The dangers of deconstructing a film too much, is that you destroy its magic.
"It is my understanding that the movie implies that all the strange things started happening just after the car crash, which - in turn - happened quite some time after the girl's suicide.
Did they hit her ghost? If so, why would she start sitting on his shoulders and haunt him only after this? Plus, kill his friends. Couldn't she have done this a long time ago? " - JayRZay
Bear in mind that this is an unusual ghost story, there can't be many serious films (I can't think of any) where the ghost wasn't out for revenge on the main protagonist. Natre just wants to be with Tun, not kill him.
There are no hard and fast story telling rules governing the time it takes for a ghost to return, following a person's death. But it usually coincides with a time the protagonist feels happy and content with his lot. This is deliberately so, for effect ... here's a happy guy, here comes something to upset things, how does he cope with it. You shouldn't worry about the timing of Natre's return.
The happy scene of them laughing in the car is abruptly changed to one where a girl has apparently been killed and they drive away, this is a trope that Joss Whedon uses to great effect. This is also when Natre attaches herself to Tun, so to answer your question, yes, they hit her ghost.
"What is the point of the car accident?" - JayRZay
"Also I'll have to admit I didn't get the point of the scene with the photographs of the car crash." - JayRZay
These two scenes are connected to the strange light contamination on Tun's photographs.
Shortly after the accident, we see Tun and Jane in their flat, she is suffering with guilt about the accident and driving away, Tun is worried about the ruined photographs [connection]. Then we see Jane making offerings by burning that paper (possibly elaborate joss paper) to clear her conscience, and a collection of photographs of fatal accidents pinned to boards. I can only assume they are the Thai equivalent of leaving flowers at a crash site for the loved ones that died. In the one photograph that they focus on we see a familiar sweep of white, similar to those on Tun's photographs [connection]. Later in the film we discover that among the faked "ghost" pictures printed in a magazine, the owner has some "genuine" examples of ghosts caught on film [connection]. And so the connections are made; the white marks on Tun's photographs are a ghost (Natre), just like that one in the collection pinned to the boards, the reason they discovered this was because of the (non)accident involving Natre.
Hopefully, this explains why they had to have the accident with Natre, what the scene with the photographs of accidents was for, and how it ties in with the idea that Tun is in fact being "haunted" (by Natre).
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e3tGxnFKfEhttp://tinyurl.com/LTROI-story
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JayRZay
10 years ago
Thanks for the reply and your thoughts on the matter.
It does make sense for the most part, but I feel that this makes the movie more complicated than it needed to be. Assume Natre waited until he was most happy. Fine - let him be together with his new girlfriend when the haunting starts.
I think the accident dilutes or obscures the motives. Partly because committing a hit-and-run didn't turn out to be a bad thing. They weren't worse off for hitting Natre or leaving her at the accident site. Apparently it didn't matter at all. So in terms of ethics, there is no statement here at all. Is it necessary for the plot? I see your point - they used it, but I can't quite agree it was necessary.
His girlfriend could have been concerned about the "ghosts" on the photos, his friends may have died one by one, so there was plenty of reason to follow the "ghost photography lead" anyway.
And also I find the connection between actual car accidents and their hit-and-run with a ghost a bit slim. After all, nobody was injured or killed in their "accident" except for a billboard sign. So really the accident, within the reality of the movie, apparently was of very little significance. I feel it was far too prominent, even if it was supposed to be a red herring.
Of course most horror movies require some contrived plot elements, but the way the accident scene was set up, it felt like the motif of the movie, a pivotal event. At least an event of some importance. When it turned out that it was just of no greater importance or meaning at all, I was quite surprised. I guess I wouldn't quite agree this was necessary.
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Jameron
10 years ago
"Partly because committing a hit-and-run didn't turn out to be a bad thing. They weren't worse off for hitting Natre or leaving her at the accident site. Apparently it didn't matter at all. So in terms of ethics, there is no statement here at all" - JayRZay
It played on Jane's mind so much that she felt compelled to make an offering to A) ease her conscience, and possibly b) pray for peace for the soul of the person she killed. This tells us that she has a conscience ... unlike Tun, who was wandering around
not making an offering, a sign of lack of conscience [this ties in to the story later in the film when we find out what happened to Natre ... and what Tun did, or didn't do].
