failure) and his ability to combine that with an emotional and comedic impact in his films, and I think he delivers that here. Of course, I'm a veiwer who finds deliberatley absurd plots hilarious, as most plots are absurd to me anyway, but I thought the emotional quality that survived to that final moment (which, I agree, was done better in "SM") was well earned, and wonderfully shot, and exciting even! Yes, the dutch angles may be overwrought, as is the plot, as is the world of the film, and I bought that as part of the fun of the film. I think he reached a few similar heights in "Girl From Monday," although I would say, overall, "GFM" is a less successful outing. Still, I think this is a good sign that we can see new evolutions of Hartley, and hopefully leave behind the "No Such Thing" days. Ultimately, I delighted in this attempt to transform Henry's lies into truth, and turn Fay into an unlikely spy-pulp heroin (not to mention bringing back Elena Lowhenson!). It's not going to appeal to audiences who don't know Hartley, and it is a tough proposition for us viewers who have been with him for a while, but I admire that risk, as well as his shining dedication to his characters and his style. I'd watch a third, happily, but, still, I was glad to hear the comment about him leaving genre pics behind.

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[–] ptoche 17 years ago

It's hard to believe that this is a sequel to Henry Fool. While Henry Fool is refreshing, witty, comical, Fay Grim is slow, boring, and doesn't go anywhere. A huge disappointment.

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[–] nlpnt 17 years ago

It sort-of works if you try to forget the director's other stuff and take it on it's own level. Parker Posey and Saffron Burrows are still reasonable eye-candy...
....although if that's the level it works best on, he might as well have edited for a PG-13 to cash in on the tween-girl demographic that would pay to see Liam Aiken read from the phone book...

Donuts...is there anything they can't do?

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] rewind64155 17 years ago

Oh no. All you posters are keeling me with your posts on this one. I just bought this movie for $2 in a discount bin because Jeff Goldblum is in it.....Guess I will save it for a time when I need to get sleepy.

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[–] sludgehound 10 years ago

Tried this awhile back and gave up. Didn't grab me at all. Nice to see comments here with similar reactions. Usually I can hack it through most small independents but there's a batch that just don't do it. Add one to pile. But do find Posey quite fascinating in small budg way. She's almost more of a still life, single shot, model type though. Like so hot in a single frame or two but when in a series of frames like this mess, well there's nothing more to bother with.
Rough level for this promising actor. At best she needs to get the Glenn Close type of leading roles. Might bring out her depth. Right now it just seems she is crusing on secondary setting in sort of a Queen of the Bs manner. Keeps her cult fans happy but also limits her appeal for top line productions.
We'll see. Many have failed at this stage, a few succeed. Lot depends on whether she wants to make the leap. Doesn't come on a silver platter.
Better to go down in a blaze than to just remain a hot ember.
But not everyone wants it big or can even understand the difference. Happy enough to just drift along. Maybe that's their strength to know their limits and stay within them. That's my reaction to her choices. Supporting player.
Still young enough that the Glenn Close kind of things may yet be offered.
If she alters her image & choices that may be key in days ahead.
No real matter now since she certainly is maintaining her artsy stature.
Maybe the Woody Allen Project will offer her some mileage. Often happens if his film gets good marks. This 2015 does seem like just another retread of what Woody used to appear in. Now he has stand-ins for his old days. She does get a top billing which can help raise her standing even if cast does reek of indy. Like to see Posey in something like Serena as a lead or co-lead female. Build up her rep as a draw for women to make their males attend the film.
Then into the Fatal Attraction, Dangerous Liaisons, Body Heat, Witness kind.
Think she'd really score in that format.

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