Any truths to this story


I'm aiming for a couple of things here.
Are there actually people who do this and this?
Is it considered cheating or is there a law against it in America?
Do casino's actually use systems that can predict gambling descisions in realtime, or is this just a bunch of crap. That would be kinda interesting, and I would consider that cheating, I mean that just wouldn't be fair.


I wouldn't call what they are doing cheating, it's like what the guy says, trying to play the game better than other with your brain. I'm it seems the casino will try to do anything to *beep* you up as well.

Just a couple of things I was wondering about. Interesting film, really enjoyed it.

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There are people who do it full time. It's their vocation.
It's not cheating and it's not illegal. The trick is to bet more when chances of winning are bigger and to bet less when chances of winning are small. What's illegal in rasing your bet? You won't call a chess master a cheater only because of his ability to find the best combination using his brain. On Amazon you can find a lot of books describing different (complex and simple) card-counting systems. Casinos can't prohibit card-counting but if they find out that you are a card-counter they can ask you to leave since a casino is a private property. If you return they can sue you for tresspassing.

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I believe this movie was based on a MIT card counting team. Check out the link below:

http://www.mitcardcounting.com/

--
"Surrender Dorothy!"

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[deleted]

i watched a whole 2 hour documentary on the MIT blackjack team and a lot of the stuff is fairly accurate, though they had larger teams...

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Read

Bringing Down the House: The Inside Story of Six M.I.T. Students Who Took Vegas for Millions | Trade Paperback
Ben Mezrich | SIMON AND SHUSTER | September 2003



A good book containing all the facts. I believe there is a sequel out to it now, called Busting Vegas.

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Do you remember the name of that documentary? I watched before I saw The Last Casino and liked them both. I've seen The Last Casino a few times since then, but I've only seen that documentary once.

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Don't remember the documentary actually. The book is a quick read. I have recently picked up the Busting Vegas book. Not really a sequel, a new true story featuring MIT students. Hopefully it is as good as Bringing down the House..


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I am about to watch this movie, but I thought that I would not bother to critique it (as of yet). Instead, I offer the following pithyn commentary: I am a veteran (professional) Card Counter. There is an estimated 150 - 200 pro's in North America. The books and films on this subject make it appear to be an easy skill to master. It is certainly not that. It takes extensive study and practice. The memorization and playing skill need to be virtually flawless, as there is NO room for error. The Card Counters actual profit margin is approximately 1% of all monies wagered. Any errors commited will negate that and you'll be playing without profit and putting your assets at risk with a false expectation of 'earning' a living! What's more, It takes a HUGE bankroll to survive the (inevitable) losing streaks; meaning (at minimum) 1,000 times your minimum wager in [order to earn perhaps 1.5 minimum wagers per hour. Mull that over for a moment. You will be unable to play more than perhaps 15 - 20 hrs. per week as fatigue will degrade your playing accuracy and excessive "exposure" to casinos will quickly have them 'showing you the door.' There are only a few places in the U S A where I am permitted to play this game before security gurads and executives ask me to kindly take my business elsewhere before they arrest me for 'trespassing'. NOTE: Canada has NO casinos that offer games with rules variations and procedures that are profitable for a Card Counter. This is because the courts in Canada decided that Card Counters cannot be ejected from the casinos for counting cards. Ditto for Atlantic City, N.J. ~ but I digress. So you think that you will play an average of just 20 hrs. per week (flawlessly) and you'll need to earn perhaps $60 per hr. to survive as you'd like to? $60 times 1,000 means that you'll REQUIRE a CASH bankroll (on your person) of $60,000 ! Ready to give it a go? Before devoting a half year to intense study and hundreds of hours of monotonously mind-numbing practice to hone your skills, you''ll do well indeed to develop a healthy sense of cynicism and skepticism to aid you in fully understanding that the purveyors of books and films on this (quasi-romantic) subject employ a generous measure of distortion and hyperbole when they extoll Card Counting. Is it a hard way to make an easy living, or is it an easy way to make a hard living? Neither. It is an intensely repetitious boring activity. There is no gambling excitement for a professional player - only endless hours of doing the same mental arithmetic endlessly ~ while pretending to care whether or not the individual hands played are winners or losers. Last week I played about 30 hrs. of blackjack. Did I see or do anything that I have not seen or done hundreds of thousands of times before? No. Card Counting quickly develops all of the charm and excitement of an intellectual assembly line. Fun it aint my friends. A job it is -- for the few who can hold their focus on the numbers swirling in their heads amid the clatter of slot machines, the stench of cigars, and the patter of players and dealers alike. It is intolerable for nearly any intelligent person who tries to do this for any appreciable period of time.

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Reading your story I suppose you are intelligent person, so why are you doing this intolerable, boring, nonprofit job?

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Agreed, my thoughts exactly. Why acknowledge all the downsides of your chosen career? Yeesh, take up low stakes poker, at least as a change of pace ;)


- - -

Chipping away at a mountain of pop culture trivia,
Darren Dirt.

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I will say that I play enough to "earn" the same as I would from a minimum wage job. I did however suffer a bad loss and may never return, but I did have a 6 week winning streak. I play a quarter a hand and I quit when I win 8 times my bet.

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I have also watched the MIT and some Breaking Vegas episodes. But isn't it true that casinos have made it harder for card counters to make money off them by using more than one deck and shuffling machines?

It's not the same as it was a few decades ago
So the fact that they can make money off easily makes the movie pretty unrealistic?

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But isn't it true that casinos have made it harder for card counters to make money off them by using more than one deck and shuffling machines?

They say that in the movie that there will be tricks that the casino will use to try and mess you up. Like changing dealers and saying that they use multiple decks.

While card counting is not illegal casinos do not like people doing that.

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I would never get a job I don't like. There is no point going through life hating what you do to get money.

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well its not like doing regular jobs and such are not boring and repetitive. Every job is the same unless you really have a passion for it (which usually wears off after a few years as well).
So it all comes down to money really, easiest way you can make the money with the least amount of effort is the key.

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[deleted]

I agree. It is incredibly boring. It takes a long time to win a little money. After a while you're just going through the motions. Hit, stand, double down, split. Much easier to write books about it, trying to sound like an expert with all kinds of strategies, and claim to be "retired." So many "retired" counters writing books and simulation software. I wonder why? Hmmmm...

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