MovieChat Forums > Darwin's Nightmare (2005) Discussion > A probable fraud

A probable fraud

posted 18 years ago by aurlb
23 replies | jump to latest

Even if what you mentioned is total truth, and I don't think the film is telling you they bring guns to Tanzania but to Angola and Congo.
Also it is a documentary, you see a security "officer" with madness in his eyes tell those things... you believe only if you want. The same for the pilots.

Anyway the main points of the film are still there so why care for those details ? Only if you're scared to face the truth.

[–] thanasaki_mtl 18 years ago

Anyway the main points of the film are still there so why care for those details ? Only if you're scared to face the truth.

Exactly!

It doesn't make a difference whether the arms are landing in Tanzania, Angola or any other landing strip in Africa, the point is that they land, period. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Big $$$ for these western arms dealers, that's the point, PERIOD.

Obviously the OP didn't get it and as howcanyoubesure stated, keep on denying what you don't see, that's exactly what they want.

[–] boolia74 18 years ago

The pilot who mentioned carrying tanks in the past, made it clear that this was a cargo for Angola, not Tanzania, but as the last poster said the country is not the issue - why are rich Northern countries allowing arms into the continent as a whole? The documentary demonstrated that most of the pilots didn't know (or want to know) what they were bringing into Africa. If they did, they were extremely reticent or vague in their discussion, which did not inspire confidence in them.In general, the pilots and Asian fish factory managers appeared not to care about the plight of the Tanzanian people (apart from the final pilot who spoke and demonstrated a spark of conscience and humanity). Neither is the point about the discarded fish heads important, the fish were riddled with maggots and giving off health-damaging levels of ammonia. The appalling working conditions would not be tolerated in the EC or the US and were shown to be totally unacceptable.

[–] wari 16 years ago

Anyway the main points of the film are still there so why care for those details ? Only if you're scared to face the truth.

I disagree, if details are miss presented or a LIE, then a documentary is compromised and any intelligent viewer will have reservations in everything that the maker says.

[–] prezike 18 years ago

Interesting infos on "Darwin's nightmare". A recent article in France just revealed probable frauds about the film.

First of all, many of the most disgusting fish heads we see are not meant for the locals but for hens and pigs. Second, for most Africans, the head is the best part in the fish. So they don't care about eating fried fish heads. On the contray. But Mr Sauper never tells us that.

But the most important news is the fact that there has never been any plane bringing guns to Tanzania where the film is set. To Angola or Congo, yes, but not to Tanzania. It seems one such plane was stuck one day (in 2001) on a Tanzanian air field but it was not going to Tanzania. Sauper's insistance in having the locals or the pilots say that the planes are exporting weapons in exchange for the Perch filets should have made us guess there was something... fishy... about all this.

"Interesting" that you did not site the source of this article on "Darwin's Nightmare" leaving a difficult time for anyone to actually check the legitimacy and validity of the article, you claim to have been written, leading to your rather presumptuous and potentially slanderous position of calling the film maker a "probable fraud" (a VERY strong statement to make about a documentary) without doing our own research.

While I cannot verify, based upon my own preliminary research, whether or not "many of the most disgusting fish heads" were used for hens and pigs; the reality -- which you apparently admit to -- is that AT LEAST SOME of the fish carcasses and heads we saw in the film were being used for human food and were plied up on the ground and floor and not treated in any sanitary manner for eating. Your apologist position on this matter is downright scary. Are you really going to defend the fact that the expensive meat is taken off of the fish, while the carcass and head are treated like garbage and left, CLEARLY, for the poorest Tanzanians?

And your poor excuse for a defense, which is clearly sophomoric, which is to suggest that "for most Africans, the head is the best part of the fish" is like saying that for Americans pigs intestines are their favorite part of the animal. It's about as ignorant a statement as it comes. I'm sorry, have you even been to an African country and eaten the local food? What makes you an expert on African cuisine -- as if there is one single culinary tradition for the entire continent? (of course, which is dead wrong and downright insulting to many) I can say with some authority (having visited the continent) that many regions of Africa value fish fillets and other parts which Europeans, Japanese and other Westerners also hold in esteem.

