MovieChat Forums > Lakposhtha parvaz mikonand (2005) Discussion > Negative image of Kurdistan?

Negative image of Kurdistan?

posted 19 years ago by viglen
18 replies | jump to latest

Just finished watching the movie...
it wasnt bad, As an iraqi , i know how kurdistan looks like , although places like those do exist, why didnt they show some better looking places? like hawler? sulaymaniah? Not all of kurdistan is in rubble..
For example the one shot that they said they went to Hawler (Irbil) they showed some market, there is so much more beautiful sites
I know bahman ghobadi doesnt enjoy showing lovely sites of kurdistan in his movies to show desperation in the movie , but seriously the image that people may get after watching this movie is that all of Kurdistan is stones and grovle....that's not the Kurdistan I know
Shame on Bahman for not showing the beauties of Kurdistan

[–] mandy-1 19 years ago

This was not a travelog. It was an astounding drama about the cost of war and hatred with a beautifully complex plot and some of the finest acting you will ever have the privlege to see.

[–] viglen 19 years ago

"This was not a travelog"
really? wow ... thanks for the enlightenment

"It was an astounding drama about the cost of war and hatred with a beautifully complex plot and some of the finest acting you will ever have the privlege to see."
Yes i know....Did i mention anything about the acting? did i mentiond anything about the plot? NO
I mentioned how Bahman an iranian-kurd missed the opportunity to show the different beauties of kurdistan that it is renowkned for in Iraq.
I like how you're trying to teach me about the movie , that the acting is the best i will ever see....did i mention anything about that?? seriously
You probably have never seen the kurdish scenery i am refering to but here's a few, and maybe you'll understand why i dont appreciate how he showed the whole of kurdistan as bleak grey and all in all un-livable

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kurdo/5316009/
http://www.ekurd.net/wallpaper/gallery1/gallery1.asp
http://www.ekurd.net/wallpaper/gallery1/gallery1.asp?ID=158
http://www.ekurd.net/wallpaper/gallery1/gallery1.asp?ID=126
http://www.ekurd.net/wallpaper/gallery1/gallery1.asp?ID=38
http://www.ekurd.net/wallpaper/gallery1/gallery1.asp?ID=131
http://www.ekurd.net/wallpaper/gallery1/gallery1.asp?ID=68
and many more at ekurd.net

These spectacular views of kurdistan in teh images , are some of the finest view you will ever have the privilege to see mandy !!

[–] PrinceMishkin 19 years ago

"'This was not a travelog'
really? wow ... thanks for the enlightenment"

The sarcasm is misplaced. Both your posts suggest that you do indeed believe it to be a travelogue. This is a drama; the director is under no more compulsion to show positive, pretty images of Kurdistan than Martin Scorsese is -- in, shall we say, Raging Bull -- to show positive images of New York City. He didn't "miss the opportunity" to show different beauties. He simply chose to tell a story set elsewhere.

These pictures are indeed impressive. But, you know what, the film is NOT a travelogue.

[–] viglen 19 years ago

" this sarcasm is misplaced"
Oh no , i think it was quite well placed
I found it hilarious that mandy was teaching me about what a travelogue is and what a movie is....

"is a drama; the director is under no more compulsion to show positive, pretty images of Kurdistan "
I know it is a drama that tries to explain the desperation and destruction in parts of kurdistan....but what i find specifically hurtful to the kurdish people is to imply that their whole country is rubble and gravel.
Why cant there be positive images of kurdistan? If he does want to provide the story line with some depth , he should just rely on background negative images...I think the beautiful images of the mountains and the other breath taking views of kurdistan would provide a more interesting look to their negative lives.... a contrast would do good
Just because they're not living in the best conditiions doesnt mean the views and areas of kurdistan have to suffer for it

You could go ask any non-iraqi after watching the movie , what they thought kurdistan would look like, what would they say? that kurdistan is just a mixture of rubble and gun shops...
I am deeply saddened that a kurd would actualy do this to his own country for the sake of making a good movie that otehr non-iraqi's could watch...coz if he did put pretty pictures of kurdistan then that wouldnt have as much as an effect as say a dingy market shop....
he sacrificed the beauties and depth of kurdistan to further his story...that may be ligetimate to a certain extent , but i have seen enough of his movies to realize that he will always show kurdistan as a pile of rubble

[–] Kooman 19 years ago

Viglen even though he's Iraqi I won't hold that against him jk. I am an Iranian-Kurd and i beleive Viglen does have a point but so do other users. This movie was about desperation and sought not to explore Kurdistans beauty, which i must say is very beautiful, but the hardship its gone through. Bahman also made Marooned In Iraq which again he didn't use any nice landscaping shots. I thought his work for Abbas Kiarostami on "The Wind Will Carry Us" would've opened his eyes. I was wrong

[–] noralee 19 years ago

The director isn't trying to show all of Kurdistan. He specified that this locale is on the Iraq border and it's clear that all these kids have directly experienced war. So he's focusin on those parts of Kurdistan that have been traumatized physically by war. So therefore would have rubble.

And I thought much of the mountain locale was beautiful.