What we also find out is that there were no reported fatalities or hospital visits on that night. So no-one actually got killed, or seriously injured by Jane. She has already started to suspect that she hit a ghost and therefore no legal consequences should follow.
"His girlfriend could have been concerned about the "ghosts" on the photos, his friends may have died one by one, so there was plenty of reason to follow the "ghost photography lead" anyway." - JayRZay
Tun's friends dying one by one was not connected directly to the "ghosts" on the photographs, they died because they raped Natre, there was no need to link them with the car accident.
Jane's interest in the "ghosts" on the photographs was amplified when she saw the same thing on the accident photos pinned to that board. Without seeing the other photographs she would have just assumed that Tun's camera was faulty.
I'm not saying that the accident Jane had with Natre's ghost was genius, or the only way it could have been done, but it served its purpose and added a little adrenalin to the beginning of the film. Without having a reason to visit the Temple(?) and make an offering she would have never seen those other photographs with the "ghosts" on them, the filmmakers would have had to find another way to do it that could have been more contrived. I'm happy with what we got.
"Of course most horror movies require some contrived plot elements, but the way the accident scene was set up, it felt like the motif of the movie, a pivotal event." - JayRZay
I didn't see it like that at all, which probably explains our different reading of the scene. I saw it as a point in the film where things are going to change but not particularly pivotal. A few scenes later we discover that no-one was killed and then it becomes more of an unanswered question until later on.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e3tGxnFKfEhttp://tinyurl.com/LTROI-story
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JayRZay
10 years ago
Tun's friends dying one by one was not connected directly to the "ghosts" on the photographs, they died because they Natre, there was no need to link them with the car accident.
Exactly yet - my point - they were all alive and well the evening of the accident, and dead a few days later. Years after the incident everybody is affected right after the accident.
Without having a reason to visit the Temple(?) and make an offering she would have never seen those other photographs with the "ghosts" on them, the filmmakers would have had to find another way to do it that could have been more contrived.
Yes; or less. I would argue that would have been easily possible.
I respect your point of view; it certainly didn't "ruin" the movie for me, but it did leave a sour taste (usually the 'suspension of disbelief' works pretty well for me, but this scene stands out somehow) and I do maintain that the movie would have been considerably better off without this scene altogether. Or if Natre had died just this very night and that was why everything started then, and the car accident was her first move to get their attention.
But the way the story is told, she's been dead for a long time. I don't remember any mention of time, but it must have been long enough for Natre's mother to alienate the village by her strange behavior, and this certainly takes more than a few days. So really everything starting because (or "when") they ran over her ghost is really, within the reality of the movie, a crazy, crazy coincidence. And never addressed as such.
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Jameron
10 years ago
"But the way the story is told, she's been dead for a long time. I don't remember any mention of time, but it must have been long enough for Natre's mother to alienate the village by her strange behavior, and this certainly takes more than a few days. So really everything starting because (or "when") they ran over her ghost is really, within the reality of the movie, a crazy, crazy coincidence. And never addressed as such." - JayRZay
I don't see it as a coincidence. I really don't see that it could be anything other than Natre planning it that way. Who knows why, maybe to see if Tun had matured enough to develop a conscience, he obviously hadn't. Whatever the reasoning, it is extremely unlikely that a ghost would be wandering aimlessly across a road in the middle of the night without a purpose.
You are right, the film didn't address this point, but I didn't miss the exposition.
This is indeed the problem with tropes, or classic storytelling frameworks. There are short cuts to put the audience into the "action" without having to rely on exposition heavy scenes, or a four hour run time. Unfortunately, they can leave people asking questions, such as your own, "Why is this all happening now, not years ago?". This question didn't even occur to me, maybe I've seen enough films where this is done that I just accept it now, "Oh, right. Now Karma is going bite their ass, for whatever they did in the past that will be explained as I watch the rest of the film".
I'm glad it didn't ruin the experience for you.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e3tGxnFKfEhttp://tinyurl.com/LTROI-story
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