I also don't follow your logic as to how his insistence in asking about the illegal importing of arms is poor journalism? We're talking about ILLEGAL activity involving the dealing of weapons to war-torn areas in parts of Africa that involve children and the raping and murder of many innocent people. Don't you think that those pilots might be just tad bit worried about what might happen if they say something about it, and as implied in their response that they MIGHT be willing to admit to it out of guilt? If it was CLEARLY not true then why can't they get their stories straight and even more compelling of an argument is the investigative journalists report that was published, and other anecdotal evidence. I don't think we can say FOR CERTAIN if it's true, and that's fair enough, but there certainly is a lot of evidence that should be investigated and questioned.

No where does he imply that it is the fish being dealt for arms, or that the arms are primarily for Tanzania (at this time, although it wouldn't seem like too far of a stretch). He inquires about it, which seems like a rational question. Why would he not ask? The film maker and the other witnesses suggest that the cargo companies are making additional capital from the arms transport or some other form of corruption along the line of travel, and that the Europeans don't care about Africa in the same way as Europe because big businesses keep making money off of the current system while the European nations GDP increases. They suggest that Tanzania is a hub for illegal arms trade to places like Congo, Angola and Liberia, all of which have had major conflict recently.

I am beginning to wonder if you are one of these Cargo Plane owners, benefiting on a monetary level from this kind of globalization, a corrupt official or some other person with stakes here, because your argument is so full of holes that it holds no water at all from a critical perspective.

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[–] Bladerunner 18 years ago

First I want to say that I do NOT agree with the first poster and I am NOT defending his position, so please don't lump me with him as you read what I have to say.

What bothers me is the DEMAND for the guns. YES, it is inconscionable that arms are being brought in, but there is DEMAND for the guns and that is very disturbing. I have a very close friend who is a pastor who just returned from a trip to Africa. He was asked to come to see first hand what is happening with the Lord's Resistance Army, or LRA, a lawless band of rebels that use abduction, torture, and mutilation to terrorize the population. Several members of the leadership of a church over there asked him (and others) to come, but we (as a church) did not want to appear as the "world police" and felt that it was best for us to simply give money and support where we could without flying over there like a bunch of tourists on a macabre sight-seeing tour. After a time though they were insistent because they felt that possibly us coming would provoke people from all over to come and help and it would raise the awareness of what is happening. So he went with just one other man, so we wouldn't be wasting money on airfare and so forth that could be going to helping some of the children that are the victims of this madman's army.

I know that not all people feel this way, but I just wanted to say that not all born-again Christians are Bible-beating, SUV driving, Ultra-Right Wing radicals. Many, many of us are just people, flawed, sometimes stupid, NOT perfect people who are trying to take the words and commands of God seriously which means FIRST AND FOREMOST that we love our fellow man, without judgment, without cramming the Bible down their throat, without making a big religious show of it, simply to follow God's word and love people, help people, because He first loved us. That means being respectful of people, of other religions, NOT jamming Jesus in people's faces, but by our actions, giving and helping people we show that Jesus really has made a difference in our lives and we do what we do because His love for us *compels* us to act. Ok, sorry, just wanted to say that.

Anyway, this "army" led by Joseph Kony goes into villages and kidnaps children, forcing the boys to become part of the "army" and the girls to become sex slaves. When I first heard it I thought it was an urban myth, but it isn't and now that the world's press has taken notice and President Yoweri Museveni (Uganda) has made it his mission to route the LRA. You can read all about it by doing a Google search or simply going to the BBC news site and doing a search for LRA. The children of Northern Uganda and south Sudan also, play during the day, but at night they grab their bedroll and leave their villages to head into town to sleep in shelters with hundreds of children, because the LRA strikes most often at night.