[–] 19 years ago

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[–] viglen 19 years ago

exactly...EXACTLY!!

i said this is tailored for the european audience who wouldnt want to see the lesse beings in iraq , living in a backdrop of beauty , coz it would be contradiciting
bahman should stop tailoring to that audience and start showing the beauties of kurdistan!
cheers seanbeanfan!!

[–] Anastasia_M 19 years ago

Well, I'm an American who just saw this film, and I have to say that the last thing I came away with was some idea that all of Kurdistan is a country of rubble and gun shops.

First: I didn't even know that this was Kurdistan. All I knew was that it was the Iraq-Turkey Border.

Second: I understood this to be a film about the effects of war on children -- people in general, but children specifically. I understood that what I was seeing was a makeshift refugee camp and a village torn by war. I in no way "assumed" that all of the country was in this kind of shape. Give viewers a little credit for being able to think, please.

Third: Much of the scenery around the village was breathtakingly beautiful; why you thought that there were no images of beauty in this film is beyond me. You may know the country better, but you have let that completely color what you think other people are getting out of the film. I can tell you that in at least the cases I personally know of, you are totally wrong in your assessment.

This isn't to say that I don't understand the political point you are making. I just think that you are assuming people will think things that they won't neccessarily think. It is a story about war. We understand that.

Now... that having been said, I do have a couple of questions.

What is the significance of the title? I know that there were a couple of scenes with turtles, but I feel like I'm missing something.

What did the girl mean when she said that the baby was of the people who had victimized her and her family? Just where did that baby come from?

P.S.: I did check out that website and the pictures that you posted. And yes; itis quite beautiful. But it still in no way diminishes what was done with the film. In fact, some of the scenery on that website was very much like the scenery in the movie. Which only supports my point that it wasn't bereft of local beauty.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://www.drunkduc k.com/Wikkinz ~ Wikkinz; an online graphic novel

[–] 19 years ago

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[–] Lazymoo 19 years ago

I always assumed turtles was a reference to mines, as mines resemble turtleshells.

As for this being an "anti-war" film, I didn't get that impression at all. There is a powerful scene in which everyone is cheering when the americans come which actually changed my feelings somewhat on the war in Iraq. It was clearly anti-landmines though.

I disagree with the opinion that this portrayed Kurdistan in a negative light, it showed the amazing resiliance of the Kurds and featured breathtaking

[–] 19 years ago

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[–] shaun-pain 19 years ago

although a very late post (as you will probably not read this) but to other readers...

think back to when riga (the little boy) threw the turtles in the puddle. then it cuts to a shot of the turtles swimming. then... closer to the end of the film... remember where the little boys? and how he couldn't swim to the top?

turtles CAN fly.

[–] PeykanTM 19 years ago

If you pay attention to all these garbage artsy Iranian movies that are being released in North American and Europe all of them are filmed in the worst areas so viewers can feel great and thing how much more superior they are to those in the movie.
The only one of the internationally acclaimed Iranian movies that had nice setting was Color of Paradise, which was set in a very beautiful area (Mazandaran, Gilan)

[–] yamahaazul 19 years ago

Fist of all, I'm a kurd from Syrian Kurdistan, and I really love cinema. This is the reason because when a kurdish movie is released, I know I will like it so much (influenced emotionally). But then, when I turn see see the same films I begin to analyze them.

I think Ghobadi does the things well, because this is the function he has choosen. It's good show to occidental people the bad luck and the misery of an ethnos, the kurdish town in this case. Then, there are other functions, the entertainment, artistic, etc, more happy in general. This is the thing that the kurds filmakers don't show, maybe because all have a feeling in his heart that push them to show the misery of his people.
I think it would be interesting that kurds begin to make also films that shows the good face of Kurdistan Iraq. This way, people will know that this autonomous territory of Kurdistan (after Iraq war) is like a floating little paradise. I said all my friends that this summer I will go to Kurdistan Iraq (its one of my dreams), but this friend thinks that its so dangerous. This is the image that kurds must change, but Ghobadi has not choosen it. Its relapses on another filmaker, I hope soon, because the incipient kurdish cinema needs a plurythematic cinema, with varied generes, and no stand up on the crude drama...

But in the other hand, I admire Ghobadi's courage, making the film with around 20 bodyguards, and the result is magnific. Baybe he could show some more beautiful places, true, but he maintained film's tone very well, and I admire his election. I think all the kurds (and no kurds) should support the new kurdish cinema, and hope that the new filmakers play all the generes possibly, to make a strong kurdish cinema (and universal).

About the meaning of the title, I don't undestant, but I think that it refers that turtles also can blow up because of mines or the war (remember that this is an antiwar film).

Sorry by my english,
AZAD, Spain.

[–] sanambamshad 19 years ago

I completely understand what you mean.but the idea is not about showing beauty.he is showing the life of some poor kids in a completely realistic way.If the are no such directors as Ghobadi who is going to show the West what is going on in other parts of the world? people who come from third world countries ,like me and you are completely aware of the facts and things that are going on in our countries but there are other people in this world other than us who need to see and who need to open their eyes to the miserable life of people and children in poor countries, and showing beauty of these countries will not do the same job and will not have the same effect.

[–] pesarkhoobnaz 19 years ago

I think all the kurds should support the new kurdish cinema...

Long live Kurdistan

[–] 19 years ago

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