Here is a link to a story about it and how one guy (a missionary) is helping. Please don't think that my posting a link to the CBN (700 Club) is my endorsement of that organization. The story of the two girls who were forced to cut each other's hands off will break your heart.

http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/CWN/082605uganda.asp

We all need to concentrate on the DEMAND of these guns; if the demand is removed then there will be no more gunrunning. That is NOT to say that we shouldn't ALSO be trying to crack down on the scum that bring in the guns, and the a**holes that fund them. We need to concentrate on the WHOLE problem, and the way that YOU and I can get involved is by finding an organization that is ethical that is actively involved in helping people and other organizations that are helping these children terrorized by the LRA. Right now there is a desperate need for trauma counselors in Uganda to help with the children who are rescued from the LRA. If you know anyone who could help, please tell him or her that several relief organizations are funding qualified people to go over to help these children.

"...nothing is left of me, each time I see her..." - Catullus

[–] prezike 18 years ago

Bladerunner, that was a nicely stated response, and I do understand (as someone raised Catholic) that not all Christians are the same, and that one of the values lost upon many (both practicing Christians and those that are not of the faith) is that one of the teachings of Christ was to help those less fortunate than themselves.

While I respect the notion of not trying to repeat "White Man's Burden" and still be positive in trying to help the problems that face all too many African nations there is a danger, in my view, of focusing too intently on certain aspects of the "demand" for arms. For instance if much of the resources and energy is spent on curtailing just the flow of weapons other important components of the problem may be neglected. This is a similar problem to the "War on Drugs" that America has been "fighting" for so long, as well as the fact that plenty of weapons reach the U.S. illegally and legally, including young children, today. People who are concerned need to be asking the question of why is there a demand for arms on a deep level and address those issues.

I think your point about trauma counselors and positions like that are extremely valuable in the immediate, but HISTORY HAS SHOWN THAT WHEN BROAD ECONOMIC IMPROVEMENT OCCURRS THAT MANY OF THESE PROBLEMS BECOME LESS PREVELANT. What is most valuable about this film, in my view, is that it shows how there are clearly some serious problems with the way in which globalization is being practiced in countries like Tanzania, who are defined as "developing." The capital that Europe and other developed nations are investing or spending is not "trickling down" to the lowest classes, who in countries like Tanzania are extraordinarily high in number. This is a problem in "industrialized" nations as well, where the lowest classes rarely see any significant improvement to their standard of living, and sometimes take huge financial hits during supposed "economic booms," such as what is happening now in the U.S. This is a VERY SERIOUS problem because countries that have low poverty rates tend to be the most stable. It's simple common sense, and something I wish more people who are concerned about these inequalities would focus attention on.

Notice how most of the most unstable nations tend to have economies that are highly dependent upon one or a few natural resources, and usually require a great deal of unskilled labor. Middle Eastern nations dependence on oil is a prime example of this while another case is where Central African nations like Congo depend on gem mining. It's not quite that simple but clearly a nation dependent upon low skill labor, that does not work hard on improving their people's education level in order to compete in markets that require higher skilled workers (aka educated) are going to be at the mercy of those industries like oil and mining. Regions in the U.S. like the Northeastern part of the Midwest with states like Michigan, Ohio, West Virginia and Western Pennsylvania, which have had large numbers of poorly educated factory workers who had depended on the Auto, Coal & Steel industries are all too familiar with this problem. That's why that area has been and is still economically depressed. It even remained that way during the "economic boom of the late 90's" while highly educated workers in cities like San Jose/San Francisco, Seattle and NYC benefited.

Essentially, a major key to a nations stability and safety is economic improvement which typically comes from an increasing of the level of education across the board in a country, which has been the reason why countries like Taiwan, Korea, Singapore, China have improved so much and are mostly stable. That's one of the major reasons why the invasion of Iraq was so misguided, because those who supported it thought that democracy could come before economic improvement. If they bothered to look at East Asia, especially places like China and Taiwan, they could have seen how both nations have decreased the state's power, and people's happiness level, as their economies improved. In fairness, East Asia also has a different culture where Confucianism, in particular, plays a prominent role towards stability. However, that's another reason why the bombing of Japan may have worked, because their people are more willing to submit to authority and have their own identity. In the Middle East, especially a place like Iraq where factions have been competing for power 1500 years submission is not as simple, but I'm digressing here.

Clearly, the onus is not just on the Western nations as their are certainly problems with corrupt leadership in too many African nations (although the West is partially responsible for that as well, due to the Triangle/Slave Trade, African Imperialism/Colonization and later assassinations of Presidents, CIA and other agencies interventions/meddling, etc.). One cannot simply stop weapons entering these nations and expect the problems to go away (not saying this is what you said). I am just skeptical, as suggested by some in 'Darwin's Nightmare' about how honest those with much wealth and power in the West is about helping turn things around in many African nations, and history has shown this to be a consistent problem. Remember, as long as a current system benefits one group it is going to be a tough road to change, especially if they have most of the wealth and power, no matter how just or necessary of a change it may be.

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[–] Bladerunner 18 years ago

I think to a large extent we are basically saying the same thing, that simply stopping the flow *in* isn't going to deal with the problem. You know, I've spent so much time looking at this stuff, and the funny thing is I see the logic of both sides of the argument, that is vis-à-vis global economics and "Trickle Down Economics" and the whole enchilada. Which isn't to say that I buy the "Trickle Down" theory, but I see some sanity in both sides.

I do agree that just invading Iraq and setting up a government is not going to make everything all better, frankly I don't know if those people can EVER live in peace. I don't mean to be condescending there, but we're never going to see a solution to relations between Sunni-Shia in Iraq. Which brings up the whole Middle East thing, I get so damn tired of Muslims and Jews and Christians fighting over the friggin' Temple Mount. It's just so tiresome, you'd think after a few decades they'd just get tired of fighting all the time. Obviously it's about more than the Temple Mount (read: LAND) but that is at the heart of it. But of course I know that it's awful easy for me to sit over here in the comfort and freedom of my living room and pontificate about a situation that I don't ever have to live in. I am very torn however about Iraq. I did *not* want to go to war there, I was against going with all my being, but I think — in the long run — it is going to be for the best. I know that isn't a popular opinion among the political circle I run in (I'm a liberal conservative <hehe>) but I remember the days of Carter and how the perception of a weakened military (and the chones to use it) created a whole host of problems. I know the opinion that we are causing strife in the world, but I think some times you have to break a few eggs. I don't mean to be flippant about it by saying that, but I think sometimes you have to go to war.

The fact is that we as a human race simply have not evolved to the point where it isn't still necessary, from time to time, to rattle the saber and actually use it. I am no war hawk, but the problem is that sometimes a show of force *is* the answer. I hate to admit that, but in my 43 years I've seen some situations solved by the military. Which is NOT to say that all situations are solved by that method, as a matter-of-fact I think that in every fifty situations, probably about one should be dealt with by force.

I don't know why I rambled on about that, but it just makes me so mad that it is true that sometimes force is necessary. The whole Iraq thing is such a damn mess; I wish we'd just set up a provisional government (which we supposedly have done) and go home. Sunni-Shia relations are never going to be ironed out, never. It saddens me that so often religion is at the center of too many conflicts. However, if you're going to have a conflict, I suppose it's better that it is something important like religion that something stupid like cantaloupe.

Rabbit-trailing a bit away from oil-related misery, I am so happy that Governor Swarzenegger has instituted “Vision 2010” which has as its goal: "to ensure that by the end of the decade every Californian has access to hydrogen fuel along the State’s major highways, with a significant and increasing percentage of that hydrogen produced from clean, renewable sources." When you started talking about governments that are living on their natural resources and doing NOTHING for their people, it got me thinking how much I would love it if the U.S. (and everywhere else too) would finally get out from under the grip of OIL. I feel so sorry for the peoples of the OPEC nations, because the top 1/2 of 1% are living like kings (and some ARE kings) and yet they are doing nothing, nothing, nothing for their infrastructure, their economy, their people, zip, zero. That stuff will one day run out, and then what will they have to show for the billions and billions of dollars that whooshed through their fingers? The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

I tell you another thing that gets me pissed off, are the rich Christians and Muslims too, who justify not giving money to the poor by saying stuff like "Oh, they'll just spend it on drugs or alcohol". God said to give to the poor; He did not say to make sure they wouldn’t spend it on booze first. Another thing that pisses me off are these people who buy these huge houses and drive these super-expensive cars and justify it by saying that it is an "investment". Bulls**t! When I was still in the field building stairs I built a $45,000 set of stairs (there were actually three sets, one from the entry to the 2nd floor, one from the kitchen to the 2nd floor, and one from the back of the house to the "media room") for a man and a woman and ONE KID. This house was 5600 square feet and cost $5.5 million dollars! It had one guy and his trophy wife and one daughter that only stayed with him every other weekend, living in a house big enough for a friggin' army and it cost enough to feed every homeless person in the U.S. for a week. What really got me hot was one time he comes in and I was wrapping early because my kids and I were going to take some stuff we had bought and collected (my son is a Boy Scout and his passion is collecting food for the Food Bank) down to the food bank, and we were going to work the dinner shift and this guy asks me why I'm leaving early. I felt a little apprehensive telling him about working at the food bank, because I'm kind of a "don't let your left hand know what your right hand is doing" kinda guy, but I told him and he says (I am NOT making this up) "Those people don't want to work, not when they've got guys like you buyin' em' food and then cookin' it up so all they have to do is hold out the bowl and sit down and scarf it up. You've gotta take a hard line with people like that, otherwise they'll never get off their ass and make a living."

Well, after I scooped my jaw off the floor I said, "One of the women I'm serving food to tonight is still recovering from injuries that she suffered as she was trying to stop her husband from beating her son. The boy died, and he almost beat her to death too. The women's shelter is too crowded so she is staying in a room that a friend of mine usually rents, but he's letting her stay there until she can get on her feet (which could be a long time). She is in hiding because he is out on bail, even though the district attorney asked for no bail because he is threat to her and he *murdered* his son. She has nothing, she can't go home because he is there, and when he's not his no-good family is there waiting for her to try to get her to drop the charges (which she couldn't even if she wanted to, because the state is bringing the charges, not her). He thrashed all her clothing and all her belongings, and everything is in his name. Another guy lost his family last year in a traffic accident on I-35, his wife and his two daughters were killed when a truck driver fell asleep and hit them head on, killing them instantly. He was a master electrician, making lots of money, but after they died he just shut down. It's been two years and he is finally starting to talk about working again and going back home to Oklahoma where his family lives (his folks and brothers). Another guy has a long history of mental illness, but we all know what happened to the mental institutions, so he is on the street and he is a veteran. The Army didn't seem to mind that he was a paranoid schizophrenic when they sent him off to Vietnam for a year, so now he has THAT experience AND he is mentally ill. But HEY, you're right, we should just kick all of those people out on the street and tell them to get a JOB!"

This sleaze just looks at me like he didn't say anything wrong and says, "Well, there's always a few 'exceptions' anywhere you look, but basically people don't want to do anything." To which I said, "Yea, you're right about that, some people don't want to do anything, no matter how great the need or how badly people are suffering". He didn't even understand that I was talking about his stupid a**. Anyway, I guess I'm pissed about a lot of things because there are a lot of things to be pissed about. Jesus said it's harder for a rich man to get into heaven than it is for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle... I believe that may be an *understatement* simply because He didn't want to discourage rich people. ;-)

When my wife and I were looking for our first home (and this home as well) all of our friends were buying houses in the upscale subdivisions, but we bought a nice little house in an established neighborhood. It wasn't as big or as nice as one we could have afforded, but I didn't want my kids growing up next door to kids who have big screen, plasma televisions in their bedroom. I wanted them to live in a neighborhood that was culturally diverse, that had some older folks and people who work for a living. I'm so happy we did, because when things got bad in the cell market a few years ago (and PC sales were in the toilet) a lot of people we knew had to sell their home and move into an apartment or a much smaller house. I don't understand these people who mortgage themselves to the hilt, with two car payments costing what I pay each month for my mortgage, and then they can't do anything and they have no time for their kids. My wife and I have lots of time to spend with our kids, and we take two weeks of vacation each year as a family, not to mention little extended weekend trips camping and stuff like that (thank God). What the heck is the advantage of living in a huge house and driving a Porsche when you have to work seventy hours a week and you never get to ENJOY life?! Oh well, I'm rambling big time; I just get on a rant and take off. Sorry.

Thanks for your great posts prezike; I'm enjoying chatting with you.

"...nothing is left of me, each time I see her..." - Catullus

[–] wheezer69 18 years ago

An excellent eye-opening movie...

As for the longwinded posters intent on demonstrating their "intellegence", you need to get off your soapboxes. Nobody cares about you political views - comments should be focused only on the film.

[–] gabridl 18 years ago

Compliments to prezike and bladerunner for the intelligence of their posts, here and elsewhere.

I wasn't going to weigh in, because I know the director, so I'm partisan. But I can tell you that the author of that nonsense in the French press about the "fraud" in this film is a paid stooge of the arms industry.

Sauper and I don't always agree on everything, but our differences are matters of perspective, not fact. Those slandering Sauper's veracity are doing so for a reason.

[–] cokane98 18 years ago

This is an interesting discussion, and for that the film should be applauded, However i felt Sauper was too keen to get his own agenda across. If people want to find out more then follow this link to a letter by the scientist that were briefly featured in the film, the site that it on also has a lot of information on the Lake Victoria as well.
http://www.lake-victoria.info/page/105.html

[–] nahana 18 years ago

This film maker provided Europeans and the rest of the developed world with a stereotype. The film shows poeple exactly what they want to see: Africa is a disaster hit by famine, war, unhappiness, and economic hardship at every turn. However this is not the whole truth. Yes, Tanzania has a large problem with AIDS and poverty however it is not spiralling towards disaster as the movie portrays. Mwanza is a poor area but the inhabitants do not live of rotten fish heads. Yes, there are time when families go hungry but there are also times when they do not. This is typical for any poor population that feeds itself through agriculture and fishing. There are many deeper and subtler reasons for Tanzania's problems. This film makes a mockery of them by blaming it all on the Nile Perch. It also increases the problem because many poeple have begun to boycott the fish from Mwanza. These fisherman have now been robbed of their income just as the film robbed them of their dignity. Prezike you are horribly pretentious to assume that by having visited the continent you are now a leading authority on it. You can not put down other poeple's opinions in this manner. You may reply to this with statements like: You have been brainwashed or You don't care about the problems, and etc but you must realize that not every documentary tells the truth. Media is the most manipulated form of communication because so much can be left out. This movie left out what Mwanza really looks like. It left out the culture and the happiness that can be seen in Mwanza. It unforgivably trashed Tanzania's reputation by portryaing as a hellhole when it is not. Our president confronted the film maker and asked him for evidence but the french man could find none to prove his theories.

[–] ctizya 18 years ago

What is the source of this information? Seeing it's coming from Europe lo and behold it's a country probably benefitting from this situation. It sounds like in any type of situation like this the ones who benefit from it all will nitpick any little detail to discredit their detractors.

The main thing is that everyone involved says when the planes arrive they are "empty" and when they leave they are full of fish. I've spent time in isolated communities and I have never seen planes arrive or leave empty when they are that size. They most likely drop off weapons at other sources as well, like the one pilot said guns for Angola grapes from South Africa. They never once say in the film that the weapons are for Tanzania, only the local population "hope" for a war to get them out of poverty. The guns were either going to Angola, Congo or Sierra Leone (that we know of).

This type of thing happens all over the world. Rich foreign countries benefit from the depleted natural resources of poor countries while these countries own governments leave their own people out of the cut. In between all this are the weapons. Absolutely appalling. This is all a direct result of irresponsible colonialism from decades past.

[–] jedenfors 18 years ago

you choose to believe or not believe when you watch a documentary. you are not seeing the absolute truth in any documentary, you are only seeing what the camera has captured.
darwins nightmare is one of the strongest documentaries i have ever seen raising only questions and no answers. nobody can walk away from this film unaffected.

[–] 18 years ago

[deleted]

[–] chemiche3 18 years ago

aurlb,

I object to you saying that the head is the best part if the fish for most Africans. THAT IS NOT TRUE! We would like to have the 'minofu' the fillet/steak parts that are shipped to Europe! The reason why Africans feast on heads is because that's what they are left with and it has more meat than the tail, or stripped fish skeleton. Money talks so the Europeans get to enjoy the best parts of the fish. Reminds me of slavery in the USA, the slaves ate the parts of the animal the master did not want like the offals etc.

[–] elowil 18 years ago

It's strange what humans will do when the truth is just too difficult to accept. It is really better to convince yourself that this story was contrived than to sit by helplessly and accept the truth of the matter?

[–] forever18-now 18 years ago

I would just like to say to the first poster Aurlb...
The war is not with Eastasia its with Eurasia we have allways been at war with Eurasia. lol

Your comments are so Orwellian its scary. Europe is bleeding Africa dry, the aid is not ment to help the africans only enough to put them on life support and they support the governments there that dont represent the people and those governments use war to exert control over them. So enjoy your expensive Nile pearch tonight...

[–] got_doobie 18 years ago

Prezikie - As a matter of fact, fish heads are valued in places around the world (including Japan). Maybe you've never had them before, but they are indeed quite delicious. Also, people eat pig intestines all around the world. I really can't see how your comparison of fish heads to pig intestines makes a good argument.

It's funny how people think that what they grew up eating is supposedly what people everywhere else should be eating. What someone throws away in one country might be deliciously prepared in another.

[–] prezike 18 years ago

As a matter of fact, fish heads are valued in places around the world (including Japan). Maybe you've never had them before, but they are indeed quite delicious. Also, people eat pig intestines all around the world. I really can't see how your comparison of fish heads to pig intestines makes a good argument.

It's funny how people think that what they grew up eating is supposedly what people everywhere else should be eating. What someone throws away in one country might be deliciously prepared in another.

I believe you completely misunderstood what I was trying to say. I never said that fish heads are not a valuable food source to some people in the world. The original poster made a sweeping generalization/sterotyping comment by saying that all of Africa values fish heads as a good source of food when that is factually incorrect. I used the example of pig intestines to show how ridiculous of a comment it would be to say that all Americins enjoy that food (when its popularity is mostly restricted to some African-Americans, mostly in the South).

The greater point, which you seem to overlook, is the issue of context. Sure, people can value and enjoy eating fish heads around the world, but in this case the poorest population surrounding Lake Victoria are not even given a choice of what part of the fish they want. It has already been decided for them by the group in power, who are the Europeans and Japanese consumers who value the fillet portion of the Nile Carp far higher than the rest of the fish (which one can deduce based on the fact that the rest of the fish is thrown away).

Generally, I agree, many people do not think about their own perspective when it comes to food and cultural values, but I assure you that in this case you are way base in your assessment of what lies beneath my comments.

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